Guest guest Posted December 28, 2007 Report Share Posted December 28, 2007 Dear colleagues, I recently posted a message on religion and science with regards to animal sacrifice where I mentioned a quote by the Dalai Lama which was apparently made to the astronomer Carl Sagan. I could not confirm that the interviewer was Sagan but I have come across this Cornell University article which does indicate that the interviewer was indeed Carl Sagan : http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/Oct07/Sagan.Dalai.cover.MR.html Regards, http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/Oct07/Sagan.Dalai.cover.MR.html Oct. 3, 2007 Carl Sagan and the Dalai Lama found deep connections in 1991-92 meetings, says Sagan's widow By Melissa Rice <cunews Religion and science do not have to be at odds. Science, said Ann Druyan, widow of Cornell astronomer Carl Sagan, can communicate with, learn from and even benefit from religion and vice versa. Jon Reis Photography In 1991 Cornell Professor Carl Sagan had a lengthy conversation with the Dalai Lama about science and religion. Druyan, a writer and media producer who collaborated with Sagan for 19 years until his death in 1996, reflected on dialogues in the early 1990s between Sagan and the Dalai Lama at a Sept. 28 lecture in Anabel Taylor Auditorium. For the first time, film excerpts of the meeting between the two were shown in a public venue. Sagan, Cornell professor and author of " Cosmos, " " Contact " and " Dragons of Eden, " among other books, was perhaps best known for his extraordinary ability to communicate science to the public. " He wanted to share with everyone the wonder and awe that science inspired in him, " Druyan said. She stressed that there were political motivations behind Sagan's work as well: " Carl believed that you can't have a democratic society if you have a tiny scientific elite and a public who is uncomfortable with the methods and language of science, " she said. Sagan entered the public eye in the 1960s -- a time rife with changes in both culture and thought. The Catholic church had just switched from giving masses in Latin to local languages so that everyone could understand them, and Druyan said Sagan was trying to do the same for science. The Dalai Lama, who has had a lifelong interest in science, first met with Sagan during a visit to Ithaca in 1991. Their discussion continued in India the following year, where the Dalai Lama cleared his calendar to spend a full day talking with Sagan and Druyan. Robert Barker/University Photography On Sept. 28 at Cornell, Ann Druyan, writer and media producer and widow of the late Carl Sagan, reflected on conversations Sagan had with the Dalai Lama on science and religion in the early 1990s. In the short segment shown of their conversations, Sagan asked the Dalai Lama about his beliefs in God and what he as a Buddhist would do if a discovery in science conflicted with Buddhist doctrine. The Dalai Lama replied that even Buddha was said to question his teachings and that Buddhists rely on doctrine as " findings " rather than as " scripture. " " If through thorough investigation things become clear, only then is it time to accept and believe, " he said. " So is there no conceivable scientific finding that would make you no longer consider yourself a Buddhist? " Sagan responded. The Dalai Lama said there would be no point at which his spirituality and his respect for science would come at such odds with each other. " Buddhism is not so much a religion, but a 'science of the mind' or an 'inner science' .... there is much benefit to learning from [scientists'] findings, " he explained. Regarding the contributions of religion to science, Druyan said that while science has developed an amazing library of facts, it does not have the human social organization and the ability to inspire that religion has. That's why we have lost that magical excitement with space exploration that the world once shared, she said. What science needs are more ambassadors. " We don't have a Carl Sagan right now, " she said -- a well-informed, ethical and passionate leader, versed in the arts and sciences, concerned about the planet yet willing to " get into any kind of trouble for the sake of the human future. " Druyan's lecture was one of many events on campus prefacing the Dalai Lama's Oct. 9 visit to Cornell. Many of the ideas she discussed are put forth in Sagan's latest book, " The Varieties of Scientific Experience: A Personal View of the Search for God, " which she edited. *Graduate student Melissa Rice is a writer intern at the Cornell Chronicle.* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 28, 2007 Report Share Posted December 28, 2007 Fascinating article ! Thx for that info on my two favorite heros of all time. I think Druyan is right, what we need are more ambassadors - we don't have a Carl Sagan right now...or do we? Who would you appoint? This would make an interesting thread...is there someone out there today representing the interests of the earth and all life on it, versed in the arts and sciences, and willing to " get into any kind of trouble for the sake of the human future. " Who would you nominate for the post? Cheers, Jigs, AN > > Fri, 28 Dec 2007 16:46:16 +0530 > <aapn > > Science and religion > > Dear colleagues, > I recently posted a message on religion and science > with regards to animal sacrifice where I mentioned a quote by the Dalai Lama > which was apparently made to the astronomer Carl Sagan. I could not confirm > that the interviewer was Sagan but I have come across this Cornell > University article which does indicate that the interviewer was indeed Carl > Sagan : http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/Oct07/Sagan.Dalai.cover.MR.html > Regards, > > > http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/Oct07/Sagan.Dalai.cover.MR.html > Oct. 3, 2007 > Carl Sagan and the Dalai Lama found deep connections in 1991-92 meetings, > says Sagan's widow > By Melissa Rice <cunews > > Religion and science do not have to be at odds. Science, said Ann Druyan, > widow of Cornell astronomer Carl Sagan, can communicate with, learn from and > even benefit from religion and vice versa. > > Jon Reis Photography > In 1991 Cornell Professor Carl Sagan had a lengthy conversation with the > Dalai Lama about science and religion. > > Druyan, a writer and media producer who collaborated with Sagan for 19 years > until his death in 1996, reflected on dialogues in the early 1990s between > Sagan and the Dalai Lama at a Sept. 28 lecture in Anabel Taylor Auditorium. > For the first time, film excerpts of the meeting between the two were shown > in a public venue. > > Sagan, Cornell professor and author of " Cosmos, " " Contact " and " Dragons of > Eden, " among other books, was perhaps best known for his extraordinary > ability to communicate science to the public. " He wanted to share with > everyone the wonder and awe that science inspired in him, " Druyan said. > > She stressed that there were political motivations behind Sagan's work as > well: " Carl believed that you can't have a democratic society if you have a > tiny scientific elite and a public who is uncomfortable with the methods and > language of science, " she said. > > Sagan entered the public eye in the 1960s -- a time rife with changes in > both culture and thought. The Catholic church had just switched from giving > masses in Latin to local languages so that everyone could understand them, > and Druyan said Sagan was trying to do the same for science. > > The Dalai Lama, who has had a lifelong interest in science, first met with > Sagan during a visit to Ithaca in 1991. Their discussion continued in India > the following year, where the Dalai Lama cleared his calendar to spend a > full day talking with Sagan and Druyan. > > Robert Barker/University Photography > On Sept. 28 at Cornell, Ann Druyan, writer and media producer and widow of > the late Carl Sagan, reflected on conversations Sagan had with the Dalai > Lama on science and religion in the early 1990s. > > In the short segment shown of their conversations, Sagan asked the Dalai > Lama about his beliefs in God and what he as a Buddhist would do if a > discovery in science conflicted with Buddhist doctrine. The Dalai Lama > replied that even Buddha was said to question his teachings and that > Buddhists rely on doctrine as " findings " rather than as " scripture. " > > " If through thorough investigation things become clear, only then is it time > to accept and believe, " he said. > > " So is there no conceivable scientific finding that would make you no longer > consider yourself a Buddhist? " Sagan responded. > > The Dalai Lama said there would be no point at which his spirituality and > his respect for science would come at such odds with each other. " Buddhism > is not so much a religion, but a 'science of the mind' or an 'inner science' > ... there is much benefit to learning from [scientists'] findings, " he > explained. > > Regarding the contributions of religion to science, Druyan said that while > science has developed an amazing library of facts, it does not have the > human social organization and the ability to inspire that religion has. > That's why we have lost that magical excitement with space exploration that > the world once shared, she said. > > What science needs are more ambassadors. " We don't have a Carl Sagan right > now, " she said -- a well-informed, ethical and passionate leader, versed in > the arts and sciences, concerned about the planet yet willing to " get into > any kind of trouble for the sake of the human future. " > > Druyan's lecture was one of many events on campus prefacing the Dalai Lama's > Oct. 9 visit to Cornell. Many of the ideas she discussed are put forth in > Sagan's latest book, " The Varieties of Scientific Experience: A Personal > View of the Search for God, " which she edited. > > *Graduate student Melissa Rice is a writer intern at the Cornell Chronicle.* > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 29, 2007 Report Share Posted December 29, 2007 Dear Jigme, I am glad to note your appreciation for Carl Sagan, he is my hero too. I have seen him only once on television during a programme on the History Channel but have read most of his books. His intellectual breadth is truly astonishing and every book shines with compassion and gentleness towards life on earth. In reply to your question on who could be a planetary ambassador, it might be difficult to choose one person. But I can suggest one individual who could be one. The man is Richard Dawkins, Charles Simonyi Professor of the Public Understanding of Science at Oxford University. Dawkins had great admiration for Sagan and had this to say about his colleague: " In my review for The Times of London of The Demon-Haunted World, I mentioned a chapter heading of Carl Sagan's Cosmos: " Who Speaks for Earth? " I went on that it was " a rhetorical question that expects no particular answer, but I presume to give it one. My candidate for planetary ambassador, my own nominee to present our credentials in galactic chancelleries, can be none other than Carl Sagan himself. He is wise, humane, polymathic, gentle, witty, well-read, and incapable of composing a dull sentence. In the Financial Times this year, I described him as " a beacon of clear light in a dark world of alien abductions and 'real-life X-files,' of psychic charlatans and New Age airheads, of fatcat astrologers giggling all the way to the millennium. " I met him only once, so my feeling of desolation and loss at his death is based entirely on his writings. Carl Sagan was one of the great literary stylists of our age, and he did it by giving proper weight to the poetry of science. It is hard to think of anyone whom our planet can so ill afford to lose. " Richard Dawkins has described religion as a virus and God as a delusion in his latest book 'The God Delusion'. His work is of particular interest since he is a zoologist who has spoken for granting human rights to great apes. You can read a very enlightening interview of Richard Dawkins on the following website : http://www.mukto-mona.com/rationalism/dawkins_gordy_slack.htm Thank you again for expressing your admiration for Carl Sagan and I agree with you when you say that the world desperately needs a man like him to take on religion so that monstrosities like animal sacrifice are put to an end. Cheers, On 12/28/07, Herojig <herojig wrote: > > Fascinating article ! Thx for that info on my two favorite > heros > of all time. I think Druyan is right, what we need are more ambassadors - > we > don't have a Carl Sagan right now...or do we? Who would you appoint? This > would make an interesting thread...is there someone out there today > representing the interests of the earth and all life on it, versed in > the arts and sciences, and willing to " get into any kind of trouble for > the > sake of the human future. " Who would you nominate for the post? > Cheers, > Jigs, AN > > <journalistandanimals<journalistandanimals%40gmail.com> > > > > Fri, 28 Dec 2007 16:46:16 +0530 > > <aapn <aapn%40>> > > Science and religion > > > > Dear colleagues, > > I recently posted a message on religion and science > > with regards to animal sacrifice where I mentioned a quote by the Dalai > Lama > > which was apparently made to the astronomer Carl Sagan. I could not > confirm > > that the interviewer was Sagan but I have come across this Cornell > > University article which does indicate that the interviewer was indeed > Carl > > Sagan : > http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/Oct07/Sagan.Dalai.cover.MR.html > > Regards, > > > > > > http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/Oct07/Sagan.Dalai.cover.MR.html > > Oct. 3, 2007 > > Carl Sagan and the Dalai Lama found deep connections in 1991-92 > meetings, > > says Sagan's widow > > By Melissa Rice <cunews <cunews%40cornell.edu>> > > > > Religion and science do not have to be at odds. Science, said Ann > Druyan, > > widow of Cornell astronomer Carl Sagan, can communicate with, learn from > and > > even benefit from religion and vice versa. > > > > Jon Reis Photography > > In 1991 Cornell Professor Carl Sagan had a lengthy conversation with the > > Dalai Lama about science and religion. > > > > Druyan, a writer and media producer who collaborated with Sagan for 19 > years > > until his death in 1996, reflected on dialogues in the early 1990s > between > > Sagan and the Dalai Lama at a Sept. 28 lecture in Anabel Taylor > Auditorium. > > For the first time, film excerpts of the meeting between the two were > shown > > in a public venue. > > > > Sagan, Cornell professor and author of " Cosmos, " " Contact " and " Dragons > of > > Eden, " among other books, was perhaps best known for his extraordinary > > ability to communicate science to the public. " He wanted to share with > > everyone the wonder and awe that science inspired in him, " Druyan said. > > > > She stressed that there were political motivations behind Sagan's work > as > > well: " Carl believed that you can't have a democratic society if you > have a > > tiny scientific elite and a public who is uncomfortable with the methods > and > > language of science, " she said. > > > > Sagan entered the public eye in the 1960s -- a time rife with changes in > > both culture and thought. The Catholic church had just switched from > giving > > masses in Latin to local languages so that everyone could understand > them, > > and Druyan said Sagan was trying to do the same for science. > > > > The Dalai Lama, who has had a lifelong interest in science, first met > with > > Sagan during a visit to Ithaca in 1991. Their discussion continued in > India > > the following year, where the Dalai Lama cleared his calendar to spend a > > full day talking with Sagan and Druyan. > > > > Robert Barker/University Photography > > On Sept. 28 at Cornell, Ann Druyan, writer and media producer and widow > of > > the late Carl Sagan, reflected on conversations Sagan had with the Dalai > > Lama on science and religion in the early 1990s. > > > > In the short segment shown of their conversations, Sagan asked the Dalai > > Lama about his beliefs in God and what he as a Buddhist would do if a > > discovery in science conflicted with Buddhist doctrine. The Dalai Lama > > replied that even Buddha was said to question his teachings and that > > Buddhists rely on doctrine as " findings " rather than as " scripture. " > > > > " If through thorough investigation things become clear, only then is it > time > > to accept and believe, " he said. > > > > " So is there no conceivable scientific finding that would make you no > longer > > consider yourself a Buddhist? " Sagan responded. > > > > The Dalai Lama said there would be no point at which his spirituality > and > > his respect for science would come at such odds with each other. > " Buddhism > > is not so much a religion, but a 'science of the mind' or an 'inner > science' > > ... there is much benefit to learning from [scientists'] findings, " he > > explained. > > > > Regarding the contributions of religion to science, Druyan said that > while > > science has developed an amazing library of facts, it does not have the > > human social organization and the ability to inspire that religion has. > > That's why we have lost that magical excitement with space exploration > that > > the world once shared, she said. > > > > What science needs are more ambassadors. " We don't have a Carl Sagan > right > > now, " she said -- a well-informed, ethical and passionate leader, versed > in > > the arts and sciences, concerned about the planet yet willing to " get > into > > any kind of trouble for the sake of the human future. " > > > > Druyan's lecture was one of many events on campus prefacing the Dalai > Lama's > > Oct. 9 visit to Cornell. Many of the ideas she discussed are put forth > in > > Sagan's latest book, " The Varieties of Scientific Experience: A Personal > > View of the Search for God, " which she edited. > > > > *Graduate student Melissa Rice is a writer intern at the Cornell > Chronicle.* > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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