Guest guest Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 1. The Myanmar cyclone and 2. The China Quake. Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that we all are aware of. After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding (and this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we can. Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their animals. Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an AFA but to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the miseries simply seem to be getting worse. With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who shares the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education which we all need. But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things through the past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. As for all of us, there is always a next time. Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes well. For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that online thingy fixed. Cheers !! Azam -- United against elephant polo http://www.stopelephantpolo.com http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Thank you Azam, it is a thoughtful suggestion, but I believe that the educational benefits in attending AfA, that you and Merritt rightly highlight in previous messages, are too important to ignore. The theme for the conference - Lessons Learned - couldn't be more apt from our perspective. Certainly my own presentation will now widen from discussing bear management to what we have learned here in Sichuan during the course of our work with companion animals in the earthquake affected areas. Many presenters and attendees have a wealth of experience to share in this respect and I know there is much we can do to improve in all areas of disaster relief together. I would hate to lose this opportunity to share the rights... and wrongs. Looking forward to seeing everyone there, Jill Jill Robinson MBE Founder & CEO Animals Asia Foundation Find out about our latest moon bear rescue in Chengdu, China and Friends....or Food http://www.animalsasia.org AZAM SIDDIQUI wrote: > > 1. The Myanmar cyclone and > > 2. The China Quake. > > Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that > we all > are aware of. > > After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding > (and > this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, > borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we > can. > Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this > awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of > attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel > expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their > animals. > Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. > We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to > utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an > AFA but > to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other > organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the > miseries > simply seem to be getting worse. > > With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who > shares > the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education > which we all need. > But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to > improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. > Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things > through the > past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. > I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the > FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other > non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. > As for all of us, there is always a next time. > Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes > well. > For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that > online thingy fixed. > > Cheers !! > > Azam > > -- > United against elephant polo > http://www.stopelephantpolo.com <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com> > http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui > <http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Hi Azam, I can understand that you feel we should help the Chinese, but why the Burmese? We are not granted any access nor any control how (read if) any aid is distributed to the victims. Are you suggesting to send money without strings attached to their government ? I am sure the Burmese military will soon put it all on a personal account in Switzerland... Furthermore you say; " Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. " Do you actually believe that either one of these two horrible regimes will learn to have any respect for animals if they can't even show any respect for humans, giving their past and current suppression of minorities and people that think different? I don't think so. I personally do not believe in supporting governments like this in any way and support complete isolation of these monsters. I would suggest you (and everyone else) spend their money where they think they can make the biggest difference , even if that is to attend a conference. PS the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing, I have seen all those animal and human NGO's walking around Southern Thailand after the Tsunami doing nothing else then making pictures for fundraising, some of them were only there because they felt their presence was expected by others. Wouldn't be surprised if that happens now again in Burma and China. The thoughts of Kim strike me also as very relevant on the future of so called " rescued " animals, when at what moment does the disaster relief actually end? Edwin Wiek WFFT Thailand _____ aapn [aapn ] On Behalf Of AZAM SIDDIQUI Friday, 06 June, 2008 4:47 PM aapn Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 1. The Myanmar cyclone and 2. The China Quake. Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that we all are aware of. After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding (and this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we can. Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their animals. Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an AFA but to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the miseries simply seem to be getting worse. With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who shares the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education which we all need. But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things through the past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. As for all of us, there is always a next time. Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes well. For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that online thingy fixed. Cheers !! Azam -- United against elephant polo http://www.stopelep <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com> hantpolo.com http://www.freewebs <http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui> .com/azamsiddiqui Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Couldn't agree more, Jill. See you all there. David Wong _____ aapn [aapn ] On Behalf Of Jill Robinson Saturday, June 07, 2008 7:30 AM AZAM SIDDIQUI Cc: aapn Re: Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 Thank you Azam, it is a thoughtful suggestion, but I believe that the educational benefits in attending AfA, that you and Merritt rightly highlight in previous messages, are too important to ignore. The theme for the conference - Lessons Learned - couldn't be more apt from our perspective. Certainly my own presentation will now widen from discussing bear management to what we have learned here in Sichuan during the course of our work with companion animals in the earthquake affected areas. Many presenters and attendees have a wealth of experience to share in this respect and I know there is much we can do to improve in all areas of disaster relief together. I would hate to lose this opportunity to share the rights... and wrongs. Looking forward to seeing everyone there, Jill Jill Robinson MBE Founder & CEO Animals Asia Foundation Find out about our latest moon bear rescue in Chengdu, China and Friends....or Food http://www.animalsa <http://www.animalsasia.org> sia.org AZAM SIDDIQUI wrote: > > 1. The Myanmar cyclone and > > 2. The China Quake. > > Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that > we all > are aware of. > > After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding > (and > this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, > borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we > can. > Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this > awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of > attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel > expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their > animals. > Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. > We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to > utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an > AFA but > to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other > organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the > miseries > simply seem to be getting worse. > > With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who > shares > the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education > which we all need. > But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to > improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. > Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things > through the > past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. > I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the > FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other > non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. > As for all of us, there is always a next time. > Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes > well. > For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that > online thingy fixed. > > Cheers !! > > Azam > > -- > United against elephant polo > http://www.stopelep <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com> hantpolo.com <http://www.stopelep <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com> hantpolo.com> > http://www.freewebs <http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui> ..com/azamsiddiqui > <http://www.freewebs <http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui> ..com/azamsiddiqui> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Dear Edwin, Let me write you our experience of floods of Mumbai in July 2005. I run small NGO 'PAWS' compared to the 'Leaders'. I shared my experience that time on AAPN. First time in my life I saw a disaster. The Mobile networks Jam, trains halted on spot, Water & electrical connections lost, my father didn't came back from his job. I felt like we landed on some planet. My younger brother Pradip who is that time Cameraman with zee news informed that buffalos were floating dead on water & some of them are tied in stables. The rain water is going in ears, eyes & mouth of buffalos. If the person like me will just keep quiet at that time, then I have no rights to do animal welfare. I personally went to all volunteers house taken them, took ambulance started collecting unwanted vegetables from market & reached to spot. Firstly we released all buffalo that are tied-up, then we started 'RESCUING' calves which were floating in water. RESCUE means - we catched them, shifted them to high area in Kalyan city where there is no flooded water. Many had to be treated for their wounds & leg injures. We could not rescue many calves who went in Ulhas river water as well as stuck-up in electrical boards. No matter municipal workers & fire brigade helped us a lot. They use to take food after 12 hours working. There are few buffalo calves & buffalos tangled in wire, trees. I had seen the mother buffalo died on spot because she could not run out of stable & the poor calf was standing on the dead mother's body & survived. We had to release & RESCUE the calf which was already infected with Pneumonia. Removing carcasses from stables was another hectic job, many times we had to break the walls with municipal dumpers & remove the dead one & RESCUE the alive one. We worked from 8th July till 15th August till all routine life started running back as normal. First help came from Kartick for medicines; neither had we gone to any international group not we felt that our presence should be there. Our presence was must there as no other NGO is existing except us. There lots of International Animal related magazines made articles & International NGO's offered their help (They are always looking out & wait for such opportunities). But we did that job by our money & funds & own volunteers. If the NGO's will not do RESCUE then who will feed the contents of disaster column to these animal / bird magazines / newspaper? They themselves created their own hero in these areas to keep them making news. Regards, Nilesh Bhanage Tel : 0251 - 2625059 Cell : 09820161114 " Hand that help is more holier than lips that pray! " Edwin Wiek [edwin.wiek] Saturday, June 07, 2008 12:16 PM aapn FW: Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 Hi Azam, I can understand that you feel we should help the Chinese, but why the Burmese? We are not granted any access nor any control how (read if) any aid is distributed to the victims. Are you suggesting to send money without strings attached to their government ? I am sure the Burmese military will soon put it all on a personal account in Switzerland... Furthermore you say; " Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. " Do you actually believe that either one of these two horrible regimes will learn to have any respect for animals if they can't even show any respect for humans, giving their past and current suppression of minorities and people that think different? I don't think so. I personally do not believe in supporting governments like this in any way and support complete isolation of these monsters. I would suggest you (and everyone else) spend their money where they think they can make the biggest difference , even if that is to attend a conference. PS the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing, I have seen all those animal and human NGO's walking around Southern Thailand after the Tsunami doing nothing else then making pictures for fundraising, some of them were only there because they felt their presence was expected by others. Wouldn't be surprised if that happens now again in Burma and China. The thoughts of Kim strike me also as very relevant on the future of so called " rescued " animals, when at what moment does the disaster relief actually end? Edwin Wiek WFFT Thailand _____ aapn <aapn%40> [aapn <aapn%40> ] On Behalf Of AZAM SIDDIQUI Friday, 06 June, 2008 4:47 PM aapn Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 1. The Myanmar cyclone and 2. The China Quake. Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that we all are aware of. After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding (and this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we can. Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their animals. Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an AFA but to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the miseries simply seem to be getting worse. With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who shares the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education which we all need. But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things through the past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. As for all of us, there is always a next time. Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes well. For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that online thingy fixed. Cheers !! Azam -- United against elephant polo http://www.stopelep <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com> > hantpolo.com http://www.freewebs <http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui <http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui> > .com/azamsiddiqui Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Edwin, Lemme clear the confusion. I meant aiding the animals in distress both in China and Myanmar. I am suggesting to assist those organisations who are involved on the ground in the post disaster rescue & rehab efforts. Animals Asia has been not only spearheading the animal rescue work in some of the worst affected regions of China but has assisted in saving human lives as well. Infact we filed a report on Animals Asia`s rescue work for NDTV where you would be surprised to know that Jill and her team were shown aiding the human victims and not animals, something which is so unique and a lesson which we all should learn. The reason that our bureau chief Mr. Kishalay Bhattacharjee insisted on highlighting this aspect of service is so that the animal people are not regarded as a community that is biased. I posted a weblink link to the news report on AAPN which was aired globally on Television and electronic news media. I am sure the Chinese authorities would be proud of Animals Asia for providing this yeoman service to their citizens. Similarly IFAW has appealed for aid as their team is still eagerly waiting for a green signal from the Burmese Junta. This whole world is just hoping for the best, hoping that just as the UN chief`s visit could help in sneaking some aid, maybe in sometime the Junta leaders hearts might melt. No harm in trying or helping those who are trying, right Edwin? If Ban Ki Moon can make a breakthrough I do not understand why we cant. When there are serious people on the job, I am sure there can be enormous breakthroughs in facilitating aid to animals in China and also to Myanmar (hopefully). Even I was skeptic about the Chinese government and sometime back was protesting to boycott the Olympics, till Jill justified the negatives of such a protest by the animal people and how it can affect the good work that is presntly on swing with regards to animal welfare in China. I am not suggesting that we pump the two Governments with funds, but yes what I am trying to say is to help ease the funding crisis that has been projected by Jill & IFAW. And I am atleast 100% confident that every penny sent to Animals Asia would be spent for a cause, whether it is the animals or humans they have proved that their attitude towards life of any form is equal. >the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing< The above is a general statement Edwin. Yes, you may have your reasons to say so, but such a general statement is would only make those genuinely sacrificing a little sad, specially when it comes from someone who has so much credibility and experience in this field. Azam On 6/7/08, Edwin Wiek <edwin.wiek wrote: > > Hi Azam, > > I can understand that you feel we should help the Chinese, but why the > Burmese? We are not granted any access nor any control how (read if) any > aid > is distributed to the victims. Are you suggesting to send money without > strings attached to their government ? I am sure the Burmese military will > soon put it all on a personal account in Switzerland... Furthermore you > say; > " Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. " Do you actually > believe that either one of these two horrible regimes will learn to have > any > respect for animals if they can't even show any respect for humans, giving > their past and current suppression of minorities and people that think > different? I don't think so. I personally do not believe in supporting > governments like this in any way and support complete isolation of these > monsters. I would suggest you (and everyone else) spend their money where > they think they can make the biggest difference , even if that is to attend > a conference. > > PS the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing, I have seen all > those animal and human NGO's walking around Southern Thailand after the > Tsunami doing nothing else then making pictures for fundraising, some of > them were only there because they felt their presence was expected by > others. Wouldn't be surprised if that happens now again in Burma and China. > The thoughts of Kim strike me also as very relevant on the future of so > called " rescued " animals, when at what moment does the disaster relief > actually end? > > > Edwin Wiek > WFFT Thailand > _____ > > aapn <aapn%40> [ > aapn <aapn%40>] On Behalf Of AZAM > SIDDIQUI > Friday, 06 June, 2008 4:47 PM > aapn > Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 > > 1. The Myanmar cyclone and > > 2. The China Quake. > > Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that we > all > are aware of. > > After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding (and > this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, > borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we > can. > Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this > awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of > attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel > expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their > animals. > Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. > We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to > utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an AFA > but > to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other > organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the > miseries > simply seem to be getting worse. > > With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who shares > the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education > which we all need. > But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to > improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. > Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things through > the > past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. > I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the > FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other > non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. > As for all of us, there is always a next time. > Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes > well. > For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that > online thingy fixed. > > Cheers !! > > Azam > > -- > United against elephant polo > http://www.stopelep <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com> hantpolo.com > http://www.freewebs <http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui> > .com/azamsiddiqui > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 One good cause is never a good reason to reject/avoid a second, If you feel strongly about one or the other and have only one option, feel that is where you will get or be the most benefit, go to it, get involved and report your experience welcomingly to the rest, but never allow a good cause to become an instrument to dampen enthusiasm for a second . Look for ways for the one to compliment the other. ;- ) - " AZAM SIDDIQUI " <azam24x7 " aapn " <aapn > Friday, June 06, 2008 6:46 AM Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 > 1. The Myanmar cyclone and > > 2. The China Quake. > > Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that we all > are aware of. > > After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding (and > this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, > borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we > can. > Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this > awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of > attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel > expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their > animals. > Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. > We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to > utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an AFA but > to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other > organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the miseries > simply seem to be getting worse. > > With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who shares > the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education > which we all need. > But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to > improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. > Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things through the > past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. > I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the > FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other > non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. > As for all of us, there is always a next time. > Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes > well. > For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that > online thingy fixed. > > Cheers !! > > Azam > > -- > United against elephant polo > http://www.stopelephantpolo.com > http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Hi Azam, I think you are making a conclusion about something I didn't say. I never questioned the work of Jill or AA at all. They are on the ground there and it is there home base. Of course they will do all they can and it is an extremely ugly job especially the first few days when there is death and misery all around them. I can only wish them all strength in helping out as I know very well how difficult it is especially the first hours after the disaster. Still the question is how do you aid animals if you can not get to them and you can not trust the local authorities you or others are forced to work through? That is the issue in Burma. Ban Ki Moon made a breakthrough? Veni, Vidi, Vici.... He went, he watched and said he got what he wanted. Now lots of NGO staff are stuck in hotels in Yangon waiting to get permission to go to the disaster area while the clock is still ticking. Most that came back to Bangkok were frustrated that they were not able to do much, seeing their food aid disappear in military trucks while rotting rice was distributed to the villagers. If you really believe that the heart of the Junta will melt seeing a few people help out victims in their country I think you are thinking of another country, maybe Lalaland. Wake up Azam, these people have so much blood on their hands, and now even put over a million people at risk of disease and starvation, it is not very likely they will remember what " sympathy or compassion " means. As for the general statement, maybe, but it is a general feeling. I was involved with some preperations in the last weeks to send in a team to Burma (as Thai vets and doctors were allowed in) but under the conditions the Junta sets it would not be ethically correct and we pulled out as it turned into a PR show. Some organizations don't seem to have a problem with this, we do. And please Azam I am not calling names so don't reply again concluding with someone's personal name or any organization. From my military background I can tell you that the Burma resistance might actually get stronger if the misery there continues on a longer term and people suffer badly for a longer time. It might make on the shorter term more victims, but will speed up the liberation of a country that is being suppressed by their military leader, saving many lives over the longer term. I know this is not a popular statement, but believe it is true. Cheers, Edwin _____ AZAM SIDDIQUI [azam24x7] Saturday, 07 June, 2008 7:51 PM edwin.wiek Cc: aapn Re: FW: Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 Edwin, Lemme clear the confusion. I meant aiding the animals in distress both in China and Myanmar. I am suggesting to assist those organisations who are involved on the ground in the post disaster rescue & rehab efforts. Animals Asia has been not only spearheading the animal rescue work in some of the worst affected regions of China but has assisted in saving human lives as well. Infact we filed a report on Animals Asia`s rescue work for NDTV where you would be surprised to know that Jill and her team were shown aiding the human victims and not animals, something which is so unique and a lesson which we all should learn. The reason that our bureau chief Mr. Kishalay Bhattacharjee insisted on highlighting this aspect of service is so that the animal people are not regarded as a community that is biased. I posted a weblink link to the news report on AAPN which was aired globally on Television and electronic news media. I am sure the Chinese authorities would be proud of Animals Asia for providing this yeoman service to their citizens. Similarly IFAW has appealed for aid as their team is still eagerly waiting for a green signal from the Burmese Junta. This whole world is just hoping for the best, hoping that just as the UN chief`s visit could help in sneaking some aid, maybe in sometime the Junta leaders hearts might melt. No harm in trying or helping those who are trying, right Edwin? If Ban Ki Moon can make a breakthrough I do not understand why we cant. When there are serious people on the job, I am sure there can be enormous breakthroughs in facilitating aid to animals in China and also to Myanmar (hopefully). Even I was skeptic about the Chinese government and sometime back was protesting to boycott the Olympics, till Jill justified the negatives of such a protest by the animal people and how it can affect the good work that is presntly on swing with regards to animal welfare in China. I am not suggesting that we pump the two Governments with funds, but yes what I am trying to say is to help ease the funding crisis that has been projected by Jill & IFAW. And I am atleast 100% confident that every penny sent to Animals Asia would be spent for a cause, whether it is the animals or humans they have proved that their attitude towards life of any form is equal. >the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing< The above is a general statement Edwin. Yes, you may have your reasons to say so, but such a general statement is would only make those genuinely sacrificing a little sad, specially when it comes from someone who has so much credibility and experience in this field. Azam On 6/7/08, Edwin Wiek <edwin.wiek wrote: Hi Azam, I can understand that you feel we should help the Chinese, but why the Burmese? We are not granted any access nor any control how (read if) any aid is distributed to the victims. Are you suggesting to send money without strings attached to their government ? I am sure the Burmese military will soon put it all on a personal account in Switzerland... Furthermore you say; " Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. " Do you actually believe that either one of these two horrible regimes will learn to have any respect for animals if they can't even show any respect for humans, giving their past and current suppression of minorities and people that think different? I don't think so. I personally do not believe in supporting governments like this in any way and support complete isolation of these monsters. I would suggest you (and everyone else) spend their money where they think they can make the biggest difference , even if that is to attend a conference. PS the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing, I have seen all those animal and human NGO's walking around Southern Thailand after the Tsunami doing nothing else then making pictures for fundraising, some of them were only there because they felt their presence was expected by others. Wouldn't be surprised if that happens now again in Burma and China. The thoughts of Kim strike me also as very relevant on the future of so called " rescued " animals, when at what moment does the disaster relief actually end? Edwin Wiek WFFT Thailand _____ aapn <aapn%40> [aapn <aapn%40> ] On Behalf Of AZAM SIDDIQUI Friday, 06 June, 2008 4:47 PM aapn Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 1. The Myanmar cyclone and 2. The China Quake. Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that we all are aware of. After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding (and this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we can. Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their animals. Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an AFA but to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the miseries simply seem to be getting worse. With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who shares the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education which we all need. But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things through the past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. As for all of us, there is always a next time. Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes well. For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that online thingy fixed. Cheers !! Azam -- United against elephant polo http://www.stopelep <http://www.stopelep/> <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com <http://www.stopelephantpolo.com/> > hantpolo.com <http://hantpolo.com/> http://www.freewebs <http://www.freewebs/> <http://www.freewebs.com/azamsiddiqui> .com/azamsiddiqui Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 13, 2008 Report Share Posted June 13, 2008 Dear All, I am compelled to comment on the suggestion below that we should only help animals and not people. What are we to judge that local people are not also animal lovers and the guardian of their own animals? How dare we to suggest that the way to " rescue " animals is to take them away from the Chinese? Stories coming out of China's earthquake zone demonstrating the bond and love between people and animals are countless, as the attached photo article from Chinese government media, the Xinhua news agency shows. When many areas in the quake zone started to implement dog culling to prevent disease, " mass dog killing " orders were questioned and criticized by people around China. In the quake zone, people have witnessed the heroic efforts of search and rescue dogs and many people's lives were saved because of dogs. To many quake survivors, their family pet may be the only family member they have left. IFAW's work in ZunDao is helping local people to help animals. Through providing help to animals, quake victims in the local community also benefit. IFAW's team comprised of Chinese veterinarians and emergency response specialists, went from village to village vaccinating dogs and distributing dog food. IFAW successfully persuaded government officials in Zun Dao county to replace dog culling with humane vaccination campaigns. When IFAW team went into villages looking for dogs to vaccinate, at first we faced skepticism. Villagers were afraid that their dogs might be killed, so they tried to hide their dogs. When reassured by our team that we are here to help their animals, they cooperated with us to get their animals vaccinated. This lady (Ms. Tan) holding a boy in one arm and a small dog in another, said that the dog came to her after the earthquake and refused to leave. She felt sorry for the dog and suspected that the dog must has lost his family in the quake. She brought the dog to be vaccinated and pledged to provide a home to the dog. IFAW team distributed dog food. In the Chinese country side, normally people feed dogs table scraps. Many people have never seen dog food. IFAW team members used this opportunity to explain to people about the benefit of vaccination, feeding dog food so they do not scavenge, urge people not to abandon their animals and educate people about other components of Responsible Pet Ownership. One old lady who lost her grand daughter in the quake, pledged to the IFAW team that she will take care of the three dogs left by her grand daughter. IFAW team trained local veterinarians on use of anesthetic gun and other humane animal handling techniques. But more importantly, our work raised local awareness about animal welfare and that humane treatment of animals is really for the benefit of people. Zun Dao government officials presented IFAW with an official letter of acknowledgement and called IFAW's help to Zun Dao " timely rain in a long drought " . By separating animals from people and somehow making a distinction between helping animals from helping people, we are hurting our own cause of promoting animal welfare. The calls for boycotting Olympics because of China's animal welfare record does the same. They not only hurt the work for groups working in China to change animal policies, they pit the world against the Chinese, even though we are all love animals! Best, Grace Grace Ge Gabriel Asia Regional Director-IFAW Mobile:+1-508-496-4471(US) Mobile: +86-13701299387 (China) www.ifaw.org <http://www.ifaw.org/> ________________________________ aapn [aapn ] On Behalf Of AZAM SIDDIQUI Saturday, June 07, 2008 8:51 AM edwin.wiek Cc: aapn Re: FW: Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 Edwin, Lemme clear the confusion. I meant aiding the animals in distress both in China and Myanmar. I am suggesting to assist those organisations who are involved on the ground in the post disaster rescue & rehab efforts. Animals Asia has been not only spearheading the animal rescue work in some of the worst affected regions of China but has assisted in saving human lives as well. Infact we filed a report on Animals Asia`s rescue work for NDTV where you would be surprised to know that Jill and her team were shown aiding the human victims and not animals, something which is so unique and a lesson which we all should learn. The reason that our bureau chief Mr. Kishalay Bhattacharjee insisted on highlighting this aspect of service is so that the animal people are not regarded as a community that is biased. I posted a weblink link to the news report on AAPN which was aired globally on Television and electronic news media. I am sure the Chinese authorities would be proud of Animals Asia for providing this yeoman service to their citizens. Similarly IFAW has appealed for aid as their team is still eagerly waiting for a green signal from the Burmese Junta. This whole world is just hoping for the best, hoping that just as the UN chief`s visit could help in sneaking some aid, maybe in sometime the Junta leaders hearts might melt. No harm in trying or helping those who are trying, right Edwin? If Ban Ki Moon can make a breakthrough I do not understand why we cant. When there are serious people on the job, I am sure there can be enormous breakthroughs in facilitating aid to animals in China and also to Myanmar (hopefully). Even I was skeptic about the Chinese government and sometime back was protesting to boycott the Olympics, till Jill justified the negatives of such a protest by the animal people and how it can affect the good work that is presntly on swing with regards to animal welfare in China. I am not suggesting that we pump the two Governments with funds, but yes what I am trying to say is to help ease the funding crisis that has been projected by Jill & IFAW. And I am atleast 100% confident that every penny sent to Animals Asia would be spent for a cause, whether it is the animals or humans they have proved that their attitude towards life of any form is equal. >the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing< The above is a general statement Edwin. Yes, you may have your reasons to say so, but such a general statement is would only make those genuinely sacrificing a little sad, specially when it comes from someone who has so much credibility and experience in this field. Azam On 6/7/08, Edwin Wiek <edwin.wiek <edwin.wiek%40wfft.org> > wrote: > > Hi Azam, > > I can understand that you feel we should help the Chinese, but why the > Burmese? We are not granted any access nor any control how (read if) any > aid > is distributed to the victims. Are you suggesting to send money without > strings attached to their government ? I am sure the Burmese military will > soon put it all on a personal account in Switzerland... Furthermore you > say; > " Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. " Do you actually > believe that either one of these two horrible regimes will learn to have > any > respect for animals if they can't even show any respect for humans, giving > their past and current suppression of minorities and people that think > different? I don't think so. I personally do not believe in supporting > governments like this in any way and support complete isolation of these > monsters. I would suggest you (and everyone else) spend their money where > they think they can make the biggest difference , even if that is to attend > a conference. > > PS the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing, I have seen all > those animal and human NGO's walking around Southern Thailand after the > Tsunami doing nothing else then making pictures for fundraising, some of > them were only there because they felt their presence was expected by > others. Wouldn't be surprised if that happens now again in Burma and China. > The thoughts of Kim strike me also as very relevant on the future of so > called " rescued " animals, when at what moment does the disaster relief > actually end? > > > Edwin Wiek > WFFT Thailand > _____ > > aapn <aapn%40> <aapn%40> [ > aapn <aapn%40> <aapn%40>] On Behalf Of AZAM > SIDDIQUI > Friday, 06 June, 2008 4:47 PM > aapn > Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 > > 1. The Myanmar cyclone and > > 2. The China Quake. > > Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that we > all > are aware of. > > After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding (and > this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, > borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we > can. > Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this > awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of > attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel > expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their > animals. > Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. > We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to > utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an AFA > but > to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other > organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the > miseries > simply seem to be getting worse. > > With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who shares > the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education > which we all need. > But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to > improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. > Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things through > the > past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. > I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the > FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other > non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. > As for all of us, there is always a next time. > Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes > well. > For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that > online thingy fixed. > > Cheers !! > > Azam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 Dear All, I normally try not to get involved in these types of controversies as long as something positive is being done for any body or group. I have read and re-read Grace's letter and its attachments in this mail, and seem to find no mention about taking away animals from the Chinese or that only animals should be helped and not people. However, I must add that animal welfare organisations have as their main mandate the protection of animals and, as far as I know, much work to help humans has been a collateral affair. May be I have missed some earlier mail where the suggestions Grace has objected to have been made. As I keep repeating, one cannot be the most effective animal person if she/he is not a people person, too. Warm regards. Chinny Krishna Blue Cross of India www.bluecrossofindia.org <http://www.bluecrossofindia.org/> aapn [aapn ] On Behalf Of Gabriel, Grace 13 June 2008 22:15 aapn Cc: Milburn, Cindy; Cady, AJ FW: Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 Dear All, I am compelled to comment on the suggestion below that we should only help animals and not people. What are we to judge that local people are not also animal lovers and the guardian of their own animals? How dare we to suggest that the way to " rescue " animals is to take them away from the Chinese? Stories coming out of China's earthquake zone demonstrating the bond and love between people and animals are countless, as the attached photo article from Chinese government media, the Xinhua news agency shows. When many areas in the quake zone started to implement dog culling to prevent disease, " mass dog killing " orders were questioned and criticized by people around China. In the quake zone, people have witnessed the heroic efforts of search and rescue dogs and many people's lives were saved because of dogs. To many quake survivors, their family pet may be the only family member they have left. IFAW's work in ZunDao is helping local people to help animals. Through providing help to animals, quake victims in the local community also benefit. IFAW's team comprised of Chinese veterinarians and emergency response specialists, went from village to village vaccinating dogs and distributing dog food. IFAW successfully persuaded government officials in Zun Dao county to replace dog culling with humane vaccination campaigns. When IFAW team went into villages looking for dogs to vaccinate, at first we faced skepticism. Villagers were afraid that their dogs might be killed, so they tried to hide their dogs. When reassured by our team that we are here to help their animals, they cooperated with us to get their animals vaccinated. This lady (Ms. Tan) holding a boy in one arm and a small dog in another, said that the dog came to her after the earthquake and refused to leave. She felt sorry for the dog and suspected that the dog must has lost his family in the quake. She brought the dog to be vaccinated and pledged to provide a home to the dog. IFAW team distributed dog food. In the Chinese country side, normally people feed dogs table scraps. Many people have never seen dog food. IFAW team members used this opportunity to explain to people about the benefit of vaccination, feeding dog food so they do not scavenge, urge people not to abandon their animals and educate people about other components of Responsible Pet Ownership. One old lady who lost her grand daughter in the quake, pledged to the IFAW team that she will take care of the three dogs left by her grand daughter. IFAW team trained local veterinarians on use of anesthetic gun and other humane animal handling techniques. But more importantly, our work raised local awareness about animal welfare and that humane treatment of animals is really for the benefit of people. Zun Dao government officials presented IFAW with an official letter of acknowledgement and called IFAW's help to Zun Dao " timely rain in a long drought " . By separating animals from people and somehow making a distinction between helping animals from helping people, we are hurting our own cause of promoting animal welfare. The calls for boycotting Olympics because of China's animal welfare record does the same. They not only hurt the work for groups working in China to change animal policies, they pit the world against the Chinese, even though we are all love animals! Best, Grace Grace Ge Gabriel Asia Regional Director-IFAW Mobile:+1-508-496-4471(US) Mobile: +86-13701299387 (China) www.ifaw.org <http://www.ifaw. <http://www.ifaw.org/> org/> ________________________________ aapn (AT) (DOT) <aapn%40> com [aapn (AT) (DOT) <aapn%40> com] On Behalf Of AZAM SIDDIQUI Saturday, June 07, 2008 8:51 AM edwin.wiek (AT) wfft (DOT) <edwin.wiek%40wfft.org> org Cc: aapn (AT) (DOT) <aapn%40> com Re: FW: Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 Edwin, Lemme clear the confusion. I meant aiding the animals in distress both in China and Myanmar. I am suggesting to assist those organisations who are involved on the ground in the post disaster rescue & rehab efforts. Animals Asia has been not only spearheading the animal rescue work in some of the worst affected regions of China but has assisted in saving human lives as well. Infact we filed a report on Animals Asia`s rescue work for NDTV where you would be surprised to know that Jill and her team were shown aiding the human victims and not animals, something which is so unique and a lesson which we all should learn. The reason that our bureau chief Mr. Kishalay Bhattacharjee insisted on highlighting this aspect of service is so that the animal people are not regarded as a community that is biased. I posted a weblink link to the news report on AAPN which was aired globally on Television and electronic news media. I am sure the Chinese authorities would be proud of Animals Asia for providing this yeoman service to their citizens. Similarly IFAW has appealed for aid as their team is still eagerly waiting for a green signal from the Burmese Junta. This whole world is just hoping for the best, hoping that just as the UN chief`s visit could help in sneaking some aid, maybe in sometime the Junta leaders hearts might melt. No harm in trying or helping those who are trying, right Edwin? If Ban Ki Moon can make a breakthrough I do not understand why we cant. When there are serious people on the job, I am sure there can be enormous breakthroughs in facilitating aid to animals in China and also to Myanmar (hopefully). Even I was skeptic about the Chinese government and sometime back was protesting to boycott the Olympics, till Jill justified the negatives of such a protest by the animal people and how it can affect the good work that is presntly on swing with regards to animal welfare in China. I am not suggesting that we pump the two Governments with funds, but yes what I am trying to say is to help ease the funding crisis that has been projected by Jill & IFAW. And I am atleast 100% confident that every penny sent to Animals Asia would be spent for a cause, whether it is the animals or humans they have proved that their attitude towards life of any form is equal. >the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing< The above is a general statement Edwin. Yes, you may have your reasons to say so, but such a general statement is would only make those genuinely sacrificing a little sad, specially when it comes from someone who has so much credibility and experience in this field. Azam On 6/7/08, Edwin Wiek <edwin.wiek (AT) wfft (DOT) <edwin.wiek%40wfft.org> org <edwin.wiek%40wfft.org> > wrote: > > Hi Azam, > > I can understand that you feel we should help the Chinese, but why the > Burmese? We are not granted any access nor any control how (read if) any > aid > is distributed to the victims. Are you suggesting to send money without > strings attached to their government ? I am sure the Burmese military will > soon put it all on a personal account in Switzerland... Furthermore you > say; > " Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. " Do you actually > believe that either one of these two horrible regimes will learn to have > any > respect for animals if they can't even show any respect for humans, giving > their past and current suppression of minorities and people that think > different? I don't think so. I personally do not believe in supporting > governments like this in any way and support complete isolation of these > monsters. I would suggest you (and everyone else) spend their money where > they think they can make the biggest difference , even if that is to attend > a conference. > > PS the so called disaster relief is almost a fashion thing, I have seen all > those animal and human NGO's walking around Southern Thailand after the > Tsunami doing nothing else then making pictures for fundraising, some of > them were only there because they felt their presence was expected by > others. Wouldn't be surprised if that happens now again in Burma and China. > The thoughts of Kim strike me also as very relevant on the future of so > called " rescued " animals, when at what moment does the disaster relief > actually end? > > > Edwin Wiek > WFFT Thailand > _____ > > aapn (AT) (DOT) <aapn%40> com <aapn%40> <aapn%40> [ > aapn (AT) (DOT) <aapn%40> com <aapn%40> <aapn%40>] On Behalf Of AZAM > SIDDIQUI > Friday, 06 June, 2008 4:47 PM > aapn > Two reasons to avoid AFA- 2008 > > 1. The Myanmar cyclone and > > 2. The China Quake. > > Both of the above disasters have left the two nations in a state that we > all > are aware of. > > After getting Jill`s mail which explains the need of immediate funding (and > this is not a small amount), must not we explore all ways of how to beg, > borrow or steal it from all sources and help Animals Asia in every way we > can. > Imagine if the people of China and Burma (Myanmar) come to know of this > awesome sacrifice by the animal people of this globe who instead of > attending the conference wish to donate the savings of air-fare/ hotel > expenses/ conference registrations and divert them to the aid of their > animals. > Certainly this gesture would go a long way in helping the Chinese/ Burmese > authorities to look more humanely towards the animals. > We can also speak with the sponsors and tell them that the best way to > utilize and contribute to animal welfare NOW is not in sponsoring an AFA > but > to sponsor the activities of Animal Asia, SPCA-HK, IFAW and other > organisations who are tirelessly working day in and day out but the > miseries > simply seem to be getting worse. > > With due respect to the note Merritt has written, and as someone who shares > the same opinion with him that conferences are a warehouse of education > which we all need. > But let us not be self centered at the moment, let us not work on how to > improve our personal standards when such a crisis is over our heads. > Jill and their Animals Asia team have taught us many good things through > the > past conferences and this is the time to pay them back. > I feel that this is a time that we must macro FOCUS on those who need the > FUNDS on priority. By saying this I am not ignoring the needs of the other > non Chinese/ Myanmar organisations. > As for all of us, there is always a next time. > Maybe we can have a more GALA conference God willing next year if all goes > well. > For this year let us make AAPN a more happening forum till we get that > online thingy fixed. > > Cheers !! > > Azam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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