Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 which ones are you talking about peter? my earthlink has been cranky lately Peter Jun 20, 2008 7:40 AM Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter “We now know that a neo-conservative is an arsonist who sets the house on fire and six years later boasts that no one can put it out.†- Bill Moyers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Hi Peter I think we should keep them off - mainly because we are a chat list, and it can be tiresome to read these when you just want to chat. Obviously I'll go with the majority. BBJo - Peter Friday, June 20, 2008 4:40 PM Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008  Hi Fraggle The two particular ones - there was one with a dog looking for a home, but asking for $500 to be paid, and another asking people to donate $20 to help farm animals. Obviously if they hadn't been related to helping animals / veganism in any way, it wouldn't be a question, but I guess what I'd like to ascertain is where list members feel we should draw the line. BB Peter - fraggle Friday, June 20, 2008 6:14 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails which ones are you talking about peter? my earthlink has been cranky lately Peter Jun 20, 2008 7:40 AM Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter “We now know that a neo-conservative is an arsonist who sets the house on fire and six years later boasts that no one can put it out.†- Bill Moyers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 If the solicitations are for an appropriate cause, then yes allow them. It may be the email that saves a life. One can always delete. You've said it never happened before. If it becomes a real problem, you always have the option to stop them.Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we are here we might as well dance.--- On Fri, 6/20/08, Peter <metalscarab wrote: Peter <metalscarab Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Date: Friday, June 20, 2008, 11:40 AM Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 Your the moderator, So moderate! personally, couldnt give a monkeys, my delete button is primed and ready for any begging mail............ Peter vv Peter <metalscarab Sent: Friday, 20 June, 2008 4:40:53 PM Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter Sent from Mail. A Smarter Email. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 ah..ok.... i let that one thru i believe...sorry about that... personally, as long as the person talks occasionally and its not just this sorta thing, i don't mind. cheers fraggle Peter Jun 20, 2008 9:51 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi Fraggle The two particular ones - there was one with a dog looking for a home, but asking for $500 to be paid, and another asking people to donate $20 to help farm animals. Obviously if they hadn't been related to helping animals / veganism in any way, it wouldn't be a question, but I guess what I'd like to ascertain is where list members feel we should draw the line. BB Peter - fraggle Friday, June 20, 2008 6:14 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails which ones are you talking about peter? my earthlink has been cranky lately Peter Jun 20, 2008 7:40 AM Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter “We now know that a neo-conservative is an arsonist who sets the house on fire and six years later boasts that no one can put it out.†- Bill Moyers “We now know that a neo-conservative is an arsonist who sets the house on fire and six years later boasts that no one can put it out.†- Bill Moyers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008  Hi Fraggle No need to apologise - we've never had a rule about it before, so no reason not to have let it through. Just want to get a feeling for what people want us to do with these sort of things in the future.... BB Peter - fraggle Friday, June 20, 2008 8:08 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails ah..ok.... i let that one thru i believe...sorry about that... personally, as long as the person talks occasionally and its not just this sorta thing, i don't mind. cheers fraggle Peter Jun 20, 2008 9:51 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi Fraggle The two particular ones - there was one with a dog looking for a home, but asking for $500 to be paid, and another asking people to donate $20 to help farm animals. Obviously if they hadn't been related to helping animals / veganism in any way, it wouldn't be a question, but I guess what I'd like to ascertain is where list members feel we should draw the line. BB Peter - fraggle Friday, June 20, 2008 6:14 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails which ones are you talking about peter? my earthlink has been cranky lately Peter Jun 20, 2008 7:40 AM Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter “We now know that a neo-conservative is an arsonist who sets the house on fire and six years later boasts that no one can put it out.†- Bill Moyers “We now know that a neo-conservative is an arsonist who sets the house on fire and six years later boasts that no one can put it out.†- Bill Moyers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2008 Report Share Posted June 20, 2008 I think if someone gives, from the goodness of their heart, their time and efforts to save an animal from being put down, and then asks for a donation to help cover their expenses from a perspective owner, that is not only justified but will protect the animal form a noncaring person adopting, and is a a fine example of what being vegan is about. Should the number of tofu recipes from any one person be limited? .--- On Fri, 6/20/08, fraggle <EBbrewpunx wrote: fraggle <EBbrewpunxRe: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Date: Friday, June 20, 2008, 3:08 PM ah..ok.... i let that one thru i believe...sorry about that... personally, as long as the person talks occasionally and its not just this sorta thing, i don't mind. cheers fraggle Peter Jun 20, 2008 9:51 AM @gro ups.com Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi Fraggle The two particular ones - there was one with a dog looking for a home, but asking for $500 to be paid, and another asking people to donate $20 to help farm animals. Obviously if they hadn't been related to helping animals / veganism in any way, it wouldn't be a question, but I guess what I'd like to ascertain is where list members feel we should draw the line. BB Peter - fraggle @gro ups.com Friday, June 20, 2008 6:14 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails which ones are you talking about peter? my earthlink has been cranky lately Peter Jun 20, 2008 7:40 AM @gro ups.com Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Hi everyone We've had a couple of e-mails today from folks who contribute to the list, which are asking for donations. It's odd that we've never had this before, and then we get two in one day, but I'd like to seek the opinion of list members on whether these should be allowed on the list in the future. Just to put my view: I feel that we are a chat list, and that while we may have an interest in similar causes which often need money to help them run, it isn't appropriate for a chat list to become a place for organisations or individuals to solicit financial aid. Having said that, I would like to get a general feel for how others view this, before we make a rule regarding this sort of e-mail... so, what do people think... should e-mails soliciting money (for vegan-sympathetic causes) be allowed on the list, or should we keep them off? BB Peter “We now know that a neo-conservative is an arsonist who sets the house on fire and six years later boasts that no one can put it out.†- Bill Moyers “We now know that a neo-conservative is an arsonist who sets the house on fire and six years later boasts that no one can put it out.†- Bill Moyers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008  Hi all Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a "donation" to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow "marketplace" advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008  Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. BBJo - Peter Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi all Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a "donation" to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow "marketplace" advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 You have no idea of the situation with the rescue of the dog Jake. You should consider inquiring about the rescue and I am certain you will change your mind. This truly saddens me.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, jo <jo.heartwork wrote: jo <jo.heartworkRe: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Date: Saturday, June 21, 2008, 10:30 AM  Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. BBJo - Peter @gro ups.com Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi all Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a "donation" to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow "marketplace" advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 I only know what was on the e-mail, so don't know about the whole situation.However, I do know that when most people rescue an animal and then can't look after it themselves, for whatever reason, they will be happy to find a new home for it without asking for a fairly hefty chunk of cash into the bargain. I've known a large number of situations where animals have been rescued by individuals who have found themselves unable to look after that animal, and the only time they have asked anything with regards to finance is an assurance that the person taking the animal on can afford the vets bills - they have never asked anything for themselves from it, usually because they do not like making animals into comodities to be bought and sold! BBPeter2008/6/21 lei subigone <subigone: You have no idea of the situation with the rescue of the dog Jake. You should consider inquiring about the rescue and I am certain you will change your mind. This truly saddens me.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, jo <jo.heartwork wrote: jo <jo.heartworkRe: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Date: Saturday, June 21, 2008, 10:30 AM  Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. BBJo - Peter @gro ups.com Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi all Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a " donation " to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow " marketplace " advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 You are assuming that this person is making a profit, which is not the case, therefore your argument holds no water. I won't say any more regarding this matter.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, Peter Kebbell <metalscarab wrote: Peter Kebbell <metalscarabRe: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Date: Saturday, June 21, 2008, 11:33 AM I only know what was on the e-mail, so don't know about the whole situation.However, I do know that when most people rescue an animal and then can't look after it themselves, for whatever reason, they will be happy to find a new home for it without asking for a fairly hefty chunk of cash into the bargain.I've known a large number of situations where animals have been rescued by individuals who have found themselves unable to look after that animal, and the only time they have asked anything with regards to finance is an assurance that the person taking the animal on can afford the vets bills - they have never asked anything for themselves from it, usually because they do not like making animals into comodities to be bought and sold!BBPeter 2008/6/21 lei subigone <subigone >: You have no idea of the situation with the rescue of the dog Jake. You should consider inquiring about the rescue and I am certain you will change your mind. This truly saddens me.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com> wrote: jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com>Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails@gro ups.comSaturday, June 21, 2008, 10:30 AM  Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. BBJo - Peter @gro ups.com Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi all Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a "donation" to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow "marketplace" advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008  This whole argument seems to suggest to me that it would definitely be best not to have this sort of post on this group. Jo - lei subigone Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:06 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails You are assuming that this person is making a profit, which is not the case, therefore your argument holds no water. I won't say any more regarding this matter.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, Peter Kebbell <metalscarab > wrote: Peter Kebbell <metalscarab >Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Date: Saturday, June 21, 2008, 11:33 AM I only know what was on the e-mail, so don't know about the whole situation.However, I do know that when most people rescue an animal and then can't look after it themselves, for whatever reason, they will be happy to find a new home for it without asking for a fairly hefty chunk of cash into the bargain.I've known a large number of situations where animals have been rescued by individuals who have found themselves unable to look after that animal, and the only time they have asked anything with regards to finance is an assurance that the person taking the animal on can afford the vets bills - they have never asked anything for themselves from it, usually because they do not like making animals into comodities to be bought and sold!BBPeter 2008/6/21 lei subigone <subigone >: You have no idea of the situation with the rescue of the dog Jake. You should consider inquiring about the rescue and I am certain you will change your mind. This truly saddens me.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com> wrote: jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com>Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails@gro ups.comSaturday, June 21, 2008, 10:30 AM  Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. BBJo - Peter @gro ups.com Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi all Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a "donation" to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow "marketplace" advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008  No, I'm assuming that they are asking for a set amount of money in order for someone to take ownership of a dog. However you look at it, that is selling. BB Peter - lei subigone Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:06 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails You are assuming that this person is making a profit, which is not the case, therefore your argument holds no water. I won't say any more regarding this matter.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, Peter Kebbell <metalscarab wrote: Peter Kebbell <metalscarabRe: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails Date: Saturday, June 21, 2008, 11:33 AM I only know what was on the e-mail, so don't know about the whole situation.However, I do know that when most people rescue an animal and then can't look after it themselves, for whatever reason, they will be happy to find a new home for it without asking for a fairly hefty chunk of cash into the bargain.I've known a large number of situations where animals have been rescued by individuals who have found themselves unable to look after that animal, and the only time they have asked anything with regards to finance is an assurance that the person taking the animal on can afford the vets bills - they have never asked anything for themselves from it, usually because they do not like making animals into comodities to be bought and sold!BBPeter 2008/6/21 lei subigone <subigone >: You have no idea of the situation with the rescue of the dog Jake. You should consider inquiring about the rescue and I am certain you will change your mind. This truly saddens me.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com> wrote: jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com>Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails@gro ups.comSaturday, June 21, 2008, 10:30 AM  Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. BBJo - Peter @gro ups.com Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi all Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a "donation" to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow "marketplace" advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 I think that some animal charities, ask for you to pay for speying/neutering etc before you take the animal home, but it is normally a minimum ammount? I could be wrong? Peter vv Peter <metalscarab Sent: Saturday, 21 June, 2008 8:59:37 PMRe: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  No, I'm assuming that they are asking for a set amount of money in order for someone to take ownership of a dog. However you look at it, that is selling. BB Peter - lei subigone @gro ups.com Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:06 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails You are assuming that this person is making a profit, which is not the case, therefore your argument holds no water. I won't say any more regarding this matter.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, Peter Kebbell <metalscarab@ gmail.com> wrote: Peter Kebbell <metalscarab@ gmail.com>Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails@gro ups.comSaturday, June 21, 2008, 11:33 AM I only know what was on the e-mail, so don't know about the whole situation.However, I do know that when most people rescue an animal and then can't look after it themselves, for whatever reason, they will be happy to find a new home for it without asking for a fairly hefty chunk of cash into the bargain.I've known a large number of situations where animals have been rescued by individuals who have found themselves unable to look after that animal, and the only time they have asked anything with regards to finance is an assurance that the person taking the animal on can afford the vets bills - they have never asked anything for themselves from it, usually because they do not like making animals into comodities to be bought and sold!BBPeter 2008/6/21 lei subigone <subigone >: You have no idea of the situation with the rescue of the dog Jake. You should consider inquiring about the rescue and I am certain you will change your mind. This truly saddens me.--- On Sat, 6/21/08, jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com> wrote: jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com>Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails@gro ups.comSaturday, June 21, 2008, 10:30 AM  Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. BBJo - Peter @gro ups.com Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails  Hi all Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a "donation" to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow "marketplace" advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? BB Peter Sent from Mail. A Smarter Email. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 I am new on here, so dont know if this will get published or not. I actually run a cat rescue, as well as working full time, and if we didnt ask for donations when rehoming, we simply wouldnt be able to keep going. The donation we ask for is only ever a fraction of what the cat has actually cost us. Years ago we didnt push for a donation- we were just glad that the cat was now in a loving home. The result of that policy was me pouring so much of my own money into the cat rescue that I am hideously in debt, to the point of possibly losing my home, which is also home for all the unhomeable cats here. How are small rescues supposed to keep rescuing when they have run out of money? If there's people out there who reckon its possible to keep rescuing and rehoming without asking for donations, then great, get yourselves rescuing then- the more rescuers the better, because there's a heck of a lot out there needs rescuing. , " Peter " <metalscarab wrote: > > No, I'm assuming that they are asking for a set amount of money in order for someone to take ownership of a dog. However you look at it, that is selling. > > BB > Peter > - > lei subigone > > Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:06 PM > Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails > > > You are assuming that this person is making a profit, which is not the case, therefore your argument holds no water. I won't say any more regarding this matter. > > --- On Sat, 6/21/08, Peter Kebbell <metalscarab wrote: > > Peter Kebbell <metalscarab > Re: Opinions wanted on donation e- mails > > Saturday, June 21, 2008, 11:33 AM > > > I only know what was on the e-mail, so don't know about the whole situation. > > However, I do know that when most people rescue an animal and then can't look after it themselves, for whatever reason, they will be happy to find a new home for it without asking for a fairly hefty chunk of cash into the bargain. > > I've known a large number of situations where animals have been rescued by individuals who have found themselves unable to look after that animal, and the only time they have asked anything with regards to finance is an assurance that the person taking the animal on can afford the vets bills - they have never asked anything for themselves from it, usually because they do not like making animals into comodities to be bought and sold! > > BB > Peter > > > > 2008/6/21 lei subigone <subigone >: > > You have no idea of the situation with the rescue of the dog Jake. You should consider inquiring about the rescue and I am certain you will change your mind. This truly saddens me. > --- On Sat, 6/21/08, jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com> wrote: > > jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com> > Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails > @gro ups.com > Saturday, June 21, 2008, 10:30 AM > > >  > > Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. > > I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. > > BB > Jo > > > - > Peter > @gro ups.com > Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM > Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails > > >  > > Hi all > > Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. > > However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. > > I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a " donation " to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! > > So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow " marketplace " advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? > > BB > Peter > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2008 Report Share Posted June 21, 2008 Hi moggymutt :-) No reason this wouldn't get onto the list. I think you've sort of made my point - you ask for donations. That is very different to saying that " you must pay $xxx to take ownership " . One is asking for people to help your organisation to continue to do its good work without putting a price on it, the other is selling. BB Peter - " moggymutt " <moggymutt Saturday, June 21, 2008 9:34 PM Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails I am new on here, so dont know if this will get published or not. I actually run a cat rescue, as well as working full time, and if we didnt ask for donations when rehoming, we simply wouldnt be able to keep going. The donation we ask for is only ever a fraction of what the cat has actually cost us. Years ago we didnt push for a donation- we were just glad that the cat was now in a loving home. The result of that policy was me pouring so much of my own money into the cat rescue that I am hideously in debt, to the point of possibly losing my home, which is also home for all the unhomeable cats here. How are small rescues supposed to keep rescuing when they have run out of money? If there's people out there who reckon its possible to keep rescuing and rehoming without asking for donations, then great, get yourselves rescuing then- the more rescuers the better, because there's a heck of a lot out there needs rescuing. , " Peter " <metalscarab wrote: > > No, I'm assuming that they are asking for a set amount of money in order for someone to take ownership of a dog. However you look at it, that is selling. > > BB > Peter > - > lei subigone > > Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:06 PM > Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails > > > You are assuming that this person is making a profit, which is not the case, therefore your argument holds no water. I won't say any more regarding this matter. > > --- On Sat, 6/21/08, Peter Kebbell <metalscarab wrote: > > Peter Kebbell <metalscarab > Re: Opinions wanted on donation e- mails > > Saturday, June 21, 2008, 11:33 AM > > > I only know what was on the e-mail, so don't know about the whole situation. > > However, I do know that when most people rescue an animal and then can't look after it themselves, for whatever reason, they will be happy to find a new home for it without asking for a fairly hefty chunk of cash into the bargain. > > I've known a large number of situations where animals have been rescued by individuals who have found themselves unable to look after that animal, and the only time they have asked anything with regards to finance is an assurance that the person taking the animal on can afford the vets bills - they have never asked anything for themselves from it, usually because they do not like making animals into comodities to be bought and sold! > > BB > Peter > > > > 2008/6/21 lei subigone <subigone >: > > You have no idea of the situation with the rescue of the dog Jake. You should consider inquiring about the rescue and I am certain you will change your mind. This truly saddens me. > --- On Sat, 6/21/08, jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com> wrote: > > jo <jo.heartwork@ gmail.com> > Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails > @gro ups.com > Saturday, June 21, 2008, 10:30 AM > > >  > > Good points Peter - I must admit I did not read the posts properly as I saw they were wanting donations. I agree that this would seem like a money-making venture - most people would have just been pleased to save the animal and pass it to a good home. > > I think there should be no posts where money is wanted, and no adverts. I think we should keep it as a chat group, with the odd information on events, restaurants etc. > > BB > Jo > > > - > Peter > @gro ups.com > Saturday, June 21, 2008 8:37 AM > Re: Opinions wanted on donation e-mails > > >  > > Hi all > > Thanks for the opinions so far on this issue - I hope there will still be a few more. > > However, I don't think anyone has yet given an opinion on exactly where we should draw the line when it comes to people or organisations using vegan chat list to raise funds for their causes, or using the list as a marketplace for selling items or pets. > > I do find it interesting how people have viewed the posts in question. A few people have commented on the one selling the dog for $500 that it seems reasonable to ask for a " donation " to cover their expenses. However, I would suggest that if you put a price tag on something, no matter how flowery you put the wording around it, you are selling an item. If a person selling would like a donation, it would have been far more reasonable in my view to highlight how much had been spent on saving the animal's life, and say that they would appreciate a donation to help cover their costs... without putting a figure on it! > > So, where do we draw the line? Do we allow " marketplace " advertisements for pets? Do we allow fund-raising requests from charities? What should and shouldn't we allow? > > BB > Peter > --- To send an email to -! Groups Links Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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