Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are looking for. Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or place of, his other activities, can there be a help to the seeker? Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. " Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5 Love to all, Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Dear Alan, this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge liberates, not action. Om Arunachala, Richard , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs wrote: > > Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are looking for. > > Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or place of, his other activities, can there be a help to the seeker? > Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. " > > Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5 > > Love to all, > > Alan > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Dear Richard, Yes indeed, Thanks, Alan --- On Wed, 1/10/08, Richard Clarke <richard wrote: Richard Clarke <richard Re: The False Guru Wednesday, 1 October, 2008, 1:54 PM Dear Alan, this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge liberates, not action. Om Arunachala, Richard , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote: > > Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are looking for. > > Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or place of, his other activities, can there be a help to the seeker? > Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. " > > Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5 > > Love to all, > > Alan > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 " Richard Clarke " <richard wrote: > this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge > liberates, not action. > And the very backbone of the whole Advaita Vedanta. Yours in bhagavan, Mouna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 , " upadesa " <maunna wrote: > > " Richard Clarke " <richard@> wrote: > > > this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge > > liberates, not action. > > > > And the very backbone of the whole Advaita Vedanta. > > Yours in bhagavan, > Mouna > Liberation liberates. Nothing else. ~A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Here is the original text as there could be something 'between' the first lines. Alan Q: There are a number of spiritual teachers teaching various paths. Whom should one take for one's Guru? A: Choose that one where you find you get shanti [peace]. Q: Should we not also consider his teachings? A: He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or in place of, his other activities, can that be a help to the seeker? Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent happiness. If activity is advocated the adviser is not a master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. Q: How can I find my own Guru? A: By intense meditation. Q: If it is true that the Guru is one's own Self, what is the principle underlying the doctrine which says that, however learned a disciple may be or whatever occult powers he may possess, he cannot attain Self-realization without the grace of the Guru? A: Although in absolute truth the state of the Guru is that of oneself [the Self], it is very hard for the self which has become the individual [jiva] through ignorance to realize its true state or nature without the grace of the Guru. On Wed, October 1, 2008 14:54, Richard Clarke wrote: > Dear Alan, > > > this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge liberates, not > action. > > Om Arunachala, > Richard > > > , Alan Jacobs > <alanadamsjacobs wrote: > >> >> Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are >> > looking for. >> >> Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is >> > not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace > and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells > him to do something in addition to, or place of, his other activities, can there be > a help to the seeker? >> Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's >> > inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a master but a > killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be > said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the > aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. " >> >> Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5 >> >> >> Love to all, >> >> >> Alan >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Dear Alan, Thanks for expanding this quotation more fully. I am sure it will help clarify Ramana's position on this question. Regards, Alan --- On Wed, 1/10/08, alan <alan wrote: alan <alan Re: Re: The False Guru Wednesday, 1 October, 2008, 4:48 PM Here is the original text as there could be something 'between' the first lines. Alan Q: There are a number of spiritual teachers teaching various paths. Whom should one take for one's Guru? A: Choose that one where you find you get shanti [peace]. Q: Should we not also consider his teachings? A: He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or in place of, his other activities, can that be a help to the seeker? Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent happiness. If activity is advocated the adviser is not a master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. Q: How can I find my own Guru? A: By intense meditation. Q: If it is true that the Guru is one's own Self, what is the principle underlying the doctrine which says that, however learned a disciple may be or whatever occult powers he may possess, he cannot attain Self-realization without the grace of the Guru? A: Although in absolute truth the state of the Guru is that of oneself [the Self], it is very hard for the self which has become the individual [jiva] through ignorance to realize its true state or nature without the grace of the Guru. On Wed, October 1, 2008 14:54, Richard Clarke wrote: > Dear Alan, > > > this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge liberates, not > action. > > Om Arunachala, > Richard > > > , Alan Jacobs > <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote: > >> >> Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are >> > looking for. >> >> Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is >> > not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace > and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells > him to do something in addition to, or place of, his other activities, can there be > a help to the seeker? >> Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's >> > inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a master but a > killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be > said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the > aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. " >> >> Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5 >> >> >> Love to all, >> >> >> Alan >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Dear Alan (ferryfee), I feel your hunch is right that there could be something ‘between’ the first lines. They *may* contain a reference to someone or some particular teaching known to the questioner and Bhagavan. Or they might be meant specifically for this individual questioner. After all, if one reads “Living by the Words of Bhagavan” we find Annamalai Swami’s life with Ramana was filled directions from Ramana which involved a great deal of activity and work on Annamalai’s part. Peter On Behalf Of alan 01 October 2008 16:48 Re: [ - Ramana Guru] Re: The False Guru Here is the original text as there could be something 'between' the first lines. Alan Q: There are a number of spiritual teachers teaching various paths. Whom should one take for one's Guru? A: Choose that one where you find you get shanti [peace]. Q: Should we not also consider his teachings? A: He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or in place of, his other activities, can that be a help to the seeker? Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent happiness. If activity is advocated the adviser is not a master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. <snip> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Its not even knowledge in the sense it is translated, this is second hand information borrowed from without. Nisargadatta talks of prior to 'I am'... before you ate the fruit of knowledge and it got stuck in the throat chakra. It's your own inner "recognition" or "apperception" - your own innocent simplicity is wisdom. -d --- On Wed, 10/1/08, upadesa <maunna wrote: upadesa <maunna Re: The False Guru Date: Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 10:01 AM "Richard Clarke" <richard > wrote:> this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge> liberates, not action. > And the very backbone of the whole Advaita Vedanta.Yours in bhagavan,Mouna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 , " Richard Clarke " <richard wrote: > > Dear Alan, > > this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge > liberates, not action. > > Om Arunachala, > Richard > > , Alan Jacobs > <alanadamsjacobs@> wrote: > > > > Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are > looking for. > > > > Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is > not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities > and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his > activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or > place of, his other activities, can there be a help to the seeker? > > Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's > inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a > master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] > or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. > Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his > fetters. " > > > > Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5 > > > > Love to all, > > > > Alan Namaste, When you compare Ramana to the 'Road Show' gurus one can see the difference. Most have frenetic activity and donating sums all the time, or building this or that to keep the deal going........Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Dave Sirjue <davesirjue wrote: > > Its not even knowledge in the sense it is translated, this is second hand information borrowed from without. In the Advaita Vedanta sense, Jnanam is the Knowledge of the Self, and as Bhagavan pointed out, " To Know the Self is to Be the Self " . The same same idea was expanded in Upadesa Saram. For the second part of the sentence, ALL information is borrowed from without, since the mind and the intellect with all their opinions is also the " without " . Within there is only All Pervading Silence and Fullness. Richard's posting is correct in many ways, since Karma yoga (action as sadhana surrendering the fruits to the Lord) is only a preparation for Jnanam (Knowledge), and both require Bhakti (the combination of Karma and Jnanam) since the Highest Devotion is the dissolution of the apparent separation between " me " and the Self. Regards, Mouna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Sudhuji, Yuh gotta be careful here... Within is the ego too ...all the bundle of thoughts, feeling, sensations, judgements, emotions and so on. The ego will disguise itself in all forms, trying everything under the sun to protect iand perpetuate itself. The Seer or Witness to silence is still a dual experience and is actually the ego in its most transformed subtle and casual forms. Disidentifcation from ego is no easy business and there's no way out. Yuh ain't got a chance as 'you're no where in the picture. Yamraj makes this point clear to Nakichetas: "Not by any effort of meditations, yoga, tapasya, listening, reading and so on but to whom the Self chooses, it is revealed" Krishna says in Gita somewhere 1 in millions ever make it or know Him as he demonstrates to his lovers the gopis promising he'll return but he never never shows up. -d--- On Wed, 10/1/08, upadesa <maunna wrote: upadesa <maunna Re: The False Guru Date: Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 2:56 PM Dave Sirjue <davesirjue@ ...> wrote:>> Its not even knowledge in the sense it is translated, this is secondhand information borrowed from without. In the Advaita Vedanta sense, Jnanam is the Knowledge of the Self, andas Bhagavan pointed out, "To Know the Self is to Be the Self". The same same idea was expanded in Upadesa Saram.For the second part of the sentence, ALL information is borrowed fromwithout, since the mind and the intellect with all their opinions isalso the "without". Within there is only All Pervading Silence andFullness.Richard's posting is correct in many ways, since Karma yoga (action assadhana surrendering the fruits to the Lord) is only a preparation forJnanam (Knowledge), and both require Bhakti (the combination of Karmaand Jnanam) since the Highest Devotion is the dissolution of theapparent separation between "me" and the Self.Regards,Mouna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 1, 2008 Report Share Posted October 1, 2008 Dave Sirjue <davesirjue wrote: > Yuh gotta be careful here... Within is the ego too ... I think you understood what I was saying. Actually Dave, since you want precision, there is no such thing as within or without, ego or you name it. I respect your position, honestly, but something doesn't seem to happen in our lines of communication, hope you know what I mean. So it's fine, let's leave it there. Yours in Bhagavan, Mouna (Funny enough, I have another dear friend that also follows the Saiva lines and we have a very hard time communicating some simple issues about Reality, what I learned recently is that it's an old indian tradition that Kashmir Saivism and Advaita Vedanta, although sprouting from the same seed, have a hard time dissolving their differences) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 --- On Wed, 10/1/08, upadesa <maunna wrote: upadesa <maunna Re: The False Guru Date: Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 6:38 PM Dave Sirjue <davesirjue@ ...> wrote: > Yuh gotta be careful here... Within is the ego too ...I think you understood what I was saying. Actually Dave, since you want precision, there is no such thing aswithin or without, ego or you name it. I respect your position, honestly, but something doesn't seem tohappen in our lines of communication, hope you know what I mean.So it's fine, let's leave it there.Yours in Bhagavan,Mouna(Funny enough, I have another dear friend that also follows the Saivalines and we have a very hard time communicating some simple issuesabout Reality, what I learned recently is that it's an old indiantradition that Kashmir Saivism and Advaita Vedanta, although sproutingfrom the same seed, have a hard time dissolving their differences) Let's leave aside our personal philosophical predispositions; you're not going to dodge your way out so easily by trying to dismiss a key point someone made... that is discourteous in local parlance. How could you say, if you're in your right mind, there are no such things as name and forms ? Would you tell a policeman that there is no one driving a car or that there is no car when you are caught speeding ? He'll figure you went bazokee and send you to the bunkers for good! Remember the joke of the elephant and the seeker that Ramakrishna once told ? Come good -dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 Dave Sirjue <davesirjue wrote: > > Let's leave aside our personal philosophical predispositions; you're not going to dodge your way out so easily by trying to dismiss a key point someone made... that is discourteous in local parlance. > How could you say, if you're in your right mind, there are no such things as name and forms ? Would you tell a policeman that there is no one driving a car or that there is no car when you are caught speeding ? > He'll figure you went bazokee and send you to the bunkers for good! > Remember the joke of the elephant and the seeker that Ramakrishna once told ? > Come good > -dave Dave! I just have a kind of epiphany! Because that is exactly the kind of discussions I was having with my friend, and he is a dear friend I tell you!! Sometimes we found ourselves SCRRRREAMING our lungs out in those discussions in indian restaurants in LA. People watching those two strange characters screaming about " if the world is real or not? " !!!, I'm sure they thought we were nuts! (and we were in a way...), now is much more calm, actually we don't discuss so much. Anyhow, I'm not dodging my way out, and sorry if I was " discourteous " , maybe it's because I'm not local. That being said: It is with my " left mind " that I will say that there is no such thing as name and form, with my " right mind (or brain) " I will acknowledge that apparent " reality " . I hope you read enough Advaita V. to understand what I'm talking about. The policeman, the car, the speed, the ticket, the money, the telling him: " I'm sorry officer, I didn't notice " , him telling me: " I'm also sorry sir, sign here! " , the bazokee, the bunkers, the elephant, the guru steping aside, you, me him/her or Him/Her, That, and all the rest of infinite etcaeteras are simply " Mythia " ... relative, transactional apparent namarupaik reality that seems to be there but in actual and factual investigation proves to be changing, not-solid and conceptual, ergo, apparent. This is the little detail that makes the difference between our views. The bottom line is that there is no bottom line, Advaita means... well I don't have to tell you that, right? Did I come good enough? All the best, friend, Yours in Bhagavan, Mouna (and without screaming...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 Hi Alan,This is a really tough-to-digest teaching of Bhagavan Ramana. Many of the great saints like Swami Vivekananda and Swami Sivananda (founder of Divine Life Society) have advocated intense activity in the form of selfless Karma Yoga. Even Lord Krishna advocates intense selfless activity to Arjuna (who wanted to become a mendicant). Here below is a small extract from Swami Sivananda's writings on the Karma Yoga teachings of Gandhiji: Study the autobiography of Mahatma Gandhi. He never made any difference between menial service and dignified work. Scavenging or cleaning the latrines were the highest yoga for him, the highest puja. He annihilated his illusory little `I' through this service. Many highly educated persons joined his ashram to learn yoga under him. They thought that Gandhiji would teach them yoga in some mysterious manner, in a private room. They thought that he would teach them pranayama, meditation, awakening of the kundalini, etc. They were asked to clean the latrines first. Gandhiji used to mend his own shoes. He himself used to grind the flour. He would take upon himself the work of others when they were unable to do their allotted portion of work. When an educated person, a new ashramite, felt shy to do grinding work, Gandhiji himself would do the work in front of him. And then the man would willingly do the work the next day. Try to do daily as many virtuous actions as possible. When you go to sleep have a review of your day's actions. Mark them in your spiritual diary. Performance of virtuous actions is the beginning of spiritual life. Repeat mentally or silently with the breath, the Lord's name  such as Hari Om, Sri Ram, or your own ishta mantra. Do this even when you are working in the office. A strong habit of repetition of the mantra will soon be formed. Karma, according to Jaimini Rishi, is the performance of agnihotra and other vedic rituals. According to the Gita, any action done with niskamya bhava (unselfishly, motivelessly) , is karma yoga. Lord Krishna says: "Work incessantly. Your duty is to work but not to expect the fruits thereof." The central teaching of the Gita is non attachment to work. Breathing, eating, seeing, hearing, thinking, etc., are all karmas. Service of your guru or a mahatma (saint) is the highest form of karma yoga. This purifies your heart quickly. Contact with a great soul or guru has immense advantages. You will benefit by the magnetic aura of the great personage. You will draw inspiration from him. Check out the all-new face of India. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 Dear Sri Rajesh Kumar, Ramana's injunction that it was harmfulto command activity by Gurus to their devotees was not in my view a criticism of Karma or Bhakti Yoga. Bhagavan's Maha Yoga is said to incorporate all the Yogas of Kharma Yoga, Bhakti Yoga and of course Jnana Yoga. It is documented that several of Bhagavan's devotees engaged in 'activities' under his supervision such as Annamalia Swami and Kunju Swami. The point is that Bhagavan seems to have rather made suggestions to his Devotees in reponse to their questions rather than giving them orders and a prescribed regimen of sadhana as is done in many Ashrams. I feel he knew that ordering them what to do as a matter of regimen, was an interference and cast a shadow between their Inner ruler or Guru within or their own Real SELF, from which intimate guidance and grace always flow. There is no doubt that the names your cite were great Jnanis , but Jnana can be reached by way of Karma Yoga and Bhakti Yoga as well as Atma Vichara and Jnana Yoga. Bhagavan never, ever denied this possibility. I trust this makes it easier to digest. All best wishes and regards, Alan --- On Thu, 2/10/08, A T Rajesh Kumar <gabbardaaku wrote: A T Rajesh Kumar <gabbardaaku Re:The False Guru Thursday, 2 October, 2008, 8:03 AM Hi Alan, This is a really tough-to-digest teaching of Bhagavan Ramana. Many of the great saints like Swami Vivekananda and Swami Sivananda (founder of Divine Life Society) have advocated intense activity in the form of selfless Karma Yoga. Even Lord Krishna advocates intense selfless activity to Arjuna (who wanted to become a mendicant). Here below is a small extract from Swami Sivananda's writings on the Karma Yoga teachings of Gandhiji: Study the autobiography of Mahatma Gandhi. He never made any difference between menial service and dignified work. Scavenging or cleaning the latrines were the highest yoga for him, the highest puja. He annihilated his illusory little `I' through this service. Many highly educated persons joined his ashram to learn yoga under him. They thought that Gandhiji would teach them yoga in some mysterious manner, in a private room. They thought that he would teach them pranayama, meditation, awakening of the kundalini, etc. They were asked to clean the latrines first. Gandhiji used to mend his own shoes. He himself used to grind the flour. He would take upon himself the work of others when they were unable to do their allotted portion of work. When an educated person, a new ashramite, felt shy to do grinding work, Gandhiji himself would do the work in front of him. And then the man would willingly do the work the next day. Try to do daily as many virtuous actions as possible. When you go to sleep have a review of your day's actions. Mark them in your spiritual diary. Performance of virtuous actions is the beginning of spiritual life. Repeat mentally or silently with the breath, the Lord's name such as Hari Om, Sri Ram, or your own ishta mantra. Do this even when you are working in the office. A strong habit of repetition of the mantra will soon be formed. Karma, according to Jaimini Rishi, is the performance of agnihotra and other vedic rituals. According to the Gita, any action done with niskamya bhava (unselfishly, motivelessly) , is karma yoga. Lord Krishna says: " Work incessantly. Your duty is to work but not to expect the fruits thereof. " The central teaching of the Gita is non attachment to work. Breathing, eating, seeing, hearing, thinking, etc., are all karmas. Service of your guru or a mahatma (saint) is the highest form of karma yoga. This purifies your heart quickly. Contact with a great soul or guru has immense advantages. You will benefit by the magnetic aura of the great personage. You will draw inspiration from him. Check out the all-new face of India. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008  Dear Sri Rajesh Kumar for myself it is like this Sri Ramana Maharsha advised us all to get rid of the SENSE OF DOERSHIP and in my personal experience this IS IT as long as we believe we have done something or we have failed: we are bound in a prison..... in His Grace - A T Rajesh Kumar Thursday, October 02, 2008 9:03 AM Re:The False Guru Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.173 / Virus Database: 270.7.5/1702 - Release 01/10/2008 9.05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 David, Yes, it is not cognitive, mental knowledge, but rather Self-knowledge (at the same 'level' as the knowledge that you exist. Do you need to think to exist or to know that you exist?). If you look carefully in the posting you will see that Knowledge is capitalized. This is a hint at its special meaning as Self-knowledge. Om Arunachala, Richard , Dave Sirjue <davesirjue wrote: > > Its not even knowledge in the sense it is translated, this is second hand information borrowed from without. Nisargadatta talks of prior to 'I am'... before you ate the fruit of knowledge and it got stuck in the throat chakra. > > It's your own inner " recognition " or " apperception " - your own innocent simplicity > is wisdom. > > -d > > --- On Wed, 10/1/08, upadesa <maunna wrote: > > upadesa <maunna > Re: The False Guru > > Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 10:01 AM " Richard Clarke " <richard@ > wrote: > > > this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge > > liberates, not action. > > > > And the very backbone of the whole Advaita Vedanta. > > Yours in bhagavan, > Mouna > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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