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Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are looking for.

 

Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true

master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants peace and

rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher tells

him to do something in addition to, or place of, his other activities, can there

be a help to the seeker?

Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent

happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a master but a killer. In

such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may be said to

have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant,

he can only strengthen his fetters. "

 

Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5

 

Love to all,

 

Alan

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Dear Alan,

 

this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge

liberates, not action.

 

Om Arunachala,

Richard

 

, Alan Jacobs

<alanadamsjacobs wrote:

>

> Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are

looking for.

>

> Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is

not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities

and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his

activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or

place of, his other activities, can there be a help to the seeker?

> Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's

inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a

master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma]

or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master.

Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his

fetters. "

>

> Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5

>

> Love to all,

>

> Alan

>

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Dear Richard,

 

Yes indeed, Thanks,

 

Alan

 

--- On Wed, 1/10/08, Richard Clarke <richard wrote:

 

Richard Clarke <richard

Re: The False Guru

 

Wednesday, 1 October, 2008, 1:54 PM

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Alan,

 

this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge

liberates, not action.

 

Om Arunachala,

Richard

 

, Alan Jacobs

<alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote:

>

> Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are

looking for.

>

> Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is

not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities

and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his

activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or

place of, his other activities, can there be a help to the seeker?

> Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's

inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a

master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma]

or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master.

Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his

fetters. "

>

> Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5

>

> Love to all,

>

> Alan

>

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" Richard Clarke " <richard wrote:

 

> this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge

> liberates, not action.

>

 

And the very backbone of the whole Advaita Vedanta.

 

Yours in bhagavan,

Mouna

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, " upadesa " <maunna wrote:

>

> " Richard Clarke " <richard@> wrote:

>

> > this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge

> > liberates, not action.

> >

>

> And the very backbone of the whole Advaita Vedanta.

>

> Yours in bhagavan,

> Mouna

>

 

 

Liberation liberates. Nothing else.

 

~A

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Here is the original text as there could be something 'between' the first lines.

 

 

Alan

 

 

Q: There are a number of spiritual teachers teaching various

paths. Whom should one take for one's Guru?

A: Choose that one where you find you get shanti [peace].

Q: Should we not also consider his teachings?

A: He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true

master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants

peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If

a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or in place of, his

other activities, can that be a help to the seeker?

Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent

happiness. If activity is advocated the adviser is not a master but a

killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death

[Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a

person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters.

Q: How can I find my own Guru?

A: By intense meditation.

Q: If it is true that the Guru is one's own Self, what is the principle

underlying the doctrine which says that, however learned a disciple

may be or whatever occult powers he may possess, he cannot attain

Self-realization without the grace of the Guru?

A: Although in absolute truth the state of the Guru is that of

oneself [the Self], it is very hard for the self which has become the

individual [jiva] through ignorance to realize its true state or nature

without the grace of the Guru.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On Wed, October 1, 2008 14:54, Richard Clarke wrote:

> Dear Alan,

>

>

> this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge liberates, not

> action.

>

> Om Arunachala,

> Richard

>

>

> , Alan Jacobs

> <alanadamsjacobs wrote:

>

>>

>> Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are

>>

> looking for.

>>

>> Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is

>>

> not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants

peace

> and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher

tells

> him to do something in addition to, or place of, his other activities, can

there be

> a help to the seeker?

>> Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's

>>

> inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a master but a

> killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may

be

> said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the

> aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. "

>>

>> Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5

>>

>>

>> Love to all,

>>

>>

>> Alan

>>

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Dear Alan,

 

Thanks for expanding this quotation more fully. I am sure it will help clarify

Ramana's position on this question.

 

Regards,

 

Alan

 

--- On Wed, 1/10/08, alan <alan wrote:

 

alan <alan

Re: Re: The False Guru

 

Wednesday, 1 October, 2008, 4:48 PM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here is the original text as there could be something 'between' the first lines.

 

Alan

 

Q: There are a number of spiritual teachers teaching various

paths. Whom should one take for one's Guru?

A: Choose that one where you find you get shanti [peace].

Q: Should we not also consider his teachings?

A: He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true

master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants

peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If

a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or in place of, his

other activities, can that be a help to the seeker?

Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent

happiness. If activity is advocated the adviser is not a master but a

killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death

[Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a

person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters.

Q: How can I find my own Guru?

A: By intense meditation.

Q: If it is true that the Guru is one's own Self, what is the principle

underlying the doctrine which says that, however learned a disciple

may be or whatever occult powers he may possess, he cannot attain

Self-realization without the grace of the Guru?

A: Although in absolute truth the state of the Guru is that of

oneself [the Self], it is very hard for the self which has become the

individual [jiva] through ignorance to realize its true state or nature

without the grace of the Guru.

 

On Wed, October 1, 2008 14:54, Richard Clarke wrote:

> Dear Alan,

>

>

> this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge liberates, not

> action.

>

> Om Arunachala,

> Richard

>

>

> , Alan Jacobs

> <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote:

>

>>

>> Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are

>>

> looking for.

>>

>> Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is

>>

> not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants

peace

> and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If a teacher

tells

> him to do something in addition to, or place of, his other activities, can

there be

> a help to the seeker?

>> Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's

>>

> inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a master but a

> killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death [Yama] may

be

> said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a person cannot liberate the

> aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters. "

>>

>> Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5

>>

>>

>> Love to all,

>>

>>

>> Alan

>>

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Dear Alan (ferryfee),

 

I feel your hunch is right that there

could be something ‘between’ the first lines. They *may* contain a reference to someone or some

particular teaching known to the questioner and Bhagavan. Or they might be

meant specifically for this individual questioner. After all, if one

reads “Living by the Words of Bhagavan” we find Annamalai Swami’s

life with Ramana was filled directions from Ramana which involved a great deal

of activity and work on Annamalai’s part.

 

Peter

 

 

 

 

 

On Behalf Of alan

01 October 2008 16:48

 

Re: [ -

Ramana Guru] Re: The False Guru

 

 

 

 

Here is the original text as there could be something 'between' the first

lines.

 

Alan

 

Q: There are a number of spiritual teachers teaching various

paths. Whom should one take for one's Guru?

A: Choose that one where you find you get shanti [peace].

Q: Should we not also consider his teachings?

A: He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is not a true

master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities and wants

peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his activities. If

a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or in place of, his

other activities, can that be a help to the seeker?

Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's inherent

happiness. If activity is advocated the adviser is not a master but a

killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma] or death

[Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master. Such a

person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his fetters.

 

<snip>

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Its not even knowledge in the sense it is translated, this is second hand information borrowed from without. Nisargadatta talks of prior to 'I am'... before you ate the fruit of knowledge and it got stuck in the throat chakra.

 

It's your own inner "recognition" or "apperception" - your own innocent simplicity

is wisdom.

 

-d --- On Wed, 10/1/08, upadesa <maunna wrote:

upadesa <maunna Re: The False Guru Date: Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 10:01 AM

 

 

"Richard Clarke" <richard > wrote:> this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge> liberates, not action. > And the very backbone of the whole Advaita Vedanta.Yours in bhagavan,Mouna

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, " Richard Clarke " <richard

wrote:

>

> Dear Alan,

>

> this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge

> liberates, not action.

>

> Om Arunachala,

> Richard

>

> , Alan Jacobs

> <alanadamsjacobs@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Tony, Richard and others , here is the exact quote you are

> looking for.

> >

> > Bhagavan: " He who instructs an ardent seeker to do this or that is

> not a true master. The seeker is already afflicted by his activities

> and wants peace and rest. In other words he wants cessation of his

> activities. If a teacher tells him to do something in addition to, or

> place of, his other activities, can there be a help to the seeker?

> > Activity is creation. Activity is the destruction of one's

> inherent happiness. If activiy is advocated the adviser is not a

> master but a killer. In such circumstances either the creator [brahma]

> or death [Yama] may be said to have come in the guise of a master.

> Such a person cannot liberate the aspirant, he can only strengthen his

> fetters. "

> >

> > Godman be As You Are P 97 and Talks P 544-5

> >

> > Love to all,

> >

> > Alan

 

Namaste,

 

When you compare Ramana to the 'Road Show' gurus one can see the

difference. Most have frenetic activity and donating sums all the

time, or building this or that to keep the deal going........Tony

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Dave Sirjue <davesirjue wrote:

>

> Its not even knowledge in the sense it is translated, this is second

hand information borrowed from without. 

 

In the Advaita Vedanta sense, Jnanam is the Knowledge of the Self, and

as Bhagavan pointed out, " To Know the Self is to Be the Self " .

The same same idea was expanded in Upadesa Saram.

For the second part of the sentence, ALL information is borrowed from

without, since the mind and the intellect with all their opinions is

also the " without " . Within there is only All Pervading Silence and

Fullness.

Richard's posting is correct in many ways, since Karma yoga (action as

sadhana surrendering the fruits to the Lord) is only a preparation for

Jnanam (Knowledge), and both require Bhakti (the combination of Karma

and Jnanam) since the Highest Devotion is the dissolution of the

apparent separation between " me " and the Self.

 

Regards,

Mouna

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Sudhuji,

 

Yuh gotta be careful here... Within is the ego too ...all the bundle of thoughts, feeling, sensations, judgements, emotions and so on. The ego will disguise itself in all forms, trying everything under the sun to protect iand perpetuate itself. The Seer or Witness to silence is still a dual experience and is actually the ego in its most transformed subtle and casual forms.

 

Disidentifcation from ego is no easy business and there's no way out. Yuh ain't got a chance as 'you're no where in the picture. Yamraj makes this point clear to Nakichetas: "Not by any effort of meditations, yoga, tapasya, listening, reading and so on but to whom the Self chooses, it is revealed"

 

Krishna says in Gita somewhere 1 in millions ever make it or know Him as he demonstrates to his lovers the gopis promising he'll return but he never never shows up.

:)

-d--- On Wed, 10/1/08, upadesa <maunna wrote:

upadesa <maunna Re: The False Guru Date: Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 2:56 PM

 

 

Dave Sirjue <davesirjue@ ...> wrote:>> Its not even knowledge in the sense it is translated, this is secondhand information borrowed from without. In the Advaita Vedanta sense, Jnanam is the Knowledge of the Self, andas Bhagavan pointed out, "To Know the Self is to Be the Self". The same same idea was expanded in Upadesa Saram.For the second part of the sentence, ALL information is borrowed fromwithout, since the mind and the intellect with all their opinions isalso the "without". Within there is only All Pervading Silence andFullness.Richard's posting is correct in many ways, since Karma yoga (action assadhana surrendering the fruits to the Lord) is only a preparation forJnanam (Knowledge), and both require Bhakti (the combination of Karmaand Jnanam) since the Highest Devotion is the dissolution of theapparent separation between "me" and the

Self.Regards,Mouna

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Dave Sirjue <davesirjue wrote:

 

> Yuh gotta be careful here... Within is the ego too ...

 

I think you understood what I was saying.

Actually Dave, since you want precision, there is no such thing as

within or without, ego or you name it.

I respect your position, honestly, but something doesn't seem to

happen in our lines of communication, hope you know what I mean.

So it's fine, let's leave it there.

 

Yours in Bhagavan,

Mouna

 

(Funny enough, I have another dear friend that also follows the Saiva

lines and we have a very hard time communicating some simple issues

about Reality, what I learned recently is that it's an old indian

tradition that Kashmir Saivism and Advaita Vedanta, although sprouting

from the same seed, have a hard time dissolving their differences)

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--- On Wed, 10/1/08, upadesa <maunna wrote:

upadesa <maunna Re: The False Guru Date: Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 6:38 PM

 

 

Dave Sirjue <davesirjue@ ...> wrote: > Yuh gotta be careful here... Within is the ego too ...I think you understood what I was saying. Actually Dave, since you want precision, there is no such thing aswithin or without, ego or you name it. I respect your position, honestly, but something doesn't seem tohappen in our lines of communication, hope you know what I mean.So it's fine, let's leave it there.Yours in Bhagavan,Mouna(Funny enough, I have another dear friend that also follows the Saivalines and we have a very hard time communicating some simple issuesabout Reality, what I learned recently is that it's an old indiantradition that Kashmir Saivism and Advaita Vedanta, although sproutingfrom the same seed, have a hard time dissolving their differences)

Let's leave aside our personal philosophical predispositions; you're not going to dodge your way out so easily by trying to dismiss a key point someone made... that is discourteous in local parlance.

How could you say, if you're in your right mind, there are no such things as name and forms ? Would you tell a policeman that there is no one driving a car or that there is no car when you are caught speeding ?

He'll figure you went bazokee and send you to the bunkers for good!

Remember the joke of the elephant and the seeker that Ramakrishna once told ?

Come good :)

-dave

 

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Dave Sirjue <davesirjue wrote:

>

> Let's leave aside our personal philosophical predispositions; you're

not going to dodge your way out so easily by trying to dismiss a key

point someone made... that is discourteous in local parlance. 

> How could you say, if you're  in your right mind, there are no such

things as name and forms ? Would you tell a policeman that there is no

one driving a car or that there is  no car when you are caught speeding ?

> He'll figure you went bazokee and send you to the bunkers for good!

> Remember the joke of the elephant and the seeker that Ramakrishna

once told ?

> Come good :)

> -dave

 

Dave! I just have a kind of epiphany!

 

Because that is exactly the kind of discussions I was having with my

friend, and he is a dear friend I tell you!! Sometimes we found

ourselves SCRRRREAMING our lungs out in those discussions in indian

restaurants in LA. People watching those two strange characters

screaming about " if the world is real or not? " !!!, I'm sure they

thought we were nuts! (and we were in a way...), now is much more

calm, actually we don't discuss so much.

 

Anyhow, I'm not dodging my way out, and sorry if I was " discourteous " ,

maybe it's because I'm not local. That being said:

 

It is with my " left mind " that I will say that there is no such thing

as name and form, with my " right mind (or brain) " I will acknowledge

that apparent " reality " . I hope you read enough Advaita V. to

understand what I'm talking about.

The policeman, the car, the speed, the ticket, the money, the telling

him: " I'm sorry officer, I didn't notice " , him telling me: " I'm also

sorry sir, sign here! " , the bazokee, the bunkers, the elephant, the

guru steping aside, you, me him/her or Him/Her, That, and all the rest

of infinite etcaeteras are simply " Mythia " ... relative, transactional

apparent namarupaik reality that seems to be there but in actual and

factual investigation proves to be changing, not-solid and conceptual,

ergo, apparent.

 

This is the little detail that makes the difference between our views.

The bottom line is that there is no bottom line, Advaita means... well

I don't have to tell you that, right?

 

Did I come good enough?

 

All the best, friend,

 

Yours in Bhagavan,

Mouna

 

(and without screaming...)

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Hi Alan,This is a really tough-to-digest teaching of Bhagavan Ramana. Many of the great saints like Swami Vivekananda and Swami Sivananda (founder of Divine Life Society) have advocated intense activity in the form of selfless Karma Yoga. Even Lord Krishna advocates intense selfless activity to Arjuna (who wanted to become a mendicant). Here below is a small extract from Swami Sivananda's writings on the Karma Yoga teachings of Gandhiji:

Study the autobiography of Mahatma Gandhi. He never made any

difference between menial service and dignified work. Scavenging or

cleaning the latrines were the highest yoga for him, the highest

puja. He annihilated his illusory little `I' through this service.

 

Many highly educated persons joined his ashram to learn yoga under

him. They thought that Gandhiji would teach them yoga in some

mysterious manner, in a private room. They thought that he would

teach them pranayama, meditation, awakening of the kundalini, etc.

They were asked to clean the latrines first.

 

Gandhiji used to mend his own shoes. He himself used to grind the

flour. He would take upon himself the work of others when they were

unable to do their allotted portion of work. When an educated person,

a new ashramite, felt shy to do grinding work, Gandhiji himself would

do the work in front of him. And then the man would willingly do the

work the next day.

 

Try to do daily as many virtuous actions as possible. When you go to

sleep have a review of your day's actions. Mark them in your

spiritual diary. Performance of virtuous actions is the beginning of

spiritual life.

 

Repeat mentally or silently with the breath, the Lord's name ­ such as

Hari Om, Sri Ram, or your own ishta mantra. Do this even when you are

working in the office. A strong habit of repetition of the mantra

will soon be formed.

 

Karma, according to Jaimini Rishi, is the performance of agnihotra

and other vedic rituals. According to the Gita, any action done with

niskamya bhava (unselfishly, motivelessly) , is karma yoga. Lord

Krishna says: "Work incessantly. Your duty is to work but not to

expect the fruits thereof." The central teaching of the Gita is non­

attachment to work. Breathing, eating, seeing, hearing, thinking,

etc., are all karmas.

 

Service of your guru or a mahatma (saint) is the highest form of

karma yoga. This purifies your heart quickly. Contact with a great

soul or guru has immense advantages. You will benefit by the magnetic

aura of the great personage. You will draw inspiration from him.

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Dear Sri Rajesh Kumar,

 

Ramana's injunction that it was harmfulto command activity by Gurus to their

devotees was not in my view a criticism of Karma or Bhakti Yoga. Bhagavan's Maha

Yoga is said to incorporate all the Yogas of Kharma Yoga, Bhakti Yoga and of

course Jnana Yoga. It is documented that several of Bhagavan's devotees engaged

in 'activities' under his supervision such as Annamalia Swami and Kunju Swami.

The point is that Bhagavan seems to have rather made suggestions to his Devotees

in reponse to their questions rather than giving them orders and a prescribed

regimen of sadhana as is done in many Ashrams.

 

I feel he knew that ordering them what to do as a matter of regimen, was an

interference and cast a shadow between their Inner ruler or Guru within or their

own Real SELF, from which intimate guidance and grace always flow. There is no

doubt that the names your cite were great Jnanis , but Jnana can be reached by

way of Karma Yoga and Bhakti Yoga as well as Atma Vichara and Jnana Yoga.

Bhagavan never, ever denied this possibility. I trust this makes it easier to

digest.

 

All best wishes and regards,

 

Alan

 

--- On Thu, 2/10/08, A T Rajesh Kumar <gabbardaaku wrote:

 

A T Rajesh Kumar <gabbardaaku

Re:The False Guru

 

Thursday, 2 October, 2008, 8:03 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi Alan,

This is a really tough-to-digest teaching of Bhagavan Ramana. Many of the great

saints like Swami Vivekananda and Swami Sivananda (founder of Divine Life

Society) have advocated intense activity in the form of selfless Karma Yoga.

Even Lord Krishna advocates intense selfless activity to Arjuna (who wanted to

become a mendicant). Here below is a small extract from Swami Sivananda's

writings on the Karma Yoga teachings of Gandhiji:

 

 

Study the autobiography of Mahatma Gandhi. He never made any

difference between menial service and dignified work. Scavenging or

cleaning the latrines were the highest yoga for him, the highest

puja. He annihilated his illusory little `I' through this service.

 

Many highly educated persons joined his ashram to learn yoga under

him. They thought that Gandhiji would teach them yoga in some

mysterious manner, in a private room. They thought that he would

teach them pranayama, meditation, awakening of the kundalini, etc.

They were asked to clean the latrines first.

 

Gandhiji used to mend his own shoes. He himself used to grind the

flour. He would take upon himself the work of others when they were

unable to do their allotted portion of work. When an educated person,

a new ashramite, felt shy to do grinding work, Gandhiji himself would

do the work in front of him. And then the man would willingly do the

work the next day.

 

Try to do daily as many virtuous actions as possible. When you go to

sleep have a review of your day's actions. Mark them in your

spiritual diary. Performance of virtuous actions is the beginning of

spiritual life.

 

Repeat mentally or silently with the breath, the Lord's name ­ such as

Hari Om, Sri Ram, or your own ishta mantra. Do this even when you are

working in the office. A strong habit of repetition of the mantra

will soon be formed.

 

Karma, according to Jaimini Rishi, is the performance of agnihotra

and other vedic rituals. According to the Gita, any action done with

niskamya bhava (unselfishly, motivelessly) , is karma yoga. Lord

Krishna says: " Work incessantly. Your duty is to work but not to

expect the fruits thereof. " The central teaching of the Gita is non­

attachment to work. Breathing, eating, seeing, hearing, thinking,

etc., are all karmas.

 

Service of your guru or a mahatma (saint) is the highest form of

karma yoga. This purifies your heart quickly. Contact with a great

soul or guru has immense advantages. You will benefit by the magnetic

aura of the great personage. You will draw inspiration from him.

 

 

 

 

Check out the all-new face of India.

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Dear Sri Rajesh Kumar

 

for myself it is like this

 

 

Sri Ramana Maharsha advised us all to get rid of the SENSE OF DOERSHIP

 

and in my personal experience this IS IT

 

as long as we believe we have done something or we have failed: we are bound in a prison.....

 

in His Grace

 

 

 

 

 

-

A T Rajesh Kumar

Thursday, October 02, 2008 9:03 AM

Re:The False Guru

 

 

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David,

 

Yes, it is not cognitive, mental knowledge, but rather Self-knowledge

(at the same 'level' as the knowledge that you exist. Do you need to

think to exist or to know that you exist?).

 

If you look carefully in the posting you will see that Knowledge is

capitalized. This is a hint at its special meaning as Self-knowledge.

 

Om Arunachala,

Richard

 

, Dave Sirjue <davesirjue wrote:

>

> Its not even knowledge in the sense it is translated, this is second

hand information borrowed from without. Nisargadatta talks of prior to

'I am'... before you ate the fruit of knowledge and it got stuck in

the throat chakra.

>  

> It's your own inner " recognition " or " apperception " - your own

innocent simplicity

> is wisdom.

>  

> -d 

>

> --- On Wed, 10/1/08, upadesa <maunna wrote:

>

> upadesa <maunna

> Re: The False Guru

>

> Wednesday, October 1, 2008, 10:01 AM

" Richard Clarke " <richard@ > wrote:

>

> > this seems to be the same as taught in the Gita, that Knowledge

> > liberates, not action.

> >

>

> And the very backbone of the whole Advaita Vedanta.

>

> Yours in bhagavan,

> Mouna

>

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