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Hello Soul

I was following your conversation with Michael.

What you said is totally true, the mind stops following the old patterns of thinking that it was used to follow before, whenever facing the objective world. You do not reurn to the Self, you remain immersed in the Self; whether you are facing the objective world or not.

In otherwords, any contact with objective world does not re-create you as an ego with its own world.

mourad

 

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Namaste Mourad,

 

On using the word " remain " or " return " .....

 

I think we can pick on words or not.... One could pick apart the

words of Sri Ramana, or any sage or not.

 

I thought, from memory, Sri Ramana had used the word " return " ..so

looked and found, from 'Conscious Immortality' p.66...to a

devoteee, " We all have to return to our source " ...

 

 

Ramana also uses the word " remain " , from the same book p.168, to a

devotee, " You are now advised to give up all these false ideas, and

to trace your source and remain as the Self. In that state there are

no differences and no questions will arise " .

 

I have also have read and heard .. " point your attention

towards " , " turn your attention towards " , and " focus on the Self " ....

 

 

It is understood here that our true nature, Self, does not come or

go, our true nature is always here, always was...so in this sense

there is no 'return'as such, but there's no problem here with this

word ,as it is understood what it is pointing to. Return the

attention to the Self, our true nature and identify with this,rather

than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who we are.

 

 

Blessings,

 

Soul

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " mourad " <mourad_shamel

wrote:

>

>

> Hello Soul

>

> I was following your conversation with Michael.

>

> What you said is totally true, the mind stops following the old

> patterns of thinking that it was used to follow before, whenever

> facing the objective world. You do not reurn to the Self, you remain

> immersed in the Self; whether you are facing the objective world or

not.

>

> In otherwords, any contact with objective world does not re-create

you

> as an ego with its own world.

>

> mourad

>

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Hello Soul,

" Return the attention to the Self, our true nature and identify with

this,rather than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who

we are. "

 

It appears that the suggestion (returning the attention to the Self)

is made to the 'mind'. At the same time, it is also asked not to

identify with the 'mind'. Can the mind avoid identifying with itself?

 

Looks like the only way is to enquire who the 'i' is and arriving at a

check mate.

 

Would you agree?

sundar

 

, " souleternalbeing "

<souleternalbeing wrote:

>

> Namaste Mourad,

>

> On using the word " remain " or " return " .....

>

> I think we can pick on words or not.... One could pick apart the

> words of Sri Ramana, or any sage or not.

>

> I thought, from memory, Sri Ramana had used the word " return " ..so

> looked and found, from 'Conscious Immortality' p.66...to a

> devoteee, " We all have to return to our source " ...

>

>

> Ramana also uses the word " remain " , from the same book p.168, to a

> devotee, " You are now advised to give up all these false ideas, and

> to trace your source and remain as the Self. In that state there are

> no differences and no questions will arise " .

>

> I have also have read and heard .. " point your attention

> towards " , " turn your attention towards " , and " focus on the Self " ....

>

>

> It is understood here that our true nature, Self, does not come or

> go, our true nature is always here, always was...so in this sense

> there is no 'return'as such, but there's no problem here with this

> word ,as it is understood what it is pointing to. Return the

> attention to the Self, our true nature and identify with this,rather

> than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who we are.

>

>

> Blessings,

>

> Soul

, " mourad " <mourad_shamel@>

> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Hello Soul

> >

> > I was following your conversation with Michael.

> >

> > What you said is totally true, the mind stops following the old

> > patterns of thinking that it was used to follow before, whenever

> > facing the objective world. You do not reurn to the Self, you remain

> > immersed in the Self; whether you are facing the objective world or

> not.

> >

> > In otherwords, any contact with objective world does not re-create

> you

> > as an ego with its own world.

> >

> > mourad

> >

>

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vanakkam sundar-ji,

 

when there is a thought, the mind exists....

 

no thought, no mind...

Shambo Arunachaleshwara

 

anbudan

 

TAT TVAM ASI ...--- On Thu, 11/27/08, Sundararajan <sundar22ca wrote:

Sundararajan <sundar22ca Re: To Soul Date: Thursday, November 27, 2008, 10:01 AM

 

 

Hello Soul,"Return the attention to the Self, our true nature and identify withthis,rather than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as whowe are."It appears that the suggestion (returning the attention to the Self) is made to the 'mind'. At the same time, it is also asked not toidentify with the 'mind'. Can the mind avoid identifying with itself?Looks like the only way is to enquire who the 'i' is and arriving at acheck mate.Would you agree?sundar, "souleternalbeing"<souleternalbeing@ ...> wrote:>> Namaste Mourad,> > On using the word "remain" or "return" .....> > I think we can pick on words or not.... One could pick apart the > words of Sri Ramana, or any sage or not.> > I thought, from

memory, Sri Ramana had used the word "return"..so > looked and found, from 'Conscious Immortality' p.66...to a > devoteee, "We all have to return to our source"...> > > Ramana also uses the word "remain", from the same book p.168, to a > devotee, "You are now advised to give up all these false ideas, and > to trace your source and remain as the Self. In that state there are > no differences and no questions will arise".> > I have also have read and heard .."point your attention > towards", "turn your attention towards", and "focus on the Self"....> > > It is understood here that our true nature, Self, does not come or > go, our true nature is always here, always was...so in this sense > there is no 'return'as such, but there's no problem here with this > word ,as it is understood what it is pointing to. Return the > attention to

the Self, our true nature and identify with this,rather > than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who we are.> > > Blessings,> > Soul> > > > > > > , "mourad" <mourad_shamel@ > > wrote:> >> > > > Hello Soul> > > > I was following your conversation with Michael.> > > > What you said is totally true, the mind stops following the old> > patterns of thinking that it was used to follow before, whenever> > facing the objective world. You do not reurn to the Self, you remain> > immersed in the Self; whether you are facing the objective world or > not.> > > > In otherwords, any contact with objective

world does not re-create > you> > as an ego with its own world.> > > > mourad> >>

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Vanakkam Anbudan (or more correctly Vanakkam Anbu. Since anbudan would

mean WITH anbu),

 

I agree with 'no thought -> no mind'.

But, how does this relate to 'returning attention to the Self'?

 

Does 'returning attention to the Self' mean having a 'no thought' state?

sundar

 

, mango tree <oldmangotree

wrote:

>

> vanakkam sundar-ji,

>  

> when there is a thought, the mind exists....

>  

> no thought, no mind...

>

> Shambo Arunachaleshwara

>  

> anbudan

>  

>

> TAT TVAM ASI ...

>

> --- On Thu, 11/27/08, Sundararajan <sundar22ca wrote:

>

> Sundararajan <sundar22ca

> Re: To Soul

>

> Thursday, November 27, 2008, 10:01 AM

Hello Soul,

> " Return the attention to the Self, our true nature and identify with

> this,rather than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who

> we are. "

>

> It appears that the suggestion (returning the attention to the Self)

> is made to the 'mind'. At the same time, it is also asked not to

> identify with the 'mind'. Can the mind avoid identifying with itself?

>

> Looks like the only way is to enquire who the 'i' is and arriving at a

> check mate.

>

> Would you agree?

> sundar

>

> , " souleternalbeing "

> <souleternalbeing@ ...> wrote:

> >

> > Namaste Mourad,

> >

> > On using the word " remain " or " return " .....

> >

> > I think we can pick on words or not.... One could pick apart the

> > words of Sri Ramana, or any sage or not.

> >

> > I thought, from memory, Sri Ramana had used the word " return " ..so

> > looked and found, from 'Conscious Immortality' p.66...to a

> > devoteee, " We all have to return to our source " ...

> >

> >

> > Ramana also uses the word " remain " , from the same book p.168, to a

> > devotee, " You are now advised to give up all these false ideas, and

> > to trace your source and remain as the Self. In that state there are

> > no differences and no questions will arise " .

> >

> > I have also have read and heard .. " point your attention

> > towards " , " turn your attention towards " , and " focus on the Self " ....

> >

> >

> > It is understood here that our true nature, Self, does not come or

> > go, our true nature is always here, always was...so in this sense

> > there is no 'return'as such, but there's no problem here with this

> > word ,as it is understood what it is pointing to. Return the

> > attention to the Self, our true nature and identify with this,rather

> > than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who we are.

> >

> >

> > Blessings,

> >

> > Soul

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > , " mourad " <mourad_shamel@ >

> > wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > > Hello Soul

> > >

> > > I was following your conversation with Michael.

> > >

> > > What you said is totally true, the mind stops following the old

> > > patterns of thinking that it was used to follow before, whenever

> > > facing the objective world. You do not reurn to the Self, you remain

> > > immersed in the Self; whether you are facing the objective world or

> > not.

> > >

> > > In otherwords, any contact with objective world does not re-create

> > you

> > > as an ego with its own world.

> > >

> > > mourad

> > >

> >

>

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, " Richard " <richarkar wrote:

>

> Who is this separate being that returns to or remains in the Self?

 

Only the mind, which believes itself separate. In a sense, the mind

returns to the Reality.

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Dear Moderators,

 

Re Message #47225

 

I've received this message from Soul, see below, nearly 20 times since it

was posted. It's only on the web page once. Is there something wrong with

the List Server? Any one else with the same problem?

 

I've checked my own mail server and the problem is not there - the message

is deleted from my mail server following each time it is downloaded to my

PC?

 

Best wishes,

 

Peter

 

 

 

 

On Behalf Of souleternalbeing

27 November 2008 00:29

 

Re: To Soul

 

Namaste Mourad,

 

On using the word " remain " or " return " .....

 

I think we can pick on words or not.... One could pick apart the words of

Sri Ramana, or any sage or not.

 

I thought, from memory, Sri Ramana had used the word " return " ..so looked and

found, from 'Conscious Immortality' p.66...to a devoteee, " We all have to

return to our source " ...

 

 

Ramana also uses the word " remain " , from the same book p.168, to a devotee,

" You are now advised to give up all these false ideas, and to trace your

source and remain as the Self. In that state there are no differences and no

questions will arise " .

 

I have also have read and heard .. " point your attention towards " , " turn your

attention towards " , and " focus on the Self " ....

 

 

It is understood here that our true nature, Self, does not come or

go, our true nature is always here, always was...so in this sense

there is no 'return'as such, but there's no problem here with this

word ,as it is understood what it is pointing to. Return the

attention to the Self, our true nature and identify with this,rather

than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who we are.

 

 

Blessings,

 

Soul

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Hi Sundar,

 

Re your question: 'Does 'returning attention to the Self' mean having

a 'no thought' state?'

 

First I'd like to point out that in an earlier message (Message

#47225) Soul wrote to Mourad about the use of the words 'return' and

'remain' and quoted Ramana from 'Conscious Immortality' where he used

these words while speaking to particular devotees.

 

In this light 'returning attention to the self' is a direction Ramana

gave to particular devotees at a certain time - at that time these

words were appropriate and in a similar situation these words may or

may not be appropriate.

 

I feel that the fact that Ramana spoke these words gives them an

energy that comes from the way of being that he represented in such a

way that the 'you' who is being directed to 'return attention to the

Self' falls away.

 

In the absence of the 'you' just mentioned there is Presence as your

true nature.

 

~ ~ ~

 

Know Thyself.

 

This is the direction that every sage in some form or another has given.

 

A response to this might be, 'Who is this 'Thy' that is being directed

to 'Know Thyself'?

 

Another response is, 'To Know Thyself is to be Aware'.

 

And still another response is to actually 'live' the direction by

asking 'Who am I?' such that there is the realization that this

question cannot be answered intellectually and that there is a 'living

answer' that is not of the measure of the mind... A way that that

living answer may be expressed is:

 

'I am formless Awareness functioning in form.'

 

In this light the answer to your question, 'Does 'returning attention

to the Self' mean having a 'no thought' state?' is that what these

words are pointing to is not a 'state', rather they point to your true

nature where thinking as functioning can arise yet this 'form' of

thinking is the action of your true nature called 'insight'.

 

Love,

James

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " Sundararajan " <sundar22ca

wrote:

>

> Vanakkam Anbudan (or more correctly Vanakkam Anbu. Since anbudan would

> mean WITH anbu),

>

> I agree with 'no thought -> no mind'.

> But, how does this relate to 'returning attention to the Self'?

>

> Does 'returning attention to the Self' mean having a 'no thought' state?

> sundar

>

> , mango tree <oldmangotree@>

> wrote:

> >

> > vanakkam sundar-ji,

> >  

> > when there is a thought, the mind exists....

> >  

> > no thought, no mind...

> >

> > Shambo Arunachaleshwara

> >  

> > anbudan

> >  

> >

> > TAT TVAM ASI ...

> >

> > --- On Thu, 11/27/08, Sundararajan <sundar22ca@> wrote:

> >

> > Sundararajan <sundar22ca@>

> > Re: To Soul

> >

> > Thursday, November 27, 2008, 10:01 AM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Hello Soul,

> > " Return the attention to the Self, our true nature and identify with

> > this,rather than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who

> > we are. "

> >

> > It appears that the suggestion (returning the attention to the Self)

> > is made to the 'mind'. At the same time, it is also asked not to

> > identify with the 'mind'. Can the mind avoid identifying with itself?

> >

> > Looks like the only way is to enquire who the 'i' is and arriving at a

> > check mate.

> >

> > Would you agree?

> > sundar

> >

> > , " souleternalbeing "

> > <souleternalbeing@ ...> wrote:

> > >

> > > Namaste Mourad,

> > >

> > > On using the word " remain " or " return " .....

> > >

> > > I think we can pick on words or not.... One could pick apart the

> > > words of Sri Ramana, or any sage or not.

> > >

> > > I thought, from memory, Sri Ramana had used the word " return " ..so

> > > looked and found, from 'Conscious Immortality' p.66...to a

> > > devoteee, " We all have to return to our source " ...

> > >

> > >

> > > Ramana also uses the word " remain " , from the same book p.168, to a

> > > devotee, " You are now advised to give up all these false ideas, and

> > > to trace your source and remain as the Self. In that state there

are

> > > no differences and no questions will arise " .

> > >

> > > I have also have read and heard .. " point your attention

> > > towards " , " turn your attention towards " , and " focus on the Self " ....

> > >

> > >

> > > It is understood here that our true nature, Self, does not come or

> > > go, our true nature is always here, always was...so in this sense

> > > there is no 'return'as such, but there's no problem here with this

> > > word ,as it is understood what it is pointing to. Return the

> > > attention to the Self, our true nature and identify with

this,rather

> > > than identifying with thought,emotions, body, mind as who we are.

> > >

> > >

> > > Blessings,

> > >

> > > Soul

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > , " mourad " <mourad_shamel@ >

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Hello Soul

> > > >

> > > > I was following your conversation with Michael.

> > > >

> > > > What you said is totally true, the mind stops following the old

> > > > patterns of thinking that it was used to follow before, whenever

> > > > facing the objective world. You do not reurn to the Self, you

remain

> > > > immersed in the Self; whether you are facing the objective

world or

> > > not.

> > > >

> > > > In otherwords, any contact with objective world does not

re-create

> > > you

> > > > as an ego with its own world.

> > > >

> > > > mourad

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

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Dear Richard,

 

I am off on Saturday, leaving for England.

 

It was great meeting you and Carol at Arunachala and Ganesan's. I met Jai to-day and he showed me your new abode. It looks great!

 

All love and every best wish

 

In His Grace,,

 

Alan--- On Thu, 27/11/08, Richard <richarkar wrote:

Richard <richarkar Re: To Soul Date: Thursday, 27 November, 2008, 2:29 AM

 

 

Who is this separate being that returns to or remains in the Self?

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Very simly put...

 

http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=2p2nlxaIW1I

 

 

 

Love and blessings to all,

 

Soul

 

 

-- In , " Tim G. " <fewtch wrote:

>

> , " Richard " <richarkar@> wrote:

> >

> > Who is this separate being that returns to or remains in the Self?

>

> Only the mind, which believes itself separate. In a sense, the

mind

> returns to the Reality.

>

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