Guest guest Posted September 22, 2009 Report Share Posted September 22, 2009 Swami Sadasivananda <sadasivananda WHAT BHAGAVAN REQUIRES OF US ! My Life and Quest, by Arthur Osborne Deep-rooted tendencies and predispositions are not so easily eradicated. Only in the rarest cases, when a man is already concentrated and already, without knowing it, ripe for self surrender, will a single mental conviction, a single vision, or even a single flash of realization (as in the case of the Maharshi) suffice to effect an immediate and permanent change. Normally the most it can do is to turn his mind in a new direction and convince him of the necessity of working to achieve the permanent change. It might be said that what is required is willingness to open one's heart to the truth, in fact to surrender oneself, to give up one's ego, to conceive of the possibility of its non-existence. That is why the Quran speaks of unbelievers rather as perverse than ignorant, saying of them that even if an angel came down from heaven to explain to them, they would not listen. From this it might be supposed that those who do understand and take the quest should be people of uncommon goodness, strikingly free from egoism. Some are, no doubt, and it is they who are on a good way, because, whatever the religion and whatever the path followed, it is a path towards liquidation of the ego, the individual 'I'-consciousness with all its fears and cravings, its grudges and pettiness, and therefore the goal obviously cannot be attained while building up or even retaining the ego. However, it is by no means always so. In fact, many who take the path, many members of spiritual groups, will be found to be more egoistic than those one would be likely to meet in some group of people united for worldly or social ends — more jealous, more ungoverned, quicker to take offense, less generous, less inclined to give in. This is likely to come as a shock and disillusionment to one joining such a group. One explanation that is given is that spiritual training (as is claimed also for certain types of psychiatric treatment) squeezes out the lower tendencies in a man, of which he himself was perhaps unaware, bringing them to the surface and thereby making them temporarily more obtrusive, so that an aggravation is a stage in the cure. When a devotee complained to the Maharshi that other thoughts arose more forcibly when he tried to meditate, he replied: "Yes, all kinds of thoughts arise in meditation. That is only right, for what is hidden in you is brought out. Unless it rises up how can it be destroyed? Thoughts rise up spontaneously, but only to be extinguished in due course, thus strengthening the mind." (The Teachings of Ramana Maharshi in His Own Words, Ch. 5). Once when people complained to him of the arrogant behaviour of an old devotee he replied: "That is his vasanas (inherent tendencies) coming out." When a person first understands and sets forth on the spiritual quest one may see a new radiance overspread him, a sort of foreshadowing of his perfected state, making him altogether delightful. However, this will not last. It will be followed by a stage when all his lowest possibilities come to the surface and he seems to be worse than before. At this time patience is needed. However, this stage is also temporary, and therefore this cannot be the full explanation of the egoistic types that are often found in a spiritual circle, at any rate such of them as were arch-egoists before taking the path and remain so after wards. When Christ was accused of associating with riff-raff his reply was that it is those who are sick that need a doctor, not those who are well. There was probably a good deal of sarcasm in this reply (for Christ also was an extremely militant teacher and verbally he hit back hard when attacked); it can hardly be taken at its face value, because only those who have attained the goal are really well, certainly not the smugly self-satisfied who could ask such a question. However, it does indicate that it is often the misfits, those who have failed to adapt themselves to life, who recognize that they are sick and seek treatment. When the Maharshi was asked why we should seek Self-realization he would sometimes answer: "Who asks you if you are satisfied with life as it is?" When asked what use it is, he replied:"Why do you seek Self-realization? Why don't you rest content with your present state? It is evident that you are discontented and your discontent will come to an end if you realize your Self." (ibid, Ch.7). This explains why it is the discontented who seek, but not why so many of them are unpleasant persons. It may be because the quest offers much for the ego to grasp at. This may seem a surprising statement when its whole purpose is the liquidation of the ego, and yet it is true. Man in his present state possesses only a small part of his potential powers and perceptions. The process which goes on, often unconsciously, during the quest is a twofold process of expansion and contraction, symbolized by Jupiter and Saturn, expanding a man's faculties while at the same time crushing him to the point of 'self-naughting', as the medieval Christian mystics put it. Christ said that a man must lose his life in order to gain it and that when a man attains the kingdom of heaven all else shall be added to him.-- Teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi web site: http://www.ramanateaching.orgAsk your question in relation to Bhagavan's teachings, meditation and spirituality at: http://www.ramanateaching.org/faqTo contact Swami Sadasivananda:http://www.ramanateaching.org/contact.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2009 Report Share Posted September 22, 2009 thanks for posting this alan i will post it on face book it is very timely for me Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 7:47:17 PM Re: WHAT BHAGAVAN REQUIRES OF US ! Swami Sadasivananda <sadasivananda@ gmail.com> WHAT BHAGAVAN REQUIRES OF US ! My Life and Quest, by Arthur Osborne Deep-rooted tendencies and predispositions are not so easily eradicated. Only in the rarest cases, when a man is already concentrated and already, without knowing it, ripe for self surrender, will a single mental conviction, a single vision, or even a single flash of realization (as in the case of the Maharshi) suffice to effect an immediate and permanent change. Normally the most it can do is to turn his mind in a new direction and convince him of the necessity of working to achieve the permanent change. It might be said that what is required is willingness to open one's heart to the truth, in fact to surrender oneself, to give up one's ego, to conceive of the possibility of its non-existence. That is why the Quran speaks of unbelievers rather as perverse than ignorant, saying of them that even if an angel came down from heaven to explain to them, they would not listen. From this it might be supposed that those who do understand and take the quest should be people of uncommon goodness, strikingly free from egoism. Some are, no doubt, and it is they who are on a good way, because, whatever the religion and whatever the path followed, it is a path towards liquidation of the ego, the individual 'I'-consciousness with all its fears and cravings, its grudges and pettiness, and therefore the goal obviously cannot be attained while building up or even retaining the ego. However, it is by no means always so. In fact, many who take the path, many members of spiritual groups, will be found to be more egoistic than those one would be likely to meet in some group of people united for worldly or social ends — more jealous, more ungoverned, quicker to take offense, less generous, less inclined to give in. This is likely to come as a shock and disillusionment to one joining such a group. One explanation that is given is that spiritual training (as is claimed also for certain types of psychiatric treatment) squeezes out the lower tendencies in a man, of which he himself was perhaps unaware, bringing them to the surface and thereby making them temporarily more obtrusive, so that an aggravation is a stage in the cure. When a devotee complained to the Maharshi that other thoughts arose more forcibly when he tried to meditate, he replied: "Yes, all kinds of thoughts arise in meditation. That is only right, for what is hidden in you is brought out. Unless it rises up how can it be destroyed? Thoughts rise up spontaneously, but only to be extinguished in due course, thus strengthening the mind." (The Teachings of Ramana Maharshi in His Own Words, Ch. 5). Once when people complained to him of the arrogant behaviour of an old devotee he replied: "That is his vasanas (inherent tendencies) coming out." When a person first understands and sets forth on the spiritual quest one may see a new radiance overspread him, a sort of foreshadowing of his perfected state, making him altogether delightful. However, this will not last. It will be followed by a stage when all his lowest possibilities come to the surface and he seems to be worse than before. At this time patience is needed. However, this stage is also temporary, and therefore this cannot be the full explanation of the egoistic types that are often found in a spiritual circle, at any rate such of them as were arch-egoists before taking the path and remain so after wards. When Christ was accused of associating with riff-raff his reply was that it is those who are sick that need a doctor, not those who are well. There was probably a good deal of sarcasm in this reply (for Christ also was an extremely militant teacher and verbally he hit back hard when attacked); it can hardly be taken at its face value, because only those who have attained the goal are really well, certainly not the smugly self-satisfied who could ask such a question. However, it does indicate that it is often the misfits, those who have failed to adapt themselves to life, who recognize that they are sick and seek treatment. When the Maharshi was asked why we should seek Self-realization he would sometimes answer: "Who asks you if you are satisfied with life as it is?" When asked what use it is, he replied:"Why do you seek Self-realization? Why don't you rest content with your present state? It is evident that you are discontented and your discontent will come to an end if you realize your Self." (ibid, Ch.7). This explains why it is the discontented who seek, but not why so many of them are unpleasant persons. It may be because the quest offers much for the ego to grasp at. This may seem a surprising statement when its whole purpose is the liquidation of the ego, and yet it is true. Man in his present state possesses only a small part of his potential powers and perceptions. The process which goes on, often unconsciously, during the quest is a twofold process of expansion and contraction, symbolized by Jupiter and Saturn, expanding a man's faculties while at the same time crushing him to the point of 'self-naughting' , as the medieval Christian mystics put it. Christ said that a man must lose his life in order to gain it and that when a man attains the kingdom of heaven all else shall be added to him.-- Teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi web site: http://www.ramanate aching.orgAsk your question in relation to Bhagavan's teachings, meditation and spirituality at: http://www.ramanate aching.org/ faqTo contact Swami Sadasivananda:http://www.ramanate aching.org/ contact.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2009 Report Share Posted September 22, 2009 I would like to add my thanks as well. Suffering certainly does not seem to ease up after the initial glow of Sri Bhagavan Ramana darshan wears away. So much underbrush to clear away, a lifetime of it I guess. Thank you Alan bhai. Thomas > > > > > ________________________________ > Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs > > Monday, September 21, 2009 7:47:17 PM > Re: WHAT BHAGAVAN REQUIRES OF US ! > >  > Swami Sadasivananda <sadasivananda@ gmail.com> > > > >WHAT BHAGAVAN REQUIRES OF US ! > >  > >>>>      My Life and Quest, by Arthur Osborne > >>>>  Deep-rooted tendencies and predispositions are not so easily eradicated. Only in the rarest cases, when a man is already concentrated and already, without knowing it, ripe for self surrender, will a single mental conviction, a single vision, or even a single flash of realization (as in the case of the Maharshi) suffice to effect an immediate and permanent change. Normally the most it can do is to turn his mind in a new direction and convince him of the necessity of working to achieve the permanent change. > > > >   It might be said that what is required is willingness to open one's heart to the truth, in fact to surrender oneself, to give up one's ego, to conceive of the possibility of its non-existence. That is why the Quran speaks of unbelievers rather as perverse than ignorant, saying of them that even if an angel came down from heaven to explain to them, they would not listen. From this it might be supposed that those who do understand and take the quest should be people of uncommon goodness, strikingly free from egoism. Some are, no doubt, and it is they who are on a good way, because, whatever the religion and whatever the path followed, it is a path towards liquidation of the ego, the individual 'I'-consciousness with all its fears and cravings, its grudges and pettiness, and therefore the goal obviously cannot be attained while building up or even retaining the ego. However, it is by no means always so. In fact, many who take the path, many members > of spiritual groups, will be found to be more egoistic than those one would be likely to meet in some group of people united for worldly or social ends †" more jealous, moreungoverned, quicker to take offense, less generous, less inclined to give in. This is likely to come as a shock and disillusionment to one joining such a group. > > > >   One explanation that is given is that spiritual training (as is claimed also for certain types of psychiatric treatment) squeezes out the lower tendencies in a man, of which he himself was perhaps unaware, bringing them to the surface and thereby making them temporarily more obtrusive, so that an aggravation is a stage in the cure. When a devotee complained to the Maharshi that other thoughts arose more forcibly when he tried to meditate, he replied: > > > > " Yes, all kinds of thoughts arise in meditation. That is only right, for what is hidden in you is brought out. Unless it rises up how can it be destroyed? Thoughts rise up spontaneously, but only to be extinguished in due course, thus strengthening the mind. " (The Teachings of Ramana Maharshi in His Own Words, Ch. 5). > >>   Once when people complained to him of the arrogant behaviour of an old devotee he replied: " That is his vasanas (inherent tendencies) coming out. " When a person first understands and sets forth on the spiritual quest one may see a new radiance overspread him, a sort of foreshadowing of his perfected state, making him altogether delightful. However, this will not last. It will be followed by a stage when all his lowest possibilities come to the surface and he seems to be worse than before. At this time patience is needed. However, this stage is also temporary, and therefore this cannot be the full explanation of the egoistic types that are often found in a spiritual circle, at any rate such of them as were arch-egoists before taking the path and remain so after wards. > > > >   When Christ was accused of associating with riff-raff his reply was that it is those who are sick that need a doctor, not those who are well. There was probably a good deal of sarcasm in this reply (for Christ also was an extremely militant teacher and verbally he hit back hard when attacked); it can hardly be taken at its face value, because only those who have attained the goal are really well, certainly not the smugly self-satisfied who could ask such a question. However, it does indicate that it is often the misfits, those who have failed to adapt themselves to life, who recognize that they are sick and seek treatment. When the Maharshi was asked why we should seek Self-realization he would sometimes answer: " Who asks you if you are satisfied with life as it is? " When asked what use it is, he replied: " Why do you seek Self-realization? Why don't you rest content with your present state? It is evident that you are discontented and your > discontent will come to an end if you realize your Self. " (ibid, Ch.7). This explains why it is the discontented who seek, but not why so many of them are unpleasant persons. > > > >   It may be because the quest offers much for the ego to grasp at. This may seem a surprising statement when its whole purpose is the liquidation of the ego, and yet it is true.. Man in his present state possesses only a small part of his potential powers and perceptions. The process which goes on, often unconsciously, during the quest is a twofold process of expansion and contraction, symbolized by Jupiter and Saturn, expanding a man's faculties while at the same time crushing him to the point of 'self-naughting' , as the medieval Christian mystics put it. Christ said that a man must lose his life in order to gain it and that when a man attains the kingdom of heaven all else shall be added to him. > > > >-- > >Teachings of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Maharshi web site: http://www.ramanate aching.org > > > >Ask your question in relation to Bhagavan's teachings, meditation and spirituality at: http://www.ramanate aching.org/ faq > > > >To contact Swami Sadasivananda: > >http://www.ramanate aching.org/ contact.html > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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