Guest guest Posted January 17, 2010 Report Share Posted January 17, 2010 Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control. Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough. No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright. The successful few owe their success to their perseverance. A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly. Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign ourselves to the guiding Power. source: Talk 398 Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2010 Report Share Posted January 19, 2010 Mind control is the essence of Maharshi's eperience. As a young man he was seized by the fear of death. Wrestling with this fear is the fastest way to control the mind. Perseverance is provided by the abject terror of the experience and desire to cease this terror. Once we have mind control the world is transformed. One realizes tneir true self is not this mind that we can now control, it is the unnameable thing that carries many names. Mind control is not one's birthright it is true, but today we have a few teachers extolling it's practical use. , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs wrote: > > > Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control. > > Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough. > No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright. > The successful few owe their success to their perseverance. > A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly. > Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination > all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign > ourselves to the guiding Power. > > source: Talk 398 > > Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2010 Report Share Posted January 19, 2010 Dear Bigripfan, I like your posting. The only point I would make is that in his first Death Experience, he didn't so much wrestle so as to obtain mind control ,but investigated with single minded enquiry and intense attention- into the question 'who is that dies'? I agree mind control , one way or another, through watching flow of breath, Self Remembering, Mantra Japa or Atma Vichara are essential to Devotees on Bhagavan's infallible way to Self Realisation. Few teachers as you say, today, realise its necessity. They are shy of making effort and will park in the same space until they try. Yours in Bhagavan, Alan--- On Tue, 19/1/10, bigripfan <davemahar wrote: bigripfan <davemahar Re: MIND CONTROL Date: Tuesday, 19 January, 2010, 4:53 Mind control is the essence of Maharshi's eperience. As a young man he was seized by the fear of death. Wrestling with this fear is the fastest way to control the mind. Perseverance is provided by the abject terror of the experience and desire to cease this terror. Once we have mind control the world is transformed. One realizes tneir true self is not this mind that we can now control, it is the unnameable thing that carries many names. Mind control is not one's birthright it is true, but today we have a few teachers extolling it'spractical use. , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote:>> > Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control.> > Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough.> No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright.> The successful few owe their success to their perseverance.> A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly.> Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination> all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign> ourselves to the guiding Power.> > source: Talk 398> > Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya!> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2010 Report Share Posted January 19, 2010 Dear Bigrifan, Mind control is a big illusion. Sri Bhagavan says in Updeasa Saram verse 17, that if we investigate what mind is, we will find that there is no mind. How to control that which does not exist. It is like drinking water in a mirage. Who wants to control mind? Mind itself. So Sri Bhagavan says it is like a thief dressed like a policeman trying to catch the thief who is himself. Any thought of control is itself a thought. Sri Bhagavan did not even want the devotees to think that they have not realized. Any thought obscures pure consciousness. So, for the devotee's query of mind slipping, Sri Bhagavan says don't think, because it just adds one more thought. He says when ever you happen to notice that thought is arising, enquire( who am I) and shift your attention from thought(mind) to the consciousness 'I'( turning inward) Again, to control means to do some thing. Sri Bhagavan says let us not pose as doers( doership too is a big illusion). One may ask is effort in enquiry not doing? Enquiry is a strange process. It is the process of continuously redirecting attention(which is what we are) from mind to `I', that is, being ourselves, till it does not stray any more. When attention wanders from `I' to he, she, it ( the world) it is redirected to `I'. Further, do we know which thought is going to come up next, can we predict the next thought, the tenth thought? So what are we going to control? Sri Bhagavan's death experience was instantaneous. With the death of the body, I am the body thought( I thought) too died. When the body had died, there was no body for the consciousness to attach itself to. So it was freed instantaneously. That is what happens to us in sleep. In sleep to there is no mind, nobody, so no `I' thought, because there is no body for the `I' to attach to. We are pure consciousness in sleep. After the separation of consciousness from the insentient body, the body of Sri Bhagavan was somehow brought to life by a divine act and He continued to live in that body to teach us. Love Yours in Bhagavan Ramamohan , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs wrote:>> Dear Bigripfan,>  > I like your posting. The only point I would make is that in his first Death Experience, he didn't so much wrestle so as to obtain mind control ,but investigated with single minded enquiry and intense attention- into the question 'who is that dies'?>  >  I agree mind control , one way or another, through watching flow of breath, Self Remembering, Mantra Japa or Atma Vichara are essential to Devotees on Bhagavan's infallible way to Self Realisation. Few teachers as you say, today, realise its necessity. They are shy of making effort and will park in the same space until they try.>  > Yours in Bhagavan,>  > Alan> > --- On Tue, 19/1/10, bigripfan davemahar wrote:> > > bigripfan davemahar Re: MIND CONTROL> > Tuesday, 19 January, 2010, 4:53> > >  > > > > > > Mind control is the essence of Maharshi's eperience. As a young man he was seized by the fear of death. Wrestling with this fear is the fastest way to control the mind. Perseverance is provided by the abject terror of the experience and desire to cease this terror. Once we have mind control the world is transformed. One realizes tneir true self is not this mind that we can now control, it is the unnameable thing that carries many names. Mind control is not one's birthright it is true, but today we have a few teachers extolling it's> practical use. > > , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote:> >> > > > Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control.> > > > Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough.> > No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright.> > The successful few owe their success to their perseverance.> > A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly.> > Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination> > all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign> > ourselves to the guiding Power.> > > > source: Talk 398> > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya!> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2010 Report Share Posted January 19, 2010 Dear Rammohan-ji: Thank you. What you say is very deep and wise indeed. Bhagavan guided everyone from where they were. He said different things at different times to different people. Of course, you are giving the highest and the purest teaching of Bhagavan. If one fully grasps it, nothing more needs to be done about mind control. On the other hand, for many people, concentration, meditation, and making the mind one pointed has benefits and leads to deeper understanding of the teaching. Namaste and love to all Harsha On Behalf Of Ramamohan Tuesday, January 19, 2010 10:54 AM Re: MIND CONTROL Dear Bigrifan, Mind control is a big illusion. Sri Bhagavan says in Updeasa Saram verse 17, that if we investigate what mind is, we will find that there is no mind. How to control that which does not exist. It is like drinking water in a mirage. Who wants to control mind? Mind itself. So Sri Bhagavan says it is like a thief dressed like a policeman trying to catch the thief who is himself. Any thought of control is itself a thought. Sri Bhagavan did not even want the devotees to think that they have not realized. Any thought obscures pure consciousness. So, for the devotee's query of mind slipping, Sri Bhagavan says don't think, because it just adds one more thought. He says when ever you happen to notice that thought is arising, enquire( who am I) and shift your attention from thought(mind) to the consciousness 'I'( turning inward) Again, to control means to do some thing. Sri Bhagavan says let us not pose as doers( doership too is a big illusion). One may ask is effort in enquiry not doing? Enquiry is a strange process. It is the process of continuously redirecting attention(which is what we are) from mind to `I', that is, being ourselves, till it does not stray any more. When attention wanders from `I' to he, she, it ( the world) it is redirected to `I'. Further, do we know which thought is going to come up next, can we predict the next thought, the tenth thought? So what are we going to control? Sri Bhagavan's death experience was instantaneous. With the death of the body, I am the body thought( I thought) too died. When the body had died, there was no body for the consciousness to attach itself to. So it was freed instantaneously. That is what happens to us in sleep. In sleep to there is no mind, nobody, so no `I' thought, because there is no body for the `I' to attach to. We are pure consciousness in sleep. After the separation of consciousness from the insentient body, the body of Sri Bhagavan was somehow brought to life by a divine act and He continued to live in that body to teach us. Love Yours in Bhagavan Ramamohan , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs wrote: > > Dear Bigripfan, >  > I like your posting. The only point I would make is that in his first Death Experience, he didn't so much wrestle so as to obtain mind control ,but investigated with single minded enquiry and intense attention- into the question 'who is that dies'? >  >  I agree mind control , one way or another, through watching flow of breath, Self Remembering, Mantra Japa or Atma Vichara are essential to Devotees on Bhagavan's infallible way to Self Realisation. Few teachers as you say, today, realise its necessity. They are shy of making effort and will park in the same space until they try. >  > Yours in Bhagavan, >  > Alan > > --- On Tue, 19/1/10, bigripfan davemahar wrote: > > > bigripfan davemahar > Re: MIND CONTROL > > Tuesday, 19 January, 2010, 4:53 > > >  > > > > > > Mind control is the essence of Maharshi's eperience. As a young man he was seized by the fear of death. Wrestling with this fear is the fastest way to control the mind. Perseverance is provided by the abject terror of the experience and desire to cease this terror. Once we have mind control the world is transformed. One realizes tneir true self is not this mind that we can now control, it is the unnameable thing that carries many names. Mind control is not one's birthright it is true, but today we have a few teachers extolling it's > practical use. > > , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ ....> wrote: > > > > > > Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control. > > > > Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough. > > No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright. > > The successful few owe their success to their perseverance. > > A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly. > > Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination > > all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign > > ourselves to the guiding Power. > > > > source: Talk 398 > > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2010 Report Share Posted January 19, 2010 Dear Harsha still waiting for your answer..... in Sri Ramana Maharshi michael - Harsha Tuesday, January 19, 2010 5:05 PM RE: Re: MIND CONTROL Dear Rammohan-ji: Thank you. What you say is very deep and wise indeed. Bhagavan guided everyone from where they were. He said different things at different times to different people. Of course, you are giving the highest and the purest teaching of Bhagavan. If one fully grasps it, nothing more needs to be done about mind control. On the other hand, for many people, concentration, meditation, and making the mind one pointed has benefits and leads to deeper understanding of the teaching. Namaste and love to all Harsha On Behalf Of RamamohanTuesday, January 19, 2010 10:54 AM Subject: Re: MIND CONTROL Dear Bigrifan, Mind control is a big illusion. Sri Bhagavan says in Updeasa Saram verse 17, that if we investigate what mind is, we will find that there is no mind. How to control that which does not exist. It is like drinking water in a mirage. Who wants to control mind? Mind itself. So Sri Bhagavan says it is like a thief dressed like a policeman trying to catch the thief who is himself. Any thought of control is itself a thought. Sri Bhagavan did not even want the devotees to think that they have not realized. Any thought obscures pure consciousness. So, for the devotee's query of mind slipping, Sri Bhagavan says don't think, because it just adds one more thought. He says when ever you happen to notice that thought is arising, enquire( who am I) and shift your attention from thought(mind) to the consciousness 'I'( turning inward) Again, to control means to do some thing. Sri Bhagavan says let us not pose as doers( doership too is a big illusion). One may ask is effort in enquiry not doing? Enquiry is a strange process. It is the process of continuously redirecting attention(which is what we are) from mind to `I', that is, being ourselves, till it does not stray any more. When attention wanders from `I' to he, she, it ( the world) it is redirected to `I'. Further, do we know which thought is going to come up next, can we predict the next thought, the tenth thought? So what are we going to control? Sri Bhagavan's death experience was instantaneous. With the death of the body, I am the body thought( I thought) too died. When the body had died, there was no body for the consciousness to attach itself to. So it was freed instantaneously. That is what happens to us in sleep. In sleep to there is no mind, nobody, so no `I' thought, because there is no body for the `I' to attach to. We are pure consciousness in sleep. After the separation of consciousness from the insentient body, the body of Sri Bhagavan was somehow brought to life by a divine act and He continued to live in that body to teach us. Love Yours in Bhagavan Ramamohan , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs wrote:>> Dear Bigripfan,>  > I like your posting. The only point I would make is that in his first Death Experience, he didn't so much wrestle so as to obtain mind control ,but investigated with single minded enquiry and intense attention- into the question 'who is that dies'?>  >  I agree mind control , one way or another, through watching flow of breath, Self Remembering, Mantra Japa or Atma Vichara are essential to Devotees on Bhagavan's infallible way to Self Realisation. Few teachers as you say, today, realise its necessity. They are shy of making effort and will park in the same space until they try.>  > Yours in Bhagavan,>  > Alan> > --- On Tue, 19/1/10, bigripfan davemahar wrote:> > > bigripfan davemahar Re: MIND CONTROL> > Tuesday, 19 January, 2010, 4:53> > >  > > > > > > Mind control is the essence of Maharshi's eperience. As a young man he was seized by the fear of death. Wrestling with this fear is the fastest way to control the mind. Perseverance is provided by the abject terror of the experience and desire to cease this terror. Once we have mind control the world is transformed. One realizes tneir true self is not this mind that we can now control, it is the unnameable thing that carries many names. Mind control is not one's birthright it is true, but today we have a few teachers extolling it's> practical use. > > , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote:> >> > > > Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control.> > > > Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough.> > No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright.> > The successful few owe their success to their perseverance.> > A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly.> > Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination> > all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign> > ourselves to the guiding Power.> > > > source: Talk 398> > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya!> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2010 Report Share Posted January 20, 2010 Dear Harshaji, Thank you for your comment. What you say is indeed what Sri Bhagavan said too. What ever practice one was following, Sri Bhagavan advised them to continue with that. No method to gain onepointedness was excluded by Sri Bhagavanas, as said in talk 401. `That which is, is the One Reality. It may be represented by a form, a japa, mantra, vichara or any kind of attempt. All of them finally resolve themselves into that One Single Reality. Bhakti, vichara, japa are only different forms of our efforts to keep out the unreality. The unreality is an obsession at present. Reality is our true nature. We are wrongly persisting in unreality, that is, thoughts and worldly activities. Cessation of these will reveal the Truth. Our attempts are directed towards keeping them out. It is done by thinking of the Reality only. Although it is our true nature it looks as if we are thinking of the Reality. What we do really amounts to the removal of obstacles for the revelation of our true Being. Meditation or vichara is thus a reversion to our true nature. D.: Are our attempts sure to succeed? M.: Realisation is our nature. It is nothing new to be gained. What is new cannot be eternal. Therefore there is no need for doubting if one would lose or gain the Self.' Harshaji, I fully agree with what you say. We can indeed look out and take a step forward from where we are and in which ever path we are. Thanks again for your very valuable comment. Love Yours in Bhagavan Ramamohan , " Harsha " wrote: > > Dear Rammohan-ji: > > > > Thank you. What you say is very deep and wise indeed. > > > > Bhagavan guided everyone from where they were. He said different things at > different times to different people. Of course, you are giving the highest > and the purest teaching of Bhagavan. > > > > If one fully grasps it, nothing more needs to be done about mind control. On > the other hand, for many people, concentration, meditation, and making the > mind one pointed has benefits and leads to deeper understanding of the > teaching. > > > > Namaste and love to all > > Harsha > > > > > On Behalf Of Ramamohan > Tuesday, January 19, 2010 10:54 AM > > Re: MIND CONTROL > > Dear Bigrifan, > > Mind control is a big illusion. Sri Bhagavan says in Updeasa Saram verse 17, > that if we investigate what mind is, we will find that there is no mind. > > > > How to control that which does not exist. It is like drinking water in a > mirage. Who wants to control mind? Mind itself. So Sri Bhagavan says it is > like a thief dressed like a policeman trying to catch the thief who is > himself. Any thought of control is itself a thought. Sri Bhagavan did not > even want the devotees to think that they have not realized. Any thought > obscures pure consciousness. So, for the devotee's query of mind slipping, > Sri Bhagavan says don't think, because it just adds one more thought. He > says when ever you happen to notice that thought is arising, enquire( who > am I) and shift your attention from thought(mind) to the consciousness 'I'( > turning inward) > > > > Again, to control means to do some thing. Sri Bhagavan says let us not pose > as doers( doership too is a big illusion). One may ask is effort in enquiry > not doing? Enquiry is a strange process. It is the process of continuously > redirecting attention(which is what we are) from mind to `I', that is, being > ourselves, till it does not stray any more. When attention wanders from `I' > to he, she, it ( the world) it is redirected to `I'. > > > > Further, do we know which thought is going to come up next, can we predict > the next thought, the tenth thought? So what are we going to control? > > > > Sri Bhagavan's death experience was instantaneous. With the death of the > body, I am the body thought( I thought) too died. When the body had died, > there was no body for the consciousness to attach itself to. So it was freed > instantaneously. That is what happens to us in sleep. In sleep to there is > no mind, nobody, so no `I' thought, because there is no body for the `I' to > attach to. We are pure consciousness in sleep. After the separation of > consciousness from the insentient body, the body of Sri Bhagavan was somehow > brought to life by a divine act and He continued to live in that body to > teach us. > > > > Love > > Yours in Bhagavan > > Ramamohan > > > , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Bigripfan, > >  > > I like your posting. The only point I would make is that in his first > Death Experience, he didn't so much wrestle so as to obtain mind control > ,but investigated with single minded enquiry and intense attention- into the > question 'who is that dies'? > >  > >  I agree mind control , one way or another, through watching flow of > breath, Self Remembering, Mantra Japa or Atma Vichara are essential to > Devotees on Bhagavan's infallible way to Self Realisation. Few teachers as > you say, today, realise its necessity. They are shy of making effort and > will park in the same space until they try. > >  > > Yours in Bhagavan, > >  > > Alan > > > > --- On Tue, 19/1/10, bigripfan davemahar@ wrote: > > > > > > bigripfan davemahar@ > > Re: MIND CONTROL > > > > Tuesday, 19 January, 2010, 4:53 > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > Mind control is the essence of Maharshi's eperience. As a young man he was > seized by the fear of death. Wrestling with this fear is the fastest way to > control the mind. Perseverance is provided by the abject terror of the > experience and desire to cease this terror. Once we have mind control the > world is transformed. One realizes tneir true self is not this mind that we > can now control, it is the unnameable thing that carries many names. Mind > control is not one's birthright it is true, but today we have a few teachers > extolling it's > > practical use. > > > > , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ > ...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control. > > > > > > Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself > bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough. > > > No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s > birthright. > > > The successful few owe their success to their perseverance. > > > A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly. > > > Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination > > > all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign > > > ourselves to the guiding Power. > > > > > > source: Talk 398 > > > > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya! > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Alan; When one is in the grip of the fear of death it is all-consuming. It is the mind that is generating the fear. One only wants to escape this terrifying experience. One does not have the luxury of knowing that mind and self are seperate. At some point one realizes that one must stop the flow of thought, this is where perseverance kicks in. Stopping thought is like the Greek rolling the stone up a hill, only to have it roll back countless times. When one reaches some control a mantra of some sort comes in handy. When unwanted thoughts creep in under the door as they surely will, repeating the mantra will plug the gap. The mind is a miraculous thing. With it we can do marvelous things, but it is also a raging beast which can be a source of unspeakable things Maharshi had the luck to have the King of Fears visited on him and the perseverance to break through. Somehow I don't see him investigating things while going through this experience. That would be like inquiring about the nature of the tiger with the tiger's teeth at your heels. Ramamohan seems to think mind is an illusion and does not exist. Try this as the tiger is trying his best to eat you. Dave Mahar (aka BigRipFan) , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs wrote: > > Dear Bigripfan, >  > I like your posting. The only point I would make is that in his first Death Experience, he didn't so much wrestle so as to obtain mind control ,but investigated with single minded enquiry and intense attention- into the question 'who is that dies'? >  >  I agree mind control , one way or another, through watching flow of breath, Self Remembering, Mantra Japa or Atma Vichara are essential to Devotees on Bhagavan's infallible way to Self Realisation. Few teachers as you say, today, realise its necessity. They are shy of making effort and will park in the same space until they try. >  > Yours in Bhagavan, >  > Alan > > --- On Tue, 19/1/10, bigripfan <davemahar wrote: > > > bigripfan <davemahar > Re: MIND CONTROL > > Tuesday, 19 January, 2010, 4:53 > > >  > > > > > > Mind control is the essence of Maharshi's eperience. As a young man he was seized by the fear of death. Wrestling with this fear is the fastest way to control the mind. Perseverance is provided by the abject terror of the experience and desire to cease this terror. Once we have mind control the world is transformed. One realizes tneir true self is not this mind that we can now control, it is the unnameable thing that carries many names. Mind control is not one's birthright it is true, but today we have a few teachers extolling it's > practical use. > > , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control. > > > > Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough. > > No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright. > > The successful few owe their success to their perseverance. > > A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly. > > Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination > > all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign > > ourselves to the guiding Power. > > > > source: Talk 398 > > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2010 Report Share Posted January 21, 2010 Dear Dave, I think you are generally right in what you say. Re. the First Death Experience leading to his Self Realisation he did say that he did enquire into the question 'who dies'? This may not be at once- but later? Anyway its is a somewhat academic point- as he Awakened! All regards, Alan --- On Thu, 21/1/10, bigripfan <davemahar wrote: bigripfan <davemahar Re: MIND CONTROL Date: Thursday, 21 January, 2010, 0:25 Alan;When one is in the grip of the fear of death it is all-consuming. It is the mind that is generating the fear. One only wants to escape this terrifying experience. One does not have the luxury of knowing that mind and self are seperate. At some point one realizes that one must stop the flow of thought, this is where perseverance kicks in. Stopping thought is like the Greek rolling the stone up a hill, only to have it roll back countless times. When one reaches some control a mantra of some sort comes in handy. When unwanted thoughts creep in under the door as they surely will, repeating the mantra will plug the gap. The mind is a miraculous thing. With it we can do marvelous things, but it is also a raging beast which can be a source of unspeakable thingsMaharshi had the luck to have the King of Fears visited on him and the perseverance to break through. Somehow I don't see him investigating things while going through this experience. That would be like inquiring about the nature of the tiger with the tiger's teeth at your heels. Ramamohan seems to think mind is an illusion and does not exist. Try this as the tiger is trying his best to eat you.Dave Mahar (aka BigRipFan), Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote:>> Dear Bigripfan,>  > I like your posting. The only point I would make is that in his first Death Experience, he didn't so much wrestle so as to obtain mind control ,but investigated with single minded enquiry and intense attention- into the question 'who is that dies'?>  >  I agree mind control , one way or another, through watching flow of breath, Self Remembering, Mantra Japa or Atma Vichara are essential to Devotees on Bhagavan's infallible way to Self Realisation. Few teachers as you say, today, realise its necessity. They are shy of making effort and will park in the same space until they try.>  > Yours in Bhagavan,>  > Alan> > --- On Tue, 19/1/10, bigripfan <davemahar@. ..> wrote:> > > bigripfan <davemahar@. ..>> Re: MIND CONTROL> > Tuesday, 19 January, 2010, 4:53> > >  > > > > > > Mind control is the essence of Maharshi's eperience. As a young man he was seized by the fear of death. Wrestling with this fear is the fastest way to control the mind. Perseverance is provided by the abject terror of the experience and desire to cease this terror. Once we have mind control the world is transformed. One realizes tneir true self is not this mind that we can now control, it is the unnameable thing that carries many names. Mind control is not one's birthright it is true, but today we have a few teachers extolling it's> practical use. > > , Alan Jacobs <alanadamsjacobs@ ...> wrote:> >> > > > Devotee: But the mind slips away from our control.> > > > Bhagavan: Be it so. Do not think of it. When you recollect yourself bring it back and turn it inward. That is enough.> > No one succeeds without effort. Mind control is not one’s birthright.> > The successful few owe their success to their perseverance.> > A passenger in a train keeps his load on the head by his own folly.> > Let him put it down: he will find the load reaches the destination> > all the same. Similarly, let us not pose as the doers, but resign> > ourselves to the guiding Power.> > > > source: Talk 398> > > > Om Namo Bhagavate Sri Ramanaya!> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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