Guest guest Posted October 3, 2001 Report Share Posted October 3, 2001 Respected Krushnaji, This is turning out to be a very fruitful discussion. I must thank Donna for starting it with her chart and Sandy for her perspective. I remember the discussion we had about 1-7. This was in relation to Jupiter and Mercury. These could not be samdharmi because while they had 4-10 lordships (6th and 9th), they also had 1:7 lordships (3-9). But I thought this was only because we were looking at natural samdharmi relations. What will happen if Ju:Me are in the same sign? Do these become samdharmi or are they disqualified from being samdharmi because of their natural lordship over opposing signs? Perhaps Donna might be willing to make a write up on this and put it in the lessons if you tell her all the exceptions and relations to be considered. I think the concept of samdharmi is one of the main tenets of this system and elimination of confusion on this would benefit everyone. Kind regards Sanjay - <varsh126 Wednesday, October 03, 2001 2:39 PM Re: Rectification Dear Sanjay, My answer on your comments, see below > Respected Krushnaji, > > Please see my comments in capitals below. > > Kind regards > Sanjay > > - > > Dear Sandy and Sanjay, > One thing I should clarify here. Whewn the power ful > significator is aspecting the upchay stan, it may not give the result > until it is lord of A or B. > > - I SUPPOSE YOU MEAN D OR E. IS THAT CORRECT? Sorry this is typo in hurry. it should be D and E. > > Please also note that this law is not applicable to > samdharmi planets. They are coming forward to give the result, as > arepresentation to some other planet. If such samdharmi planets are > having their sight on the upchay stan (A,B,C) still they can give the > results. > In the present case Venus is having maximum points, So it > can give the result, and As Saturn is Natural samdharmi to Venus it > can give the result. This is not away from our rules. Here We should > also consider one more thing, Saturn and Venus are in 1:7 situation. > Which makes them F. Enemy. Here Saturn gives power to Venus but Venus > is with 4 points. It means Venus is not in favor to Saturn. > Saturn can represents Venus may not be justified. > > WHAT I UNDERSTAND FROM THIS IS THE FOLLOWING: > > 1. A PLANET ASPECTING A B OR C CAN GIVE THE RESULT EVEN IF IT IS NOT THE > LORD OF D OR E PROVIDED IT IS SAMDHARMI TO A POWERFUL SIGNIFICATOR. WOULD > THIS NOT EXPLODE THE NUMBER OF POSSIBILITIES? THE MAIN THING I LIKE ABOUT > THIS SYSTEM WAS THAT IT GAVE YOU VERY SPECIFIC RULES AND CERTAIN PERIODS > COULD BE RULED OUT WITH CERTAINTY. IT SEEMS THAT THERE ARE OTHER ASPECTS TO > THIS. this is not away from the rules. When two planets which are samdharmi if they are in 4:10 relation ship, will act powerfully. if 1:7 or 6:8 will not come forward, until and unless they have some specific reason. > > 2. WE HAD SOME RULES FOR FINDING SAMDHARMI PLANETS WHICH WERE VERY CLEAR. > NOW IT SEEMS THAT THERE IS A JUDGEMENTAL ISSUE ON DECIDING THE SAMDHARMI > RELATIONSHIP. WHAT YOU ARE SAYING IN THE CURRENT CHART IS THAT SATURN, > THOUGH NATURAL SAMDHARMI TO VENUS, DOES NOT LOOK LIKE IT CAN ACT AS SUCH IN > THIS PARTICULAR CHART. Please note that in this perticular case they are situated 1:7 place. If you remember, Similar question you have asked some time back regarding Mercury and Jupiter, why they are not treated as samdharmi. answer was because in other set of houses they have 1:7 relationship. Similarly in this case the venus and Saturn are samdharmi, but in the chart they are situated in 1:7th place. The sight of venus is not favoring Saturn. In such relationship if both planets are with less points, they would have worked as samdharmi. DO WE EXTEND THIS LOGIC TO OTHER SAMDHARMI RELATIONS > AS WELL? FOR EXAMPLE, TWO PLANETS MIGHT BE IN THE NAVAMSHA OF THE SAME > PLANET (WHICH WOULD MAKE THEM SAMDHARMI.) HOWEVER, THEY MIGHT BE 1- 7 IN THE > RASHI CHART here again we should check the points of each planets. (I HAVE NOT CHEECKED IF THIS IS PHYSICALLY POSSIBLE OR NOT, I AM > JUST LOOKING FOR THE PRINCIPLE.) WOULD THIS MEAN THAT THESE ARE NOT > SAMDHARMI? DOES THIS MEAN THAT WE HAVE TO REWRITE THE RULES BY WHICH WE > JUDGE SAMDHARMI RELATIONSHIPS? Please note that we always find the quality of the planets. If any planet is samdharmi to other planet, and if the so called samdharmi planet is lord of 12th house from B, it will not act. Similar check should be made. krushna > > > > > , " Sandy Crowther " <sandy@t...> > wrote: > > Dear Sanjay, > > > > Dear Sandy, > > > > I think your analysis is too involved. > > > > You have to see the basic principles first. No plant aspecting A B > or C can > > give the event, unless it happens to be the lord of D or E. > > > > We both agree on this.But the planet with the highest point value > is also a > > contender for consideration along with the lords of D and E - that > is my > > understanding anyway. In other words, I don't think it is solely > dependent > > on the lords of D and E - although they are eager to bring about the > > results. I think you also have to consider the strength of the > points of the > > chart in question.Not just the lords of D and E. I think that is > part of the > > basic principles. > > > > If you take Aries ascendant, then the event happened in the sub of > Saturn. > > Saturn is not lord of D or E. Even if it is samdharmi to Venus, it > cannot > > give the result. Result can only be given by a samdharmi which does > not > > aspect A B or C. > > > > This is where we differ in our understanding.It is my understanding > (but I > > could be wrong too :-)) that Saturn cannot " directly " give the > result when > > acting alone, because Saturn aspects a significator house. However, > I also > > took it to be a consideration because it is samdharmi to a planet > (Venus) > > that CAN give the result via substitution for Venus - being that > Venus has > > the highest amount of points and Saturn is the sub lord.but I could > also be > > incorrect. > > > > I also understood that results are given by the planet with the > highest > > amount of points for the chart in question, with consideration > given to > > samdharmi planets as substitutes, OR, during the periods of the > lords of D > > and E who are also anxious to bring about results. > > > > > > Of course, I could have misunderstood and you might be right. In > any case, I > > will learn. > > > > Hmm.guess we should let Krushna sort this one out.:-).because I may > be wrong > > also, and I admit I AM rusty! :-) > > > > ~Namaste~ > > Sandy > > http://www.jupitersweb.com/ <http://www.jupitersweb.com/> > > > > > > > > L & L > > Sanjay > > > > - > > " Sandy Crowther " <sandy@t...> > > > > Monday, October 01, 2001 4:58 AM > > RE: Re: Rectification > > > > > > Dear Krushna and Group, > > > > Dear Sandy, > > Your presence in the group will make the things more > pleasant. > > Your knowedge will also be helpful. > > Thanks > > krushna > > > > > > Thanks Krushna, I'm a bit rusty on this system but have attempted a > bit of > > research here on Donna's rectification, using only 1 event - her > father's > > death. I can, however, see significant considerations for both > sides - in > > support of both Aquarius and Aries.Your arguments certainly hold up > > significantly for Aquarius lagna, but can you tell me where I may be > > misleading myself with the following, for additionally seeing > support, and > > possible consideration for Aries also? Here is what I have so far. > > > > Aries lagna: > > > > Lords of D and E are eager to bring results. > > Venus has the highest points in Donna's 4th, which is death for her > father > > (8th from 4th.). > > Mars, lord of D is in sign of Jupiter and Nakshatra of Jupiter > (lord of E) > > Jupiter, lord of E is in sign of Saturn and Nakshatra of Sun. > > > > Venus, planet with the highest point value for House 4, father's > death, is > > in sign of Saturn and Nakshatra of Jupiter - Lord of E. > > Venus does not aspect A, B, or C - so it qualifies as the most > likely > > candidate for bringing about results, because of highest point > value. > > # 25 Nakshatra, Purva Bhadra, is indicative of both heart problems > and blood > > circulation. > > Jupiter can be samdharmi for Venus and is lord of E - eager to > bring results > > (death). (Or do we not use a samdharmi in this case?) > > > > In the ashtakavarga system, Krushna's teachings have given the > facts that > > during the sub-period of the lords of certain houses, results are > certain to > > be linked up with other houses. > > > > Aries lagna - Saturn sub: > > > > Saturn lords the 10th and 11th for Aries > > During the sub period of the lord of the 10th, results are linked > to the 1st > > and 5th house matters. > > During the sub=periods of the lord of the 11th, results are linked > to to 2nd > > and 6th house matters. > > > > According to ashtakavarga teachings and documents from Krushna's > lessons: > > > > 1. 1st lists " Death " > > 2. 5th lists " disease " > > 3. 2nd lists " Family/Relatives " > > 4. 6th lists " disease/sickness " > > > > I compared the above to Mars bhukti with Aquarian lagna: > > Mars lords houses 3 and 10 for Aquarius > > For the 3rd - results are linked to the 6th and 10th house matters > > For the the 10th, results are linked to the 1st and 5th house > matters > > > > 1. 6th lists " disease/sickness " > > 2. 10th lists nothing relative to death of father or illness > > 3. 1st lists " Death " > > 4. 5th lists " disease " > > > > So there is supporting evidence to link the Saturn sub with the > death of her > > father, (in addition to the Mars sub for Aquarius lagna :-).) For > the Mars > > sub - there is no mention of the link with respect to > family/relatives when > > considering the significance of the sub lords. > > > > Now to arrive at the date of death, we have to consider the transit > lord of > > the upachaya house (House A) of her father's death. Generally, as > you have > > taught us, it should be in the sign and constellation of a powerful > > significator. > > > > Aries: Shows transit lord of house A, Saturn, at 27:14 Pisces, in > the sign > > of Jupiter in the constellation of Mercury, and posited in the 12th > house on > > 8/20/97. Jupiter and Mercury are both with 19 points in positions > 2nd and > > 3rd in ranking for positions of strength. Tha main dasha lord, > Mars, is in > > the sign of the bhukti lord - so the connection between the > mahadasha and > > bhukti lord is established. > > > > Aquarius: Shows transit lord of house A, Jupiter, at 22:46 > Capricorn, in the > > sign of Saturn and constellation of Moon in the 12th on 8/20/97. > Saturn is > > in highest strength with 28 points while Moon ranks 5th with 15 > points. > > > > Is this a consideration when both are not in the top 3 positions for > > strength? Just wanting to know where I have goofed up - or if, in > fact, > > Aries could be a consideration based on the above? Perhaps if I > work on an > > analysis of the other events Donna listed, things will fall into > place > > better for one versus the other. :-) Thanks Krushna.I'll get up to > par here > > eventually. > > > > ~Namaste~ > > Sandy > > http://www.jupitersweb.com/ < http://www.jupitersweb.com/> > > > > > > > > > > , " Sandy Crowther " <sandy@t...> > > wrote: > > > Dear Krushna and List, > > > > > > Hi Krushna and everyone! Donna gave me away like I'm lurking - > > which I have > > > been. :-) > > > > > > I'm trying to finish up some loose ends and get back into the > swing > > here of > > > things here at Ashtakavarga.I've been missing this list! Sorry for > > my > > > prolonged absence.I've been trying to follow all the mails, and > > will be back > > > and hopefully active very soon.I'll need to freshen up a bit > before > > I jump > > > right in though - so I'll wade through my mountain of notes as > soon > > as > > > possible. > > > > > > Thanks Krushna for this list and your patience.I've now completed > > teaching > > > the MaHaBote Course which is freeing up some time. And Margarita - > > you are > > > doing so GREAT!!! And nice to see Sanjay back and active too. :- > > )..Long time > > > no see.:-) > > > > > > ~Namaste~ > > > Sandy > > > http://www.jupitersweb.com/ < http://www.jupitersweb.com/> > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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