Question about a chart

[Guest guest]

Hello,

 

I didn't have time to participate recently.

 

 

Few weeks ago, Philippe Bonin sent a chart to the list. I send again these

datas.

 

" This woman got through a big crisis in her marriage

and separated from her husband but she isn't happy about this separation,

although she started the crisis.

She was born on June 15th 1959 in Alger (Algeria) 36°47'N, 3°3'E at 3:40am.

The ascendant is 0°13' Taurus. It can't be Aries according to the

behaviour of the woman.

 

Mars lord of VII is on the same degree as Venus lord of VI. Venus is 45°

from the Sun, so, according to the principles, marriage is spoilt. She

married in Rahu's main period, Rahu being samdharmi to Mercury functional

karak.

 

However, I don't understand why the marriage took place in Saturn's

sub- period (September 5th 1981). The great crisis happened in March/April

2001. She left home, came back a

few weeks later, and they separated again very recently (October 2002).This

is Venus sub-period (lord of VI) which is not surprising. However, there was

no crisis in last Venus sub-period. At that time, on the opposite,

she got pretty well along with her husband. Things began to change slowly

in 1992 and got worse until now.

 

The ashtakavarga system doesn't seem to work in this chart. Perhaps we have

not understood some rules. So, your help is welcome. If Krushna has some

spare time, his experience will be very helpful. "

 

Best regards

Denis

 

 

 

Pour des renseignements sur les séminaires, les consultations et les cours

par correspondance, ainsi que pour des logiciels et des leçonsd'astrologie

gratuits, visitez mon site : www.astrocours.fr.st

[Guest guest]

Dear Denis, and list members,

The So called marriage, is the result of 12 and 5th house.

Saturn is having good points for both the houses and is lord of D and

E. Then Mercury, Ketu(Ju + Me) is also having good points. Venus in

Rahu main is having less points, But the period have followed by

Sun, Moon, which are again having good points. The relation in Venus

might have stressed, but covered by next period. The Mars is having

less points for all the houses So in 92 relations started spoiling.

The influence of 7th house which was super shaded by 12th and 5th

house, started showing it's effect.

In Jupiter main, which is lord of 12th from 12th house, Have

reduced the effect of 12th house. Here the 7th house started giving

the result. Where Ju, Sa, Ketu (for Ju) Ve are having less points.

Due to Ju main all magic of 12th (Bed comfort) diminished. and in

real sense 7th house started working Means the real partnership of

life. From 92, Mars, followed by Ju, Sa, Then Ve is present.

Other points about Venus are covered by you. The Moon with

Rahu and 30 points in 1st house, shows the trend of the mind of the

lady.

I am also too busy now a days. Just today got some time. Seen

your mail, so answered it.

krushna

, Denis Labouré

<Laboure@W...> wrote:

> Hello,

>

> I didn't have time to participate recently.

>

>

> Few weeks ago, Philippe Bonin sent a chart to the list. I send

again these

> datas.

>

> " This woman got through a big crisis in her marriage

> and separated from her husband but she isn't happy about this

separation,

> although she started the crisis.

> She was born on June 15th 1959 in Alger (Algeria) 36°47'N, 3°3'E at

3:40am.

> The ascendant is 0°13' Taurus. It can't be Aries according to the

> behaviour of the woman.

>

> Mars lord of VII is on the same degree as Venus lord of VI. Venus

is 45°

> from the Sun, so, according to the principles, marriage is spoilt.

She

> married in Rahu's main period, Rahu being samdharmi to Mercury

functional

> karak.

>

> However, I don't understand why the marriage took place in Saturn's

> sub- period (September 5th 1981). The great crisis happened in

March/April

> 2001. She left home, came back a

> few weeks later, and they separated again very recently (October

2002).This

> is Venus sub-period (lord of VI) which is not surprising. However,

there was

> no crisis in last Venus sub-period. At that time, on the opposite,

> she got pretty well along with her husband. Things began to change

slowly

> in 1992 and got worse until now.

>

> The ashtakavarga system doesn't seem to work in this chart. Perhaps

we have

> not understood some rules. So, your help is welcome. If Krushna has

some

> spare time, his experience will be very helpful. "

>

> Best regards

> Denis

>

>

>

> Pour des renseignements sur les séminaires, les consultations et

les cours

> par correspondance, ainsi que pour des logiciels et des

leçonsd'astrologie

> gratuits, visitez mon site : www.astrocours.fr.st

[Guest guest]

Dear Krushnaji and Dennis,

 

I just went through the chart, and yes Venus is apart from Sun by 45

degrees but it is aspected by Guru. So it might keep Venus under

check. Here is my attempt.

 

For computation of Marriage, Shani is causing moderate delay, and

delay upto about 22 - 24.5 years (assuming 18 is early marriage).

 

Now marriage happened in Shanis antra probably because Venus is

spoiled. Marriage happened during the period of strongest

significicator for 7th house being Sun with 22 points. i.e. around

Sept 13th - Sept 16th. (The marriage happened during when sun

transitted Sun + Venus, I would have said Sun+Sun or Sun only).

Narrowing down that Antra of Shani, Shani is situated with Guru in

Navamsa and in the sign of Guru in Rasi so 1st 1/3rd portion. Hence

1981.

 

Marriages performed during planets with low points are generally

indications of unhappy marriage or break of marriage during LOD or

LOE for 7th house or planet with high points.

 

Dennis, did the native have a child during 1989/04 and 1990/03 i.e.

Suns antra. Sun has highest points for 11th house ? Could you

please comment ..

 

Thanking you,

Cheers !!!

Ash

 

 

 

, " krushanain

<krushanain> " <krushanain> wrote:

> Dear Denis, and list members,

> The So called marriage, is the result of 12 and 5th

house.

> Saturn is having good points for both the houses and is lord of D

and

> E. Then Mercury, Ketu(Ju + Me) is also having good points. Venus in

> Rahu main is having less points, But the period have followed by

> Sun, Moon, which are again having good points. The relation in

Venus

> might have stressed, but covered by next period. The Mars is having

> less points for all the houses So in 92 relations started spoiling.

> The influence of 7th house which was super shaded by 12th and 5th

> house, started showing it's effect.

> In Jupiter main, which is lord of 12th from 12th house, Have

> reduced the effect of 12th house. Here the 7th house started giving

> the result. Where Ju, Sa, Ketu (for Ju) Ve are having less points.

> Due to Ju main all magic of 12th (Bed comfort) diminished. and in

> real sense 7th house started working Means the real partnership of

> life. From 92, Mars, followed by Ju, Sa, Then Ve is present.

> Other points about Venus are covered by you. The Moon with

> Rahu and 30 points in 1st house, shows the trend of the mind of the

> lady.

> I am also too busy now a days. Just today got some time.

Seen

> your mail, so answered it.

> krushna

> , Denis Labouré

> <Laboure@W...> wrote:

> > Hello,

> >

> > I didn't have time to participate recently.

> >

> >

> > Few weeks ago, Philippe Bonin sent a chart to the list. I send

> again these

> > datas.

> >

> > " This woman got through a big crisis in her marriage

> > and separated from her husband but she isn't happy about this

> separation,

> > although she started the crisis.

> > She was born on June 15th 1959 in Alger (Algeria) 36°47'N, 3°3'E

at

> 3:40am.

> > The ascendant is 0°13' Taurus. It can't be Aries according to the

> > behaviour of the woman.

> >

> > Mars lord of VII is on the same degree as Venus lord of VI. Venus

> is 45°

> > from the Sun, so, according to the principles, marriage is

spoilt.

> She

> > married in Rahu's main period, Rahu being samdharmi to Mercury

> functional

> > karak.

> >

> > However, I don't understand why the marriage took place in

Saturn's

> > sub- period (September 5th 1981). The great crisis happened in

> March/April

> > 2001. She left home, came back a

> > few weeks later, and they separated again very recently (October

> 2002).This

> > is Venus sub-period (lord of VI) which is not surprising.

However,

> there was

> > no crisis in last Venus sub-period. At that time, on the

opposite,

> > she got pretty well along with her husband. Things began to

change

> slowly

> > in 1992 and got worse until now.

> >

> > The ashtakavarga system doesn't seem to work in this chart.

Perhaps

> we have

> > not understood some rules. So, your help is welcome. If Krushna

has

> some

> > spare time, his experience will be very helpful. "

> >

> > Best regards

> > Denis

> >

> >

> >

> > Pour des renseignements sur les séminaires, les consultations et

> les cours

> > par correspondance, ainsi que pour des logiciels et des

> leçonsd'astrologie

> > gratuits, visitez mon site : www.astrocours.fr.st

[Guest guest]

Dear Krushna and Ash,

 

thank you for your comments on this chart. I had first proposed it on the

list some time ago and can provide the additional information Ash is asking

for:

the native had two children (girls). Their birthdates are January 1st 1987

and August 20th 1989. This was respectively Venus and Sun sub-period (even

for the second child, the conception took place in Venus sub-period). The

role of Venus is not clear to me for this event. Sun seems to be better at

first sight (high points, lord of D for house XI being B).

Concerning the marriage, it was a very official one (no common life before

marriage). If I understand Krushna's analysis, the marriage was based only

on superficial romantic and sexual attraction and is signified by houses V

and XII, not VII. But how could one have predicted it, according to the fact

that it had all the appearances of normality ?

 

Best regards

Philippe

[Guest guest]

Dear Philippe,

 

I asked about child birth as I took this chart to practice the

Ashtakavarga system. Sun not only has the hightest point in the

worksheet it also is LOE for 11th house. So based on that I asked if

the native had a child birth during that period. Venus too has high

points for 11th house but not the highest, so I guess its also

capable of giving childbirth and Venus comes before Sun after the

marriage ??

 

If you go through the archives, and refer to some discussion

regarding marriages that have taken place during periods of planets

with low points and not being that of LOD or LOE then there are some

problems or the other in marriage.

Quality of Marriage you should check from the lords of 1st/7th from

lagna, sun and moon and for females in addition to those check for

Mars and Venus too.

 

Then also check for worksheet points to see the good and the bad

periods, and from Krushnajis email I am still trying to understand

how nicely the Mahadasa swami was used to show the subtle difference

between how Venus could give such different results during its antra.

 

We also should overlap charts of the native and her husband to see

the compatibility. Its again given in a lesson. If that is strong

then the couple can " work things out " . I guess that is why Krushnaji

said about high points in Lagna (making her adament or stubborn) and

Moon+Rahu combination and degreewise being very close in conjunction

can make her very emotionally unstable or wishy washy in her

decisions.

 

Hope that helps,

Cheers !!!

Ash

 

Now answering your quesiton, the Karak Venus is spoilt thereby in

such chart there is a strong possiblity for a marriage when the

timing of delay finishes by Shani, in the natives case it moderate

delay and Shanis antra was running at that time and so if 5th and

12th points were good meaning she was ready and prepared for 5th and

12th house matters, those were more dominiating in her mind. Maybe

she was not ready for a Partnership in the real sense in her mind,

maybe you can verify that ?

 

Krushnaji has given us all these points in past discussion and in

lesson.

 

I thought it was a good example for studying on studying Karak for

7th house, both Natural and Functional. Here FK is aspected by 6th

lord Saturn and Venus is away from sun by 45 degrees.

 

A good chart to study.

 

 

, " philippe bonin "

<philippe.bonin@w...> wrote:

> Dear Krushna and Ash,

>

> thank you for your comments on this chart. I had first proposed it

on the

> list some time ago and can provide the additional information Ash

is asking

> for:

> the native had two children (girls). Their birthdates are January

1st 1987

> and August 20th 1989. This was respectively Venus and Sun sub-

period (even

> for the second child, the conception took place in Venus sub-

period). The

> role of Venus is not clear to me for this event. Sun seems to be

better at

> first sight (high points, lord of D for house XI being B).

> Concerning the marriage, it was a very official one (no common life

before

> marriage). If I understand Krushna's analysis, the marriage was

based only

> on superficial romantic and sexual attraction and is signified by

houses V

> and XII, not VII. But how could one have predicted it, according to

the fact

> that it had all the appearances of normality ?

>

> Best regards

> Philippe

[Guest guest]

Dear Ash,

 

thank you again for your comments. Concerning the state of mind of the lady

when she got married, I think that she wasn't really ready for a deep

partnership. The problem is, in the West, most people are not ready for a

deep partnership when they begin to live with somebody, whether it is an

official marriage or not (maybe I'm too pessimistic).

Recently, I studied this chart and others from the same family. If you are

interested in the husband's chart, for example, I can send it.

Could you tell me where to look in order to find the way one must calculate

Shani's delay precisely ? I didn't find it in the lessons (except how to

determine whether the event takes place in the first, second or third part

of the sub-period). I went through the archives but the key-word research

didn't give any result.

 

Best regards

Philippe

[Guest guest]

Dear Philippe,

Regarding partnership, or moving in, or mentally being ready for a

commitment as a marriage are finer things. We are using Vimshottari

Dasa starting from Moon's nakshatra so it deals with mind.

 

Generally what we think about or desire we tend to do or accomplish.

So we should also keep that in mind. If one is living together and

mentally not ready to be a partner, then it could be for

companionship, or even looking for someone better to come along, or

whatever the motives are, we have to check.

 

If its for pleasure then you will find that 12th house points are

high and points for 5th and 7th are low, so there is no love or

partnership involved. This we can also check from the antardasa

running. If it has high points for 5th, and low for 7th and high for

12th like in the case you gave, then strong feelings of love, and

12th house matters are more predominant in the " Mind " , and 7th house

matters are supressed.

 

Similary we have to be intuitive and see what the points are showing,

and the antra running are LOD and LOE for which house i.e 4th and 8th

house from where the planet is situated. In the case you gave,

Shanis antra was running and Shani for sure was eager to give result

for 5th and 12th house (as event if it aspected A,B or C house for

5th or 12th, it would have no effect and would still go ahead and

give result). These laws for friendship work wonderfully.

 

If attraction between the 2 is strong then we check for association

of Venus, Mars, Saturn, Rahu or male and female, its given in the

lesson for love marriage.

 

In the chart you gave, the native had 6:8 combinations in 3 spots and

4:10 this coupled with Rahu+Moon close conjunction and high points in

the 1st house and low points during marriage and Venus being spoilt

and 6th lord aspecting Mercury (FK) are saying something. So the

native may have disputes (i.e. quality of married life). Now unless

her husband has a balancing chart (Overlapping of chart), that he may

try to save the partnership, relationship then that attraction can be

seen by studying Venus, Saturn, Rahu and Mars between the 2 charts,

that could have a superceding effect despite all the indications.

Its takes 2 to tango.

Lastly, the Karma of ancestors, I have seen Krushnaji mention that in

a post, but I do not know how to see that, maybe Krushnaji can

comment on it. I guess the Good Karma of Ancestors superscedes all

factors ????

 

We have to study all these factors In my opinion.

 

Thanking you,

Cheers !!!

Ash

 

 

, " philippe bonin "

<philippe.bonin@w...> wrote:

> Dear Ash,

>

> thank you again for your comments. Concerning the state of mind of

the lady

> when she got married, I think that she wasn't really ready for a

deep

> partnership. The problem is, in the West, most people are not ready

for a

> deep partnership when they begin to live with somebody, whether it

is an

> official marriage or not (maybe I'm too pessimistic).

> Recently, I studied this chart and others from the same family. If

you are

> interested in the husband's chart, for example, I can send it.

> Could you tell me where to look in order to find the way one must

calculate

> Shani's delay precisely ? I didn't find it in the lessons (except

how to

> determine whether the event takes place in the first, second or

third part

> of the sub-period). I went through the archives but the key-word

research

> didn't give any result.

>

> Best regards

> Philippe

[Guest guest]

Dear Margarita and Ash,

 

yes indeed, Margarita, having children postponed the crisis in the native's

couple.

Here is some additional information about the native: she was badly injured

in a bicycle accident in november 1965, and lost one of her kidneys. I think

this is signified by Mars lord of VII (kidneys) associated with Venus lord

of VI. The accident was during Moon/Venus. Venus has the lowest score for

VII (accidents). The role of the Moon is not so clear to me.

She lost her mother on June 24th 1985 (cancer). This was in Rahu/Ketu. Ketu

is samdharmi to Jupiter lord of VIII (lord of E for XI=VIII from IV being

B). But I've been told Krushna takes house III for the mother. In that case

house B should be X and house E=VII. Jupiter occupies it and gets 5 points

in BAV.

The role of Rahu could be explained if we take X=B, because in that case it

is samdharmi to Mercury lord of A. If we take XI=B, Mercury is natural karak

and it also works.

Her father also died of cancer (July 1991). It was in Rahu/Moon. I don't see

the link with house IV (VIII from IX).

 

Now here's the husband's chart:

August 2nd, 1958 2:42 pm in Nancy, France (48°41'N, 6°12'E). Lagna 0°15'

Scorpio, Moon 20°51' Aquarius.

I rectified the TOB because I thought the Scorpio ascendant was more

suitable. The official TOB was 2:30pm.

Jupiter FK is spoiled by being in Libra. It is aspecting Venus and aspected

by Mars lord of VI. In SAV, house I gets 24 points and house VII 30 points.

This suggests that the wife dominated the couple, which is true. I see no

other affliction concerning marriage.

The marriage took place on September 5th 1981 in Saturn/Venus. Saturn is

natural samdharmi to Venus, and Venus to Saturn lord of IV=E for VII. But

Venus only has 11 points for 7th house in SAV. This doesn't seem so good.

The crisis in the couple was in Mercury/Mars. Mars is lord of VI. It is

aspecting Jupiter FK.

 

Of course, your corrections and comments will be welcome.

 

Best regards

Philippe