Ayanamsa Letter to the Group

[Guest guest]

Dear Puneet and Group,

 

There had been exchanges on the value of the ayanamsa starting as far back as message # 519. The value given by Krushnaji in that mail for August 13th 1936 was 22:04:28, which was different from the value given in the lesson. Referring back to message # 585 and # 603, Krushnaji said that his computer was attacked by a virus forcing him to replace his hard disk and re feed all the data. Somewhere during that time and when the KAY Calculator was created, an error of about 7 mins crept in.

 

When Margarita and myself were solving charts with Krushnaji when he was teaching us KAS, we realized that consistently the dashas that Krushnaji was getting and what we were getting were off.

When designing this Worksheet and tuning the Ayanamsa we again hit the same issues.

Krushnaji then said that he would re-compute the values from the first principles as it was imperative that we have the correct KAY values as it would make a difference in some charts when planets would be very close to border and also in dasha length for about 56 days, just as Puneet has pointed out so astutely in his mail.

 

Donna and myself just recently got the new computed values which we have fed into the KAS 2005 program and it is in fact the same value that he had originally used back when he was rectifying Ron's chart (message # 519). There is a difference of approximately 7 mins.

 

We shall start to work on the new release of a new Krushnas Ayanamsa Calculator for the benefit of all once we have ironed out all the issues with KAS2005. This was one of the reasons why we hadn't mentioned it yet on the list as we wanted to make sure everything was in proper order with the KAY Calculator as well as the program.

 

Donna, myself and Krushnaji have been very busy in working on the final copy of the KAS2005 and we have not had a chance to work on the new Krushnas Ayanamsa Calculator as of yet.

Once that is out, you can feed in the corrected value for 1/1/1900 in your programs, so please be patient.

 

We are sorry for this inconvenience, but unfortunately computer viruses are a part of life and in this case, what was originally Krushna's correct values got mixed up along the way until we figured out the descrepancies and why they were occurring. At least now, we know we have the correct values. Hope this clears up the issue. . .

 

 

Donna and AshModerators of KAS List.

Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more.

[Guest guest]

Dear Krushnaji, Sanjay, Ash, Donna, and Group,

 

If this is the case, it is much more than an oversight; and I do not

see why it was never addressed previous to now. After all, many times

when giving advice we are counseling people when they are at their

most vulnerable. See exchanges regarding suicide parameters (May 5,

2002) and recall the karma of the astrologer principle most should be

aware of. As astrologers this is where we need the real data.

 

I have kept quiet most of the time on the list and have not given

much voice. In private email I tired my best and asked many times

about true/mean nodes and why Ron's chart was the anomaly to all the

other charts (see msg #519 as Ash pointed out. See that Krushna used

true nodes). Luckly I have not accumulated much, if any, of this

karmic stain (guru chandal) as I've only guided a few – and that

vaguely stating the obvious. Whenever I asked about this over the

years unfortunately the only response I got was that this was

discussed in previous mails and to check the archive.

 

I have tried to consult Krushnaji on this and other matters/questions

off the list for the past 2 years, and have not got any response. For

me Ron's chart has been the only anomaly. I get my result in my own

way it seems.

 

Over the next couple of days I will have to think whether I should

leave this list. I'm not sure right now. I have taken a lot of

principles, and have enough despite the guidance, to build now in my

next 60+ years.

 

Pranam and

Thanks,

-Puneet

 

, Ash <ashsam73>

wrote:

> Dear Puneet and Group,

>

> There had been exchanges on the value of the ayanamsa starting as

far back as message # 519. The value given by Krushnaji in that mail

for August 13th 1936 was 22:04:28, which was different from the value

given in the lesson. Referring back to message # 585 and # 603,

Krushnaji said that his computer was attacked by a virus forcing him

to replace his hard disk and re feed all the data. Somewhere during

that time and when the KAY Calculator was created, an error of about

7 mins crept in.

>

> When Margarita and myself were solving charts with Krushnaji when

he was teaching us KAS, we realized that consistently the dashas that

Krushnaji was getting and what we were getting were off.

> When designing this Worksheet and tuning the Ayanamsa we again hit

the same issues.

> Krushnaji then said that he would re-compute the values from the

first principles as it was imperative that we have the correct KAY

values as it would make a difference in some charts when planets

would be very close to border and also in dasha length for about 56

days, just as Puneet has pointed out so astutely in his mail.

>

> Donna and myself just recently got the new computed values which we

have fed into the KAS 2005 program and it is in fact the same value

that he had originally used back when he was rectifying Ron's chart

(message # 519). There is a difference of approximately 7 mins.

>

> We shall start to work on the new release of a new Krushnas

Ayanamsa Calculator for the benefit of all once we have ironed out

all the issues with KAS2005. This was one of the reasons why we

hadn't mentioned it yet on the list as we wanted to make sure

everything was in proper order with the KAY Calculator as well as the

program.

>

> Donna, myself and Krushnaji have been very busy in working on the

final copy of the KAS2005 and we have not had a chance to work on the

new Krushnas Ayanamsa Calculator as of yet.

> Once that is out, you can feed in the corrected value for 1/1/1900

in your programs, so please be patient.

>

> We are sorry for this inconvenience, but unfortunately computer

viruses are a part of life and in this case, what was originally

Krushna's correct values got mixed up along the way until we figured

out the descrepancies and why they were occurring. At least now, we

know we have the correct values. Hope this clears up the issue. . .

>

>

> Donna and Ash

> Moderators of KAS List.

>

>

>

>

>

> Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more.

[Guest guest]

Dear Puneet,I certainly understand your feelings in this regard, but no matter how

honest anyone's intentions were, unfortunately, the simple truth of the

matter is that a mistake was made and we're doing our best to remedy

that mistake by telling the truth, knowing fully well what it would look

like to the group and just trying to make it right.

 

If you choose to leave the group, then we will surely miss your presence as

you always offer valuable input, but I'd rather we all try to get thru this

rough patch now and know for sure that the ayanamsa value is now correct

than to pretend it never happened at all and continue on in the same fashion

as we did before, in ignorance.

 

In any case, it's your choice. No matter what your decision, I wish you well.

 

Take care -

Donna

 

 

 

If this is the case, it is much more than an oversight; and I do not see why it was never addressed previous to now. After all, many times when giving advice we are counseling people when they are at their most vulnerable. See exchanges regarding suicide parameters (May 5, 2002) and recall the karma of the astrologer principle most should be aware of. As astrologers this is where we need the real data. I have kept quiet most of the time on the list and have not given much voice. In private email I tired my best and asked many times about true/mean nodes and why Ron's chart was the anomaly to all the other charts (see msg #519 as Ash pointed out. See that Krushna used true nodes). Luckly I have not accumulated much, if any, of this karmic stain (guru chandal) as I've only guided a few - and that vaguely stating the obvious. Whenever I asked about this over the years unfortunately the only response I got was that this was discussed in previous mails and to check the archive. I have tried to consult Krushnaji on this and other matters/questions off the list for the past 2 years, and have not got any response. For me Ron's chart has been the only anomaly. I get my result in my own way it seems.Over the next couple of days I will have to think whether I should leave this list. I'm not sure right now. I have taken a lot of principles, and have enough despite the guidance, to build now in my next 60+ years.Pranam and Thanks,-Puneet , Ash <ashsam73> wrote:> Dear Puneet and Group,> > There had been exchanges on the value of the ayanamsa starting as far back as message # 519. The value given by Krushnaji in that mail for August 13th 1936 was 22:04:28, which was different from the value given in the lesson. Referring back to message # 585 and # 603, Krushnaji said that his computer was attacked by a virus forcing him to replace his hard disk and re feed all the data. Somewhere during that time and when the KAY Calculator was created, an error of about 7 mins crept in.> > When Margarita and myself were solving charts with Krushnaji when he was teaching us KAS, we realized that consistently the dashas that Krushnaji was getting and what we were getting were off. > When designing this Worksheet and tuning the Ayanamsa we again hit the same issues. > Krushnaji then said that he would re-compute the values from the first principles as it was imperative that we have the correct KAY values as it would make a difference in some charts when planets would be very close to border and also in dasha length for about 56 days, just as Puneet has pointed out so astutely in his mail. > > Donna and myself just recently got the new computed values which we have fed into the KAS 2005 program and it is in fact the same value that he had originally used back when he was rectifying Ron's chart (message # 519). There is a difference of approximately 7 mins.> > We shall start to work on the new release of a new Krushnas Ayanamsa Calculator for the benefit of all once we have ironed out all the issues with KAS2005. This was one of the reasons why we hadn't mentioned it yet on the list as we wanted to make sure everything was in proper order with the KAY Calculator as well as the program. > > Donna, myself and Krushnaji have been very busy in working on the final copy of the KAS2005 and we have not had a chance to work on the new Krushnas Ayanamsa Calculator as of yet. > Once that is out, you can feed in the corrected value for 1/1/1900 in your programs, so please be patient.> > We are sorry for this inconvenience, but unfortunately computer viruses are a part of life and in this case, what was originally Krushna's correct values got mixed up along the way until we figured out the descrepancies and why they were occurring. At least now, we know we have the correct values. Hope this clears up the issue. . .> > > Donna and Ash> Moderators of KAS List.> > > > > > Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more.

[Guest guest]

Dear Puneet, Donna and List,

 

Perhaps not my place to get involved as I am more or less a silent learner on this List, but here are my thoughts.

 

I assume this ayanamsa has been worked and validated by Krushna over the years - it has been close enough to accurate as we could hope for, although of course there is no doubt concern over the 7 minute discrepancy.

 

At the same time, all other popular ayanamsas like Lahiri, KP, and so on would probably have gone under the same sort of tweaking and tuning.

 

Although they have been established for many years, prior to their (current standing) official validation I am sure they (other popular ayanamsas) too would have been released - and then later rectified by a few minutes here and there - based on people's feedback/findings - before finally nailing them down to what they are now.

 

Even then, taking Lahiri (purely as an example, not as a target), it is known that some people still try to fine tune their concern of the exactness of it. At least that is what I have seen on various lists. Part of the usefulness of most Astrology softwares, they allow for "rectification" of the official Lahiri/KP values, etc.

 

I too hope you do not leave the list, Puneet as I find you an excellent contributor/scholar of the KAS system. You did a great analysis of my Job situation/Moon antra a few months back.

 

Best - Sateesh.

 

========

 

 

 

- Donna Quinn

Sunday, January 16, 2005 5:17 AM

Re: Ayanamsa Letter to the Group

 

Dear Puneet,I certainly understand your feelings in this regard, but no matter how

honest anyone's intentions were, unfortunately, the simple truth of the

matter is that a mistake was made and we're doing our best to remedy

that mistake by telling the truth, knowing fully well what it would look

like to the group and just trying to make it right.

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Donna, Sateesh,

 

Thanks for your reply. For some reason I do not believe Donna's

ayanamsa program is the culprit. And I do not think Krushna & all of

us would have gone for 4-5yrs with such an error on list since we

can pin point to 10 days. My opinoin has been that Ron's chart was

just an anomaly.

 

Going deeper only brings out more questions..It is imporant because

we should think in the future of this system - will the people be

helped or harmed? When astrologers mislead some stains for future

are started.

 

For this I consulted an oracle outside astrology, and I'm believing

there is some seeds for guru chandal.

 

Best wishes,

-Puneet

 

, " Sateesh Batas "

<makara@n...> wrote:

> Dear Puneet, Donna and List,

>

> Perhaps not my place to get involved as I am more or less a silent

learner on this List, but here are my thoughts.

>

> I assume this ayanamsa has been worked and validated by Krushna

over the years - it has been close enough to accurate as we could

hope for, although of course there is no doubt concern over the 7

minute discrepancy.

>

> At the same time, all other popular ayanamsas like Lahiri, KP, and

so on would probably have gone under the same sort of tweaking and

tuning.

>

> Although they have been established for many years, prior to their

(current standing) official validation I am sure they (other popular

ayanamsas) too would have been released - and then later rectified

by a few minutes here and there - based on people's

feedback/findings - before finally nailing them down to what they

are now.

>

> Even then, taking Lahiri (purely as an example, not as a target),

it is known that some people still try to fine tune their concern of

the exactness of it. At least that is what I have seen on various

lists. Part of the usefulness of most Astrology softwares, they

allow for " rectification " of the official Lahiri/KP values, etc.

>

> I too hope you do not leave the list, Puneet as I find you an

excellent contributor/scholar of the KAS system. You did a great

analysis of my Job situation/Moon antra a few months back.

>

> Best - Sateesh.

>

> ========

>

>

>

> -

> Donna Quinn

>

> Sunday, January 16, 2005 5:17 AM

> Re: Ayanamsa Letter to the

Group

>

>

> Dear Puneet,

>

> I certainly understand your feelings in this regard, but no matter

how

> honest anyone's intentions were, unfortunately, the simple truth

of the

> matter is that a mistake was made and we're doing our best to

remedy

> that mistake by telling the truth, knowing fully well what it

would look

> like to the group and just trying to make it right.

[Guest guest]

Dear Puneet,> > > Going deeper only brings out more questions..It is imporant because > we should think in the future of this system - will the people be > helped or harmed? When astrologers mislead some stains for future > are started.

 

When astrologers intentionally mislead, that's one thing, but there was

no intention involved here. We're all human. We all make mistakes. It

really does no one any good to point fingers or stand in judgement of

the reasons why it happened. The main focus should be on the fact that

we DID find the error and corrected it thru the new program. Krushna's

system is an excellent one. If you choose to go forward with it, you will

learn so much more, but if it truly bothers you this much, then perhaps it's

best to move on to something that you feel will give you better results -

something that you feel you can have 100% confidence in. That's your

choice to make. In the meantime, all we can do is try to make it

right, be honest about it and do our best to move forward with this.

 

Donna

[Guest guest]

I'm really in no position to say " when astrologers intentionally

mislead " what happens. Yes we are all human. I'm also in no position

to say more on when things are done without intention (you can look

to background of Ramayana for this). There is no use to debate on

this level. I can only say what I have identified here in the past

couple of days is quirky as the evidence based accuaracy of this

system is very clear to me. " If it ain't broke, don't fix it. " I'm

sure you will figure it out soon.

 

Bye now. Wish you guys all the best.

-Puneet

 

, Donna Quinn

<DQuinn12@o...> wrote:

> Dear Puneet,

> >

> >

> > Going deeper only brings out more questions..It is imporant

because

> > we should think in the future of this system - will the people be

> > helped or harmed? When astrologers mislead some stains for future

> > are started.

>

> When astrologers intentionally mislead, that's one thing, but there

was

> no intention involved here. We're all human. We all make mistakes.

It

> really does no one any good to point fingers or stand in judgement

of

> the reasons why it happened. The main focus should be on the fact

that

> we DID find the error and corrected it thru the new program.

Krushna's

> system is an excellent one. If you choose to go forward with it,

you will

> learn so much more, but if it truly bothers you this much, then

perhaps it's

> best to move on to something that you feel will give you better

results -

> something that you feel you can have 100% confidence in. That's

your

> choice to make. In the meantime, all we can do is try to make it

> right, be honest about it and do our best to move forward with this.

>

> Donna

[Guest guest]

Hi Sateesh -

 

 

Perhaps not my place to get involved as I am more or less a silent learner on this List, but here are my thoughts.

 

Glad to hear from you again Sateesh. )

 

I assume this ayanamsa has been worked and validated by Krushna over the years - it has been close enough to accurate as we could hope for, although of course there is no doubt concern over the 7 minute discrepancy.

 

At the same time, all other popular ayanamsas like Lahiri, KP, and so on would probably have gone under the same sort of tweaking and tuning.

 

Although they have been established for many years, prior to their (current standing) official validation I am sure they (other popular ayanamsas) too would have been released - and then later rectified by a few minutes here and there - based on people's feedback/findings - before finally nailing them down to what they are now.

 

Even then, taking Lahiri (purely as an example, not as a target), it is known that some people still try to fine tune their concern of the exactness of it. At least that is what I have seen on various lists. Part of the usefulness of most Astrology softwares, they allow for "rectification" of the official Lahiri/KP values, etc.

 

What you say is very valid. Ayanamsas in general, are certainly not an exact science by any means, or there wouldn't be so many to choose from to begin with. Everyone has their own system, their own perspective, their own beliefs about which is the truly correct one. And I'm sure that each ayanamsa, taken from its own platform, has its own relevance in accordance to its own system.

 

But the fact remains that with our ayanamsa, a mistake was made somewhere along the line. It has now been rectified and hopefully, with the start of a brand new year and a brand new program, we can all make a fresh start and begin a brand new chapter as well.

 

Donna

 

[Guest guest]

 

Dear Puneet -

> I'm really in no position to say "when astrologers intentionally > mislead" what happens. Yes we are all human. I'm also in no position > to say more on when things are done without intention (you can look > to background of Ramayana for this). There is no use to debate on > this level.

 

I totally agree with you. I'm sure that you will make the best decision

for yourself. Those who are meant to learn this system, simply will,

no matter what. And those who choose to move on will do that as well.

It's all a matter of choice.

 

I think you're a fine astrologer, Puneet. No matter what you choose to

do in the end, I'm sure you will do it with honor.

 

Take care-

Donna