Furthrer Discussion on Ve / Me and Ju

[Guest guest]

Dear Group,

 

I thought this also might add value to understand the upchay theory and how it

is given in all the texts but its imbedded and one has to understand this to

undertand what might the Sages have meant.

In any case below is my understanding for what its worth.

 

Cheers !!!

Ash

 

----------------

Dear Dev ji,

 

3rd is house of parakram. So when 3rd house grows, what can it mean?

 

About becoming a thief, then for example, if 3rd lord is Sun i.e. Gemini lagna

and every year when Sun is in Capricorn, all the Gemini borns for that 1 month

will they all become theifs?

 

Of if Say Sag or Sco born person and for 2.5 years Sa will be in Cancer or

Gemini, then all those persons will become Thiefs?

 

That is not possible and I do not think our Maharishis would mean that.

 

7th lord in 8th house and 8th hosue is very important to have children then how

is it bad if one wants to procreate?

 

That way 7th lord in 12th house will pave way for 5th house i.e. become Karak

for 5th house. So now how is it that 7th lord in 12th will become bad? (here i

am adding 12th house angle which is not in our discussion, but to point out that

blindly going by 8th as bad and 12th as bad cannot be the norm for whole chart).

 

3rd lord in 8th house means 3rd house grows in significance. 3rd house is that

of parakram and if you notice the attributes that Kalyan Verma has attributed to

" General " significance is based on parakram for example Thief means an " Act " or

" Parakram " , it can also mean that a person will " Serve others " means again its

dealing with " Parakram " and here there is growth. Now how a person will use the

parakram will depend on the nature of the person i.e. if he will become a theif

or serve the community at large etc etc.

 

Therefore 3rd lord in 8th means its " Growing the significance of 3rd " . 3rd is

Mool karak for 1st.

 

Parakram lord goes in the house that controls 11th i.e. success and tries to

grow 11th house matters. Now a person can become rich by " stealing " i.e. thief

and using his parakram in bad way or antisocial way or he migth grow his wealth

serving othesr of a good cause and being a role model citizen.

 

So again, upchay theory is used is my point. Just going by 6th 8th and 12th as

BAD for all house cannot be true.

 

I hope you understand my point.

 

12th lord in 8th is again dealing with Parakram. 10th from 3rd in 6th from 3rd.

Besides, if Aries is the lagna then 12th lord in any house will enhance the

result of the house its placed in. Therefore the significance of 8th house will

become good. In other words, in VA one is using it as vipareet raj yog.

 

ok i am out of time.

 

If you do not agree with my chain of thought, we can agree to disagree.

 

Cheers !!!

Ash

 

 

, " axeplex " <axeplex wrote:

>

> Dear Ash ji,

>

> By BAD, he meant opposite to what we were discussing.

> 3rd in 8th - will earn livelihood serving others, a thief

> 7th in 8th - wife and marital issues

> 12th in 8th - shall gain and have good qualities

>

> To me, Upachaaya are definitely mentioned by Prasara but here what you were

mentioning was referring from 3rd. It can not be same as ASC and would related

to 3rd significations.

>

> regds

> Dev

>

> , " ashsam73 " <kas@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Dev ji,

> >

> > Upchay is also given by Parasara. The meaning of upchay is growth, heap and

prosprity.

> >

> > Therefore, now we have a contradiction. If you go by 3rd lord in 8th is

" BAD " then we would need to understand what the Maharishi meant by " BAD " .

> >

> > Otherwise 3rd lord in 8th means its in 6th from 3rd. 6th is powerful upchay

sthan as its upchay from both Phal sthan and Karak sthan.

> >

> > So kindly share what is meant by " Good " and " Bad " . then we can resolve

this.

> >

> > Or in other words " Good " and " Bad " for what? is it for full life or is it

for some event or is it for ALL 12 house etc etc.

> >

> > Kindly elucidate.

> >

> > Cheers !!!

> > Ash

> >

> > , " axeplex " <axeplex@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Ash ji,

> > >

> > > I have few differences to what you have written.

> > >

> > > 3rd in 8th is not a good combination (Prasara)

> > > 7th in 8th is not a good combination (Prasara)

> > > 12th in 8th is a good combination (Prasara).

> > >

> > > From and how we are assuming 7th in 8th or 3rd in 8th as good combination.

And why we are assuming 12th in 8th as bad?

> > >

> > > regds

> > > Dev

> > >

> > > , " ashsam73 " <kas@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Kiran ji,

> > > >

> > > > Take Kalpurush chart.

> > > >

> > > > Me rules 3rd and 6th house. It is placed in 8th house. Therefore as

3rd lord its placed in upchay i.e. 6th from 3rd and as 6th lord its placed in

3rd from 6th. Therefore the results of these 2 house will get enhanced. 6th

house is Upchay for 1st house and so in KAS terms LoE is in House A. or in

other words, the results of 1st house is enhanced. 8th house is KARAK sthan for

1st and its natural lord is Mars. 3rd house is Mool Karak sthan for 1st house

and its lord is in Karak sthan.

> > > >

> > > > Regarding Rich, again 8th house is 10th from 11th house. Now Mercury is

in upchay sthan for 11th house. Now 6th house (natural 6th is Virgo) so natural

6th lord is in 3rd from own house so upchay sthan and then again from phal sthan

i.e. 11th house its in 10th so again in upchay. 6th house is KARAK sthan for

11th which is success. So the native will be very rich.

> > > >

> > > > The upchay theory is the underlying theory behind this and if you use

the same theory for most of the results given in classics so many things will

get clear.

> > > >

> > > > Case 2

> > > > Ve is 8th house. Ve rules 2nd and 7th house. From 7th house its in

dhan sthan. From 2nd house its in opposition to it. 8th house is upchay sthan

from 11th and in 11th from 10th as well. So upchay to both the house of

authority and income. So like that.

> > > >

> > > > Case 3

> > > >

> > > > Ju rules natural 12th and 9th house. As natual 9th lord its in 8th

house i.e. in 12th from 8th which is not conducive to matters of luck. A person

might have to face hard ships. Now as 12th lord in 8th house, means its upchay

for 3rd house i.e. 10th from 3rd and its placed in 6th house from 3rd therefore

the results of 3rd house will get enhanced. Therefore such a person will have

to work hard in life. Now it means the opposite house of luck (9th) house is

triggering which is hard work. So all the attributes like serving people,

associating with lower class people etc are psychology associated with such.

> > > >

> > > > All this is based on kalpurush chart. So many things will change based

on lord ship.

> > > >

> > > > If Guru rules 8th and itself is placed in 8th house then it will become

sarla yoga so things change.

> > > >

> > > > For Virgo lagna if Ve is in 8th house then ........

> > > >

> > > > Hope that helps,

> > > > Cheers !!!

> > > > Ash

> > > >

> > > > , " kiran.rama "

<kiran.rama@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Saravali says:

> > > > > If Mercury occupies the 8th, the native will win famous names

(titles),

> > > > > be strong, long-lived, will support his family and be equal to a king,

> > > > > or will become a justice. ---> Mercury in 8th house is good

> > > > > If Venus is in the 8th, the native will be long-lived, will enjoy

> > > > > incomparable happiness, be very rich, be equal to a king and moment

> > > > > after moment will feel delighted. --> Venus in 8th house is good

> > > > > f Jupiter occupies the 8th, the native will be insulted, long-lived,

be

> > > > > a servant, will serve his own people, be pitiable and will have union

> > > > > with dirty women. --> Jupiter in 8th house is bad

> > > > >

> > > > > This is perplexing - How can 2 benefic planets Me & Ve give good

results

> > > > > in 8th house - and opposite for Ju

> > > > > Thanks

> > > > > Kiran