The God concept, direct, personal experience, believing in self

July 29, 2008

Jonathan,

Nice to meet you. What a great topic and discussion you've started. I

can offer in answer to your question about the collective (and forgive

me if this has already been mentioned; I haven't read the whole thread),

that most sources in the new spirituality movement or new age, or

whatever term you want to call it, and this feels right to me also,

consider the " collective " state you speak of the beginning whence we

come (in our current theatre of expression) and the end to which we

aspire, separation and fragmentation being artificial and temporary

constructs provided as devices through which experience can be gathered

and maximised through all levels (heirarchically and laterally) by the

Whole. The visual sometimes offered is that of a circle with no

beginning or end in the temporal sense.

And yes, since time as we perceive it does not capture the whole

picture, I like to say we are already at some level or in some dimension

united and reunited in this oneness state, thus this reality can and

does filter down through all (individuated) expressions, including our

present locus of incarnated human. So there really are concrete and

knowable answers available to us even here, while still living on Earth.

But what I really want to say and what moved me to post is what a good

and useful thing it is to question and consider these concepts, even

though you may feel right now that this is unknowable information or

unprovable or scientifically unsupportable.

I'm speaking as a " reformed agnostic, " one who was not one whit ashamed

to profess ignorance on spiritual matters including the existence of God

and an afterlife. Someone with a real feel and respect for science will

also know its limitations, and that science could neither prove nor

disprove such things at the moment made atheism, to my way of thinking,

seem as much a potential delusion as religion. This stuff was simply

outside my realm (small " my " , so I was an undecided voter about it.

What claiming ignorance did for me, aside from entraining comfort within

a profound and protracted context of " not knowing " was position me in a

state of humility in relation to Truth, whatever that would be revealed

to be. I didn't expect to stumble into it until my death, which would

have been the deciding point.

I had a fingers crossed type hope, but not expectation enough to extract

me from what became a near Woody Allen caliber neurosis at times,

concerning death as meaning possible annhilation. I envied the devout;

at least they had a certainty about life's continuance and some type of

deeper meaning to it all. I'd had it as a child; I remembered how right

it felt, how comforting. Nothing made sense without that kind of hope

and promise.

What happened, you ask? What had to happen. Direct experience. One

might say " undeniable " experience, but that didn't stop me using every

brain cell to test its undeniability. I used all my rational processes

to consider from every angle what might be happening as my mind went

strange places and I began remembering the larger part of Who I Am. (I

now believe my upper chakras were opening to higher information and

functioning.)

I read up on mental illnesses and through process of elimination came to

spirituality last. I actually had to have two awakenings because after

the first one I went into denial, falling back into agnosticism and

writing off my spiritual experiences as some form of mental illness. (I

went on to make a full " recovery, " that in itself disproved the mental

illness theory.)

I had no context to make the leap into belief, even in the face of all

the " evidence " of my own personal, direct experience. And still, I

considered myself at that time and still do, probably one of the more

open minded folks in human form. I simply wasn't educated as to the

potentials of human consciousness/spirit.

So, here is what I mean to say. This will sound deceptively simple, but

may save you years of bother. Because the ultimate " proof " of the More

you may be curious about now or even searching for will come *through

direct personal experience, " then, in order to really see that proof

when it comes (and it will, if you are looking at all in its direction),

you must begin to condition yourself now to *believe in yourself.*

Yes, we are the extensions of the God Centre/Source, the fingers of the

Hand. And as you say, there is a Higher part in man, the part that

seems quite obvious when you give it its due, the part that science

knows it can't measure or quite explain. Our poets and artists have

tried to uncover it, describe it, and have moved us to tears sometimes

as they manage to communicate a bit of it, a glimpse of that More. Some

of the tears are in grief over all we have forgotten about ourSelves.

For an atheist to be asking the questions you are and actually

interested in different views on these topics tells me that you are

already superceding the label of " atheist " (or perhaps any label),

because atheists have the matter settled to their mind. It's a forgone

conclusion, a done deal, not subject to revision.

A very holy and sacred state or space is created when we place our

beliefs (whatever they may be) in that " subject to revision " place.

This seems simple, but being open in this way, being " undecided " is

truly terrifying to many. It is on this turf, however, that we come to

find our God, who waits for us here. This admission to ignorance, this

questioning, is a place of light, a blessed place of reception.

I think you may be above this particular fear of being undecided or

incomplete - or perhaps are on the verge of releasing it, releasing this

protection of " being right " and knowing the deal. If so, it may feel

very tenuous for awhile, maybe even with desparate moments as you

struggle to get a new footing.

Don't rush things. We are all really floating around anyway, so may as

well get used to having nothing under your feet now. Floating can be

fun, anyway. Enter your sacred place and feel foolish or ignorant or

doubting or curious or searching, but be open to whatever will come and

meet you there. Whatever else you will be, you will be brave. You will

be standing inside yourSelf. You will be protected.

No, this is not more than you can handle. The fact that you are asking

means it's time. The timing is perfect, and so is your path and all the

choices you've made to bring you here and will make. It all leads to

the same place, and your way will be unlike any other's way. You get to

make the rules, but the ending's the same. Everybody wins.

It's good to get other's views and learn from their experience, but you

will have your own direct experience, because this is the way we unfold

- through personal choice and experience. You will climb your own

mountains and taste your own fruits along the way and will be able to

share what you've learned with others.

Science does not teach us how to judge and analyse and interpret and

savour our own experiences. It describes and catalogues in a

de-personalised way, by design. When I finally gave in to my own Truth,

it meant letting go of the desire for someone to come in and say,

objectively, that what I was going through was real. No one came to my

rescue, would you believe?

Except for myself.

I had to mourn science, as I realised my experiences went beyond what my

dear old friend was able to offer me. So, not only did my whole

worldview have to change, so too did my criteria for measuring and

evaluating it. A double whammy.

I switched over to a new system, which I call " inner knowing. " This is

what stabalised my new world and grounded me. What felt good (in my

body)was kept, what felt rotten was tossed. How could knowing truth be

this simple? I got over it.

When you are ready, Jonathan, ask for your proofs, then hang on for the

ride. Explore your Self and then *believe* the results you get. They

will all fall into your lap. Open your eyes and see them, then believe

in yourself and your inner ability to know fact from fiction. Don't

think you're nuts or delusional.

Likewise, don't think you're not deserving or doing it wrong or

pretending. You will know when you are for real; listen to yourself.

Believe yourself. It may seem that belief in oneself is a pretty basic

concept, something out of preschool self esteem class, but it is a very

advanced level accomplishment, and perhaps an ongoing one right up to

completion/reunion.

Belief in Self, Self empowerment, Self Love, these are the things which

require a firm constitution to explore and develop, simply because of

our God content and because even acknowledging higher Self involves

assuming a higher view and level of operation.

No, science can't help us with this one (yet, anyway). You will have to

help yourself, to a great extent, but there are always others (like

those here) you can talk to and share with, books to read that help ease

the expansion, etc.

This is the (sometimes scary, but ultimately exhilarating) process which

puts us in touch with our " god within " - on purpose. You will be

redesigning your model of Self along with your model of Reality. Your

Self is bigger and better and more beautiful and grand than you will

feel comfortable seeing or accepting. This is what the challenge will

be, whenever you choose to accept it.

To be open to all that you are, and not to shrink from it. There,

within you, you will find plenty of God, and it will lead you to even

larger visions of God beyond concepts of Self. It's a magical mystery

tour for one. The next train will be along any minute (with many

connections along this route!)

Openess (open eyes, open heart), belief, flexibility and adaptability,

courage, cleverness, humour and humility. Take these as tools or

weapons on your journey. Leave the labels, known models, conventional

explanations and expectations behind; you will quickly outgrow their

usefulness. Truth is much more complex and inclusive than we expect it

to be. Better to start again and consider life up to this point a very

loosely related prelude.

Life is about to change (if you let it).

Thank you for asking the questions. Please continue not knowing all the

answers and always keep asking. I've always held questions in higher

regard than answers. They're what make us move. Your humble and

beautiful questions inspired me tonight.

x,

Droxine

I must echo Brandi that Neale Donald Walsch is a good starting point to

working on developing a new (and personal) God concept. Common sense is

not so common.

, " jonrow_2914 "

<jrowland wrote:

>

> I am groping with the concept a divine being per se and would welcome

> input. For perspective sake I would probably be classified as an

> atheist in the conventional sense but believe that we have within us

> that which is divine – we just struggle to come to terms with it

in

> our present state with our present limitations (many wrongly self

> imposed!). I have always found conventional religions, whilst

> enlightening, to be limited to differing degrees and only providing

> part of the answer and often only when taken out of the context in

> which the religion is actually presented and when viewed in a broader

> context along with other religions. The concept of " oneness " seems to

> be generally accepted by many nowadays especially within the context

> of the eastern and older beliefs. Then accepting that " oneness " and

> in the kundalini context where the divine power is within us all, do

> we `evolve' (wrong word but I can't think of a better expression right

> now) to a point where we all achieve that divine state and then we are

> there? Is it an individual expression as such where we all end up on

> an equal and divine plane so to speak? Or do we end up collectively

> forming a divine whole? If it is a collective situation and I know

> time is relative, but thinking linearly, does total `divinity' only

> happen when the last person makes it home?

>

> I accept I am probably grasping at a bigger concept than my i self can

> handle, but my I self is teasing me by holding out on the answer for

> the moment and hence the interest in knowing how the group feels on

> this score.

>

> Love and blessings - Jonathan

>

July 29, 2008

Hi Droxine – thank you for your wonderful, thought-provoking and very

pertinent input re my question – your take on it does in many ways

mirror my own and has helped reinforce some concepts.

I think using the term `atheist' in respect of myself is possibly

misleading in many ways. I do believe that there is considerably more

to us than meets the eye here in the physical but I don't go with the

concept of a deity that is `humanized' (or `superhumanised')

emotion-wise as many religions or beliefs tend to present their gods.

God in my mind is the perfect and `homogenised' extension of

ourselves and I am not sure how that `perfect and homogenised

extension' comes together when we all get to that point (and I am

assuming that we do get there!). That final product is above and

beyond the emotions and related drivers that we get entangled with on

this plane - that final product just is in my mind if that makes sense.

Your comments re science are so relevant – I qualified in the sciences

and have this habit of rationalizing absolutely everything – if it

works I figure out how and why and that conditional thinking is

probably a big part of my stumbling block – I definitely need to move

away from the how and why and accept that that things just are! (the

understanding will come later as you so aptly point out). I

definitely battle to allow the inner knowing take precedent over

mind-invoked logic – an ongoing challenge for me!

I chuckled at your comment re stumbling into the answers at death –

that is probably one of my biggest problems – I don't want to wait for

transition at death to get there – patience has never been a forte' of

mine and I feel that I am wasting time `treading water' so to speak

while trying to get there! lol (chrism has also often told me quite

correctly to be patient, and while I accept and acknowledge your and

his advice in that regard my hard wiring keeps pushing me for results

now! Again it's a conditional thing and my life this time around has

always been about doing what needs to be done as quickly and

effectively as possible and it's a habit hard to break! Those

self-imposed linear time constraints!! lol )

As you so correctly say the secret is just to believe in myself,

forget the conditioning and let it happen!!

Blessings - Jonathan

July 29, 2008

Jonathan,

How nice to get a reply this soon. You must be on UK time.

> God in my mind is the perfect and `homogenised' extension of> ourselves and I am not sure how that `perfect and homogenised> extension' comes together when we all get to that point (and I am> assuming that we do get there!). That final product is above and> beyond the emotions and related drivers that we get entangled with on> this plane

No, if you are having any kind of a concept of God, then I don't think you can call yourself an atheist (unless you are conceiving God as a hypothetical possibility). I'm chaffing a bit at the word "homogenised," because it's hard to forget the splendid and limitless diversity of Creation/Creator, but I get where you're coming from, and I think this picture may be shared by more people than you think. I think our image of God/Source is evolving beyond that old, "superhuman" model. Intelligence may be a key concept to consider.

What it's like at "endgame" (ha) or Union is a mystery, of course, but evolving and refining toward that end involves a combination of letting go of the unnecessary and reclaiming/rediscovering/remembering the essential - all amidst contextualising in new ways via amassing loads of varied experience. This is the exercise at play. What a grand science experiment, eh?

If you want to know a hint or glimmer or feel of what it is like the closer we get to our true nature and to the Whole, look into Love, and treat it as a serious and scholarly (again advanced) topic of study. You might begin with Chrism's Valentine posting of this year (of the 13th, I believe). Search title: love, author: (advanced search). I just reposted this in my group a few days ago. Again, the topic is bigger and more encomassing than we ever dreamed or give it credit for.

We have a very sketchy vision and understanding of Love and make it very conditional and oriented to self-serving. We get only hints and glances of the real thing here. In higher experiences, astral experiences and dreams and such, we sometimes have encounters of a higher, more direct and immediate version of love (on higher planes), denser, more concrete examples on which we can then pattern a fuller understanding.

This Love is The Power, The Force, the hand of God, God, what moves us to expand and contract and move in any direction. There may be other portions of the All That Is that are more still, but the portion we are experiencing most directly right now is the one in movement. Love is the driving force behind this (and, it's a good bet, any God Expression). It is the most powerful force or quality.

So, this is the quality in us which we are refining and uncovering and shaping, just as a diamond is cut to reveal it's inner light, clarity and reflective qualities through it's surfaces. We are moving toward the complete understanding and embodiment of this power/quality.

All that does not express Love on the highest level will eventually fall away at some time or another, having served its usefulness in the exploration. Only Love is necessary and real. Only what aids the Love expression or experience will endure. It is ironic that something we as humans consider so ephemeral, fleeting and indefinable is, in the larger context and when properly understood, actually the one universtal constant to be depended on.

So, there will indeed be much letting go and shedding of skins along the way to the conclusion state. If you are like me, this thought may scare you at first, and cause you to wonder how much of your identity might be "sacrificed" in the name of ulitmate unity. I quickly got over thoughts like these. They really aren't worth the worry.

There is no such thing as death here or anywhere else, no annhilation. When on the brink of joining with Ultimate Love, there will be no thought of "sacrifice" or loss of self, only a great scrabble to get inside that space. We will simply be overcome and swept up in the pure and concentrated essence of our true nature, of Home and of finally and perfectly Fitting.

There may be some measure of "other" retained for those who still enjoy experiencing in this way; all contingencies provided for. I think there is nothing at all to fear when contemplating this particular mystery. I have learned that I create my own short sightedness and disappointments. Reality has never left me cold or wanting.

> I definitely battle to allow the inner knowing take precedent over> mind-invoked logic – an ongoing challenge for me!

Funny you should say this; as I was thinking after I posted about this "inner battle" using these words. Ha. It is still there for me, too, but there are better players now on the inner knowing side. I'm more educated and reach for validation from that side now. We've been overnourished on the side of denial for too long; it's time to even out the playing field a bit, but not relinquish our logical sides, for I still feel these two approaches can work in concert.

But have you ever noticed how some people's "logical argument" is not really logical at all, but quite biased and emotionally based or merely expressive of conventional thinking which may be overdue for some challenging and testing? We must be impeccable in what cognitive approaches we pronounce as "logical," and they must be truly logical - allowing of all possible contingencies, particularly where traditional conclusions do not reach. So, a broadening all round is in order. Make sure the game is fair, at least, both sides evenly equipped and honestly appointing their handicaps.

> I chuckled at your comment re stumbling into the answers at death –> that is probably one of my biggest problems – I don't want to wait for> transition at death to get there. . .

To be clear, this was my resigned attitude when in my agnostic phase, not a reflection of my desire to know. I thought these things were likely unknowable then. I now think different. There are masses of information out there to be had - through experience and reading about that of others.

Are you into OBE at all? Robert Monroe, William Buhlman, etc? This is one way to flex our consciousness and to know through first hand experience that we are more than our bodies. Learning how to become conscious in dreams or have conscious exits from the body is a very convincing way to explore the More that we are. There's plenty of validation that this is not something happening inside the brain or an illusion, if you get into the literature available - and this is something you can test out for yourself. It may be something to explore so you don't feel you are treading water.

> my hard wiring keeps pushing me for results now!

While patience is a good thing, this urge to move forward is also good and is no doubt the divine spark wishing to ignite into its truth. There is a time for listening to this urge and a time for listening to the stillness and having that be enough. also speaks of transformation, and that is nothing if not movement, divinely inspired.

There is a line to walk, perhaps, between desiring and having, for comfort's sake, but trust me, the impatience is there in us all and it is a very good thing because it means we see that there is More and we want it! It propels us toward Truth and Light. It inspires us and carries us on toward shore on its eternal tide. To not have the realisation of this urge would be to live in the darkness of one's own shadow; very sad with little forward movement.

So, rejoice in your passion to discover and progress and let it lead you into various directions that resonate with you. No need to rush or overdo, and acknowledging that this is not a problem to be completed with a solution but rather an ongoing discovery and way of life may be of help. It is a sacred urging to be listened and responded to in this case, not just a foible of impatience.

> Again it's a conditional thing and my life this time around has> always been about doing what needs to be done as quickly and> effectively as possible and it's a habit hard to break!

If you study and begin practicing (unconditional) Love, you will get your "quick and effective results" to be sure. This is potent stuff. And do check out the OBE authors mentioned if you haven't looked into that area already. There are a variety of approaches, but all based in direct, personal investigation and experience.

x,

Droxine

July 29, 2008

Julie

All that we are is the result of what we have thought. - (Siddhartha Gautama)Buddha--- On Tue, 7/29/08, droxine5 <Droxine1 wrote:

droxine5 <Droxine1 Re: The God concept, direct, personal experience, believing in self Date: Tuesday, July 29, 2008, 6:18 AM

Droxine,

My body started tingling as I read your words. I completely resonate with each eloquent sentence. In choosing to make things "simple" in all aspects of my life, that included my spirituality. Through much searching of the soul, I have discovoered that I truly seek God, and who He is to me is "LOVE". Pure and simple. After I felt that simple truth and started living by spiritual principles, I sought to know Him in a more intimate fashion. Again, simply, giving up books,, articles, gurus, ad infinitum, and embracing Kundalini, as stated, the bridge to the Divine, the connection between heaven and earth. Now I have no need to search for answers, just acceptance and daily practice. I am sometimes tempted by the world, ego, and a refusal to ultimate surrender for a day or two, but now that I know my path, I quickly pick myself up, dust myself off, and get back on track. And God speaks to me quite

clearly, through the words written by and every person on this post. Again, thank you for your beautiful words. I will read and reread them.

Blessings,

Julie

DroDve

July 29, 2008

Droxine... I'm used to reading inspired writings by chrism and others in this group, but this is one of the nicest things that I've read in a long time (and I've read many things that you've written). I'm inspired by your inspiration. After reading this, wishing you love and blessings seems a bit pale, but I hope that eternal love in all IT's grandeur is always with you (as well as with all others here)...

Paul

-----------------

Jonathan,Nice to meet you. What a great topic and discussion you've started. Ican offer in answer to your question about the collective (and forgiveme if this has already been mentioned; I haven't read the whole thread),that most sources in the new spirituality movement or new age, orwhatever term you want to call it, and this feels right to me also,consider the "collective" state you speak of the beginning whence wecome (in our current theatre of expression) and the end to which weaspire, separation and fragmentation being artificial and temporaryconstructs provided as devices through which experience can be gatheredand maximised through all levels (heirarchically and laterally) by theWhole. The visual sometimes offered is that of a circle with nobeginning or end in the temporal sense.And yes, since time as we perceive it does not capture the wholepicture, I like to say we are already at some level or in some dimensionunited and reunited in this oneness state, thus this reality can anddoes filter down through all (individuated) expressions, including ourpresent locus of incarnated human. So there really are concrete andknowable answers available to us even here, while still living on Earth.But what I really want to say and what moved me to post is what a goodand useful thing it is to question and consider these concepts, eventhough you may feel right now that this is unknowable information orunprovable or scientifically unsupportable.I'm speaking as a "reformed agnostic," one who was not one whit ashamedto profess ignorance on spiritual matters including the existence of Godand an afterlife. Someone with a real feel and respect for science willalso know its limitations, and that science could neither prove nordisprove such things at the moment made atheism, to my way of thinking,seem as much a potential delusion as religion. This stuff was simplyoutside my realm (small "my" , so I was an undecided voter about it.What claiming ignorance did for me, aside from entraining comfort withina profound and protracted context of "not knowing" was position me in astate of humility in relation to Truth, whatever that would be revealedto be. I didn't expect to stumble into it until my death, which wouldhave been the deciding point.I had a fingers crossed type hope, but not expectation enough to extractme from what became a near Woody Allen caliber neurosis at times,concerning death as meaning possible annhilation. I envied the devout;at least they had a certainty about life's continuance and some type ofdeeper meaning to it all. I'd had it as a child; I remembered how rightit felt, how comforting. Nothing made sense without that kind of hopeand promise.What happened, you ask? What had to happen. Direct experience. Onemight say "undeniable" experience, but that didn't stop me using everybrain cell to test its undeniability. I used all my rational processesto consider from every angle what might be happening as my mind wentstrange places and I began remembering the larger part of Who I Am. (Inow believe my upper chakras were opening to higher information andfunctioning.)I read up on mental illnesses and through process of elimination came tospirituality last. I actually had to have two awakenings because afterthe first one I went into denial, falling back into agnosticism andwriting off my spiritual experiences as some form of mental illness. (Iwent on to make a full "recovery," that in itself disproved the mentalillness theory.)I had no context to make the leap into belief, even in the face of allthe "evidence" of my own personal, direct experience. And still, Iconsidered myself at that time and still do, probably one of the moreopen minded folks in human form. I simply wasn't educated as to thepotentials of human consciousness/spirit.So, here is what I mean to say. This will sound deceptively simple, butmay save you years of bother. Because the ultimate "proof" of the Moreyou may be curious about now or even searching for will come *throughdirect personal experience," then, in order to really see that proofwhen it comes (and it will, if you are looking at all in its direction),you must begin to condition yourself now to *believe in yourself.*Yes, we are the extensions of the God Centre/Source, the fingers of theHand. And as you say, there is a Higher part in man, the part thatseems quite obvious when you give it its due, the part that scienceknows it can't measure or quite explain. Our poets and artists havetried to uncover it, describe it, and have moved us to tears sometimesas they manage to communicate a bit of it, a glimpse of that More. Someof the tears are in grief over all we have forgotten about ourSelves.For an atheist to be asking the questions you are and actuallyinterested in different views on these topics tells me that you arealready superceding the label of "atheist" (or perhaps any label), because atheists have the matter settled to their mind. It's a forgoneconclusion, a done deal, not subject to revision.A very holy and sacred state or space is created when we place ourbeliefs (whatever they may be) in that "subject to revision" place. This seems simple, but being open in this way, being "undecided" istruly terrifying to many. It is on this turf, however, that we come tofind our God, who waits for us here. This admission to ignorance, thisquestioning, is a place of light, a blessed place of reception.I think you may be above this particular fear of being undecided orincomplete - or perhaps are on the verge of releasing it, releasing thisprotection of "being right" and knowing the deal. If so, it may feelvery tenuous for awhile, maybe even with desparate moments as youstruggle to get a new footing.Don't rush things. We are all really floating around anyway, so may aswell get used to having nothing under your feet now. Floating can befun, anyway. Enter your sacred place and feel foolish or ignorant ordoubting or curious or searching, but be open to whatever will come andmeet you there. Whatever else you will be, you will be brave. You willbe standing inside yourSelf. You will be protected.No, this is not more than you can handle. The fact that you are askingmeans it's time. The timing is perfect, and so is your path and all thechoices you've made to bring you here and will make. It all leads tothe same place, and your way will be unlike any other's way. You get tomake the rules, but the ending's the same. Everybody wins.It's good to get other's views and learn from their experience, but youwill have your own direct experience, because this is the way we unfold- through personal choice and experience. You will climb your ownmountains and taste your own fruits along the way and will be able toshare what you've learned with others.Science does not teach us how to judge and analyse and interpret andsavour our own experiences. It describes and catalogues in ade-personalised way, by design. When I finally gave in to my own Truth,it meant letting go of the desire for someone to come in and say,objectively, that what I was going through was real. No one came to myrescue, would you believe?Except for myself.I had to mourn science, as I realised my experiences went beyond what mydear old friend was able to offer me. So, not only did my wholeworldview have to change, so too did my criteria for measuring andevaluating it. A double whammy.I switched over to a new system, which I call "inner knowing." This iswhat stabalised my new world and grounded me. What felt good (in mybody)was kept, what felt rotten was tossed. How could knowing truth bethis simple? I got over it.When you are ready, Jonathan, ask for your proofs, then hang on for theride. Explore your Self and then *believe* the results you get. Theywill all fall into your lap. Open your eyes and see them, then believein yourself and your inner ability to know fact from fiction. Don'tthink you're nuts or delusional.Likewise, don't think you're not deserving or doing it wrong orpretending. You will know when you are for real; listen to yourself. Believe yourself. It may seem that belief in oneself is a pretty basicconcept, something out of preschool self esteem class, but it is a veryadvanced level accomplishment, and perhaps an ongoing one right up tocompletion/reunion.Belief in Self, Self empowerment, Self Love, these are the things whichrequire a firm constitution to explore and develop, simply because ofour God content and because even acknowledging higher Self involvesassuming a higher view and level of operation.No, science can't help us with this one (yet, anyway). You will have tohelp yourself, to a great extent, but there are always others (likethose here) you can talk to and share with, books to read that help easethe expansion, etc.This is the (sometimes scary, but ultimately exhilarating) process whichputs us in touch with our "god within" - on purpose. You will beredesigning your model of Self along with your model of Reality. YourSelf is bigger and better and more beautiful and grand than you willfeel comfortable seeing or accepting. This is what the challenge willbe, whenever you choose to accept it.To be open to all that you are, and not to shrink from it. There,within you, you will find plenty of God, and it will lead you to evenlarger visions of God beyond concepts of Self. It's a magical mysterytour for one. The next train will be along any minute (with manyconnections along this route!)Openess (open eyes, open heart), belief, flexibility and adaptability,courage, cleverness, humour and humility. Take these as tools orweapons on your journey. Leave the labels, known models, conventionalexplanations and expectations behind; you will quickly outgrow theirusefulness. Truth is much more complex and inclusive than we expect itto be. Better to start again and consider life up to this point a veryloosely related prelude.Life is about to change (if you let it).Thank you for asking the questions. Please continue not knowing all theanswers and always keep asking. I've always held questions in higherregard than answers. They're what make us move. Your humble andbeautiful questions inspired me tonight.x,DroxineI must echo Brandi that Neale Donald Walsch is a good starting point toworking on developing a new (and personal) God concept. Common sense isnot so common.