Guest guest Posted July 12, 2009 Report Share Posted July 12, 2009 Namaste dear Purple just some rambling thoughts. . i do hear where you are coming from. . .a number of years ago was surprised when i went to a New Thought Church on a workshop that was listed as prayer. . . .The woman leading the workshop had the stance that no one should pray for another. . .and then went on and stated that it could even be harmful to pray for another. . . i turned that over and knew it did not fit for me personally, but trust it was right for where the woman was on her path. . .and maybe even she was trying to convey something in a frame that my mind had not been exposed to. . .sometimes semantics can cause a seeming opposition but once there is some peeling a complimentary is revealed. so often prayer and positive thought is what i can do, the Native part in me always praying. . . . chaos theory that says even a butterfly flapping its wings can create a hurricane half a world away. . .there have been many studies these days on consciousness and the healing effects of prayer. . . and it seems that in the nature of Oneness, ever prayer for anyone else or the world is in truth a prayer for our Self. . .because in Oneness no matter how we flip it, divide or dice it, it all = 1. . . . . .. Purple you are probably aware of Ho'oponopono? I have found this method of healing by Hawaiian Huna to be most interesting. . .i have opened to it. . .and at am amazed at how effective it is. . .and to be honest i find it to be ego challenging and at the same time it can leave my ego with a " holy tremble " . . . . when i read your comment about was prayer egoic and should we pray for others i wondered if you are coming from a Ho'oponopono path or something similar? The World's Most Unusual Therapist Two years ago, I heard about a therapist in Hawaii who cured a complete ward of criminally insane patients---without ever seeing any of them. The psychologist would study an inmate's chart and then look within himself to see how he created that person's illness. As he improved himself, the patient improved. When I first heard this story,I thought it was an urban legend. How could anyone heal anyone else by healing himself? How could even the best self-improvement make any sense. It wasn't logical, so I dismissed the story. However, I heard it again a year later. I heard that the therapist had used a Hawaiian healing process called Ho'oponopono. I had never heard of it, yet I could not let it leave my mind. If the story was at all true, I had to know more. I had always understood " total responsibility " to mean that I am responsible for what I think and do. Beyond that, it's out of my hands. I think most people think of total responsibility that way. We're responsible for what we do,not what anyone else does. The Hawaiian therapist who healed those mentally ill people would teach me an advanced new perspective about total responsibility. His name is Dr.Ihaleakala Hew Len. We probably spent an hour talking on our first phone call. I asked him to tell me the complete story of his work. as a therapist. He explained that he worked at Hawaii State Hospital for four years. That ward where they kept the criminally insane was dangerous. Psychologists quit on a monthly basis. The staff called in sick a lot or simply quit. People would walk through that ward with their back's against the wall, afraid of being attacked by patients. It was not a pleasant place to live, work, or visit. Dr Len told me that he never saw patients. He agreed to have an office to review their files. While he looked at those files, he would work on himself. As he worked on himself, patients began to heal. " After a few months, patients that had to be shackled were being allowed to walk, freely, " he told me. " Other's who had to be heavily medicated were getting off their medications. And those who had no chance of ever being released were being freed. " I was in awe, " Not only that, " he went on, " but the staff began to enjoy coming to work. Absenteeism an turnover disappeared. We ended up with more staff that was needed because patients were being released, and all the staff was showing up to work. Today, that ward is closed. " " What were you doing within yourself that caused those people to change? " " I was simply healing the part of me that created them " he said. I did not understand, Dr. Len explained that total responsibility for your life means that everything in your life--simply because it is in your life---is your responsibility. In a literal sense the entire world is your creation. WHEW. This is tough to swallow. Being responsible for what I say or do is one thing. Being responsible for what everyone in my life says or does is quite another. Yet, the truth is this: If you take complete responsibility for your life, then everything you see, hear, taste, touch, or in any way experience is your responsibility because it is your life. This means that terrorist activity, the president, the economy---anything you experience and don't like----is up for you to heal.. They do not exist, in a manner of speaking, except as projections from inside you. The problem is not with them, it is with you, and to change them, you have to change you. I know this is tough to grasp, let alone accept or actually live. Blame is far easier than total responsibility, but as I spoke with Dr. Len, I began to realize that healing for him and in Ho'oponopono means loving yourself. If you want to improve your life, you have to heal your life. If you want to cure anyone----even a mentally ill criminal-----you do it by healing you. I asked Dr. Len how he went about healing himself. What was he doing , exactly, when he looked at those patient's files? " I just kept saying, " I am so sorry' and ' I love you' over and over again, " he explained. That's It? That's it. Turns out that loving yourself is the greatest way to improve yourself, and as you improve yourself, you improve your world. . . . . Dr. Len says the prayer is really quite simple. For the ancient Hawaiians, all problems begin as thought. But having a thought is not the problem. So what's the problem? The problems is that all our thoughts are imbued wit painful memories, memories of persons, places, or things. The intellect working alone cannot solve these problems, because the intellect only manages. Managing things is no way to solve problems. You want to let them go! When you do the prayer what happens is that the Divinity takes the painful thought and neutralizes or purifies it. You do not purify the person, place, or thing. You neutralize the energy you associate with that person, place, or thing. So the first stage is purification of that energy. Now something wonderful happens. Not only does that energy get neutralized; it also gets released, so there's a brand new state. Buddhists call it the Void. The final step is that you allow the Divinity to come in and fill the void with light. To do Ho'oponopono , you do not have to know what the problem or error is. All you have to do is notice any problem you are experiencing physically, mentally, emotionally, whatever. Once you notice, your responsibility is to immediately begin to clean, to say, " I am sorry. Please forgive me. " " Every phenomenon on earth is symbolic, and each symbol is an open gate through which the soul, if it is ready, can enter into the inner part of the world, where you and I and day and night are all one. " Hermann Hesse , Tiffany Jones <Tiffany wrote: prayer can get tangled up in the ego. . .i have heard some groups that gather and pray for others and then when the prayer is " not effective " as they believe the outcome needs to be they suggest that the person being prayed for is resistant to God, or it is there karma. . . Some things Amma has said about praying for healing and how it interacts with karma. . . #1. Some people will be healed quickly. #2. Some people will go through a slow process, for the illness is a transformative process of bring some into deeper relationship with the divine at the soul level, and it will lead to release and healing. #3. Some people have issues and physical illnesses that cannot be healed no matter how much prayer, no matter how powerful the healer because at a spiritual soul level they have taken it on as karma for deep tranformative experience for the life time. . . Just today i received this something in my email today about Amma speaking of prayer, and will share it for it resonates with my Native beliefs. . .i will copy it. . . . " During the Atman Puja in Albuquerque, I was struck by something Amma said. Paraphrasing, she said that when groups of people pray and chant together it greatly enhances the beneficial impact on human beings on the planet, as well as Nature. " i remember reading where a devotee asked the Guru. . . " Why should we pray for another? . . . why should we serve another if it is there bad karma that needs to be worked off?. . . would we not be interferring with another's process if we stepped in and tried to help them? " . . . ..the Guru said. . . . It may be their " bad " karma but if you do not help them or pray for them, it will be your " bad " karma. . . . and it is always positive karma to love, serve, and pray " . . . . kinda like the Good Samaritan in the Bible, there was one that basically said it was bad karma that caused the man to be in the ditch and he walked around. . .but it was the man that stopped and at his own expense,time and effort rendered care for the injured man. . . purple these are some of the things that your question brought forth in me and it seems in thinking about it is perhaps the highest form of prayer might be like when we see the entire world as One. . .and every prayer is a healing and prayer for SELF, for there is only One. . .but even in our illusion of duality i think the energetic reality is the same. . .postive benefit can come from joining with others in prayer for others and our world. . .for only in our minds are we separate. . .So is all prayer SELF prayer??? i think so. . .and maybe the bigger question to assimulate is Who is Ourself?. . . much love and honor ordinary sparrow > > Why pray for another? > > > > I guess my question is , is it egoic to pray for another? and should we > > just pray for ourselves? > > > > much love and respect > > purple x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2009 Report Share Posted July 12, 2009 this is so beautiful, just what I needed to hear right now... for me, I am finding that I fear letting go of the fear.. a stuggle between levels... love, lucia ----- For the > ancient Hawaiians, all problems begin as thought. But having a thought > is not the problem. So what's the problem? The problems is that all our > thoughts are imbued wit painful memories, memories of persons, places, > or things. The intellect working alone cannot solve these problems, > because the intellect only manages. Managing things is no way to solve > problems. You want to let them go! When you do the prayer what happens > is that the Divinity takes the painful thought and neutralizes or > purifies it. You do not purify the person, place, or thing. You > neutralize the energy you associate with that person, place, or thing. > So the first stage is purification of that energy. Now something > wonderful happens. Not only does that energy get neutralized; it also > gets released, so there's a brand new state. Buddhists call it the Void. > The final step is that you allow the Divinity to come in and fill the > void with light. To do Ho'oponopono , you do not have to know what the > problem or error is. All you have to do is notice any problem you are > experiencing physically, mentally, emotionally, whatever. Once you > notice, your responsibility is to immediately begin to clean, to say, " > I am sorry. Please forgive me. " " Every phenomenon on earth is symbolic, > and each symbol is an open gate through which the soul, if it is ready, > can enter into the inner part of the world, where you and I and day and > night are all one. " Hermann Hesse > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2009 Report Share Posted July 12, 2009 your amazing sparrow! i don't have a name for where what i have comes from but you have got me lol! I can feel others pain and emotions, inside of me then I have to improve it in myself to heal it in another. from your quotes ***. " " What were you doing within > yourself that caused those people to change? " " I was simply healing the > part of me that created them " he said. I did not understand, Dr. Len > explained that total responsibility for your life means that everything > in your life--simply because it is in your life---is your > responsibility. In a literal sense the entire world is your creation.*** I resonate with this part greatly, if I were to pray for someone it would mean to me that I have to take absolute responsibility for them until I deliver them safely to their goal, physically carrying their pain until we work it out. sparrow quotes " This means that terrorist activity, the president, the > economy---anything you experience and don't like----is up for you to > heal.. They do not exist, in a manner of speaking, except as projections > from inside you. The problem is not with them, it is with you, and to > change them, you have to change you " This is my thought and experiences captured perfectly! Thankyou this has been very healing for me. love purple xx , " ordinarysparrow " <ordinarysparrow wrote: > > Namaste > > dear Purple > > just some rambling thoughts. . > > i do hear where you are coming from. . .a number of years ago was > surprised when i went to a New Thought Church on a workshop that was > listed as prayer. . . .The woman leading the workshop had the stance > that no one should pray for another. . .and then went on and stated that > it could even be harmful to pray for another. . . > > i turned that over and knew it did not fit for me personally, but trust > it was right for where the woman was on her path. . .and maybe even she > was trying to convey something in a frame that my mind had not been > exposed to. . .sometimes semantics can cause a seeming opposition but > once there is some peeling a complimentary is revealed. > > so often prayer and positive thought is what i can do, the Native part > in me always praying. . . . chaos theory that says even a butterfly > flapping its wings can create a hurricane half a world away. . .there > have been many studies these days on consciousness and the healing > effects of prayer. . . > > and it seems that in the nature of Oneness, ever prayer for anyone else > or the world is in truth a prayer for our Self. . .because in Oneness no > matter how we flip it, divide or dice it, it all = 1. . . . . .. > > > Purple you are probably aware of Ho'oponopono? I have found this method > of healing by Hawaiian Huna to be most interesting. . .i have opened to > it. . .and at am amazed at how effective it is. . .and to be honest i > find it to be ego challenging and at the same time it can leave my ego > with a " holy tremble " . . . . > > when i read your comment about was prayer egoic and should we pray for > others i wondered if you are coming from a Ho'oponopono path or > something similar? > > > The World's Most Unusual Therapist Two years ago, I heard about a > therapist in Hawaii who cured a complete ward of criminally insane > patients---without ever seeing any of them. The psychologist would > study an inmate's chart and then look within himself to see how he > created that person's illness. As he improved himself, the patient > improved. When I first heard this story,I thought it was an urban > legend. How could anyone heal anyone else by healing himself? How could > even the best self-improvement make any sense. It wasn't logical, so I > dismissed the story. However, I heard it again a year later. I heard > that the therapist had used a Hawaiian healing process called > Ho'oponopono. I had never heard of it, yet I could not let it leave my > mind. If the story was at all true, I had to know more. I had always > understood " total responsibility " to mean that I am responsible for what > I think and do. Beyond that, it's out of my hands. I think most people > think of total responsibility that way. We're responsible for what we > do,not what anyone else does. The Hawaiian therapist who healed those > mentally ill people would teach me an advanced new perspective about > total responsibility. His name is Dr.Ihaleakala Hew Len. We probably > spent an hour talking on our first phone call. I asked him to tell me > the complete story of his work. as a therapist. He explained that he > worked at Hawaii State Hospital for four years. That ward where they > kept the criminally insane was dangerous. Psychologists quit on a > monthly basis. The staff called in sick a lot or simply quit. People > would walk through that ward with their back's against the wall, afraid > of being attacked by patients. It was not a pleasant place to live, > work, or visit. Dr Len told me that he never saw patients. He agreed to > have an office to review their files. While he looked at those files, he > would work on himself. As he worked on himself, patients began to heal. > " After a few months, patients that had to be shackled were being allowed > to walk, freely, " he told me. " Other's who had to be heavily medicated > were getting off their medications. And those who had no chance of ever > being released were being freed. " I was in awe, " Not only that, " he went > on, " but the staff began to enjoy coming to work. Absenteeism an > turnover disappeared. We ended up with more staff that was needed > because patients were being released, and all the staff was showing up > to work. Today, that ward is closed. " " What were you doing within > yourself that caused those people to change? " " I was simply healing the > part of me that created them " he said. I did not understand, Dr. Len > explained that total responsibility for your life means that everything > in your life--simply because it is in your life---is your > responsibility. In a literal sense the entire world is your creation. > WHEW. This is tough to swallow. Being responsible for what I say or do > is one thing. Being responsible for what everyone in my life says or > does is quite another. Yet, the truth is this: If you take complete > responsibility for your life, then everything you see, hear, taste, > touch, or in any way experience is your responsibility because it is > your life. This means that terrorist activity, the president, the > economy---anything you experience and don't like----is up for you to > heal.. They do not exist, in a manner of speaking, except as projections > from inside you. The problem is not with them, it is with you, and to > change them, you have to change you. I know this is tough to grasp, let > alone accept or actually live. Blame is far easier than total > responsibility, but as I spoke with Dr. Len, I began to realize that > healing for him and in Ho'oponopono means loving yourself. If you want > to improve your life, you have to heal your life. If you want to cure > anyone----even a mentally ill criminal-----you do it by healing you. I > asked Dr. Len how he went about healing himself. What was he doing , > exactly, when he looked at those patient's files? " I just kept saying, " > I am so sorry' and ' I love you' over and over again, " he explained. > That's It? That's it. Turns out that loving yourself is the greatest way > to improve yourself, and as you improve yourself, you improve your > world. . . . . Dr. Len says the prayer is really quite simple. For the > ancient Hawaiians, all problems begin as thought. But having a thought > is not the problem. So what's the problem? The problems is that all our > thoughts are imbued wit painful memories, memories of persons, places, > or things. The intellect working alone cannot solve these problems, > because the intellect only manages. Managing things is no way to solve > problems. You want to let them go! When you do the prayer what happens > is that the Divinity takes the painful thought and neutralizes or > purifies it. You do not purify the person, place, or thing. You > neutralize the energy you associate with that person, place, or thing. > So the first stage is purification of that energy. Now something > wonderful happens. Not only does that energy get neutralized; it also > gets released, so there's a brand new state. Buddhists call it the Void. > The final step is that you allow the Divinity to come in and fill the > void with light. To do Ho'oponopono , you do not have to know what the > problem or error is. All you have to do is notice any problem you are > experiencing physically, mentally, emotionally, whatever. Once you > notice, your responsibility is to immediately begin to clean, to say, " > I am sorry. Please forgive me. " " Every phenomenon on earth is symbolic, > and each symbol is an open gate through which the soul, if it is ready, > can enter into the inner part of the world, where you and I and day and > night are all one. " Hermann Hesse > > > , Tiffany Jones > <Tiffany@> wrote: > > prayer can get tangled up in the ego. . .i have heard some groups that > gather and pray for others and then when the prayer is " not effective " > as they believe the outcome needs to be they suggest that the person > being prayed for is resistant to God, or it is there karma. . . > > Some things Amma has said about praying for healing and how it > interacts with karma. . . > > #1. Some people will be healed quickly. > #2. Some people will go through a slow process, for the illness is a > transformative process of bring some into deeper relationship with the > divine at the soul level, and it will lead to release and healing. > #3. Some people have issues and physical illnesses that cannot be > healed no matter how much prayer, no matter how powerful the healer > because at a spiritual soul level they have taken it on as karma for > deep tranformative experience for the life time. . . > > Just today i received this something in my email today about Amma > speaking of prayer, and will share it for it resonates with my Native > beliefs. . .i will copy it. . . . > > " During the Atman Puja in Albuquerque, I was struck by something Amma > said. Paraphrasing, she said that when groups of people pray and chant > together it greatly enhances the beneficial impact on human beings on > the planet, as well as Nature. " > > i remember reading where a devotee asked the Guru. . . " Why should we > pray for another? . . . why should we serve another if it is there bad > karma that needs to be worked off?. . . would we not be interferring > with another's process if we stepped in and tried to help them? " . . . > .the Guru said. . . . It may be their " bad " karma but if you do not help > them or pray for them, it will be your " bad " karma. . . . and it is > always positive karma to love, serve, and pray " . . . . > > kinda like the Good Samaritan in the Bible, there was one that basically > said it was bad karma that caused the man to be in the ditch and he > walked around. . .but it was the man that stopped and at his own > expense,time and effort rendered care for the injured man. . . > > purple these are some of the things that your question brought forth in > me and it seems in thinking about it is perhaps the highest form of > prayer might be like when we see the entire world as One. . .and every > prayer is a healing and prayer for SELF, for there is only One. . .but > even in our illusion of duality i think the energetic reality is the > same. . .postive benefit can come from joining with others in prayer for > others and our world. . .for only in our minds are we separate. . .So is > all prayer SELF prayer??? i think so. . .and maybe the bigger question > to assimulate is Who is Ourself?. . . > > much love and honor > ordinary sparrow > > > > > > > > Why pray for another? > > > > > > > I guess my question is , is it egoic to pray for another? and should > we > > > just pray for ourselves? > > > > > > much love and respect > > > purple x > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2009 Report Share Posted July 12, 2009 Namaste dear Purple. . . glad it spoke to you. . .your question sure helped me too. . .for this form of prayer is what i have been doing this evening. . .one of the reasons i like it is that is is non-dualistic. . .and once my ego lets go of resistance and judgment it rings so true for the deeper Self within. . . another quote i remembered tonight is one from Byron Katie. . . " I am insane if i think someone else is the problem. " . . . Purple i wonder what the world would look like if there where 51% of the world that took total 100% responsibility for what comes into each life? also i liked what was brought up in the discussion. . .Thy Will be Done. .. .i remember hearing Marianne Williamson saying, that often times people are fearful to pray for the Will of God to be done in their lives because they think God will take something from them and take away all the fun. . . but she proposes that to say Thy Will Be Done is the same as saying; May Love Prevail because God is Love . . .and God's Will is for us to be in the image and that is God Loves. . . glad you have joined us Purple ordinary sparrow , " purple_firefly111 " <purple_firefly111 wrote: > > your amazing sparrow! > i don't have a name for where what i have comes from > but you have got me lol! > I can feel others pain and emotions, inside of me then I have to improve it in myself to heal it in another. > > from your quotes ***. " " What were you doing within > > yourself that caused those people to change? " " I was simply healing the > > part of me that created them " he said. I did not understand, Dr. Len > > explained that total responsibility for your life means that everything > > in your life--simply because it is in your life---is your > > responsibility. In a literal sense the entire world is your creation.*** > > I resonate with this part greatly, if I were to pray for someone it would mean to me that I have to take absolute responsibility for them until I deliver them safely to their goal, physically carrying their pain until we work it out. > > sparrow quotes " This means that terrorist activity, the president, the > > economy---anything you experience and don't like----is up for you to > > heal.. They do not exist, in a manner of speaking, except as projections > > from inside you. The problem is not with them, it is with you, and to > > change them, you have to change you " > > This is my thought and experiences captured perfectly! > > Thank you this has been very healing for me. > > love purple xx > > > > > , " ordinarysparrow " ordinarysparrow@ wrote: > > > > Namaste > > > > dear Purple > > > > just some rambling thoughts. . > > > > i do hear where you are coming from. . .a number of years ago was > > surprised when i went to a New Thought Church on a workshop that was > > listed as prayer. . . .The woman leading the workshop had the stance > > that no one should pray for another. . .and then went on and stated that > > it could even be harmful to pray for another. . . > > > > i turned that over and knew it did not fit for me personally, but trust > > it was right for where the woman was on her path. . .and maybe even she > > was trying to convey something in a frame that my mind had not been > > exposed to. . .sometimes semantics can cause a seeming opposition but > > once there is some peeling a complimentary is revealed. > > > > so often prayer and positive thought is what i can do, the Native part > > in me always praying. . . . chaos theory that says even a butterfly > > flapping its wings can create a hurricane half a world away. . ..there > > have been many studies these days on consciousness and the healing > > effects of prayer. . . > > > > and it seems that in the nature of Oneness, ever prayer for anyone else > > or the world is in truth a prayer for our Self. . .because in Oneness no > > matter how we flip it, divide or dice it, it all = 1. . . . . .. > > > > > > Purple you are probably aware of Ho'oponopono? I have found this method > > of healing by Hawaiian Huna to be most interesting. . .i have opened to > > it. . .and at am amazed at how effective it is. . .and to be honest i > > find it to be ego challenging and at the same time it can leave my ego > > with a " holy tremble " . . . . > > > > when i read your comment about was prayer egoic and should we pray for > > others i wondered if you are coming from a Ho'oponopono path or > > something similar? > > > > > > The World's Most Unusual Therapist Two years ago, I heard about a > > therapist in Hawaii who cured a complete ward of criminally insane > > patients---without ever seeing any of them. The psychologist would > > study an inmate's chart and then look within himself to see how he > > created that person's illness. As he improved himself, the patient > > improved. When I first heard this story,I thought it was an urban > > legend. How could anyone heal anyone else by healing himself? How could > > even the best self-improvement make any sense. It wasn't logical, so I > > dismissed the story. However, I heard it again a year later. I heard > > that the therapist had used a Hawaiian healing process called > > Ho'oponopono. I had never heard of it, yet I could not let it leave my > > mind. If the story was at all true, I had to know more. I had always > > understood " total responsibility " to mean that I am responsible for what > > I think and do. Beyond that, it's out of my hands. I think most people > > think of total responsibility that way. We're responsible for what we > > do,not what anyone else does. The Hawaiian therapist who healed those > > mentally ill people would teach me an advanced new perspective about > > total responsibility. His name is Dr.Ihaleakala Hew Len. We probably > > spent an hour talking on our first phone call. I asked him to tell me > > the complete story of his work. as a therapist. He explained that he > > worked at Hawaii State Hospital for four years. That ward where they > > kept the criminally insane was dangerous. Psychologists quit on a > > monthly basis. The staff called in sick a lot or simply quit. People > > would walk through that ward with their back's against the wall, afraid > > of being attacked by patients. It was not a pleasant place to live, > > work, or visit. Dr Len told me that he never saw patients. He agreed to > > have an office to review their files. While he looked at those files, he > > would work on himself. As he worked on himself, patients began to heal. > > " After a few months, patients that had to be shackled were being allowed > > to walk, freely, " he told me. " Other's who had to be heavily medicated > > were getting off their medications. And those who had no chance of ever > > being released were being freed. " I was in awe, " Not only that, " he went > > on, " but the staff began to enjoy coming to work. Absenteeism an > > turnover disappeared. We ended up with more staff that was needed > > because patients were being released, and all the staff was showing up > > to work. Today, that ward is closed. " " What were you doing within > > yourself that caused those people to change? " " I was simply healing the > > part of me that created them " he said. I did not understand, Dr. Len > > explained that total responsibility for your life means that everything > > in your life--simply because it is in your life---is your > > responsibility. In a literal sense the entire world is your creation. > > WHEW. This is tough to swallow. Being responsible for what I say or do > > is one thing. Being responsible for what everyone in my life says or > > does is quite another. Yet, the truth is this: If you take complete > > responsibility for your life, then everything you see, hear, taste, > > touch, or in any way experience is your responsibility because it is > > your life. This means that terrorist activity, the president, the > > economy---anything you experience and don't like----is up for you to > > heal.. They do not exist, in a manner of speaking, except as projections > > from inside you. The problem is not with them, it is with you, and to > > change them, you have to change you. I know this is tough to grasp, let > > alone accept or actually live. Blame is far easier than total > > responsibility, but as I spoke with Dr. Len, I began to realize that > > healing for him and in Ho'oponopono means loving yourself. If you want > > to improve your life, you have to heal your life. If you want to cure > > anyone----even a mentally ill criminal-----you do it by healing you. I > > asked Dr. Len how he went about healing himself. What was he doing , > > exactly, when he looked at those patient's files? " I just kept saying, " > > I am so sorry' and ' I love you' over and over again, " he explained. > > That's It? That's it. Turns out that loving yourself is the greatest way > > to improve yourself, and as you improve yourself, you improve your > > world. . . . . Dr. Len says the prayer is really quite simple. For the > > ancient Hawaiians, all problems begin as thought. But having a thought > > is not the problem. So what's the problem? The problems is that all our > > thoughts are imbued wit painful memories, memories of persons, places, > > or things. The intellect working alone cannot solve these problems, > > because the intellect only manages. Managing things is no way to solve > > problems. You want to let them go! When you do the prayer what happens > > is that the Divinity takes the painful thought and neutralizes or > > purifies it. You do not purify the person, place, or thing. You > > neutralize the energy you associate with that person, place, or thing. > > So the first stage is purification of that energy. Now something > > wonderful happens. Not only does that energy get neutralized; it also > > gets released, so there's a brand new state. Buddhists call it the Void. > > The final step is that you allow the Divinity to come in and fill the > > void with light. To do Ho'oponopono , you do not have to know what the > > problem or error is. All you have to do is notice any problem you are > > experiencing physically, mentally, emotionally, whatever. Once you > > notice, your responsibility is to immediately begin to clean, to say, " > > I am sorry. Please forgive me. " " Every phenomenon on earth is symbolic, > > and each symbol is an open gate through which the soul, if it is ready, > > can enter into the inner part of the world, where you and I and day and > > night are all one. " Hermann Hesse > > > > > > , Tiffany Jones > > <Tiffany@> wrote: > > > > prayer can get tangled up in the ego. . .i have heard some groups that > > gather and pray for others and then when the prayer is " not effective " > > as they believe the outcome needs to be they suggest that the person > > being prayed for is resistant to God, or it is there karma. . . > > > > Some things Amma has said about praying for healing and how it > > interacts with karma. . . > > > > #1. Some people will be healed quickly. > > #2. Some people will go through a slow process, for the illness is a > > transformative process of bring some into deeper relationship with the > > divine at the soul level, and it will lead to release and healing. > > #3. Some people have issues and physical illnesses that cannot be > > healed no matter how much prayer, no matter how powerful the healer > > because at a spiritual soul level they have taken it on as karma for > > deep tranformative experience for the life time. . . > > > > Just today i received this something in my email today about Amma > > speaking of prayer, and will share it for it resonates with my Native > > beliefs. . .i will copy it. . . . > > > > " During the Atman Puja in Albuquerque, I was struck by something Amma > > said. Paraphrasing, she said that when groups of people pray and chant > > together it greatly enhances the beneficial impact on human beings on > > the planet, as well as Nature. " > > > > i remember reading where a devotee asked the Guru. . . " Why should we > > pray for another? . . . why should we serve another if it is there bad > > karma that needs to be worked off?. . . would we not be interferring > > with another's process if we stepped in and tried to help them? " . . .. > > .the Guru said. . . . It may be their " bad " karma but if you do not help > > them or pray for them, it will be your " bad " karma. . . . and it is > > always positive karma to love, serve, and pray " . . . . > > > > kinda like the Good Samaritan in the Bible, there was one that basically > > said it was bad karma that caused the man to be in the ditch and he > > walked around. . .but it was the man that stopped and at his own > > expense,time and effort rendered care for the injured man. . . > > > > purple these are some of the things that your question brought forth in > > me and it seems in thinking about it is perhaps the highest form of > > prayer might be like when we see the entire world as One. . .and every > > prayer is a healing and prayer for SELF, for there is only One. . ..but > > even in our illusion of duality i think the energetic reality is the > > same. . .postive benefit can come from joining with others in prayer for > > others and our world. . .for only in our minds are we separate. . ..So is > > all prayer SELF prayer??? i think so. . .and maybe the bigger question > > to assimulate is Who is Ourself?. . . > > > > much love and honor > > ordinary sparrow > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why pray for another? > > > > > > > > > > I guess my question is , is it egoic to pray for another? and should > > we > > > > just pray for ourselves? > > > > > > > > much love and respect > > > > purple x > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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