Shiva - Swaminarayan - Jesus

[Guest guest]

Other masters have also said something similar:

 

Jesus: I am the only way to God.

Buddha: Buddham Sharanam Gachami

Swaminarayan: Surrender to me. I am parabrahman.

 

Now what do you say. What Krishna said is the truth, because he lifted govardhan. Then one can argue that Jesus also did miracles. If you assume that he is the son of god as it is normally stated, then why did he say that he is the only way. Why not worship god directly.

 

All the incarnations, based on the time and circumstances have given advice accordingly and assumed a particular role. For e.g. advice given by Krishna to Uddhav in the uddhav gita is of a different nature than what he told arjun on the battlefield. Understand, Krishna appeared 7000 years ago by the name Krishna. Why do you remove any possibility of the same Krishna appearing as Jesus, Swamianaryan, Buddha etc for the benifit of mankind at different times.

 

[Guest guest]

Any tom, dick and harry can claim to be God, but so far only one being has proved it, that is Lord krishna.

 

The muslims believe that Jesus lied when he declared himself as the son of God and that he will suffer for that. He did, he was crucified.

 

God cannot be crucified, so leave Jesus out of the God category.

 

 

[Guest guest]

"Other masters have also said something similar:

 

Jesus: I am the only way to God."

 

So did you actaully read it yourself? He said he is the only way TO God. He does not say He is God Himself. By saying "I am the OMLY way to God", He is saying that His teachings, which were pure Bhakti, are the only way to God. He functioned as guru, and it is widely known that God can only be attained by accepting in all humility a guru. So since He was addressing His disciples at that time, He was correct in stating that He was the only way to God. Krishna Himself directs His devotees to not approach Him directly but through the spiritual master.

 

Buddha is predicted/stated in the Bhagavatam as an incarnation of Krishna.

 

Haribol!

[Guest guest]

SAHJANAND SWAMY ESTABLISHED SWAMINARAYAN SAMPRADAYA.

SWAMY NARAYANA MEANS PRAY TO NARAYANA THROUGH SWAMY. JUST LIKE PRAY KRISHNA LIKE RADHA. PRAY BARAYANA LIKE LAXMI( lAXMI NARAYANA). WE KNOW GOD RAMA, KRISHNA, SHIVA.

WHAT THEIR WORK.

RAMA IS MARYADA PURSHOTTAM. HE GAVE DIRECTION TO LIVE IN FAMILY. HE KILL RAVANA TO TAKE SITA BACK. HE COULD NOT CHANGES RAVANA'S MIND.

SHRI KRISHNA GAVE THEAORY OF KARMA. KRISHNA KILLES KANS AND HE PLAYED MAJOR ROLE IN MAHABHARAT TO KILL THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE. KRISHNA GAVE UPDESH OF MOKSHA TO ARJUN NOT TO DURYODHAN. KRISHNA IS CAPABLE TO RULE & CHANGE THE ATTITUDE OF DURYODHAN BUT HE HAS NOT DONE THAT.

LORD SWAMINARAYAN HAVE NEVER KILLED ANY BODY. WHO COME ACROSS TO KILL HIM OR TO GIVE HIM PAIN, LORD SWAMINARAYANA HAS CHANGED HIS ATTITUDE OF NAFRAT, KRODH & MAKE HIM COOL & HE HAS MAKE HUMAN TO HUMAN.

LORS KRISHAN COME WITH SUDARSHAN, RAMA COME WITH DHANUSH, SWAMINARAYANA COME WITH ROSE.

THIS IS HIS BIGGEST EVER ACHIVMENT FRIENDS. HE DIVERTED MIND OF JUNGLEE MANS & MAKE HIM POLITE & AHINSAK.

iF WE GO THROUGH SHASTRA BRAHMA , VISHNU & MAHES ARE HANDELING ONE BRAHMAND. THEY ARE DOING BHAKTY OF ANIRUDHH & SANKARSHAN. THERE ARE CRORE OF BRAHMANDS & SWAMINARAYANA IS PURNA PURSHOTTAMLORD.

[Guest guest]

SAHJANAND SWAMY ESTABLISHED SWAMINARAYAN SAMPRADAYA.

SWAMY NARAYANA MEANS PRAY TO NARAYANA THROUGH SWAMY. JUST LIKE PRAY KRISHNA LIKE RADHA. PRAY BARAYANA LIKE LAXMI( lAXMI NARAYANA). WE KNOW GOD RAMA, KRISHNA, SHIVA.

WHAT THEIR WORK.

RAMA IS MARYADA PURSHOTTAM. HE GAVE DIRECTION TO LIVE IN FAMILY. HE KILL RAVANA TO TAKE SITA BACK. HE COULD NOT CHANGES RAVANA'S MIND.

SHRI KRISHNA GAVE THEAORY OF KARMA. KRISHNA KILLES KANS AND HE PLAYED MAJOR ROLE IN MAHABHARAT TO KILL THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE. KRISHNA GAVE UPDESH OF MOKSHA TO ARJUN NOT TO DURYODHAN. KRISHNA IS CAPABLE TO RULE & CHANGE THE ATTITUDE OF DURYODHAN BUT HE HAS NOT DONE THAT.

LORD SWAMINARAYAN HAVE NEVER KILLED ANY BODY. WHO COME ACROSS TO KILL HIM OR TO GIVE HIM PAIN, LORD SWAMINARAYANA HAS CHANGED HIS ATTITUDE OF NAFRAT, KRODH & MAKE HIM COOL & HE HAS MAKE HUMAN TO HUMAN.

LORS KRISHAN COME WITH SUDARSHAN, RAMA COME WITH DHANUSH, SWAMINARAYANA COME WITH ROSE.

THIS IS HIS BIGGEST EVER ACHIVMENT FRIENDS. HE DIVERTED MIND OF JUNGLEE MANS & MAKE HIM POLITE & AHINSAK.

iF WE GO THROUGH SHASTRA BRAHMA , VISHNU & MAHES ARE HANDELING ONE BRAHMAND. THEY ARE DOING BHAKTY OF ANIRUDHH & SANKARSHAN. THERE ARE CRORE OF BRAHMANDS & SWAMINARAYANA IS PURNA PURSHOTTAMLORD.

[Guest guest]

You so-called swaminarayan followers, please read the sikhsapatri and follow it.

 

Lord Krishna is the only God, swaminaryan is a Guru and not God.

 

Sahajand swaminarayan is not mentioned in the Vedic scripture as an incarnation of God.

 

Visit www.gitamrta.org/swaminarayan.htm

[imported_yasodanandana]

Now what do you say. What Krishna said is the truth, because he lifted govardhan.

••the problem is what a leader says, but the problem is also if he's authentic or a fake. You go where your leaders or masters go, so if you follow jesus you'll go where jesus is, if you follow krsna you will go to krsna, if you follow sai baba you'll go to sai baba. It is not so difficult to say something superficially religious saying also that i am god or a real god's associate, but what will be the use for my disciples and utimately also for me?

 

so we will discuss on the parameters to use to decide if someone is god or not, but to try to convince us that there's not use of a little discrimination, that we have to worship everyone who claims to be god or who is called god from his followers is not much intelligent

 

Why do you remove any possibility of the same Krishna appearing as Jesus, Swamianaryan, Buddha etc for the benifit of mankind at different times.

••that's not the point as i have explained. Krsna himself says in the gita that he comes whenever dharma declines (yada, yada hi darmasya..) so there's no problem admitting it and believing it... the fact is that i heve not to accept as krsna anyone who simply gives no proof that he's what he claims to be

 

your name indicates that you consider this accuracy as useless because you believe that only formless brahman is the reality so everyone is the supreme without any discrimination... but considering this idea semplicistic and not complete i do not accept it

 

so for me is most important that who claims to be god is really god.. even if i am ready to accept that god can give many different messages in many different forms

[Guest guest]

Without adequate knowledge dont jump to any stupid conclusions. Such fanatical approaches are detrimental. Dont you know, in the purans the death of Ravan and Kansa has been predicted. They were Jay and Vijay themselves, very close to the lord, and the lord came to release them from their curse which they received from Sanatkumar and other rishis.

 

Swaminaryans dont have any scripures to support their philosophy apart from their own scriptures. But the supremacy of Sri Krishna has beeen supported by innumerable scriptures, including Shikshapatri. Then with what audacity you say that Swaminarayan is greater than Krishna. At the most, rationality may suggest that Swaminaryan was Krishna incarnate.

 

The idea of Bhaktas has become to belittle others deties than to offer supreme devotion to their own loved deity. This is not going to help in anyway, if you are treading the path to realization. Anyways, I have one question for the Vaishnavs.

 

Is it true that Vaishnavs dont believe in Jivan Mukti that is complete emancipation (the removal of I-consciousness). I believe so, because if I consciousness is removed the idea of Bhakta and Bhagwan would ceast to exist.

[Guest guest]

Anyone who defies the authoruized scriptures is a fool and he will be sent to hell for a long time.

 

In no Vedic scripture is swaminaryan mentioned. The BAPS and other swaminarayan organizations are blind leading the blind to hell.

 

The Bhagavad-gita is the authorized scripture of the Vedic religion and not any BAPS created literature.

 

Don't waste your life worshipping swaminarayan as God, you will go to hell.

 

Worship only Lord Krishna, only him. As also stated by Swaminaryan in the Sikhsapatri.

 

 

[Guest guest]

 

"Whatever a man may sacrifice to other gods, O son of Kunti, is really meant for Me alone, but it is offered without true understanding." (Lord Krishna, Bhagavad-Gita)

 

"I am the only enjoyer and the only object of sacrifice. Those who do not recognize My true transcendental nature fall down" (Lord Krishna, Bhagavad-Gita)

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

"Can you even contradict the SHIKSHAPATRI against incompetant Hare Krishna Books ?? "

 

The shiksha patri says exactly what the hare krishna books say ie. krishna is the source, shikshapatri verse 108 = krishna is the source of all incarnations. Krishna's name should be chanted, he resides in golok etc.

 

"Whereas, most of Hare Krsna books sold out in the book stalls have captured the meaning of Geeta, that too bare minimum. "

I dont know what you mean by this. The hare krishna books include the gita, and the bhagvatam a great depth and wealth of knowledge recognised by scholors and devotees including swaminaryans all over the world.

 

"If you want to learn more on Swaminrayan go to www.Swaminarayan.org or ever want to debate or want to learn more on Swaminarayan, hit this email: pchirag_007@hotmail.com . I welcome criticism and rebuttals. "

 

Please learn a little before you make silly statements, you make swaminarayans look worse than they really are.

[Guest guest]

Vijay,

 

I visited the site swaminarayan.org.

 

This site is complete non-sense. It says 'Swaminaryan Bhagwan' This is a complete lie.

 

There is no Kirhsna on the home page nor anything about the Bhagavad-gita, the main scripture of Hinduism.

 

The swaminarayan movement is destroying Hinduism and the fools who follow it don't realize it.

 

Lord krishna in his narsima form told the demon heranakashipur just before killing him that he ripes apart those who cheat the people and pretend to be God.

 

The Gurus of the swaminarayan movement are in line to be ripped apart by Lord Krishna.

 

Even Swaminarayan hiself says krishna is the supreme and he worshipped Krishna only. So why don't you so-called followers of swaminarayan worship krishna too?

 

The swaminarayan movement is lead by the blind who are leading the blind to hell.

 

Read the siksapatri and follow it if you really want to please swaminarayan.

 

In the temples built by swaminarayan himself, Lord krishna is in the center of the altar, as he is the focus of worship. In the BAPS temples, Krishna is on the far side, not the focus of worship. This proves the so-called followers of swaminaryan are insulting swaminarayan and krishna. They will all go to hell.

[Guest guest]

The site swaminarayan.org does not mention the Bhagavad-gita. Thus how can this movement represent hinduism?

 

The fact is that the bhagavad-gita is the authorized scripture of Hinduism, the main scripture.

 

These swaminarayan followers have no interest in the BG. Thus the swaminarayan movement is alien to the Vedic religion and should be totally rejected.

 

Even swaminarayan himself says krisha is the supreme and he worshiped krishna only.

 

 

[Guest guest]

In Hinduism, generally 3 main scriptures are considered most important.

 

1) Bhagwad Gita (Ved Vyas)

2) Brahma Sutra (Badarayana)

3) Dasho-upanishads (Isha, Kena, Katha, Prasna, Mundaka, Mandukya, Taitria, Aitria, Chandogya, Brihadaranyaka) written by great sages like Yagnavalkya, Atri etc.

 

And all the scholars have written commentaries or given discourses on all these 3 scriptures e.g. (Sankaracarya, Caitanya, Ramanuja etc.)

[Guest guest]

You are right to some extent advaitain,

 

All the scriptures are regarded highly, however BG is known as the cream of the essence of the upanishads, thats why its somethimes known as gitopanishad, as like the upanishad the philosophy comes directly from the lords lotus mouth.

 

In the gaudiya vaishnava sampradaya aswell as many other sampradayas, the bhagvat purana is said to be the top most scripture as it starts off rejecting artha karma dharma moksha (karma-khanda) and concentrates only on spirtual realisation. for a full presentation on it this link is useful. http://www.gosai.com/dvaita/madhvacarya/srimad-bhagavatam.html

 

I think in the gaudiya vaishnava sampradiya baladeva vidhabhushana gave a commentry on the vedanta sutra - govinda bhashya which is said to be directly spoken by the diety govindaji to baladeva.

[Guest guest]

www.swaminarayan.org (BAPS) is not an original swaminarayan sect. they keep their swamis where god stands which is not allowed.

 

i have said before that swaminarayan is reincarnation of krishna at his own will. swaminarayan has made it clear in the shikshapatri that vedas, bhagvat gita, srimad bhagvad etc are all superior to all religion.

 

also people believe that there are many religions- jain, muslim, buddhist etc. in fact there is only one religion because there is only one god. everybody should be following what the scriptures say and nothing other than that.

 

swaminarayan scriptures are the essence of the eight main scriptures that the lord holds superior.in the dark age (kaliyuga) nobody will be bothered to read big scriptures like vedas, bhagvad gita etc so swaminarayan has simplified the scriptures in terms of language and quantity

 

 

[Guest guest]

My humble pranam at da lotus feet of Bhagwan SHRI KRISHNA & SAHAJANAND SWAMI MAHARAJ

 

I am not on side on ISKCON or SWAMINARAYAN. But I was really in Search to know who is the PARABRAHMA / PURSHOTTAM and at last have concluded that SHRI KRISHNA IS PURSHOTTAM. But I really do respect teaching of SWAMINARAYAN.

 

I use to go to swaminarayn Temple everyday but now i have stopped b'coz they call PURSHOTTAM as DEV. DO you know who is KING of DEVAS ?? Well he is called INDRADEV, So does it mean SHRI KRISHNA is servant of INDRADEV ??

 

"I am the source of all SPIRITUAL & MATERIAL WORLD. Everything emanates from Me. The wise who perfectly know this engage in My devotional service and worship Me with all their hearts" (Bhagavad-Gita 10.8).

 

"Abandon all varieties of religion and just surrender unto me. I shall deliver you from all sinful reactions. Do not fear." Lord Krishna (Bg. 18.66)

 

The MAHABHARAT was only one of the LILA of SHRI KRISHNA, to give UPDESH not to ARJUN but to whole UNIVERSE. For your information ARJUN is none other then Expansion of MAHA VISHNU in form of NAR NARAYAN.

 

Please can u give me a valid Shastric or vedic support to prove Swaminarayan ad a PURSHOTTAM? I hope you will help me to destroy my confusion between SHRI KRISHNA SHRI SWAMINARAYAN.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Pray to Krishna, with an earnest heart and he himself will remove all your confusion. Let devotion reach that heights that Krishna is compelled to appear before you and give you the final judgement. Anybody telling you anything, would dispear in time. Offer utmost devotion to Sri Krishna and let him solve all your doubts.

[Guest guest]

quote

I use to go to swaminarayn Temple everyday but now i have stopped b'coz they call PURSHOTTAM as DEV. DO you know who is KING of DEVAS ?? Well he is called INDRADEV, So does it mean SHRI KRISHNA is servant of INDRADEV ??

 

no because god can be known by many appropriate names such as narnarayan dev etc. therefore calling purshotam as dev is allowed. however you must not call a devta purshottam.

 

quote:

But I was really in Search to know who is the PARABRAHMA / PURSHOTTAM and at last have concluded that SHRI KRISHNA IS PURSHOTTAM. But I really do respect teaching of SWAMINARAYAN.

 

the teaching of krishna is the same as the teaching of swaminarayan because there is no difference between them. swaminarayan was physically god just over 200 years ago and that same god was here over 1000 years ago as krishna

[Guest guest]

QUOTE

the teaching of krishna is the same as the teaching of swaminarayan because there is no difference between them. swaminarayan was physically god just over 200 years ago and that same god was here over 1000 years ago as krishna

 

REPLY

The vedas say Krishna is god and his name should be chanted, he is avatari.

 

The followers say swaminarayan is maha mantra even though it does not exist in veda

 

Followers say Swaminarayan is avatari even though no direct reference exists in vedas

 

Swaminaryan therefore can not be avatari like you claim as in shikshapatri 108 he clearly says krishna is source of all incarnations, this cant be word juggled, its clear. Therfore your books claiming swaminaryan is avtrai run contrary to shikshapatri and scripture. He says Krishnas 8 syllabl mantra should be spoken you guys utter another mantra not existing in shastra!

 

PUT ON YOUR GLASSES AND STOP AVOIDING THESE FACTS!

[samil]

Hindu teaching ->

Bhakt sahit Bhagwan

Radha and Krishna

Laxmi and Narayan

Swami and Narayan

Akshar and Purshottam

 

Ram was a avtar and no one knew about Krishna and there was no sign of Krishna taking Birth on Earth...Krishna was a avtar and there was no sign of Swaminarayan taking Birth

 

the earlier Scriptures (VEDAS) have nothing about Ramayan or Bhagwad and BHagwad or Ramayan or Vedas have nothing off Shikshapatri or Vachnamrut

[Guest guest]

Please address the point I made previously.

 

Swaminarayan says krishna is avtari verse 108 - how do you get that.

 

In ramayana jaganatha puri is mentioned in bhagvad ram is mentioned.

In veda krishna is mentioned.

 

NOWHWERE IS SWMAINARAYAN OR HIS SCRIPTURE MENTIONED. NO WHERE IS HIS MANTRA MENTIONED.

 

PLEASE ADDRESS THESE POINTS AND DONT WORD JUGGLE AND GO OFF TRACK.

 

[Guest guest]

Stop this swaminarayan non-sense and worship only Lord Krishna or you will go to hell.

 

You keep waffling and ignore the questions. This is how they (BAPS) CAPTURED YOU.

 

We krishna devotees have more intelligene and thus cannot be fooled by you or BAPS.

 

 

[Guest guest]

My Humble Pranam to Bhagwan Shri Krishna, SwamiNarayan and all devotees of both Organization.

 

Dear brothers and siters if any, We are not here to fight but we are here to make understand each other.

 

Lord Sri Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, as is confirmed by all great acaryas (spiritual masters) like Sankaracarya, Ramanujacarya, Madhvacarya, Nimbarka Svami, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu and many other authorities of Vedic knowledge in India.

 

The Lord Himself also establishes Himself as the Supreme Personality of Godhead in the Bhagavad-gita, and He is accepted as such in the Brahma-samhita and all the Puranas, especially the Srimad-Bhagavatam, known as the Bhagavata Purana (Krsnas tu bhagavan svayam). Therefore we should take Bhagavad-gita as it is directed by the Personality of Godhead Himself.

 

As per Swaminarayan Shikshapatri, Maharaj himself says Krishna is source of all incarnation (Shikshapatri Shloka #:108). So does it means Swaminaranyan is also incarnation of SHRI KRISHNA ? OR Should we say that the teaching of Swaminarayan are FALSE ?

 

In Shikshapatri Shloka Number 108 It says "The Paramatma – Shree Krishna who is supreme, Parabrahman, Bhagwan or Purushottam and who is the cause of all manifestations is the Lord of us all. He is to be worshipped for final redemption". Then why in Vachraman he says he is ParaBrahman ?

 

Or Should we say that wot is explained in all Purana's + Swaminarayan Shikshapatri is FALSE?

 

Please do not take me in wrong way but I am blind person and need to know what is the SPIRITUAL REALITY, so that we can reach to god.

 

Hoping to read from you all soonest and please NO Harsh words to each other. Keep in mind,in every human being GOD Exist, so when u say bad word to person means u saying bad words to GOD and dat is very BIG OFFENCE.

 

Hare Krishna and Jai swaminarayan to you all !!

 

[Guest guest]

In Shikshapatri Shloka Number 108 It says "The Paramatma – Shree Krishna who is supreme, Parabrahman, Bhagwan or Purushottam and who is the cause of all manifestations is the Lord of us all. He is to be worshipped for final redemption". Then why in Vachraman he says he is ParaBrahman ?

 

Or Should we say that wot is explained in all Purana's + Swaminarayan Shikshapatri is FALSE?

-----------

 

I would say that what swaminarayan taught in the shikshapatri is the same as the purans and perfectly bonifide as it doesnt contridict anything. However the followers wrote the shikshapatri and thus may be fundemental errors in there. Ive read the vachanamrita and apart from like 3 or 4 places where it implies swaminarayan is god, most of the discourses that swaminarayn gave are pritty much the same as what you find in the srimad bhagavatam just a more summary version.