a few questions please answer or attempet

[Guest guest]

hello, I’m currently doing an essay for my high school class and I’ve chosen to do a topic on the Hare Krishna movement being the only sect to break from the ideals of Hinduism and decide to solely worship Krishna instead of a multitude of unified gods? I’ve tried to gather books about the Krishna movement but have found only two and they raise many questions themselves which i hope you can make clear for me. did the movement start when it was brought to America or was the hare Krishna being practiced in India as well and as feverishly as they did in America. the books just start off when A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada came to America. also, did A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada just decide to bring this whole idea b/c he was told to "Preach Krishna consciousness to the English speaking world" or was it more than this? Between Hinduism and ISKCON, what is the real difference between them? i know that there's no caste system with ISKCON and the story substitutes Krishna in Vishnu’s place but why? why was it decided that Krishna be the all supreme god? I’m pretty sure it's not in the Bhagavad-Gita, since this was an idea that started through interpretation. So can it be said that the Hare Krishna movement was made to gather the undecided Christians by presenting a Jesus-like Hindu figure which could appease both their need for to worship one supreme god, since their love cannot be divided, reincarnation and a less restricted life style?

[Max_]

All glories to Srila Prabhupada

Hare Krishna

 

I'm not nearly as advanced as a lot of people on here, but I'll try to answer some of your questions as best I can anyway.

 

The reason that "Hare Krishnas" (another term for it being a Vaishnava) worship Krishna as the Supreme Personality of Godhead is because Krishna says this Himself in the Bhagavad-Gita. I don't know if you've read the Gita or not, but Krishna clearly states in it that He is the Supreme Personality, above all the demigods. Also Krishna does not "replace" Vishnu, Krishna and Vishnu are the same personal, but Krishna is the personal form of Godhead. But yes there has been in India for thousands of years Vaishnava Hindus who accept Vishnu(Krishna) as the Supreme Personality of Godhead. There is a big difference between Hinduism and ISKCON, because Hinduism is a religion and ISKCON is an organization for one thing. Lord Caitanya (Krishna as a devotee of Himself) came and told us how to properly worship Him (by chanting Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare / Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare) this is the real "religion". But the main goal of this all is to become Krishna Conscious, conscious of God and dedicating your life to serving Him. Also to your question about the Hare Krishna movement made to sway Christians, absolutely not the case, Krishna was Arjuna's charioteer and spiritual master on the battlefield of Kuruksetra 5000 years ago, so that out-dates the birth of Christ by 3000 years itself. But even before this people would meditate on Krishna as Vishnu, in earlier ages.

 

I'd also like to point out to you that Srila Prabhupada said that many bona fide religions are paths back home to God. So for example let's say a totally surrendered Jew who dedicates his life to God and trying to serve Him. This person is God conscious because he spends all of his time serving God and spreading His message. The Hare Krishna movement does not exist to grab a Christian on the street corner and tell him/her that they are going to hell if they don't accept Krishna as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, this doesn't happen. Srila Prabhupada instructed us to be Brahmans, completely peaceful and non-violent. Me personally I'm still in high school too, and I was raised Catholic. But the Bible just did so little for me spiritually/emotionally that I found no point in continuing being Catholic. So after a lot of soul searching I found the Hare Krishna religion and the beauty and light of Srila Prabhupada's message.

 

Hare Krishna!

[Guest guest]

Hi,

 

1) The ideals of Hinduism can be described in two differing ways. One is that the modern inaccurate interpretation of the religion says that any god can be worshipped in order to achieve liberation. However, the overwhelming ideal of Hinduism, is that one should follow the Bhagavad Gita or the Vedic scriptures. It is clearly shown in these scriptures that it is not acceptable to worship just any God. Also it does not say that there are many Supreme Lords. The Vedas always specify that God is one without a second.

 

2) The movement is thousands of years old. In Vrindavan, for example, Krishna Consciousness has been the main religion for 5000 years at the very least. In America, it started with Srila Prabhupada. As for feverishly, in India Krishna has been accepted as God by millions of people for thousands of years.

 

3) The English translations of the books start with Prabhupada. However the scriptures are at least 3000 years old.

 

4) Prabhupada was told by his spiritual master to spread Krishna Consciousness to the English-speaking world. That is the reason Prabhupada came to the west.

 

5) Hinduism describes those generally following traditions based on the Vedas. Krishna Consciousness describes those who are Hindu and believe that to love Krishna is the aim of the Vedas. ISKCON is the organisation set up to propagate KC around the world.

 

6) ISKCON has caste system, in the sense that devotees have different roles according to their personality. One can be brahmana, sudra etc. However, it is not based on birth, it is based on personality. Also, the real aim is to transcend the caste system and just identify oneself as a Vaishnava, a devotee of Vishnu.

 

7) Bhagavad Gita states Krishna as Supreme. It is not decided by anybody externally. This is confirmed by all scholars of the Gita.

 

8) Krishna Consciousness was set up in order to spread KC to the world. It has no relation to Christianity. If Christians want to take up KC, that is fine. If not, that is also fine. The KC movement has only one motivation, and that is to spread love for Krishna, for the welfare of all humanity.

 

Hare Krishna

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna!

 

All glories to Srila Prabhupada! I offer my humble obeisances unto Him!

 

First of all, I would like to say that Hare Krishna is no separate offshoot from Hinduism or something completely different from Hindusim.

 

It has been followed for centuries in India and in the modern era can be dated back to 5000 years or more. In course of time, things have been forgotten in both India and around the world.

 

That is why my spiritual master Srila Prabhupada wanted to revive this age old Vaishnava(people who follow Krishna who is Supreme) tradition to all people including the english speaking world.

 

In the Bhagavad Gita, it is explicitly stated that KRISHNA is the Supreme God and is the rightful owner of the whole cosmic manifestation.

 

There are many Gods as you say in hindusim, it is just like the US cabinet members with different ministers heading different departments. Like for example, the department of agriculture or the dept of education or dept of INternal affairs and so on are headed by different individuals who have full power over their respective departments. Needless to say the country's president is the topmost and has all control over all departments.

 

If a small country in a minsiscule planet part of a big cosmic manifestation deems lot of departments and dept heads, imagine this giant manifestation which requires supervision. That is the reason for the existence of many demigods(or according to you many gods) and these demigods preside over their respective duty as department heads or in whatever capacity. I think if Iam not wrong, there are 330 million demigods, according to Vedic injunction, taking care of this manifestation(just like the different depts taking care of the country) and that is why, if i may say, in the Bible, it says, Jesus is the son of God and He is not the God. Above all this, is the Supreme God of all Gods(like the president of the country), has total power and without HIS permission, nothing can happen. This is SRI KRISHNA, who is eternally situated in Vrndavan.

 

This is the essence, and this message, the great teacher, Srila PRabhupada tried to propogate.

 

Haribol!

 

anand

 

[Guest guest]

thank you all for replying so quickly but your answers to my questions have arisen more. Is this religion called Vaishnava, the one that was announced in the Gita? yes the Gita is Krishna's story, thus giving it the reason to focus on him, ut don't you think since it focuses on him he would say these things? "In the Bhagavad-Gita , it is explicitly stated that KRISHNA is the Supreme God and is the rightful owner of the whole cosmic manifestation." can you please give the verse in the Gita where it says this and does this statement mean that there's no Brahma or is he also one in the same. also are the other demigods present in Hare Krishna or is Krishna running the whole show? also if Krishna is Vishnu then that means he is Buddha too but wouldn't that bring sacrilegious elements into the religion? also, do you think, since there are significant similarities between Krishna and Christ do you think this is a reason why many in America catch on to hare Krishna? Since the Bhagavad-Gita is Krishna’s story is this the only book you follow or do the others play into the religion? "First of all, I would like to say that Hare Krishna is no separate offshoot from Hinduism or something completely different from Hinduism." why do people say this then. the religion itself disregards the other gods and has them as Krishna, isn't that different from Hinduism? And isn't Hare Krishna the only sect that has broken away from Hinduism?

[Max_]

What was announced in the Gita was basically a conversation between Krishna and Arjuna, them talking so that Krishna could explained many things. Of these things is Krishna explaining His many forms and how He is the controller of everything, He is the source of all and the cause of all causes. But yes Krishna does also explain in the Gita Bhakti Yoga, this is devotional service to Krishna. The story in the Gita (which is part of the Mahabharata by the way) is actually the story of a war. But in this situation on the battlefield before battle has happened Krishna explains to Arjuna the true message of the Bhagavad-Gita (Song Of God.) So for the sake of us Arjuna asks Krishna many questions, so that we can have better understanding of Krishna's and our positions. Krishna would not say that He was not the Supreme Personality of Godhead if it were not true, He is pure of any mistakes.

 

As for a verse that directly states Krishna as the ruler of the entire cosmic universe and everything in it, I'm sure there is one but I can't find it off hand. But maybe this verse will help you understand a little bit:

 

Bhagavad-Gita 7.12: Know that all states of being — be they of goodness, passion or ignorance — are manifested by My energy. I am, in one sense, everything, but I am independent. I am not under the modes of material nature, for they, on the contrary, are within Me.

 

There is a "Brahma" but this idea from Hinduism is simply Krishna's eternal energy in a impersonal way, because Krishna is all energies He has the ability to have unlimited expansions, both personal and impersonal. On your question about the demigods' roles in the Hare Krishna religion, they are of course mentioned but not worshiped, because Krishna does run the proverbial show. I give you the example of the demigods Hannuman and Siva, we respect them greatly, but we know they are just great great devotees of Lord Krishna, they are not Lord Krishna Himself. Krishna is Vishnu and therefore the avataras of Vishnu apply yes, but the Buddha's reason for coming to Earth was to stop the killing of animals that people were doing in the name of Vedic ceremony.

 

I've heard many people compare Krishna and Christ, but to say that Americans are more prone to be Krishnas because America is mostly Christian? I don't think I can really agree with that. You have to understand that most of America is from European ancestory, and if you ever study ancient European religion then you will see that it is hardcore polytheistic, which Krishna Consciousness is not.

 

The Bhagavad-Gita is our most Holy scripture, because this book is Krishna Himself explaining everything for the sake of us. But all of the Vedic literature can be applied. It's just that a lot of the older Vedic stuff is simply ceremony that explains worship of the demigods, while even the oldest stuff still explains that Krishna(Vishnu) is the Supreme Personality. Another book that is used is the Srimad-Bhagavatam, which is the history of the devotees of Krishna. There is also a book on Lord Caitanya, Krishna as a devotee of Himself and His sankirtan movement (how to properly attain Krishna in this age of Kali.)

 

On the relationship with Hare Krishna religion and Hinduism, it's basically like this, it's not an offshoot because we use the same Holy Books. The only reason that someone might say it's an offshoot we because we recognize God to be personal (Krishna) and we worship Him as such. A lot of Hindus who are not Vaishnava worship the demigods as equals because they treat God(Krishna) as being equal in all the demigods. This is an impersonal way of looking at Krishna and we do not agree with it.

 

I hope I didn't confuse you anymore! but if I did please have someone more advanced than I clarify things.

 

Hare Krishna!

[Guest guest]

Here is a great link on the explination of the Difference Between Hinduism and ISCKON.

 

 

http://www.geocities.com/priitaa108/difference_between_hinduism_kc.htm

 

[Guest guest]

thanks again for all that have replied and have shed light on this religion for me, but there are still some hazy areas. If Krishna is an incarnation of Vishnu which means Krishna is Vishnu, then Vishnu is Krishna, then isn't it really Vishnu who is saying that he's supreme rather than Krishna since he is Vishnu but not his true form? also since i now know that hare Krishna didn't break away from Hinduism, this completely destroys my topic, "Hare Krishna movement being the only sect to break from the ideals of Hinduism and decide to solely worship Krishna instead of a multitude of unified gods?" so could you possibly throw some other suggestions out there. here are some that i have in mind I’m considering: the hare Krishna’s effect on shaping the modern Hindu? the exponential growth of Indian culture acceptance through entertainment in America. why the hare Krishna’s caught on faster in America than Hinduism/Vaishnavism? if there are any others that you could possibly contribute it would be very appreciated. thank you very much.

[Max_]

I think you can still actually do your original topic for your paper, but in a modified way. One thing that you have to understand is us HKs do differ a bit even in our core theories because you ask a lot of Hindus and even if they do believe Vishnu is Supreme they won't agree that Krishna is that Original Person and energy. This in reality doesn't make much difference because like I hope you understand now Krishna=Vishnu Vishnu=Krishna, Krishna has many thousands of names. We also break away from a lot of modern Hindus because they a lot believe in the Hindu "holy trinity" being Vishnu-Shiva-Brahma treating them all exactly the same. This is not the case with Vaishnavism, because we know Krishna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and Shiva and Brahma are demigods who are great devotees of the Lord, but not the Lord Himself.

 

Another subject you could touch on is how a lot of modern Hindus treat Krishna as being impersonal. We don't believe that to be true exactly either, because Krishna has no beginning and no end He can have unlimited expansions, existing simultaneously with each other, and while a lot of these may be impersonal they are still the same Krishna. But we do believe that Krishna is the most personal relationship possible, we ask for His protection, pray to Him directly, etc. Also it isn't really fair to call us Hindus, as this is not a religion but a cultural thing more than anything. So Vaishnavas are not really Hindus, but Vaishnavas.

[Guest guest]

thanks to you all, but i decided to take the project in the route of "Does the hare Krishna movement forsake the religious beliefs of Hinduism?" basically b/c i remember someone saying that it's just a modern Hindu misconception and maybe since it became so mainstream people didn't take it seriously and thought of it as a commercial gain rather than the true nature of the hare Krishna’s does this sound better? also, quite possibly is there a site or people that i can e-mail that aren't supporters of the hare Krishna’s and have reasons for this b/c it would really help out a lot?

 

so the Vaishnavas is the name of hare Krishna’s?

then what is Hinduism? isn't Vaishnavas the main religion in India? and if Hinduism isn't a religion then what religion are books talking about when they say Hinduism.

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna

 

"so the Vaishnavas is the name of hare Krishna’s?"

Followers of Krishna Consciousness movement are Vaishnavas, in particular the Brahma-Madhava-Gaudiya-Vaishnava sampradaya.

 

"Does the hare Krishna movement forsake the religious beliefs of Hinduism?"

What are the beliefs of Hinduism? I think you are somewhat confused. Unlike most followers of other sampradayas, the four Vaishnava sampradayas accept all the Vedic texts as authentic. So in a way they are the only ones who accept all the "beliefs of Hinduism".

 

"then what is Hinduism?"

Actually it was a name given by muslim invaders to the people on the other side of river Sindhu who were followers of Vedic religion. Firstly, what are you trying to mean by religion? If you mean a faith/sentiment then that is not what the Vedic texts mean. Religion means the codes of law given by God so that a human can cross the materially conditioned life. According to Srimad Bhagvatam, that religion is first-class which teaches one how to love God without any motive. So the Vedic texts are talking about "Sanatana Dharma" meaning the eternal duty of every living being (or more precisely the eternal nature). Consequently Srila Prabhupada (and predecessor acharyas) accept both Jesus Christ and Muhammad as Spiritual Masters who preached according to time and circumstance.

 

"isn't Vaishnavas the main religion in India? and if Hinduism isn't a religion then what religion are books talking about when they say Hinduism"

Currently, yes vaishnavism is most widespread in India in the sense that people accept Lord Vishnu as the Supreme Lord, but only a very small percentage are actually following any of the authorized Vaishnava Sampradayas. Whichever books are talking of Hinduism they should be meaning Vedic religion, but actually they only mean "group of people who claim to be Hindus" and have nothing to do with the fact that most people actually do not follow the conclusions of the Vedic texts as told by the acharyas. Same is the case with all religions nowadays.