Opinions on European religion

[Max_]

Zeus, Odin, the European gods. Just give me your opinion on them and the European religions.

[Guest guest]

All originated from India...yet, as history shows they weren't affected a lot by religion and ethics, and made their own fanatic cults.

[Max_]

Norse/west Europeans had a deep faith in the old Germanic gods. Manifested in the forms of Odin, Thor, Freyja, Tyr, etc. To the point where the warriors simply cared the rune of Tyr (a great war-god in the myths) and considered themselves invincible. Now if Europeans come from India or not isn't the issue here. Unfortunately due to the Christian invasions of Europe a lot of the old religions were lost, and it didn't help that Christians spawned the viking age and gave the old ways of the people a bad name. But for the most part they were very peaceful and well balanced. The real conflict of interests is in that the old religions of Europe are all polytheistic in nature. But looking at the similarities of the Ragnarök and Kali Yuga you'd be shocked.

[Guest guest]

Anyone else?

[gopalapriyadas]

Generally speaking, the Supreme Personality of Godhead descends into this universe within Bharata-varsa, India. I'm sure there may be some exceptions.

 

The pagan religions mostly correspond to the worship of the demigods and spirits, who also appear on earth in different forms. In the fifth canto of the Srimad Bhagavatam it is described that the residents of the different varsas worship the Supreme Lord indirectly

in His deva forms. The denizens of Plaksadvipa, for instance, worship the Supreme Personality of Godhead in the form of the sun-god, Salmalidvipa, the moon-god; Kusadvipa, Agni; Krauncadvipa, Varuna; Sakadvipa, Vayu; Puskaradvipa, Brahma; etc.

 

The special glories of Bharata-varsa are extolled in the 19th chapter. However, even there it is stated:

 

"In India [bharata-varsa], there are many worshipers of the demigods, the various officials appointed by the Supreme Lord, such as Indra, Candra and Surya, all of whom are worshiped differently. The orshipers offer the demigods their oblations, considering the

demigods part and parcel of the whole, the Supreme Lord. Therefore the Supreme Personality of Godhead accepts these offerings and gradually raises the worshipers to the real standard of devotional service by fulfilling their desires and aspirations. Because the Lord is complete, He offers the worshipers the benedictions they desire even if they worship only part of His transcendental body." (SB 5.19.26)

 

In the 17th chapter it is also stated: "To show mercy to His devotees in each of these nine tracts of land, the Supreme Personality of Godhead known as Narayana expands Himself in His quadruple principles of Vasudeva, Sankarsana, Pradyumna, and Aniruddha. In this way He remains near His devotees to accept their service." (SB 5.17.14)

 

In the purport to the above verse, Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti mentions that these expansions manifest in Deity forms. It is also stated in the Padma Purana and in some of the satvata-tantras that a predominating Visnu form is worshiped in each of the nine varsas:

Vasudeva, Sankarsana, Pradyumna, Aniruddha, Narayana, Nrsimha, Hayagriva, Mahavaraha, and Brahma (the Visnu-avatar Brahma).

 

In recent millenia, much of the Visnu and demigod worship on earth has been replaced with a more impersonal worship of God such as Christianity and Islam. In this regard, I have heard Srila Prabhupada mention that even demigod worship is superior to such forms of religion, because in the case of the demigod worshiper he may advance to accept the personal worship of Visnu or Krsna, whereas a Christian or Muslim will encounter much resistance to do so.

 

Zeus, Odin and all these Pagan deities are demigods.

Here is some sastra from Bhagavad-gita on demigod worship:

 

BG 9.25

"Those who worship the demigods will take birth among the demigods; those who worship the ancestors go to the ancestors; those who worship ghosts and spirits will take birth among such beings; and those who worship Me will live with Me."

 

BG 17.4

"Men in the mode of goodness worship the demigods; those in the mode of passion worship the demons; and those in the mode of ignorance worship ghosts and spirits."

 

[Max_]

Thank you for those verses and explanations, you've put me at ease.

 

Hare Krishna

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna and dandavat pranam

 

Thanks prabhu for your explanations. I have read in many a places in Srila Prabhupada writings that Bharata-varsha actually refers to the whole world -- atleast that was the case uptil Maharaja Parakshit, though the land around Ganges receives more "bias".

[Guest guest]

Haribol, thanx for your post, gopalapriya. Concerning bharatavarsa being the whole world, this is scientific fact. Due to plate techtonics, India became separate from other continents. Prior to this, there was one continent, which is also quite vedic. In ramayana, there is discussion of seas to the north, south, east, and west, which indicates a SUPERCONTINENT Island. Puranas speak of similar seas.

 

King Prthu is given credit for working the planet into its present shape, blasting away to make mountains, rivers, continents, etc.

 

European religions are not independent of vedic culture, but may not be INDIAN. Many dont even think Indians are Indian, with their aryan invasion theories, a typical eurocentric viewpoint.

 

The european religions are vedic in nature, as are the polynesian, african, etc. The world was one in former ages, and kali yuga dispersed the surviving populations into caves in survival situations for a thousand years. The survivors of Kuruksetra did not amount to very many, and the Yadus were also gone with the age of dwarapa Yuga.

 

As cultures took root again 4000 years ago, the lore of the cavemen became druidism, greek philosophy, polynesian religion, african animism.

 

Gotta run, for now, hariobol, ys, mahaksadasa

[Max_]

And if I may ask, is it ok that I wear mjollnir (hammer of Thor) around my neck? more as a cultural than religious symbol I mean.

[Guest guest]

"Many dont even think Indians are Indian, with their aryan invasion theories, a typical eurocentric viewpoint."

 

Yes, I've read somewhere that the "Aryans" supposedly originated from Iran and then moved into India and established the Vedic culture there. Is their any proof to back up this theory or is this the type of pure nonsensical speculation we've come to expect from today's "scientists" ?

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna,

 

Oh, there are all kinds of theories -- Aryans came from around Mediterranean or from Arctic region and many more i can hardly remember. This set of theories were set in motion by Max Mueller and Germans added their own sets of imaginations. The "proofs" more or less runs as follows:

1) Vedic texts mention victories of Devas over Asuras

i.e. Devas == (heros of) Aryans; Asuras == original inhabitants

Similiarly Aryans defeating dasyus; there is mention of the dravida land (that beyond the Vindhya range) so asuras/dasyus == dravidians. Thus aryans came and pushed the original inhabitants to the dravida region.

and more similiar "proofs" you would not want to hear

2) Some skeletons in the indus valley civilization of persons who seem to have been killed in war/calamaties. Thus they must be in the war with Aryans.