witchcraft?

[Parabrahman]

what are your views on wicca and witchcraft?

[Bhaktaneal]

I see Witchcraft and Wicca as another means for the living entity to try and 'Lord It Over Material Nature'. Trying to control matter, influence others, manifest desired outcomes, and attract material objects into one's possesion...etc

 

Before I became a devotee, as I was searching for answers, I got heavily into "Creative Visualization" as taught by Shakti Gawain.(http://www.shaktigawain.com/)

 

This practice, I found, was like a form of spell casting in that you visualize something, like improved health, a new job, a pair of sunglasses...etc & make a request to the "Universe" that it or something better will come true and manifest in your life. I tried putting this to the test and found it to work remarkably well. Never~the~less, I still had unanswered questions and was still only finding temporary enjoyment and or satisfaction. It also kept me oblivious to who God was and why I find myself in this body. Infact, it just raised even more questions that I could not find acceptable answers to.

 

I found that Prabhupada's books answered my questions, and then some, leaving me with no more desires to try and manipulate myself or my surroundings with the Visualization techniques. Nor have I done a Creative Visualization exercise since my trying to becoming a devotee of Lord Krsna. Nor have I felt the need to.

 

So I belive that there are powers within ourselves that we can utilize for whatever reason...I don't understand it much, but can say by experience that it works...but compared to Krsna Consciousness, it pales, as it doesn't help me prepare for when I leave this world; doesn't help me to get back home to Godhead; what to speak I doubt that it is very pleasing to Lord Krsna, as it is yet another example of me trying to play God.

 

I did find the following that gives a comparisson of Wicca and Witchcraft. I did a search and noticed alot of sites that say Wicca borrows from eastern practices and beliefs such as Hinduism and Buddhism.

 

http://www.holygrail-church.fsnet.co.uk/Witchcraft.htm

"Witches practice clairvoyance, divination, astral projection, spells, curses, and herbal healing. They are supposed to follow a principle of ethics known as the wiccan rede where the effects of magic are believed to return threefold upon the person working it for good or ill. Not all adhere to this voluntary code. Their very belief in gods and goddesses, whether symbolic or not, identifies witchcraft groups as embracing a polytheistic conceptualisation of the universe. Modern witches, however, do not necessarily believe in a pantheon of male and female deities, but that reality itself is understood in many different ways. Truth is not a matter of correspondence between language, the world, or any one conceptual model. Put differently, there is no singular expression of truth. Truths that are contradictory are held to simultaneously. Symbols that accompany wiccan lore include the amulet, the talisman, the ankh, the pentagram, the athame (ritual dagger), the cup, the pentacle, the rune, the sigil, the wand, the tarot, the cauldron, the altar, the fith-fath (effigy) etc.

 

Witchcraft is sharply at odds with Christianity. Divination, spiritism, magic, sorcery, witchcraft, and the occult in general are condemned in the Bible. The polytheism in witchcraft is also a blatant contradiction to the strict monotheism of Christianity. Like most other non-Christian religions and religious cults of the world, witchcraft obliterates the distinction between Creator and creation. Wiccans deify nature in such a way that both God and nature are identified as synonymous. Furthermore, since divinity lies in nature and in the cosmos, it also resides within each person. Here it can be observed that wiccan thought closely parallels Hinduism and other Eastern paradigms. Traditional Christian thought holds that witchcraft has its source in Satan, the “god of this age” (2 Corinthians 4: 4). Some wiccan groups are indeed an introduction to overt diabolism and devil worship, but by no means all act as a front for fundamentalist Satanism. Principal influence of the occult revival in the twentieth century is undoubtedly Aleister Crowley without whom there would be no modern witchcraft movement today."

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna

 

These practises can give some material powers (when properly known and executed and are just like some of the left-handed tantric practises of india) and are in the mode of ignorance.

 

BG 9.25

"Those who worship the demigods will take birth among the demigods; those who worship the ancestors go to the ancestors; those who worship ghosts and spirits will take birth among such beings; and those who worship Me will live with Me."

 

BG 17.4

"Men in the mode of goodness worship the demigods; those in the mode of passion worship the demons; and those in the mode of ignorance worship ghosts and spirits."

[Guest guest]

Haribol. The verses above place the Wiccan ideal in perspective. I do not have a quarrel with wiccans, in fact, much more appreciative of them than the psuedo religionists, including even those who claim vaisnavism as tyheir own.

 

Wiccans do not hate. The are ultimately pantheistic. in that they worship nature. They worship the goddess Gaia or pele or other forms of Kali ma. They are like millions of indigenous tribal folk who also worship god in the form of nature.

 

Arjuna was fortunate. When he viewed Virata Rupa, he was not attracted, actually was frightened a bit. This is because he was already situated in his rasa with the supreme lord. But the universal form is a partial and external manifestation of the Supreme Lord.

 

So, according to the verses displayed, wiccans attain the heavenly planets of the demigods (some of which may be considered hell, ie the patalas and other tals located under the surface of the Earth.). Theyll be back, because when heavenly reaction is spent, then the form of human is again taken, to try again for the swarupa siddhi of self realization.

 

I like wiccans, they have cool stores where good incense can be purchased. And if one needs worship paraphenalia, like ghee lamps, conch shells, indian drums, etc, wiccans would have these things in their stores, whereas, the christian store would have nothing to offer, except to tell the vaisnava that his religion is devil worship.

 

hare krsna, ys, mahaksadasa

 

 

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna

 

I was not familiar with wicca but mistakingly assumed them to be similiar to witchcraft -- my apologies for that. So then is wiccan mode of worship is more like mixed passion and goodness?

[gopalapriyadas]

"All human beings are grateful to God. No matter how many sins they

commit, occasionally they become aware that God is the supreme

entity, and when they are endowed with this belief, they bow down

before the extraordinary things of this world. When ignorant people

are inspired by their gratitude to God, they naturally offer respect

to the sun, a river, a mountain, or to enormous animals. They

express their hearts before such things and display submission to

them. Granted, there is a vast difference between this type of

worship of material objects, and transcendental affection toward the

Lord. Still, when such ignorant people adopt a mood of gratitude to

God and reverence toward material objects, it gradually produces a

positive effect. Therefore, if one examines the situation logically,

one cannot ascribe any fault to them.

 

"Meditation on the formless, all-pervading feature of the Lord and

offering 'namaz' or other types of prayers to an impersonal aspect of

the Lord are also devoid of pure transcendent love, so how are these

methods any different from the worship of a cat, for example? We

consider that it is essential to arouse bhava towards Bhagavan by any

means possible. The door leading to gradual elevation is firmly shut

if people on any level of worship are ridiculed or condemned. Those

who fall under the spell of dogmatism, and thereby become sectarian,

lack the qualities of generosity and munificence. That is why they

ridicule and condemn others who do not worship in the same way as

they do. This is a great mistake on their part."

 

("Jaiva Dharma" p. 272)

 

[Parabrahman]

wicca is more of a form of white magic like calling upon nature for powers and for use of healing, much like pranic healing. you can dod reaserch on them. they also think that through each life you get more and more aware of the "summerland" which is basiclly their heaven.

[gopalapriyadas]

From my experience with this Wicca and Witches, I have found them to be strongly absorbed in the mode of ignorance, being mainly concerned with the material platform and their condition on it, how to improve their material position and altar their karma. To me it seems that their goal is not Krsna but rather themselves. Not saying that they are necessarily bad people, but very much karmis, and I don't know if that is the best association.

They are very much involved in worshiping their "Goddess", the occult, "magic" and talking to the spirits and ghosts. This is nothing more then Kali worship and aghora-yoga, albeit with a Western edge.

 

Hare Krsna.

-Gopalapriya das

[vishnu]

WITCHCRAFT IS SUPREME EVIL! MY MOTHER IS A WITCH AND SHE . RUINED MY ENTIRE LIFE!

WITCHCRAFT IS FROM SATAN!

 

[gopalapriyadas]

I think you have a few screws loose. You sound like a real loony-toon. I'm not replying to you any more.

[vishnu]

disbelieving me when i say such a truth is a sin, but that is up to you. what are you doing acting all wise and scripture this and that if you dont believe in witchcraft or that someone is involved as a victim in witchcraft?

 

youre going to be ashamed when you get in the afterlife, and no God will need to humiliate you, for the truth itself will.

[krist]

withccraft is stupid and a mental concoction only. wicca was invented in the 40's or 50's buy gerold gardner and alister crowley. its just nonsense. its not satan or anything else its just maya and very stupid. wicca is just egyptian and jewish religious rituals mixed with pagan god names. its there is no true pagan religion the christians killed all of the pagan priest long ago. so there is no lines of witches or that mumbojumbo.

 

vishnu your mother is not a witch there are no witches they are just idiots and crazys, she was a scitzo and your in need of serious mental help she messed up your brains bad kid. how old are you 13?

by the way satan is barly mantioned in the bible one thing i remember is jesus is quoted as saying the jews are of their father the devil and of their fatehr they will do; aka evil. wicca is basially jewish blackmagic and maya. read the kabbhalla and the talmud that is where wicca is really from , they are books of pure ignorance or evil as you call it. judeism is basically evil magick, hebrew religion and jewish religion are two very different religions, just so you know. jews and hebrews are not the same people or the same religon. jesus was for hebrew religion and dispised jewish religion. jews are guys that worship themselves,money,the rabbis and their race, not god. orthodox jews that is. i am anti-orthodox judeism not anti jewish. orthodox jews are athiests. i assume you dont understand this is i can see where your madeup jesus belief comes from. did you know that jews that did not belive in jesus edited the modern bibles such as the king james version and all the others that are in common use. i have read the original bible and its avery differnt bible then the judeo-chirstians bibles. its a lot easier and nice version; its true kristianity or krishainty, not christianity. krist or krish rooted in the original krishna.

[BruzWayne]

Hare Krishna, Mahaprabhu. Regarding your original question, I have no view about wicca. About witchcraft I can say that I read the episode when Krishna was a baby in Vrindabana and there was a powerful witch named Putana that wanted to kill baby Krishna by offering Him some milk straight from her poisoned nipples, so baby Krishna sucked the milk from her breast but instead of dying He took away the life of Putana until she died and then somehow her body became very large so every body in the town could see her dead body.

 

From this episode we can conclude that witches are women living in passion and ignorance under the demoniac nature so their minds are twisted, and still somehow they can acquire certain mystic powers that can work against those persons without a strong spiritual life. However, for those in Krishna Consciousness there is always shelter at Krishna's lotus feet in order to get protection from witches.

 

Now, if we take a look at our modern society we can find that many countries celebrate Halloween as a party day, right? Moreover, my first girlfriend in the past calls herself "The Witch" and so she is because she was very beautiful and at the same time very mean. Actually, I believe that she putted some kind of spell on me because I still remember her spellbound-kiss, lol. Hopefully someday she will remember her eternal position as a servant of Krishna, but that's not my business.

 

Finally I'd like to conclude with the following sentence, "We all know that witches don't exist, but that there are some, there are some." Lol.

 

So watch out, Mahaprabhu, watch out, especially if they happen to have beautiful eyes and beautiful smile and beautiful hair and beautiful mouth and beautiful every thing, 'cause the worst thing that can happen to you is falling in love with one of those pretty witches, lol. And who knows how long may take to find another woman in order to replace her, if ever possible at all.

 

Witchcraft? Tell me something new.

 

Hare Krishna.

[vishnu]

I dont know about wicca and i believe you in that, although satan played a part in creating the false deity worship,

but my mom is in something much worse. as the guy who posted after you said, in krishnas time there was a witch. i assure you, they exist nowadays too.

 

And yes, she is an idiot and crazy. and yes she messed up my brain. im 21, but i dont feel like that.

Well i shoudlnt focus on satan anyway, dont give him the honor.

i would love to read such bibles, as for the jews, we know jesus was against the religious leaders as well...

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

i myself am a wiccan reading your forum with some amusment but concern also. For those of you who think wicca is a new phenomenon, you're wrong, it is a form of paganism dating thousands of years predating christianity and the times of jesus back to 2000bc or so. In fact it is proven to be closly related to the oldest religion in europe. (odinism.)

 

Also be aware that the majority of wiccans will never attempt to manifest anything that benifits them. i myself am a witch and have been practicing witchcraft for some time but it never crosses my mind to benifit my self in any way, cirtainly no more than a prayer would benifit you. For this would contradict the wiccan rede and other beliefs we hold.

 

To dispell another myth, satan worship is something a wiccan would find impossible, we dont believe in satan. What we do believe is that the planet we live on and the nature we co-habit with, and the moon and sun that helps govern our lands are truly holy and should be repected, protected and worshiped such as the true powers they are.

 

As a wiccan i respect all religions and it is a common belief among wiccans that wicca is just one more religion among all religions that helps everyone on this planet reach the same goal (whatever you want to call it) each as viable and as important as the last. There are so many religions out there how can any claim to be the true one, The difference with wicca is it one of the only religions that admits they may not be. But does that make it any less valid?

 

My plea to you all is only to respect our religion (and all other religions) as much as we respect yours.

 

blessed be

 

Daihyd

)0(

[Guest guest]

sorry, I love you, but satans biggest lie is that he dont exist, witchcraft causes harm you are not aware of, but that si no justification to do it anyway. however jesus loves you enough to say he forgives you if you accept him.

i dont respect your religion.

i dont hate it either

[Guest guest]

well ill guess we will have to agree to disagree then, unfortunatly there are many people who are unable to do this and will continue to condemn wiccans as evil and will hesitate to accept there are choices and alternatives in this world and its personal choice that governs us.

[BruzWayne]

Hare Krishna, daihyd. You say that you are a witch. Do you mean a good intentions witch like the TV shows characters like Samantha from "Bewitched" or Sabrina "The teen witch"?

 

Hare Krishna.

[Bhakta Don Muntean]

 

withccraft is stupid and a mental concoction only. wicca was invented in the 40's or 50's buy gerold gardner and alister crowley. its just nonsense. its not satan or anything else its just maya and very stupid. wicca is just egyptian and jewish religious rituals mixed with pagan god names. its there is no true pagan religion the christians killed all of the pagan priest long ago. so there is no lines of witches or that mumbojumbo.

vishnu your mother is not a witch there are no witches they are just idiots and crazys, she was a scitzo and your in need of serious mental help she messed up your brains bad kid. how old are you 13?

by the way satan is barly mantioned in the bible one thing i remember is jesus is quoted as saying the jews are of their father the devil and of their fatehr they will do; aka evil. wicca is basially jewish blackmagic and maya. read the kabbhalla and the talmud that is where wicca is really from , they are books of pure ignorance or evil as you call it. judeism is basically evil magick, hebrew religion and jewish religion are two very different religions, just so you know. jews and hebrews are not the same people or the same religon. jesus was for hebrew religion and dispised jewish religion. jews are guys that worship themselves,money,the rabbis and their race, not god. orthodox jews that is. i am anti-orthodox judeism not anti jewish. orthodox jews are athiests. i assume you dont understand this is i can see where your madeup jesus belief comes from. did you know that jews that did not belive in jesus edited the modern bibles such as the king james version and all the others that are in common use. i have read the original bible and its avery differnt bible then the judeo-chirstians bibles. its a lot easier and nice version; its true kristianity or krishainty, not christianity. krist or krish rooted in the original krishna.

 

I think you have a few loose yourself. You're an anti-semite - that became clear with your stupid posting here.

So just to note - wicca and witchcraft are not "jewish blackmagic" -

 

There are two postings here on this that are very good - the one that compares these to Tantra - the other is by the devotee that explained visualization 'magic' - those postings pretty much cover the facts.

 

Please don't be in that maya anymore...

 

You say that you're "anti-orthodox judeism" - well that is just - what if there were those that were anti-orthodox vaishnavism?

 

Please open your heart and read the books in a proper frame of mind I'm for you!

 

BDM

[nekozuki]

Krist- my best friend is Celtic pagan because it's a family tradition his grandmother taught him what he knows, paganism is still very much alive. Do some research before you talk.

 

Bible-thumping Guest- You do you realize Christianity adopted pagan traditions and holidays, so by your logic you're all going to hell if you want to think like that. Irony huh?