The English Language

[Ibrat]

I would like to raise the issue of the English language. Here we have on the Internet discussions of Sanatan Dharma being carried out in English. Can we be absolutely sure that we are not infected by the curse of Sarasvati thereby? For the English language is nothing other than the final purification to the mleccha tongue. Recall what is said in the Bhavishya Purana:

 

The mleccha language is considered the lowest language because it bears the curse of goddess Sarasvati. Sanskrit is the language by which the whole Bharata-Varsa is being praised and glorified. The same language, after going to another country became the mleccha language and mlecchas took advantage of it.

The acute Irishman Flann O'Brien once commented that English is not really a language but in truth a mercenary code. This is the kingdom of Mammon in which we live, and English is the language on which Mammon has risen. And if anyone suspects that I am making a mere inference, I insist that they study the Tudor-Elizabethan age of England. Christian Europe collapsed when the Bible began to appear in European languages, and the English nation rose like the Leviathan from this chaos. The authors of the modern English language called themselves the Rosicrucians. They were the Rasayana shastris among the mlecchas, treading the footsteps of the ancient Tantrists, and worshipping Sarasvati under the name of Athena. It is plain that they labor under the curse of Sarasvati, for they do not remember Aryadesh. The curse springs forth from the name of the principle of the Rosicrucians, Francis Bacon. 'Bacon' derives from Vach Devi, another appellation of Sarasvati. The magician John Dee is at the heart of these secret on goings. 'Dee' is merely a contraction of 'devi'. The other significant Rosicrucian is Edward de Vere - the boar. We know the Tantrist way to obtain the grace of Sarasvati is to enjoin Varahi with Kurukulla, the father and the mother aspect of the Devi. Indeed Edward de Vere and Francis Bacon join efforts towards the composition of "Shakespeare". And we all know "Shakespeare" to be the fount of the modern English language. The name 'Shakespeare' itself is a hidden reference to Athena, or indirectly to Sarasvati Devi. The same Rosicrucians were behind the composition of the King James Bible, that which has served as the mask of religiosity behind which the worship of Mammon has risen. Francis Bacon is finally being acknowledged as the definitive author of materialism, reproducing the philosophy of the Charvaks through his elaborate Science of Induction. This is only the tip of the iceberg that lies hidden beneath that period of history known as the Age of Elizabeth. I invite all to look at my investigation into this issue at the following link:

 

http://www.aibrat.150m.com

[Guest guest]

But what are you trying to say-that English is the language of the devil? What of other languages?

[Ibrat]

"Language of the Devil" is not the right term to use. It is emanating, after all, from the grace of Sarasvati, and so cannot be described as coming from the Devil. In the same Bhavishya Purana it is said that, "The munis have explained that the dharma of the mlecchas is devotion to Lord Vishnu, fire sacrifice, non-violence, austerity and sense control." The wonderful fruits the mleccha dharma and mleccha language in the age of Kali is also predicted. "Crime is becoming prominent in the holy place of Sapta-puri. Gradually the people of Aryavarta are becoming thieves, hunters, bhillas and fools. The followers of mleccha-dharma in foreign countries are intelligent and having good qualities, whereas the people of Aryavarta are bereft of good qualities. Thus the ruling of mlecchas is also in Bharata and its islands."

 

Here it is made plain that we are ordained to be following English ways and to be conversing in English. But this is because we have become thieves, hunters, bhillas and fools. It is our final degradation at the feet of the mlecchas. It is up to the Westerners to fulfill the Age of Kali. The duty of the Aryan is to transcend the darkness and to recover the way of dharma. We cannot achieve this through the corrupted tongue of English.

 

You also ask, "What of the other languages?" The mleccha tongues are truly diverse. The Bhavishya Purana says, "There are four kinds of mleccha languages: Vraja-bhasa, Maharastri, Yavani and Garundika. In this way there are four million kinds of other languages." I am not proposing that English is just another mleccha language. My specific suggestion is that English is the final purification of all the mleccha tongues. It is fructified from the subtle body of Tantra, and through the means of the ashuras that prowl the Age of Kali. There was no human agent who designed it so that Bacon (Vach), Dee (Devi), and de Vere (Varahi) would come together to construct "Shakespeare", and to establish the Science of Induction (the materialism of the Charvaks), as well as to instigate the atheism of the Nyayas by authoring the King James Bible. When I see the names of Bacon, Dee and de Vere at the heart of Rosicrucianism then I infer only one thing - the curse of Sarasvati.

 

[Guest guest]

it is very simple:

 

concepts and philosophy can be explained with every possibile language who is fully understandable by the listener or reader

 

the mantras, to retain their full power, has to be chanted in sanskrit.. devanagari...

 

even if knowing their meaning in our language is necessary to give, until we're not fully realized, a lot more taste..

[Guest guest]

The one thing we have to keep in mind about the English language, and especially about English translations, is that the translation has to reflect the true meaning of the original sanskrit. We are blessed by Srila Prabhupada for authentic and scholarly translations in all of his works; most of his works contain word for word translation of each sanskrit word into english, which is great!

 

About the mantras, they must be chanted in sanskrit. However, the metre and pronounciation of the mantra must be authentic. It is said that this unauthentic pronounciation is the chief cause of why mantras dont have the same potency today as in the days of the scriptures.

 

Hare Krishna!

[Guest guest]

"It is said that this unauthentic pronounciation is the chief cause of why mantras dont have the same potency today as in the days of the scriptures."

 

i do not completely agree..

 

the potency of mantra is basically given by the grace of krsna through the grace of guru..

 

so, if i am connected by sri guru to the parampara' system, if i am concentrated in reciting the mantra with all my best capacities, the mantra will be effective..

 

much more effective than a perfect pronunciation by a sanskritist who is not connected in this way to krsna bhagavan

 

when someone told to srila prabhupada that his american disciples did not pronounce properly the names in the mahamantra, his divine grace answered something like "krsna is not stupid.. he knows that they're calling him"

[Ibrat]

<< concepts and philosophy can be explained with every possible language >>

 

This is exactly the point. Every language has a material substratum. Anyone can be a materialist, as long as he is prepared to follow only the letter of the law, and will ignore the spirit of the law. No concept, neither philosophy, has ever been able to define what the spirit is. When we are with dharma it is the spirit that we are concerned with. It is because the spiritual path is the ascending path. The other path the path to definitions and clever philosophies is the path that descends to Narak. I take this opportunity to quote from Tagore:

 

"Curiously enough, there are men who lose that feeling of mystery, which is at the root of all our delights, when they discover the uniformity of law among the diversity of nature. As if gravitation is not more of a mystery than the fall of an apple, as if the evolution from one scale of being to the other is not something which is even more shy of explanation than a succession of creations. The trouble is that we very often stop at such a law as if it were the final end of our search, and then we find that it does not even begin to emancipate our spirit. It only gives satisfaction to our intellect, and as it does not appeal to our whole being it only deadens in us the sense of the infinite."

 

This is the dead-end Narak of materialism, and can be arrived at through any language whatsoever. English is meant to satisfy the intellect. Its nursery was a nation that worshipped the intellect as God. There are many ways to satisfy the intellect, and this includes the appreciation of religious scripture. While we are in the sphere of English, can we be absolutely sure that we are not following our ego while we practice dharma? Everything in the Anglo-sphere is meant to entice us towards the ego. The Anglo-sphere is enormously enticing. Are we confident that we are free from its clutches? Our very smugness about the English language and English civilization points to the opposite reality. When are we going to wake up to the fact that the English have lied to us concerning almost everything we know?

[Guest guest]

No concept, neither philosophy, has ever been able to define what the spirit is.

--the fact is that pure saints and acharyas speak in modern languages and they spread in this way the krsna consciousness. So when a modern language is used to speak of true spiritual subjects by pure spiritual persons, there's full transmission of spirituality.

Everything is pure for the pure..

 

The matter is krsna's energy.. if you put it directly at the service of krsna, it is no more matter but it is spirit. In this way a material thing like a computer can be used to transmit and receive spiritual consciousness, and a material language like english, or french, or spanish and so on can become devanagari (divine language) if used for divine purposes by divine persons..

 

My spiritual masters (prabhupada and my guru maharaja) speak about spiritual concepts in english, than thousands of people, myself included, from such concepts, get the entusiasm and inspiration to use the direct link with krsna that is the sanskrit mantra hare krsna..

 

if they did not do it... if did not do it in english.... me and thousand of people were not even knowing the existence of hari nama

 

so i am extremely grateful and i do not find, for the reasons i have said, any philosophical problem in it...

 

---

 

this site is HARE KRISHNA.org...

 

gaudyas explain in many languages and with many media to chant hare krishna... explanations of the benefit of chanting are in an intellectually understandable language....... the practice of chanting is done all over the world in sanskrit without any change or attempt to translate

 

"krsna" is chanted "krsna".. not "the all attractive"

 

so what's your problem?

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hare Krishna.

 

I am an Indian but realize that it's because of the English speaking devotees that the Vedic religion will survive in Kali Yuga.

 

The Indians in general, are just not interested in Vedic culture, they want western cutlture and everything western. That's why Srila Prabhupada came to the West to make the Westerners Vedic so that it can survive.

 

Know-one had even heard of Krishna in the West until 40 years ago, but now everyone knows who he is due to SP and the English speaking devotees who have preached very well.

 

All glories to the English speaking devotees.

[Ibrat]

<< It is said that this unauthentic pronunciation is the chief cause of why mantras don't have the same potency today as in the days of the scriptures>>

 

I would like to paint a picture of how mantra is effective in Kaliyuga. I am talking about evil mantra, or black magic. Western paganism has a precursor known as the Amazon religion. Feminists and modern libertines are gradually relapsing into this previous state with the relentless advance of female emancipation. People are openly calling themselves witches in the West, and are mocking Maheshwar everyday. Simply put, Western paganism is the worship of Shakti at the expense of Shiva. It is Tantrism that has lost its allegiance to Mahadev. In other words, it is black magic.

 

How effective are the Tantric mantras chanted by the Amazon priestesses? The feminists are digging up so much about their Amazon past that we are able to make an inspired foray into this question. The eminent pagan authority Barbara G Walker tells us that the Amazon priestesses would chant mantras exhorting the grace of Vach Devi after inscribing these mantra on the bark of the beech tree. The same bark would then be grounded and added to the feed of the sacrificial boar. The meat of the boar is then "beechen". After consumption of this meat Vach Devi is supposed to grant the powers of materialism, which is to be borne of the medium of words.

 

Now fast forward to London in the age of Elizabeth. Edward de Vere ('the boar') is the premier noble in England. In fact he is the true English king according to the Grail lore. But the true king is only a blood sacrifice for the sake of the Devi. This is according to the Amazon code, which is more fundamental then the Grail lore. Edward de Vere is also the greatest poetic genius of his age. But his reputation is sacrificed when he goes underground in order to compose "Shakespeare", which is nothing but a codeword for Vach Devi. After the death of de Vere the secret authorship of "Shakespeare" is taken over by Francis Bacon, the hidden son of Queen Elizabeth. Bacon is indeed beechen, in every possible sense. He founded the Science of Induction, which lies at the very basis of the materialistic civilisation of today. The sacrifice of the boar has given us bacon. Bacon is meant to be consumed, and the result is the consumer society. We consume, and then we discard, and thereby we lay the foundation to Greed. This is exactly the substance of the Science of Induction. We are told to induce a subjective worldview from our five senses, and then to ignore whatever is not contained within sensuality. We are told be become beasts whose only function is to consume and discard. The English nation did exactly this to Francis Bacon. It accepted the Science of Induction, it accepted "Shakespeare", it accepted the King James Bible, and then reduced Bacon to a minor essayist, and have had the luxury of belittling him through the centuries as a corrupt official in the court of King James. Each of us who participate in the consumer society does exactly the same. We prey of the inductive fruits of others only towards self-aggrandisement. Isn't this exactly what was exhorted from Vach Devi by the mantras of the Amazon priestesses? Haven't we all become greedy boars constantly sniffing the soil of Prakriti in what is supposed to be material heaven, but in truth is Narak? I put this rhetorical question. Is this not the power of mantra in Kaliyuga?

 

 

[Guest guest]

actual mantra is "mana-traya".. liberation of the mind..

 

so there's not such thing as "evil mantra".. some formula who's evil, is not a mantra..

 

we have nothing to do with it..

[Ibrat]

{I am an Indian but realize that it's because of the English-speaking devotees that the Vedic religion will survive in Kali Yuga. The Indians in general, are just not interested in Vedic culture; they want western culture and everything western}

 

Which is absolutely true and is the central tragedy of our age. But we must also remember that the rules have changed in the age of ignorance. Tulsidas puts in thus:

 

"The age of Kali is a store house of impurities and vices but it has many virtues too. Final emancipation is possible in the Kali age without any exertion. Moreover, the same goal which is reached through worship of God, performance of sacrifices or the practice of Yoga in the Satyayuga and in the Treta and Dwapara yuga, men are able to attain through the name of Sri Hari in the Kali age. No other age can compare with the Kali age provided a man has faith (in its virtue); for in this age one can easily cross the ocean of transmigration simply by singing Sri Ram's holy praises."

 

In my humble opinion, this faith is to be extended to the Motherland and the Mother Tongue. What is the record of the defectors up to this point? Fat egos and material trophies. However praiseworthy their accomplishments, in the final analysis they are serving Western decadence. Show me a Westerner who can truly appreciate "satyam sivam sundaram". I see there great intellects who are able to appreciate the Vedas far better than anyone can on Indian soil, yet who mistake critical appreciation for divine awareness. For one act of submission they compensate with a hundred acts of discourse. I seriously doubt whether a Westerner is capable of submitting at the feet of Eeshwar.

 

I see a different picture in the context of the Motherland and the Mother Tongue. There is no doubt that we have lost faith in our own heritage, and that we are, one and all, panting after hallucinations shown to us by the material West. But search for those who have true faith. I am sure you will find greatness there. I give you three examples from the world of Bengali literature. Bankim Chandra Chatterji was a fount of true knowledge in an age overflowing with the false dictates of Science. The sublime cadence that flows from the pen of Rabindranath Tagore at times approaches the beauty of the Bhagavat Gita. Kazi Nazrul Islam captured, in one single voice, the rebellion that lurks within us all, which is the rebellion against the rottenness that eats away at our hearts. In the age of Kali it doesn't require nations to be following satyapath. It only requires one individual with faith in the Motherland and the Mother Tongue. Let us not concern ourselves about the fact that no-one will stand up with dignity, and that they choose instead to retreat further and further into the gutter of materialism. Nazrul is prepared to stand up tall. So tall does he stand that he becomes the dignity of us all in one human frame! Where does such strength come from if not from the grace of Sarasvati?

 

We lose faith too easily, and then we fall for the charms of a civilisation whose clear and resolute purpose is to annihilate the Motherland and to establish adharma. In both words and practice this message is being told continuously for the last 500 years. If we are still able to ignore it, what does this tell us about the depth of our corruption?

 

I accept that there is no harm in using English for our mundane purposes. But I worry about our inner state if we are not even aware of the danger that it poses.

[Guest guest]

your racism is not supported by any acharya or vedic scripture