God of Geeta / Geeta ka bhagwaan

[Guest guest]

Omshanti.

Respected guest wrote:

--------------------------

What is the proof for your imaginary god's existence ?

Are you trying to avoid my question like a typical cheater ?

I think this is what your teachers taught you. When cornered with questions just evade those questions and thus cheat them.

Why is it that only your fakeraj allegedly saw this so called nirakar shiva ? Nobody heard of this fake philosophy before your fakeraj. Why ?Is it not logical that this guy fakeraj misguided or perhaps a cheater ?

--------------------------

 

I have already written that neither God nor the soul can be seen through the naked eyes and can only be realized on the basis of faith and devotion and also through the third eye of knowledge. Neither am I capable of proving God through any scientific instrument nor can you prove the existence of Shri Krishna.

 

It is written in Gita itself that God is ajanma, avyakta, abhokta etc. which apply only to incorporeal Shiva and not the corporeal Shri Krishna. What more proof do you want? If you wish you can call that incorporeal Shiva as Shri Krishna if you like. But God says that my original name based on my actions (patit-paavan, kalyaankaari) is Shiv. Shri Sumedh has himself given the year of death of Shri Krishna. I think he will also be able to tell the date of his birth. Ram, Krishna etc. were deities (divine human beings) who entered the cycle of birth and death and hence their birthdays are celebrated in the form of Ramnavami and Janmashtami. Incorporeal Shiva only enters into another human being in the dark night of irreligiousness and ignorance at the end of Kaliyuga (Iron Age) to purify the sinful souls and to show them the light of knowledge. That is why his divine incarnation is celebrated as Mahashivratri. We call it Shivjayanti also.

 

In the end I would like to humbly ask you if your God and my God are different? If so, how many Gods exist in the universe. As far as I know God is only one, who is remembered by different names. One of his name is love also. I think that whoever respects his mortal parents will never talk about God in terms of yours or mine. Just as corporeal parents are one, God is also one, whether you like it or not.

 

With regards,

On Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar.

[Guest guest]

Dear guest,

Omshanti.

You wrote:

--------------------------

At one time(before Columbus discovered America) ignorant people in Europe believed that land beyond the seas were inhabited by demons. Does that make them right ?

 

Fact has nothing to do with number of believers. It just means that many are mis-guided, just like dada fakeraj and his followers.

--------------------------

 

I never said that just because Christians and Muslims had more followers, they are right. I only said that they are also powerful religions that have played important roles in world history, about which your scriptures are silent.All the religious fathers talk only about their own religions. They only establish increase the numbers of already existing religions. They neither destroy other religions nor establish a true kingdom and religion. But when God comes he establishes a true religion (Aadi sanatan devi devata dharma) as well as a kingdom. He gives the knowledge about all the religions, their origin and how souls of all the religions are united into one rosary, one family, the vasudhaiv kutumb.

With regards,

On Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar

[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Sumedh,

Omshanti. In the articles that you have quoted, the authors have quoted dates prior to 5000 years ago only on the basis of astronomical dates, which are not the basis of history. I have not seen any book on history where astronomy is the proof/basis for deciding the dates of any historical event or place. Most of the dates in history are based on excavations or scientific methods like C-14 Dating techniques.

 

You have still not answered my questions as to the ages of various ages like Satyug, Tretayug and Dwaparyug. If Krishna expired in 3102 BC according to you, then Shri Rama must have existed many lakhs/thousands of years earlier. If Kaliyuga's age is more than 4 lakh years then Dwapar must have been certainly much more older. If that is the case then Ramayana must have taken place lakhs of years ago. But there is no historical proof for such events having taken place at that time. When the Vedic period itself is a few thousands years old according to history then how can Ramayan would have been enacted lakhs of years ago?

 

Finally, by quoting the date of death of Shri Krishna you seem to have accepted that Shri Krishna is not a God but a human being who enters into the cycle of birth and death.

 

With regards,

ON Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar.

 

[Guest guest]

 

Neither am I capable of proving God through any scientific instrument nor can you prove the existence of Shri Krishna.

 

 

Then why did you , like a hypocrite, ask questions on where is Lord Visnu, 33 crore gods, etc. ?

 

 

In the end I would like to humbly ask you if your God and my God are different? If so, how many Gods exist in the universe. As far as I know God is only one, who is remembered by different names. One of his name is love also. I think that whoever respects his mortal parents will never talk about God in terms of yours or mine. Just as corporeal parents are one, God is also one, whether you like it or not.

 

 

Vedas speak of Lord Visnu(Narayana alias Krishna, Ram etc.) as the ONE GOD. So have many acharyas like Madhva, Ramanuja, Namdev and so many others through experience.

 

Now, your teacher Lekhraj comes and then says God is a point of light, then you come here and start claiming Lord Krishna is not GOD as he was born etc. without understanding anything what itihaasas and vedas say ?

 

Why should I believe in your teacher or you guys ?

 

Why should I think your teacher had a vision of god as you guys claim when your teachings are in opposition to Vedas ?

 

Tommorow some unknown guy can come and say I have revelation from god. He revealed to me the right knowledge and said that all religions including bramma kumaris are wrong. Listen to only what I say ? and he starts teaching his new philosophy.

 

Should I listen to this mad person ?

 

If GOD exists then HE should have revealed the true knowledge during creation only.

 

Only Vedas have no begining. Hence it goes back to GOD HIMSELF directly.

 

All other teachings like bible, quran, bramma kumaris' teachings etc. have a human being allegedly inspired by some god and also have a point of time as their begining. in bramma kumaris case, with the so called vision of lekhraj. May be lekhraj imagined himself that he got revelations from some god. After all lekhraj is a fallible human being.

[Guest guest]

 

Dear Shri Sumedh,

Omshanti. In the articles that you have quoted, the authors have quoted dates prior to 5000 years ago only on the basis of astronomical dates, which are not the basis of history. I have not seen any book on history where astronomy is the proof/basis for deciding the dates of any historical event or place. Most of the dates in history are based on excavations or scientific methods like C-14 Dating techniques.

 

 

C-14 has a maximum range of only 50,000 years. It means that things older than that cannot be even measured with instruments available today. That means we lack even the ability to know anything about history older than 50,000 years.

 

Secondly, archaeologists use mathematical models, from archaelogical data and extrapolate to approximately find the dates of say, pottery etc. It is not a scientifically exact process as this involves many assumtions.

 

Third, there was city discovered near Chennai which is 9500 years old, ie 7500 B.C., which was published in times of India.

 

http://www.stephen-knapp.com/some_of_the_archeological_finds_of_2002.htm

 

A City Dating Back to 7500 BC

 

As was announced on January 16, 2002 from New Delhi, Indian scientists have made an archaeological discovery that dates back to 7500 bce. This suggests, as a top government official said, that the world's oldest cities came up about 4,000 years earlier than is currently believed. The scientists found pieces of wood, remains of pots, fossil bones and what appeared like construction material just off the coast of Surat, Science and Technology Minister Murli Manohar Joshi told a news conference. He said, "Some of these artifacts recovered by the National Institute of Ocean Technology from the site, such as the log of wood date back to 7500 bce, which is indicative of a very ancient culture in the present Gulf of Cambay, that got submerged subsequently." Current belief is that the first cities appeared around 3500 bce in the valley of Sumer, where Iraq now stands, a statement issued by the government said. "We can safely say from the antiquities and the acoustic images of the geometric structures that there was human activity in the region more than 9,500 years ago (7500 BC)," said S.N. Rajguru, an independent archaeologist.

 

 

Fouth, there may be many other places which are older than these. Just because we have no evidence, that does not mean that there were no civilizations present as Vedas suggest.

 

Read Michael Cremo's book on Hidden Archaelogy.

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna

 

you said:

 

Omshanti. In the articles that you have quoted, the authors have quoted dates prior to 5000 years ago only on the basis of astronomical dates, which are not the basis of history. I have not seen any book on history where astronomy is the proof/basis for deciding the dates of any historical event or place. Most of the dates in history are based on excavations or scientific methods like C-14 Dating techniques.

 

 

 

One is that simply because astronomical evidence is scientifically provable compared to the archeological evidence which keeps changing every year. Second, if you want to live in your fantasies there is little i can do because i have already given links to places which are older than 4000BC according to history. So when you say that the only links i gave are giving astronomical evidence is nothing but a lie.

 

you said:

 

Finally, by quoting the date of death of Shri Krishna you seem to have accepted that Shri Krishna is not a God but a human being who enters into the cycle of birth and death.

 

 

 

Which only proves that the persons who were being quoted are technically atheists because they do not know abcs of transcendental knowledge and so you should consider them "neutral". Get off your bandawagon, rewind a little and go back to the quotes i gave earlier about Krishna ascending to His abode in His trancendental form as in the scriptures. Don't jump around claiming your victory like a little kid by putting words in my mouth, okay ...

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna

 

you said:

 

You have still not answered my questions as to the ages of various ages like Satyug, Tretayug and Dwaparyug. If Krishna expired in 3102 BC according to you, then Shri Rama must have existed many lakhs/thousands of years earlier. If Kaliyuga's age is more than 4 lakh years then Dwapar must have been certainly much more older. If that is the case then Ramayana must have taken place lakhs of years ago. But there is no historical proof for such events having taken place at that time. When the Vedic period itself is a few thousands years old according to history then how can Ramayan would have been enacted lakhs of years ago?

 

 

 

which is also incorrect. The start of Vedic period is untracable; all we have is speculations from modern historians. The Vedic texts have been dated at around 3100BC which is consistent with tradition since before that all the Vedic texts were transmitted by hearing and learning. Srila Vyasadeva seeing the future degradation of memory compiled and wrote them. When you quoted the date of manuscript mahabharata, you did not apply basic facts that manuscripts do not survive for 5000 years; Shankaracharya who lived much before that quotes them (and puranas) frequently in his works.

 

Moreover, there is no proof that your imagined god exists except in your forced imaginations.

 

And you avoided the basic question that humans have been existing for lakhs of years without breaks as is accepted by even archeologists. What you make of that? Actually just forget it; it is pretty clear to me by now that you have just decided to repeat and repeat the same things even if they have been shown to be wrong.

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna

 

To some extent yes. See Sripad Madhava's commentary on Bhagavad-Gita (esp. 2.13) for instance.

 

you said:

 

It is written in Gita itself that God is ajanma, avyakta, abhokta etc. which apply only to incorporeal Shiva and not the corporeal Shri Krishna. What more proof do you want?

 

 

 

Which has been shown to be wrong according to the scriptures, for Lord Krishna does not possess a corporeal body but a completely transcendental one. As for "incorporeal" Lord Shiva being ajanma, he is born from Lord Brahma and that is the verdict of the scriptures. Your artificial differentiation between shankar and shiva is heard of before, but has not scriptural evidence -- maybe you mean sadashiva.

 

you said:

 

Shri Sumedh has himself given the year of death of Shri Krishna. I think he will also be able to tell the date of his birth.

 

 

 

which is only your imagination, for it was the year when Lord Krishna ended His manifested lilas.

[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Sumedh,

Omshanti. You wrote:

--------------------------

Lord Krishna does not possess a corporeal body but a completely transcendental one. As for "incorporeal" Lord Shiva being ajanma, he is born from Lord Brahma and that is the verdict of the scriptures. Your artificial differentiation between shankar and shiva is heard of before, but has not scriptural evidence -- maybe you mean sadashiva.

--------------------------

 

I wish to say that just as you say that incorporeal Shiva is an imagination we can also say that Shri Krishna possessing only transcendental body (or subtle body) is also an imagination only. Roles in this corporeal world cannot be played just with subtle bodies. All the persons who have played roles on this earth have had corporeal bodies. How can Shri Krishna manage to have played role for so many years without a corporeal body in front of lakhs of people. I have not heard of any famous character of world history without a physical body. It is only a fig of imagination to say that Shri Krishna did not have a physical body.

 

We can take an example. Gandhiji was a famous personality of the last century who lead the freedom movement in India. After his death, his statues can be found all over the world. Maybe one day people will start worshipping him in temples. But neither now, nor centuries from now anyone will say that Gandhiji possessed just a transcendental or subtle body. Similarly, temples of Shri Krishna are found all over the world today. This shows that a person named Shri Krishna existed on this earth many years ago. The period of his existence may be a subject of controversy, the stories associated with him may be a subject of controversy, but if you say that he did not possess a physical body, then it is only an imagination. May be that is the reason why Hindu deities do not find any mention in the history books like other kings and queens, except for their idols being worshipped by those kings and queens who have found mention in history. The stories and characters mentioned in the religious scriptures are mostly imaginary without any historical proofs, and hence do not find any place in the history. Just as the mythological stories of Hindus do not find any place in history, the mythological stories mentioned in the Old Testament also do not find any mention in the history. No history book will start with the story of Adam and Eve. Neither will any history book will start with your so called theory of Brahma emerging from the naabhi(naval) of Vishnu and then Shankar emerging from Brahma and then Brahma creating the world. The Hindu theory of creation of world is equally imaginary as the theory of creation of world in seven days mentioned by Christians and Muslims. Although many of the scientists and historians belong to the above three major religions, i.e. Hinduism, Christianity and Islam, I have not seen any history book which says that this world was created in seven days. If you wish to cling on to imaginary, outdated stories and scriptures, it is your sweet will. It may be karnapriya (sound sweet to the ears) but is nothing more than mere imagination. god comes and gives knowledge that is practical and useful and does not narrate imaginary stories just to please the crowd.

With regards,

On Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear guest,

Omshanti. You wrote:

--------------------------

Then why did you , like a hypocrite, ask questions on where is Lord Visnu, 33 crore gods, etc. ?

--------------------------

 

I said I cannot prove God because just like we human souls God the Supreme Father of all souls is also a soul, which cannot be seen through the naked eyes and hence cannot be proved physically but only realized on the basis of devotion and knowledge.

 

But my question regarding the whereabouts of Brahma, Vishnu and Shankar and 33 crore deities is still valid, because you say that deities are imperishable (after drinking the amrit or nectar) and have bodies as mentioned in various scriptures. For a moment I may accept that Shri Krishna had a transcendental body and hence cannot be proved, but where are all the other imperishable 33 crore deities? Have all of them vanished in the thin air? And where are all the demons and their paataal lok, from where they perenially fight with the deities living in heaven? Scientists have sent probe missions upto Mars, but have not found evidence of any life beyond this earth. Then where are all the imperishable 33 crore deities mentioned in the scriptures? Did all the 33 crore deities and demons vanish along with Shri Krishna on the so-called date when he breathed his last? Why have human beings not seen any of the 33 crore deities or an equal army of demons during the few thousand years of recorded human history? It only shows that the characters and stories mentioned in the scriptures are only imaginary. It may be possible that there were human beings with these names in history but the stories associated with these names are definitely imaginary. It is a well known fact that even in the poems written during the last millenium, the poets used to add imaginary stories just to please the kings for whom they wrote the poems. Then how can we say that the mythological stories written much earlier to this millenium are historical? They are only imaginary stories with may be a pinch of truth in them. Learning morals from the stories can be nice, but trying to prove them to be historical facts is only a waste of time.

With regards,

On Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar.

[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Sumedh,

Omshanti. You had some time back wrtten:

--------------------------

which i understood perfectly well. My comment was that mind/intellect is physical in nature which has got to do nothing with the soul. btw it can be easily shown by logic that mind/intellect is physical in nature.

--------------------------

 

In this connection I have been intimated by Adhyatmik Ishwariya Vishwa Vidyalaya that mind and intellect are only called soul. In one of the richas of Rigveda there is a mention of Manarev atma, i.e. mind is only called atma or soul.

(man buddhi ko hi atma kahajata hai ,rug ved ki richa me ye baat ayi hai " Manrew atma" arthat man ko hi atma kahajata hai)

 

So mind is not physical but spiritual.

 

With regards,

ON Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar.

 

[sumedh]

Dear roohani sevadhari

 

you said:

 

man buddhi ko hi atma kahajata hai ,rug ved ki richa me ye baat ayi hai " Manrew atma" arthat man ko hi atma kahajata hai

 

 

 

This is not any quote from Rig Veda, a statement by someone at Adhyatmik... has not value. You need to give the precise reference for this, which richa with the complete quote. A vague reference has not value; why? because all the scriptures directly contradict this. For example see Bhagavad-Gita 7.4

 

bhumir apo 'nalo vayuh

kham mano buddhir eva ca

ahankara itiyam me

bhinna prakrtir astadha

 

Earth, water, fire, air, ether, mind, intelligence and false ego--all together these eight comprise My separated material energies.

 

 

 

[sumedh]

Dear roohani sevadhari

 

you said:

 

But my question regarding the whereabouts of Brahma, Vishnu and Shankar and 33 crore deities is still valid, because you say that deities are imperishable (after drinking the amrit or nectar) and have bodies as mentioned in various scriptures. For a moment I may accept that Shri Krishna had a transcendental body and hence cannot be proved, but where are all the other imperishable 33 crore deities? Have all of them vanished in the thin air? And where are all the demons and their paataal lok, from where they perenially fight with the deities living in heaven? Scientists have sent probe missions upto Mars, but have not found evidence of any life beyond this earth. Then where are all the imperishable 33 crore deities mentioned in the scriptures? Did all the 33 crore deities and demons vanish along with Shri Krishna on the so-called date when he breathed his last? Why have human beings not seen any of the 33 crore deities or an equal army of demons during the few thousand years of recorded human history?

 

 

 

As i said before, if you need to ask do it in a proper way. First off you expose your ignorance of these topics then challange others arrogantly -- do you know how persons with such a kind of behaviour have been described in the scriptures?

 

Anyways the scriptures also give precise descriptions of these planets e.g. that these planets have different time scales. Do we or the scientists have any experience where a world has a different time scale? They do not have because using mechanical means only one level (viz. bhu-mandala, and that too not properly and completely) can be probed. The fourteen planetary systems mentioned in the scriptures are in different planes of existence as can be seen from the different time scales mentioned for them. The bhu-mandala is only composed of the five gross elements (the subtle elements being present only in living beings) while the others are in more subtle and other realms of existence. This is a very complex topic; various puranas give the description of how to move from one plane to another using the sushumna passage, e.g. markandeya purana, which is said to have closed at the start of kali-yuga though there are yogic siddhis which enable one to still go there. Even many modern day yogis claim to be able to go into other realms but their claims should be taken with a grain of salt; however acharyas have confirmed all these so there is no question at least to those who believe in vedic scriptures.

 

See this for an introduction to this:

http://nersp.nerdc.ufl.edu/~ghi/vc.html

with a sample chapter here:

http://nersp.nerdc.ufl.edu/~ghi/vcchap.html

 

Suffice to say that if one is considering the descriptions of the various planetary systems from the scriptures, then one must consider the complete description not try to refute by taking a part of it. When the scientists are able to find a method to move to other planes of existence then they can try to refute it -- till then only say "we do not know" or "we do not know, and do not believe that there are other planes of existence".

[sumedh]

Dear roohani sevadhari

 

 

I wish to say that just as you say that incorporeal Shiva is an imagination we can also say that Shri Krishna possessing only transcendental body (or subtle body) is also an imagination only. Roles in this corporeal world cannot be played just with subtle bodies. All the persons who have played roles on this earth have had corporeal bodies. How can Shri Krishna manage to have played role for so many years without a corporeal body in front of lakhs of people. I have not heard of any famous character of world history without a physical body. It is only a fig of imagination to say that Shri Krishna did not have a physical body.

 

 

 

I never said that incorporeal Shiva is an imagination: what i said that what you make of Lord Shiva as being incorporeal etc. is your own imagination. Your ideas of incorporeal are your imagination; you try to "kill" Lord Shiva in your thoughts by imagining that he has no transcendental body. Shiva-tattva is very complex and would be a whole new topic in itself, but only if you come up with a better attitude.

 

Transcendental is different from normal subtle -- transcendental is subtlest of subtle. So actually the normal non-devotee humans only saw Lord Krishna as possessing a normal human body due to lack of transcendental eyes, while the pure devotees saw the transcendental form with their transcendental eyes. Actually even though the Lord is present everywhere all the time and the pure devotees can see Him, only when He comes as a lila-avataara can the normal humans see Him though they think He has a material body due to their possessing material eyes. The siddhanta is simple -- material eyes can only see a material projection of the Truth.

 

In this context Lord Krishna says:

Srimad Bhagavad-Gita 9.11

 

avajananti mam mudha

manusim tanum asritam

param bhavam ajananto

mama bhuta-mahesvaram

 

Fools deride Me when I descend in the human form. They do not know My transcendental nature and My supreme dominion over all that be.

 

 

 

All i can say is that you have taken to oppose all these direct scriptural statements without any evidence.

 

you said:

 

If you wish to cling on to imaginary, outdated stories and scriptures, it is your sweet will. It may be karnapriya (sound sweet to the ears) but is nothing more than mere imagination. god comes and gives knowledge that is practical and useful and does not narrate imaginary stories just to please the crowd.

 

 

 

you imagine anyone to be god, what can be done. Even if the ideas of your god have been shown to be wrong you cling on to them -- as you wish. It may be fashionable to call the accounts given in the vedic scriptures as "outdated", "myths" etc. but does not change the Truth. In their complete understanding none of the Vedic Truths have been shown to be incorrect a wee bit; on the other hand scientists have learned a lot from the vedic knowledge e.g. using sanskrit in AI, vedic mathematics, the latest fad of yogic postures etc.

[Guest guest]

Omshanti.

Some of the learned friends on this forum had asked me to go through Vedas, and chant the name of Shri Krishna. In this connection I would like to quote some shlokas from Geeta which speak something else.

 

1. Vedeshu yagyeshu tapah su chaiv daaneshu yatpunyafalam pradishtam

Atyeti tatsarvamidam viditwa yogi param sthaanamupaiti chaadhyam (8/28)

 

(Arth- Yogi purush is rahasya ko tatwa say jaankar vedon kay padhney may tatha yagya, tap (aur) daanaadi kay karney may jo punyafal kaha hai, us sabko nissandeh ullanghan kar jaata hai aur sanaatan parampad ko praapta hota hai.

 

2. Na vedayagyadhyayanainarna daaneirna cha kriyabhirna tapobhirugaih.

Evam roopah shakya aham nrilokay drishtum twadanyen kurupraveer. (11/48)

 

(Arth-Hey Arjun! Manushyalok may is prakaar vishwaroopvaala main a ved aur yagyon ke adhyayan say, na daan say, na kriyaaon say aur na ugra tapon say (hee) terey atirikta doosrey ke dwaara dekha ja sakta hoon)

 

3.Naaham vedairna tapasa na daanen na chejyaya.

Shakya evam vidho drishtum drishvanasi maam yatha.(11/53)

 

(Arth-Hey Arjun! Jis prakaar (tumney) mujhko dekha hai is prakaar chaturbhuj roopwaala mai in vedon say, na tap say, na daan say aur na yagya say (hee) dekha ja sakta hoon.

 

The meanings of the above shlokas have been quoted as it is from a book not published by Brahmakumaris but some other organization. The above shlokas clearly state that one cannot reach God through Vedas, tap (penance), daan (donations) yagya (which mainly involves chanting shlokas) etc. God Himself comes and gives his introduction as stated in Gita. One can realize self and God only through the third eye of knowledge which God Himself grants us in the present time.

With regards,

On Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar

 

[sumedh]

Dear roohani sevadhari

 

It is quite refreshing to see you refer to scriptures to substantiate what you say, which is quite some progress. However, the quotes you present in fact support what the learned friends on this forum said. What they said is that engaging in devotional service (by the nine processes mentioned in the quote before, primary being chanting of Holy Names) is the best way. This is what the quotes say:

 

 

vedeshu yajneshu tapahsu caiva

daneshu yat punya-phalam pradishtam

atyeti tat sarvam idam viditva

yogi param sthanam upaiti cadyam

 

SYNONYMS

 

vedeshu -- in the study of the Vedas; yajneshu -- in the performances of yajna, sacrifice; tapahsu -- in undergoing different types of austerities; ca -- also; eva -- certainly; daneshu -- in giving charities; yat -- that which; punya-phalam -- result of pious work; pradishtam -- indicated; atyeti -- surpasses; tat sarvam -- all those; idam -- this; viditva -- knowing; yogi -- the devotee; param -- supreme; sthanam -- abode; upaiti -- achieves; ca -- also; adyam -- original.

 

TRANSLATION

 

A person who accepts the path of devotional service is not bereft of the results derived from studying the Vedas, performing austere sacrifices, giving charity or pursuing philosophical and fruitive activities. Simply by performing devotional service, he attains all these, and at the end he reaches the supreme eternal abode.

 

 

 

Here yogi means a person engaged in bhakti-yoga who fixes his mind on the Supreme Lord. We know this because in 8.22 before this quote the Lord refers to bhakti only. Thus we know He is talking about a bhakta who fixes his mind on Him.

 

Bhagavad-Gita 8.22

 

purushah sa parah partha

bhaktya labhyas tv ananyaya

yasyantah-sthani bhutani

yena sarvam idam tatam

 

SYNONYMS

 

purushah -- the Supreme Personality; sah -- He; parah -- the Supreme, than whom no one is greater; partha -- O son of Pritha; bhaktya -- by devotional service; labhyah -- can be achieved; tu -- but; ananyaya -- unalloyed, undeviating; yasya -- whom; antah-sthani -- within; bhutani -- all of this material manifestation; yena -- by whom; sarvam -- all; idam -- whatever we can see; tatam -- is pervaded.

 

TRANSLATION

 

The Supreme Personality of Godhead, who is greater than all, is attainable by unalloyed devotion. Although He is present in His abode, He is all-pervading, and everything is situated within Him.

 

 

 

Elsewhere the Lord says:

 

BG 6.46: A yogi is greater than the ascetic, greater than the empiricist and greater than the fruitive worker. Therefore, O Arjuna, in all circumstances, be a yogi.

 

BG 6.47: And of all yogis, the one with great faith who always abides in Me, thinks of Me within himself, and renders transcendental loving service to Me -- he is the most intimately united with Me in yoga and is the highest of all. That is My opinion.

 

 

 

Similiarly in the other quotes you have provided, the Lord says that only a devotee can see Him and Arjuna is His dear friend. This is stated clearly in just the next quote:

 

Srimad Bhagavad-Gita 11.54

 

bhaktya tv ananyaya sakya

aham evam-vidho 'rjuna

jnatum drashtum ca tattvena

praveshtum ca parantapa

 

SYNONYMS

 

bhaktya -- by devotional service; tu -- but; ananyaya -- without being mixed with fruitive activities or speculative knowledge; sakyah -- possible; aham -- I; evam-vidhah -- like this; arjuna -- O Arjuna; jnatum -- to know; drashtum -- to see; ca -- and; tattvena -- in fact; praveshtum -- to enter into; ca -- also; parantapa -- O mighty-armed one.

 

TRANSLATION

 

My dear Arjuna, only by undivided devotional service can I be understood as I am, standing before you, and can thus be seen directly. Only in this way can you enter into the mysteries of My understanding.

 

 

 

As you say one cannot reach the Lord by reading vedas, only by devotional service which is performed through the nine processes given before, the primary being the chanting of the Holy Names.

 

you said:

 

One can realize self and God only through the third eye of knowledge which God Himself grants us in the present time.

 

 

 

He gives the "third eye", as you call it, to His pure devotees; see the quote before.

 

 

Haribol

[Guest guest]

This person from Kampil keeps spreading purest scum in the name of knowledge. Knowledge is beyond these cheats and charlatans. These are best ignored.

[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Sumedh,

Omshanti. You wrote:

---------------------------

And you avoided the basic question that humans have been existing for lakhs of years without breaks as is accepted by even archeologists. What you make of that? Actually just forget it; it is pretty clear to me by now that you have just decided to repeat and repeat the same things even if they have been shown to be wrong.

---------------------------

 

If you accept that humans have been existing since lakhs of years(now trillions as per one of our friends)then you will also have believe that human beings were monkeys once upon a time. God Shiva says that this world cycle is only of 5000 years which repeats itself. Neither human beings were monkeys nor monkeys can become humanbeings (unlike your belief).

With regards,

On Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Omshanti.

Learned guest wrote:

---------------------------

This person from Kampil keeps spreading purest scum in the name of knowledge. Knowledge is beyond these cheats and charlatans. These are best ignored.

---------------------------

I wish to humbly know that whether saying that rapes and murders are caused by God called knowledge as is being propagated by some of our learned members of this forum?

 

With regards,

On Godly service,

Roohani sevadhari,

Prajapita Brahmakumar.