Guest guest Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 Hare Krishna, I see you still have your superiority complex over Shivites, by calling their scriptures tamasic. That's typical from a sectarian source! This is what Padma Purana says. All Puranas that praise Lord Visnu as supreme is Satvik, that which praises Lord Brahma is Rajasic and that which praises Lord Rudra is Tamasic. Besides it was shown several times that Satvik puranas agree with SHRUTI while Tamasic ones do not. Sage Vyasa started the school of Vedanta. I seriously doubt he was the incarnation of Visnu, when Krishna was. Sage Vyasa was not just a great sage of history, but possibly the greatest ever! For your information Bhagavan is not limited. Lord Rama and Lord Parasurama manifested simultaneously in Ramayana. Lord Krishna multiplied HIMSELF into several cowherd boys to teach Lord Brahma a lesson. So Bhagavan can appear as Lord Krishna and Lord Veda Vyasa simultaneously. HE can appear in thousand places simultaneously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sathya Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 While it may be debated about whether Vyas was an incarnation of Vishnu or Krsna himself, you are definately right about Parsurama and Ramchandra. Parsurama was on earth even during Krsna's time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 Jai Ganesh Hare Krishna RE (This is what Padma Purana says. All Puranas that praise Lord Visnu as supreme is Satvik, that which praises Lord Brahma is Rajasic and that which praises Lord Rudra is Tamasic.) All these purans actualy describes the supreme lord who possess all three Gunas in full and yet he is nirguna. Re (Besides it was shown several times that Satvik puranas agree with SHRUTI while Tamasic ones do not.) Make your mind up if Literary incarnation Lord Vyasa wrote them all, why would they not agree with Shruti? Jai Shree Krishna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 Hare Krishna, All these purans actualy describes the supreme lord who possess all three Gunas in full and yet he is nirguna. This is nnonsense. What Shruti says is final. So those Tamasic puranas(Shiva Purana etc.) is rejected because it directly contradicts Sruti. Make your mind up if Literary incarnation Lord Vyasa wrote them all, why would they not agree with Shruti? Lord Visnu deceives undeserving individuals like in Mohini avatar. It may be the same here. Whatever the reason the fact remains that Tamasic puranas directly contradicts what Sruti says and so Shiva purana etc. are to be rejected period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 Hare Krishna, While it may be debated about whether Vyas was an incarnation of Vishnu or Krsna himself, you are definately right about Parsurama and Ramchandra. Parsurama was on earth even during Krsna's time. I take it on verses from Bhagavatam and the teachings of Madhva, Raghavendra Swamy etc. that Lord Vyas is self-same Lord Visnu. As for Lord Parasurama, it would be great if you know that HE is mentioned in Sruti. I know Ramayana is mentioned in Rig Veda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 Jai Ganesh RE (In reply to: -- All these purans actualy describes the supreme lord who possess all three Gunas in full and yet he is nirguna. -- This is nnonsense. What Shruti says is final. So those Tamasic puranas(Shiva Purana etc.) is rejected because it directly contradicts Sruti What is non-sense, the fact that the Lord possess all three Gunas? And you Know all the Shruti? Re-- Make your mind up if Literary incarnation Lord Vyasa wrote them all, why would they not agree with Shruti? - Lord Visnu deceives undeserving individuals like in Mohini avatar. It may be the same here. Whatever the reason the fact remains that Tamasic puranas directly contradicts what Sruti says and so Shiva purana etc. are to be rejected period. Let me say this one more time Puranas are not Tamasic or otherwise. Lord Shiva controls the tamoguna and his glories are sung in these puranas that you so rudly call Tamasic. One minute you talk about Sruti and than you speculate about Mohini avatar, I cant really take you seriously. Shree Vyasdev dictated, and Shree Ganesh wrote them on condition that what ever Shree Vyasdev spoke Shree Ganesh would understand. Hare Krishna Jai Shree Krishna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 Hare Krishna, What is non-sense, the fact that the Lord possess all three Gunas? And you Know all the Shruti? Exactly. This is what I call as nonsense. Bhagavan is free or above all these material characteristics like Tamasic or Rajasic nature. Even the material Satvik nature is imperfect. When one says Bhagavan is Satvik(pure goodness), it does not refer to any of these materialistic natures. On the other hand it is right to say that Bhagavan is the Lord of all these. Let me say this one more time Puranas are not Tamasic or otherwise. Lord Shiva controls the tamoguna and his glories are sung in these puranas that you so rudly call Tamasic. It is not my intention to hurt anybody, but this is what Vedas claim. Lord Rudra is not Bhagavan(Rig Veda 7:40:5) and he is subservient to Lord VISNU according to the sruti mentioned. Those puranas are mentioned to be Tamasic in Padma Purana. One minute you talk about Sruti and than you speculate about Mohini avatar, I cant really take you seriously. The fact still remains that Tamasic puranas like Shiva Purana do not agree with Sruti. This is evident to those who have read Vedas. As for Mohini Avatar, it is clear Lord Visnu does deceive undeserving beings. It is the same in Tamasic Purana. Shree Vyasdev dictated, and Shree Ganesh wrote them on condition that what ever Shree Vyasdev spoke Shree Ganesh would understand. Lord Ganesh wrote with the right understanding as mentioned in Padma Purana. It is explicitly stated in Padma Purana that those puranas that praise Lord Shiva is Tamasic, those that praise Lord Bramha is Rajasic and only those that praise Lord Visnu is SATVIK. Incidentally only Satvik Puranas agree with Sruti. What do you say about this. Please do not enter into a mode of denial. Think about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 Jai Ganesh RE (Lord Ganesh wrote with the right understanding as mentioned in Padma Purana. It is explicitly stated in Padma Purana that those puranas that praise Lord Shiva is Tamasic, those that praise Lord Bramha is Rajasic and only those that praise Lord Visnu is SATVIK. Incidentally only Satvik Puranas agree with Sruti. What do you say about this. Please do not enter into a mode of denial. Think about it.) No prabhu let me re phrase it for you The supreme Lord who is in full control of the three Gunas are described in the Puranas. Lord Vishnu who is associated with mode of good ness Lord Shiva is associated with mode of ignorance Their glories are sung in these puranas.If you want to call them as satvik and tamsik you are wellcome to it. I did say in my earlier post the supreme lord who has this gunas is yet Nirguna i.e. beyond these material nature that does not mean he does not have these gunas. Even if according to your satvik puranas you will find refrence to Lord Shiva being prayed as supreme or Vishnu Puran saying there is no different between us, but than you will deny this. In sruti Lord Rudra is indeed prayed as supreme .I do not claim to know the Vedas nor do i want to pick few slokas from here and there to feel good about myself.i can spend a thousand of life time trying to understand that which is beyond any words. The supreme Lord reveals to who so ever seek him/her with sincerity. Hare Krishna Jai Shree Krishna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2004 Report Share Posted February 19, 2004 Hare Krishna, The topic in subject ie Shivites tamasic? "NO" is wrong. It should be on Tamasic Puranas and not on Shivites. In sruti Lord Rudra is indeed prayed as supreme .I do not claim to know the Vedas nor do i want to pick few slokas from here and there to feel good about myself.i can spend a thousand of life time trying to understand that which is beyond any words. The supreme Lord reveals to who so ever seek him/her with sincerity. I can surely say that one cannot find one Sruti from Veda Samhitas that says that Lord rudra is supreme. On the other hand there are several Srutis which says that 1. Lord Visnu is Supreme 2. Lord Rudra is suservient to Lord Visnu, Maha Lakshmi and even Lord Vayu. Even if according to your satvik puranas you will find refrence to Lord Shiva being prayed as supreme or Vishnu Puran saying there is no different between us, but than you will deny this. Puranas are to be interpreted as per the Vedas. Other point is majority of the Satvik Puranas are Satvik in nature. There are Tamasik portions in Satvik Puranas like Padma Purana. So content of Purana should be taken as true if they agree with Vedas ie Sruti. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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