WE ARE GODS 2

[barney]

This single, unitary divinity had several aspects and names in the Upanishads, one of the most important of which is Atman, a word that originally meant "breath" or "soul" or "vital principle" (as the word "Atmen" does in German). As a cosmological principle or deity, Atman seems to be something like "universal soul" or "universal spirit." In the Brihad-Aranyaka Upanishad , Atman is explicitly called a Person that created the universe by first splitting himself into male and female halves. In the Chandogya Upanishad, this single god is called Brahman, and is "the One without a second"; this Brahman is not only the principle and creator of all there is, but is also fully present within each individual. This dual conception, Brahman and Atman, gets worked out in the following way. Brahman can be located both in the physical, external world and also in the spiritual and inner world where it is present as Atman, "universal spirit." Now every human being has an undying soul (atman) which, because of samsara, lasts through eternity from life to life; this undying atman is a microcosm of Atman, the universal spirit. By understanding yourself, by coming to know one's own soul, one then arrives at the knowledge of Atman itself; the key to understanding the nature of the one unitary principle of the universe is to see one's (undying) self as identical with that principle: "tat svam asi": That (Atman) is what you are, Svetaketu. (Chandogya Upanishad VI.8.4ff.)

 

Here's the equation: Brahman=Atman=atman. Brahman is the totality of the universe as it is present outside of you;, Atman is the totality of the universe as it is present within you; Brahman is the totality of the world known objectively, Atman is the totality of the world known subjectively. This equation fundamentally underlies the whole of Krishna's teachings concerning dharma in the Baghavad Gita.

 

Shankara is credited with bringing unity to Hindu religion when it was dangerously close to schism, especially between Shaiva and Vaishnava cults. He introduced the Panchayatna form of worship, which recognized five different godheads as part of Hindu religion. This effort effectively brought organization to the religion and also gave the individual devotee freedom of worship. Shankara called the daily struggles of man an illusion (maya), a puppetry (lila) played by God's hands. This is a significant phase in the life of a human soul, but only in a marginal way. The human soul functions in another plane, a second level of truth, vying to rejoin with the Universal Soul. The Absolute, however, is responsible for many transformations of the empirical world though the events of the daily world are deemed as illusions. This transformation depends on the three gunas that govern the events of the world. They are sattva (goodness, virtue), rajas (power, passion) and tamas (dullness, inertia). All earthly events, like the laws of nature, are guided by one of the three gunas or a combination thereof. There should be a balance between them for harmonious workings of the world. Disequilibria will lead to chaos, war, suffering, corruption and destruction. The concept of gunas is well documented in Sri Krishna's rendition of the sermon (Bhagavad-Gita) to Arjuna in the battlefield of Kurukshetra. (Also refer to Kapila's Sankhya philosophy).

 

The Bhagavadgita in the Mahabharata, says: The Supreme Brahman is beyond existence and non-existence. It has hands and feet everywhere, heads, mouths, eyes everywhere, ears everywhere, and it exists enveloping everything. Undivided, it appears as divided among beings; attributeless, it appears to have attributes in association with things. It is the Light of all lights, beyond all darkness, and is situated in the hearts of all beings.

 

[Guest guest]

Jivas are Krsna only, but apparently separate to the extent of the strength of sheathing of the thumb sized effulgence in the Heart. The sheath dissolves with His grace by loss of desires, loss of body sense and finally the loss of Ego. Apparent Big bulls vanish.

 

Dear Barney through you He speaks. He again speaks through others who oppose your view. Know that His work has been completed when Lord addresses you as a Dog, Satan, Fanatic, or Asura through some Jiva, and you as Jiva do not react.

 

Leave it at that. These are examples He keeps as Auspicious. One in many millions that KRSNA speaks of will realize from these examples.

 

[Guest guest]

see also the words that God Barney uses with the people who is discussing with

 

be impartial, god is impartial

[maadhav]

<< he's not your enemy, your "enemy" is who says that your beloved sri vishnu is a projection of his fantasy, that vishnu is maya and when we will be advanced we will forget Him, muslims at least believe in god >>

 

yes, i agree accept the comment about muslims.

they belive in gid, but it has not helped us hindus for 1000 years. we have been slughtered and invaded and raped, etc. by them. so, their believeing in a god as described in koran is dangerous for the world. teh total islam history proves this.

 

any one who has follen in love with a muslim or is born by a muslim may understand this, but will not agree that islam is barbaric. barbarics have no desire to discuss anything rationally.

 

 

[Guest guest]

any one who has follen in love with a muslim

 

deep attraction and rejection are both sides of the same coin... and you are constantly thinking at muslims, be careful of the consequences and write us when you will marry with a nice islamic girl with the blessings of your local mullah

 

 

[barney]

Dear Guest,

 

Let all in this forum speak their mind [WE ARE GODS],

which is clouded by their ego and dellusion. When I say we are all Gods it meant God is within us but if you all say nay than I persume satan has over shadowed your atman. Now that is called mind over matter trying to proof that you are greater than the greatest. You refuse to believe that God resides in all atman and that is your failer to undestand him. As I have said Krishna is what Arjuna believed in and so did Krishana appeared as[faith is mightier tha the sword] believed and so will other forms of God if you believe in. Krishna, Shiva, Sakthi or Murugan be it any name but He is still God and He is in all. Those who fail to understand is considered to be low in their spiritual aspiration. But eventualy they will come to their senses. Atman is like new born baby that need to be nurished as it gains sprituality it grows to be param atman who will help you the mind to reach the highest level in divinity. To me all of you are still babies and of course when babies make mistakes we forgive them for they do not know their what they say.

[barney]

You do not know the difference between atman and body. Body can be of any species but the atman is the same. Know this first if you want to argue about the divine. Every human being has an atman (individual soul - jiva-atman) that resembles the Universal Soul that is temporarily separated from It. It is compared to a fire that is the Supreme Being, from flames of which come the sparks, which are the human souls. However, the human soul has an undiminished desire to join its creator. Ordinary people (Hindus) needed a God they could conceptualize, for worship. To go about their daily lives with devotion, the common folks needed a symbol, a personal God. Upanishads that described Nirguna Brahman as the Universal Soul also offered a Saguna Brahman, who is the antithesis of Nirguna Brahman. Saguna Brahman, who is the manifested form of the World Soul, is full of attributes and character. It is a perfect being, perfect consciousness and perfect freedom (sat-chit-ananda). Hindus have perceived Saguna Brahman as different godheads to be worshipped. As the religion evolved, came into popularity - Shiva, Vishnu and Shakti, all different manifestations of the Supreme Being. Later many more god-figures appeared as avatars and incarnates, all emanating from the above three. A trinity of Gods-Brahma the creator, Vishnu the preserver and Shiva the destroyer-also became popular. Shakti (same as Durga and Kali) became the mother goddess. Imbued with deep devotion, a Hindu could now worship any icon, sometimes in noisy rituals and sometimes in quiet contemplative meditation, which would have been difficult with only an abstract, negative ‘non-entity’ like Nirguna Brahman. But the central belief of Hinduism remained unshaken that all these forms of godheads sprung from one Universal Soul. This makes Hinduism unique in the sense that it is a monotheistic religion with a pantheon of manifested forms of God. The common misconception that Hindu religion is polytheistic is simply untrue.

[Guest guest]

i know very well your style.. people are ignorant, attached to bodily forms, and brahman manifest some characters to make it more easy until them will understand the formless absolute

 

i can preach your gospel with more variety and point of views than you

 

and i have confuted many times these theories and you, instead of answering me, you have choosen to repeat the same lesson again and again

 

so i make you the same question that you were never able to answer:

 

how can god forget to be god if god is omnipotent and CIT, eternally conscious? how can maya (or satan?) who is subordinated to god, illude him?

 

if you explain it all your theory has a logical sense and it is worth to be followed by intelligent people

 

if you do not explain you are simply following a fantasy while the one that you see as your master, sri shankaracharya, declares that the ultimate goal is to worship govinda.. not to merge

[maadhav]

<< you are constantly thinking at muslims, >>

 

lakshmana was constantly thinking of ravana,

and arjun was constantly thining of duryodhan.

 

bush is constantly thinking of ben ladin.

 

[Guest guest]

lakshmana is a vishnu tattva so you do not know what god thinks

 

arjuna is a pure devotee and again you do not know

 

bush was thinking constantly at iran and did not see that the real danger was bin laden

 

you are thinking at muslims but the real danger is not muslims

[Guest guest]

respected Mr.Barney,

nice to c a very well written letter of yours.

you have very explained the energies latent within this gross body n the difference between the subtle n gross body which is toatally a sastric statement also.our body is basically made up of 8 elements 5 gross elements(earth,fire,water,ether,air) n 3 subtle elements (mind ,intelligence ,false ego).

definitely we have some latent energies within us but that doesn't necessarily make us GOD.first one has to understand who is god..definition of god?

as defined in SRIMAD BHAGVATAM (1.1.1) janmady asya yatah..... God is one from whom everything emanates.and next thing is that God is the supreme proprieter,enjoyer of all that is.(we r not).

we r qualitatively same as He but difference is in quantity e.g,drop of water from a sea is same in quality but not in quantity.

and moreover if one has to know about God n about spiritual matters you need to accept some authority who has already realized the Truth just like you do for your college studies you hear from a prof. who already knows the subject.then you will get the proper knowledge.

 

thank you very much n i ll definitely write you again.

your friend,

vikram.

[maadhav]

<< you are thinking at muslims but the real danger is not muslims >>

 

i see no evidence to believe it.

 

you see, i have taken millions of births.

now if i have to take a few more to do what is right,

then i do not mind it. i am not in a hurry to go to heaven when islam is making hell here which your any my children will suffer. but you will not understand it.

 

[Guest guest]

<< you are thinking at muslims but the real danger is not muslims >>

i see no evidence to believe it.

 

-if you are a religious man , to say that god's form is an illusion is much more dangerous... a terrorist can take away your materual life, to believe in brahman as the absolute truth can take away million lifes in the journey to godhead

 

i am not in a hurry to go to heaven when islam is making hell here which your any my children will suffer

 

-if you do not act as a sattvik person you cannot give any good to you and the people you want to help.. if you act to go in vaikunta you bring with you all the people around you.. children included.. otherwise no one will be saved, you, children, india, families and so on even if you are illuded to do some temporary relief

 

and if you care more for politics than religion, why all this hindu stuff? be honest, do not mix things and show yourself as a materialist as you are demonstrating to be

 

better to be a materialist than a false spiritualist, much better

 

but you will not understand it.

-i understand and i give logic answers and objection.. you cannot, so your idea is weak

 

[maadhav]

<< arjuna is a pure devotee and again you do not know >>

 

how you would like to live in a country that has no police and military please? why not? because no police and soldier is a pure devotee in any country. there fore all teh countries are wasting their money and manpower in keepign police and military forces. right?

 

think.

 

[maadhav]

<< so your idea is weak >>

 

if krishna's word is weak, dear saatvik.

 

traiguNya vishhayaa veda

naistriguNyo bhavaarjuna - krishna (gita)

 

 

[Guest guest]

<< arjuna is a pure devotee and again you do not know >>

how you would like to live in a country that has no police and military please?

 

the subject was if arjuna was constantly thinking to duryodana as you constantly think of muslims

 

arjuna is a pure devotee and you cannot know what he's thinking ... simple, you cannot understand him

[Guest guest]

yes your idea is weak... what do you have to do with that verse?

 

 

[Guest guest]

Can someone also please explain the literal meaning of the mantra? This would be extremely helpful to understand the excellent thoughts expressed by "maadhav".

 

Here is the mantra again:

 

OM ha.msaH soham

paramAtma chinmayam

sat chit aananda svarUpam

sah aham brahma

 

[Guest guest]

barney, i agree with your post. i have had practical experience visiting my 'istadeva' once before. this was without trying and yet this concept of an astral body exists. ive never been able to repeat the experience, but it's enough for me to agree with what you've posted up there.

[barney]

Thank you kwaka. You understood what I meant by we are GODs. Many of the memebrs in this forum does not seem to understand what was explained. We extract various kind of oil form various materials. Petrolium from earth and cooing iol from all kinds of fruts and plants. For instance connut oil is extracted form the kernel and the process is very tidies. One needs to remove the kernel from the nut and than it is grated and the milk is squeezed out and boiled to get the pure oil. A human being is the same. The body is the nut and the inner slef is the kernel and to realize the GOD withing body [nut] amn has to go through severl stages before he discovers who he really is. When he has dicovered the self he would instantly realize he is GOD ithin GOD.

 

When you see a baby girl crawling in her fours looking for her mother hoping that the mother would cuddle her in her arms. That baby girl would eventuly grow to become a new mother herself. This are process that a living sould goes through in order to reach the ultimate. But most of us do not for reasons such as looking for the Supreme Being else where and only reading the what is written without really knowing the core meaning of it. The TRUTH is within us but know one seem to care. If we are looking for peace and happiness who could we achieve when we have not realize the truth.

 

Peace and happiness would only be achieved when we realize that we are GODs and that we should behave like one in the manner GOD would. Have compassion for fellow human, share your food with those who do not have, give what you can to those who ask of you, nurse the sick, quench the thirst of of others and always be ready to help when asked for whithout caring for time. Thees are qualities of GOD. Men pray to GOd for all kinds of help without realizing that there are GODs beside him who could help if they have realized who they are. Only than this world would see peace and happiness for all living entities. This does not only apply to HINDUS but the whole human race irrespective of their belief.

 

 

If you read the gospel of Vallalar (1823-05-10 - 1873-01-23) Ramalingam you would understand what I am saying. He livied and proved what he meant by saying GOD is the form of glowing flame which flame is inside all of us.

 

Swami Ramalingam has manifested four ranges of spiritual-physical powers from his deathless body - EBP, UNO, SR Body and SR SAT Powers. His body disappeared in lieu of death, by a process of dematerialization in the concrete presence of the Divine Being of Supreme Grace-Light at his place on 30th January 1874, and that with a pre-announced intention of his to enter into all the physical bodies. In fact, it is meant to lift every man directly into the free spiritual-physical atmosphere of the divine Spirit, by a transcendence at once of all religiosity and its shackling limitations of religious fanaticism, dogmatism, violence and secondary means of approach and seeking of the Divine through priesthood and religious symbols. The Swami strongly advocated the transcendence of all religions, as the only solution, but without emphasizing religious equality or integration or co-operation of religions as an escape. He wanted to bring thereby the direct Rule of the Divine in the earthly life of man. Such a positive approach is made possible now, by directly relying on and utilizing the EBP and UNO power around man. The Swami is carrying it out. EBP power around scientists the world over has intuitively helped them to contribute to the enormous new discoveries since 1974 and they are bound to lead to human unity. Man shall utilize the same power to transcend religious barriers in order to feel the true spiritual love and brotherhood for each other as world citizens.

 

If one can learn to dematerialize one's body he is united with the original source. Dying and the soul living the body is the natural process of people who have yet to reach the highest level of divinity [untiy with GOD]. But if one can dematerialize when he is still alive that is the highest level of acheivement aof man becoming GOD in spirit.

 

 

OM NAMA SHIVAYA.

[Bhagwati]

Can someone also please explain the literal meaning of the mantra? This would be extremely helpful to understand the excellent thoughts expressed by "maadhav".

 

Here is the mantra again:

 

OM ha.msaH soham

paramAtma chinmayam

sat chit aananda svarUpam

sah aham brahma

[Guest guest]

The body is the nut and the inner slef is the kernel and to realize the GOD withing body [nut] amn has to go through severl stages before he discovers who he really is***

 

If God is so ignorant as to realize he's god after 'several stages', then he couldn't be god, could he? All vedic scriptures and acharyas, including advaitins, declare that god is omnipotent, all-knowing and so on. So the very idea that God would need to go through several stages to realize his supreme status is absurd.

 

It makes god powerless and ignorant, thus going against the veda. You'd better give up neo-vedanta of vivek, RK and get back to the basics. You have a long way to go. Instead of parroting neo-vedanta that 'we are all gods' etc., why don't you think and understand why we are NOT god for obvious reasons?

 

He livied and proved what he meant by saying GOD is the form of glowing flame which flame is inside all of us.***

 

That itself is proof that God and man are distinct. The word 'inside' shows that God is the substratum and ever distinct from man.

 

Peace and happiness would only be achieved when we realize that we are GODs and that we should behave like one in the manner GOD would.***

 

Sure Barney, you are happy that despite being god, you cannot communicate directly and have to connect to the internet and post on this website. God is so bored he's posting on hindu-religion.net. You must be happy acting like god...god posts on the net all the time!

[barney]

that's your karma. You cannot realize the TRUTH that has been revealed by saints and sages in past but that's not your fault bt your past karma. Yes, it's all in the game and so shall it be. Yes, GOD's of the last three yugas had powers beyond imagination and with a blink of an eye you would be burnt to ashes. But Gods in this yuga[age of kali] have their powers and confined to this mortal body waiting to be shade when the curse if lifted. When the karma is exhausted we will return to our spiritual form and that is where our power will return. But, it's a pity you have yet to learn the truth and so you would be in bondage for the next xouple of births trapped in this material body.

 

Hope you will realize sooner than the time frame otherwise it's self exile for you.

[Guest guest]

I don't think Barney has attained full realization and has totally conquered desire, aham, attachments, etc. Once an atman can do that, only then can one truly realize that the atman is nothing but God. "Tat tvam asi". The idea that this is so easy to achieve is erroneous.

 

I respectfully say that it's Bhimasena who should be studying more. Mocking another person in this way shows that you get emotional. But total detachment is a step on the way to realization.

[Guest guest]

WHAT?!?!?!NOOO we are not God too,only demons can say such a thing and those persons will be going to hell,good trip man.