World War 3 Began Today... God Help Us

[suryaz]

 

Originally posted by leyh:

My point exactly.

 

Humm not so “exactly” Leyh

 

Leyh: “However, I feel that in fighting these demons, a Krsna conscious person should be doing it on the spiritual and not the material platform”.

 

The war against terrorism transcends nationalism, politics, and religions that safeguard the notion of freedom and sustain the notion of freedom in choice making (and you have to remember freedom in choice making is ultimately correlated to the jiva; it is not essentially of maha-maya). At least that Leyh (even if choices are misdirected at time, at leas that freedom must be there).

 

Terrorism impinges on the jiva’s innate freedom. Its culminative expression is designed to force people into becoming a slave to religion as opposed to becoming the lover of religion. Such slavery is worse than anything else. Why? Because it transforms that which should be bhakti into slavery. That is the fundamental issue here. That is why the lover of God (regardless as to what religious religious denomination, nationality, or political party he/she belongs to) opposes this terrorism, this fanaticism.

 

Moreover, I do not know what you are hearing in Singapore. Certainly in Australia everybody knows this is not a nationalist, country or political thing. It is not a nation-to-nation war, political party-to-political party war. One’s next-door neighbour could be the next suicide terrorist (depending on his type and degree of fanaticism in beliefs). The war is about a type of fanaticism that takes away free choice and free choice is a must if bhakti – regardless as to the denomination- is to survive.

 

Terrorist networks have planned these attacks for many years previous to their orchestration. These fanatics can be born in and hold citizenship of any country (and they do). In fact the more diverse their nationality, the better it is for the mobilisation of the terrorist networks and their attacks freedom (a fundamental issue if bhakit is the persist).

 

This is not a new thing (just look at history. Our own history too. Most of us in our own movement during the early 1980’s experienced something of this; to a much lesser degree no doubt; but certainly some elements were there. It cannot be denied).

 

In the present Islamic terrorist picture, now they have built up very strong networks world-wide (in terms of qualified men, financial support and arsenal bases etc. - Oh and they would love to have a whole nation on their side too). So much so that these terrorists now feel powerful enough tolaunch attack on a greater scale in the west than they have done so before, - but hey! Leyh, they might strike just as hard in Singapore tomorrow. It is not a thing that just started today, they have conspired for this.

 

Leyh: “Thus, a Krsna Conscious person would dedicate the fight against these demons to Krsna and not to the country or political party.”

 

Krishna Consciousness or no Krishna Consciousness the terrorist issue is not a nationalist thing; nor is it of “country or political party.” It is an attack on freedom, and freedom in choice making is original to the jiva not the body. Moreover freedom in choice making is one of the most essential parts of bhakit. Without it how can there be bhakit? Now you tell me that.

 

 

[This message has been edited by suryaz (edited 09-16-2001).]

[jijaji]

Where is there any question of not fighting? We have been attacked with much loss of life to innocent citizens. It is the DUTY of the Govt. to protect us.

WE are defending ourselves from terrorist fanatics!

Does anyone here have a problem with that..? If you do please understand that if we don't do something NOW we will see increased terrorist strikes on US soil. If strikes increase our infrastructure get's torn down with more loss of life, simple as that. We have to DEFEND ourselves and especially our children from a horrid future. Yes our Devotion to God should must go on as well, but certainly Krishna himself was never one to encourage walking away from a needed war.

 

jijaji

 

------------------

STAND AND FIGHT

 

[This message has been edited by jijaji (edited 09-16-2001).]

[Caitanyachandra]

Bush as had more than enuff time to safeguard the Pentagon from Clint's adminstration. There is no excuse for such an Embarrasing attack such as what happened on Tuesday the 11th.

 

Anyway, the more subtle happenings. Bush 1 had problems in Middle East. 8 years of Clinton with no solutions. Bush 2 now sends an amary into Afghanistan. I have no heard anything from the VicePrez yet. I have no heard India voice yet. Or CHINA's. This all confusion points to a large conspiracy!...

[Caitanyachandra]

INfo on star wars from Reagons admin?

[Caitanyachandra]

hunt em down!

[jijaji]

Bush 'will still visit' China

September 14, 2001 Posted: 1:05 AM EDT (0505 GMT)

 

Bouquets have been left outside the US Embassy in Beijing

 

By CNN's Jaime Florcruz

 

BEIJING, China -- China's officialdom is never known for giving prompt public reaction to breaking news. This week has been a rare exception.

 

About four hours after terrorists attacked New York and Washington on Tuesday, President Jiang Zemin sent a message to President George W. Bush expressing sympathy and professing opposition to all forms of terrorism.

 

A day later, in a phone call with Bush, Jiang again offered help for rescue efforts and stronger cooperation against terrorism. Jiang reportedly told Bush that China strongly condemned the attacks, which "not only brought about a disaster to the U.S. people but also a challenge to the world".

 

Jiang also said China was "ready to strengthen dialogue and cooperation" with the U.S. and the international community against "all manner of terrorist violence."

 

Jiang's gesture is noteworthy. Less than six months ago, Beijing was demanding an apology from the Americans over the mid-air collision of a U.S. spy plane and a Chinese fighter plane.

 

Finger-pointing over the downing of the EP-3 plane, detention of its American crew, and the disappearance of a PLA fighter pilot, dragged Sino-U.S. relations to a new low.

 

The perceived American arrogance angered many Chinese who were still simmering over the bombing of the Chinese embassy in Belgrade by US-led NATO forces in 1999.

 

Chinese officials now have compelling reasons to worry about terrorist threats. They are preparing to host the APEC's annual summit meeting, scheduled for October 20-21 in Shanghai. With several heads of state, including Bush, expected to attend, security is a top priority.

 

A top Chinese official told Reuters news agency on Thursday that Bush will still attend the summit of Asia-Pacific leaders in Shanghai despite the catastrophic terror attacks on the United States.

 

[Tarun]

Anangaji: Both PrabhupAd & ZrIdhardev quoted Hitler.

You have some problem with them?

I read CC aloud & chant HarernAm daily. That's my medication.

You believe in drug companies and psychiatrists.

They'll provide you yours.

[jijaji]

Originally posted by Caitanyachandra:

 

I have no heard anything from the VicePrez

yet. I have no heard India voice yet. Or CHINA's. This all confusion points to a large conspiracy!...

US Says Terrorists Face 'Full Wrath'

 

By TOM RAUM

Associated Press Writer

Cheney on 'Meet the Press'

AP/Alex Wong [19K]

--

 

 

WASHINGTON (AP) — Vice President Dick Cheney said Sunday that he has no doubt Osama bin Laden was involved in the suicide hijack attacks on the United States and warned that those who harbor terrorists face ``the full wrath of the United States.''

 

Cheney singled out Afghanistan, where the exiled Saudi dissident is believed to operate, as a possible U.S. target.

 

> I'll search for India's responce!

 

jijaji

 

 

------------------

STAND AND FIGHT

 

[This message has been edited by jijaji (edited 09-16-2001).]

[jijaji]

India offers help to US against Osama

 

 

By Jawed Naqvi

 

NEW DELHI, Sept 14: India on Friday offered all out support to the United States to hunt Osama Bin Laden in Afghanistan but hastened to caution its own people against a communal fallout at home from the arriving military campaign.

 

Prime Minister Atal Behari Vajpayee said in a televised address to the nation that a military solution was needed to root out the scourge of terrorism from the world and offered all support to the United States in this endeavour. However, Vajpayee did not categorically spell out the offer of military bases in India for the US campaign.

 

That offer came in an interview to the Times of India by Minister of External Affairs and Defence Jaswant Singh.

 

"There have been contacts at all political, executive and operational levels about this," Singh said in the interview published on Friday. Asked if this meant India would agree to provide logistical help or a staging ground for a US military operation, Singh replied with an emphatic "Yes", the newspaper said.

 

In a day of rapid developments the US embassy was the centre of hectic activity. US Ambassador Robert Blackwill presented his credentials to President K.R. Narayanan and later called off his proposed visit to Washington. Prime Minister Atal Behari Vajpayee officially called off his visit to New York and the external affairs minister aborted his travel to France.

 

Blackwill said he had postponed his trip to Washington to "remain here to work with my Indian colleagues to counter the terrorist scourge".

 

The ambassador said in a brief speech before TV cameras that he was meeting all senior ministers to ascertain the possibilities of cooperating in the evolving alliance against terrorism. He commented obliquely on the recent events in Kashmir in which a little known militant group has threatened to harm women who did not observe the strict rules of Hijab.

 

"The world must not be cowed by terrorists; neither the terrorists who hijack planes filled with innocent people, nor those who threaten to shoot or maim women and girls who do not dress in a particular way. Such activities are cowardly, are reprehensible and are barbaric," Blackwill said in apparent reference to the Lashkar-i-Jabbar group's recent threats in Kashmir.

 

Vajpayee said harsh economic decisions needed to be taken in the coming months to counter the impact of the deadly terror attacks on the United States.

 

He said there would be less demand for Indian exports and foreign direct investment flows would shrink due to 'heightened uncertainties'. "For reasons such as these, we have to redouble our efforts, we have to prepare ourselves for harsh measures in the coming months," Vajpayee said.

 

He cautioned against the targeting of Muslims in the pursuit of terrorists. "If we target the people who may happen to belong to the same religion as the one professed by the terrorists, we will be falling into their trap," he said.

 

A New York Post report quoted senior US officials as saying the attack on Afghanistan may happen from Russian bases in the former Soviet Republics and from inside Afghanistan, from the areas controlled by the Northern Alliance.

 

[amanpeter]

Originally posted by leyh:

It is written in the Srimad Bhagavatam (11.5.41):

 

"Every human being born in this world is immediately indebted to the demigods,the great sages,ordinary living entities,the family,society,and so on.But a person who surrenders unto the lotus feet of the Lord and engages fully in His service is no longer indebted to anyone. In other words,he has no obligations to fulfil except executing devotional service."

 

Maybe fighting those demonic terrorists for Krsna (and not for America or any other country or political party) should be the attitude of a Krsna Conscious person.

 

 

Haribol, leyh! In the beginning, we tend to think that our Krsna conciousness depends on us, as if it were some mental exercise. Actually, it is more of an awakening through the agency of His Divine Grace. Believing we are in control leads us to view both ourselves and others in a critical light, since we're thinking how much better we could all do.

 

There is a great need at this time to unite for the coming battles and this means forging a strong sense of common identity as us vs. them; not the way most of us, as devotees, would prefer to see things. Please do not think that those such as Bhuta-bhavana das are not devotees or acting in anything other than Krsna conciousness. They are simply doing the needful. That is our duty and it must be done right now! No time for questioning our motives or contemplating philosophical points.

 

Soldiers train for these times and are ready to take charge. While we still have the luxury of communicating together here on these forums, it would be good to bear that in mind and try to understand the seriousness of all this. Firm resolve will be necessary and faith in ourselves as well as each other must be strongly fixed. If that requires vilifying the `enemy`, so be it.

 

Try to imagine the quality of faith and surrender, however misguided, that those terrorist `martyrs` must have---we must have more! Please know prabhus, though this probably appears overdramatic, that you are my only family at this time and my heart is with you, whatever happens. valaya

 

------------------

amanpeter@hotmail.com

 

[This message has been edited by amanpeter (edited 09-16-2001).]

[amanpeter]

Prabhus, this was a reply from me to Tarun in the World Review section, but I thought it relevant to this discussion also:

 

War has been declared and that demands a certain united focus. When those very freedoms that allow us to think, feel and express our individual views are threatened as they are now, we must voluntarily set aside that individuality and unite as one concerted force on all levels.

 

This struggle will undoubtedly require spiritual, mental and physical discipline from all of us for what may be an extended time to come. Make no mistake, although all this might seem somewhat surreal for many, we are fighting for our very lives, now and in the future. It will inevitably become much worse, I'm afraid.

Best to face this ugly reality, bring ourselves together in every sense of the word, and get it over with as quickly as possible. War brings it's own set of rules that must be understood and respected by all. valaya

[jijaji]

Gadhafi says US has right to take revenge

 

 

 

 

CAIRO: In a rare show of support for the United States, Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi said Sunday America had the right to take revenge for the terror attacks on New York and

Washington.

 

"The USA has the right to take revenge, but will this put an end to the problem?" he said on Libyan TV. "America is a superpower that can erase the world in one day. It can hit Afghanistan."

 

But Gadhafi added, "There is nothing in Afghanistan," and if the United States occupies Afghanistan, "it will not be in its interests."

 

Libya has been at odds with Washington over U.S. accusations that it supports terrorism. But after the attacks last Tuesday, Gadhafi expressed his condemnation of the devastation and support for the American victims.

 

On Sunday, he said the nations of the world have to get together and "determine the reasons" why terrorism develops.

 

Gadhafi urged Libyans to follow the example of Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat and donate blood for the victims of the attacks.

 

"The American people are in need of blood. Give your blood," he said.

 

[Gauracandra]

Its scary when even Gadhafi says this is wrong. I also heard he said that he thought the U.S. would soon dissolve like the former Soviet Union, into individual states running around. That guys got quite the imagination. Pretty silly thinking on his part. But if he is saying take revenge against Afganisthan then maybe he is the one responsible (I'm just being conspiratorial). Perhaps its best just to blast away at them all.

 

Gauracandra

[dasanudas]

Originally posted by amanpeter:

Haribol, leyh! In the beginning, we tend to think that our Krsna conciousness depends on us, as if it were some mental exercise. Actually, it is more of an awakening through the agency of His Divine Grace. Believing we are in control leads us to view both ourselves and others in a critical light, since we're thinking how much better we could all do.

 

There is a great need at this time to unite for the coming battles and this means forging a strong sense of common identity as us vs. them; not the way most of us, as devotees, would prefer to see things. Please do not think that those such as Bhuta-bhavana das are not devotees or acting in anything other than Krsna conciousness. They are simply doing the needful. That is our duty and it must be done right now! No time for questioning our motives or contemplating philosophical points.

 

Soldiers train for these times and are ready to take charge. While we still have the luxury of communicating together here on these forums, it would be good to bear that in mind and try to understand the seriousness of all this. Firm resolve will be necessary and faith in ourselves as well as each other must be strongly fixed. If that requires vilifying the `enemy`, so be it.

 

Try to imagine the quality of faith and surrender, however misguided, that those terrorist `martyrs` must have---we must have more! Please know prabhus, though this probably appears overdramatic, that you are my only family at this time and my heart is with you, whatever happens. valaya

 

 

Once again I find myself agreeing with Valaya in his perspectives here not that what Leyh is saying doesn't hold Truth. It's just that the overwhelming majority of the world views our predicament has moved from diplomatic and political solutions of these ever-occurring problems to the need for action.

We all, as vaisnavas like peaceful solutions and truly abhorr war and killing, our life is the salvation Army of Sankirtan and if that could be effective in bringing a change to the whole planet we're ready to dance at any given moment, instead of spending billions of dollars and sacrificing lives in the lesser option.

I invite Lord Chaitanya to return if He wishes, to scoop up everyone in his prophesized campaign.But of course once again we may not recognize Him or His preferred medium, but I certainly hope we will by Their Grace.

Before the inevitable at Kuruksetra, Krsna gave so many chances to the deluded demoniac players, still they persisted against perfect council and righteous direction, Krsna could have prevented and harmonized it then, and He can now, and if He excercises divine intervention I'm sure He has the ability to swing every heart on this planet to see His way. Otherwise it will play out accordingly, He is the Supreme Director and we ain't seen nothing at the movies yet. Krsnas glory is usually illuminated against a dark backdrop.Jesus, Krsna, Rama, Even Mahaprabhu to some degree.

Terrorising fanatical crimes appear infinitely worse than those that set the stage for Kuruksetra. We are dealing with absolute insanity these days. What was undressing a chaste women in the days of righteous kings, today is throwing acid into a womens face because she dares to show it. If anything, on the scales of value, there is cause for a war on that single issue alone. What to speak of incinerating thousands of innocent civilians, women, children and loved ones into a pulverrized mass of stinking chemicals in one fell swoop. This is the pits of dispicable cowardness. And it truly should be obliterated from the face of this earth.

I've also become of the mind that there must be a common will and determination to fight this common enemy. Not that I can't see the peaceful solution, on the contrary I've espoused it with all my heart and soul since Viet Nam, in my Guru Maharajs teachings 'to see the environment as friendly'.

We despise war as much as we are sickened by this disease of hatred afflicting these cursed souls who have misused their freewill to the ultimate extreme. Drastic crimes need drastic corrections. I think if I were in one of these corrupted hearts I would be praying to be put out of my misery. And it seems by their apparent lack of a trace of respect for others lives, that that is the death wish they seem to exhibit.

Now to get back to addressing the point that is that there are some souls prepared to literally lay their life on the line so this horror MAY be erradicated. We don't know for certain where it may raise it's ugly head again, but if at least there is a concerted effort to stem its growth in my book (BGita) it sure beats inaction. If we choose not to partake in this course of action like Uddhava that's fine, but I think we should be fully supportive in whatever capacity we have, wishing those well who are prepared to take on this dirty work. And I don't think the people who've taken this job on board need their conviction undermined or erroded considering the beast they are facing. Perhaps tempered with very clear consciousness so that sobriety and certainty are assured in the duty they are called to do. In the words of the bible "Be ye wise as serpents." For the hour is at hand.

Considering the overkill we've wittnessed in the last week your response is goswami prabhu. Even tho i suppose everyone in a sense is a victim I find it hard to see those guys as Martyrs. More like the passengers and people in the two Towers qualify for that distinction.

I just realized The Lord of The Rings. (Inc Two Towers) is due for a timely release shortly. I just saw a preview of it and it looks quite profound.

This was a hurried response please forgive any errors or offence I may have committed.

Hopefully, your aspiring servant

MKdas

[dasanudas]

This whole event that is now coming to pass is just a more tangible and visible picture of what Srila Bhaktisiddanta Saraswati Thakur declared as the all-out Totalitarian War against Maya. And how each devotee chooses to fight that is their own personal preference. I wish them all victory in conquering the enemy, however they perceive it.

May all obsticles on the battlefield be removed from each souls journey to divinity.

[JRdd]

I also have been impressed with Valaya's perspectives, and think of him as a moral comander in an army. Great views too, Mr das, solidly said, with accolades to the shastric, far more approriate here than the merely sattvic (although that is included in anything of right). Today I was with five women, we were writing and sharing poems (coincidentally none of us have television, thought I was the last of the oddballs), and of course at the end the discussion came up, that is on everyone's minds now. And they were unanimous in their disappointment at a poll taken Tuesday morning in Mt Shasta claiming that 70 percent of those polled were in favor of full retaliation. I did not know what to say in the face of such taken-for-granted pacifism. I would have had to provide much background, including my own life and beliefs in pacifism, and then the whole Vedic viewpoint, or at least that is the way it seemed to me, and this was a short chat before we dispersed. I was suprised in turn, to see the adamancy of these good women, who were into like holding the energy, focusing the light, etc. And I have to admit I felt a little wavery in myself \, as their positions spoke to my soul, which is why I am bringing this up: to reiterate Valaya's point that this must be unified as much as possible, for morale and focus. but like Mr Das I see the different sides of view too, and understand them well.

 

thanks, JR

[dasanudas]

Originally posted by rand0M aXiS:

 

Sikh activists from the Indian Youth Congress hold a rally in the northern industrial Indian city of Ludhiana, September 16, 2001. The activists were demonstrating against the recent terror attacks in the United States, and accused Saudi-born exile Osama bin Laden as the prime suspect in the attacks. REUTERS/ Rajesh Bhambi

 

 

Just saw a flash on the other side of the Indian continent in Calcutta of a bunch of very angry Bengalis burning an efigy of Binny.

I don't have the intelligence at my disposal the U.S Gov. has, but I'm not 100% convinced he's the culprit yet (in this one that is) Does anyone have any more solid evidence yet?

 

[Maitreya]

mr.dasji,

 

I'm convinced it was Osama.Either way he is a good place to start.

 

You know I am really surprised to see people in other lands offer their condolances and support to the US.I thought they all hated us over here.

[suryaz]

The following I found on RISA - It is a bit specialised in content - However, given the attacks in New York last week, it helps show the extremes to which these fanatics extend themselves to the notion of the "other". Regardless as to what the "other" is believed to be. In their own families the "other" is "women" - (it is a gender thing). On a larger scale however, the "other" is any person or persons who will not submit to them.

 

.............................................

 

"Madhu, the government of Afghanistan, is waging a war upon women. Since

the

Taliban took power in 1996, women have had to wear burqua and have been

beaten and stoned in public for not having the proper attire, even if

this

means simply not having the mesh covering in front of their eyes. One

woman

was beaten to death by an angry mob of undamentalists for accidentally

exposing her arm(!) while she was driving. Another was stoned to death

for

trying to leave the country with a man that was not a relative. Women

are

not allowed to work or even go out in public without a male relative;

professional women such as professors, translators, doctors,

lawyers,artists

and writers have been forced from their jobs and restricted to their

homes.

Homes where a woman is present must have their windows painted so that

she

can never be seen by outsiders. They must wear silent shoes so that they

are

never heard. Women live in fear of their lives for the slightest

misbehavior. Because they cannot work, those without male relatives or

husbands are either starving to death or begging in the street, even if

they

hold Ph.D.s. Depression is becoming so widespread that it has reached

emergency levels. There is no way in such an extreme Islamic society to

know

the suicide rate with certainty, but relief workers are estimating that

the

suicide rate among women must be extraordinarily high: those who cannot

find

proper medication and treatment for severe depression and would rather

take

their lives than live in such conditions. At one of the rare hospitals

for

women, a reporter found still, nearly lifeless bodies lying motionless

on

top of beds,wrapped in their burqua, unwilling to speak, eat, or do

anything, but slowly wasting away. Others have gone mad and were seen

crouched in corners,perpetually rocking or crying, most of them in fear.

When what little medication that is left finally runs out, one doctor is

considering leaving these women in front of the president's residence as

a

form of protest. It is at the point where the term "human rights

violations"

has become an understatement. Husbands have the power of life and death

over

their women relatives, especially their wives, but an angry mob has just

as

much right to stone or beat a woman, often to death, for exposing an

inch of

flesh or offending them in the slightest way. Women enjoyed relative

freedom: to work, to dress generally as they wanted, and to drive and

appear

in public alone until only 1996. The rapidity of this transition is the

main

reason for the depression and suicide; Women who were once educators or

doctors or simply used to basic human freedoms are now severely

restricted

and treated as subhuman in the name of right-wing fundamentalist Islam.

It

is not their tradition or culture,' but it is alien to them, and it is

extreme even for those cultures where fundamentalism is the rule.

Everyone

has a right to a tolerable human existence, even if they are women in a

Muslim country.........."

[dasanudas]

Originally posted by Maitreya:

mr.dasji,

 

I'm convinced it was Osama.Either way he is a good place to start.

 

You know I am really surprised to see people in other lands offer their condolances and support to the US.I thought they all hated us over here.

I think deep down inside most civilised people feel a country that has given us Alfred and Mickey Mouse could'nt be all that bad.

 

[amanpeter]

Originally posted by dasanudas:

I think deep down inside most civilised people feel a country that has given us Alfred and Mickey Mouse could'nt be all that bad.

Don't forget `The Three Stooges`! "C'mon, we got terrorists to fight!" nyuck nyuck nyuck

 

 

[dasanudas]

Originally posted by amanpeter:

Don't forget `The Three Stooges`! "C'mon, we got terrorists to fight!" nyuck nyuck nyuck

 

 

What's happen to Arnie, Bruce an Sylvester, Where are they when we need 'em most?

 

 

Actually mate I think it's like there are always elements in all countries that are envious of anyone that stands tall.

But ever since I got m' first Davey Crockett hat, my two musquets and a set a' the only levis in Oz 45 years back it became hamburger heaven to this young grommet and I had nothing but awe and admiration for the U.S. from then on.

There might have been some perception of infallible arrogance from some nations around the world some time back but i think that has shifted somewhat nowadays.

Yeah I've bin hearing some very moving eulogies, some a' the nicest humanity pouring forth from all nations over the past few days. It's a little hopeful, but how sustained it is remains to be seen. Giving honor softens everyones heart if only they could drop their guard and express what they truly feel more often, instead of letting the pressure build up till it erupts. Why do people wait for a funeral before the good stuff emerges?

 

[Guest guest]

 

Sikh activists from the Indian Youth Congress hold a rally in the northern industrial Indian city of Ludhiana, September 16, 2001. The activists were demonstrating against the recent terror attacks in the United States, and accused Saudi-born exile Osama bin Laden as the prime suspect in the attacks. REUTERS/ Rajesh Bhambi

 

 

[leyh]

Originally posted by suryaz:

 

Suryaz:

I'm not saying that the terrorist issue is a nationalist thing; nor is it of “country or political party.” I'm saying that for some people it has become a nationalist thing...the terrorists attacked OUR country and now WE'VE got to hit them back!

 

Of course a Krsna Consciousness person has to do his or her duty in fighting against these demonic terroists...but he/she should never forget that ultimately,he/she does not belong to any nation or political party.We belong to Krsna,and the fight should be for Krsna,against the evil of terrorism,just as Arjuna was instructed by Krsna to fight the battle of Kuruksetra for HIM.

 

 

[Guest guest]

The Laws of Karma

 

Here is an interesting comment by a Brazilian student (a simpleton ‘karmi’) on USA’s present karma. As most of these forums’ members are aware of the meaning of the laws of karma, we hope that some of them may reflect on this present karmic situation.

 

Luv4Islam 9/14/01 5:44 PM

************************

 

CNN using 1991 footage of Palestinians celebrating the invasion of Kuwait

 

Brazil

 

By Márcio A. V. Carvalho

 

All around the world we are subjected to 3 or 4 huge news distributors, and one of them - as you well know—is CNN. Very well, I guess all of you have been seeing (just as I've been) images from this company.

 

In particular, one set of images called my attention: the Palestinians celebrating the bombing, out on the streets, eating some cake and making funny faces for the camera.

 

Well, those images were shot back in 1991. Those are images of Palestinians celebrating the invasion of Kuwait! It's simply unacceptable that a super-power of communications as CNN uses images which do not correspond to the reality in talking about so serious an issue.

 

A teacher of mine, here in Brazil, has videotapes recorded in 1991, with the very same images; he's been sending e-mails to CNN, Globo (the major TV network in Brazil) and newspapers, denouncing what I myself classify as a crime against the public opinion.

 

But now, think for a moment about the impact of such images. Your people are hurt, emotionally fragile, and this kind broadcast have very high possibility of causing waves of anger and rage against Palestinians (and other Muslims). It's simply irresponsible to show images such as those.

 

Finally, I'd like to say that we all regret and condemn all that has happened in the last days; but Nikos has a point here. I really don't want to be misunderstood here, but the truth is that US government had shown no respect for other countries in the last decades.

 

In the 60s and 70s they had helped lots of military coups throughout the world (including Brazil in 64).

Later, with Reagan and Bush Father, the Washington Consensus have been demolishing the bases of our economies, making us more and more dependant (and, many of us, preoccupied with this situation).

 

Your current president quickly made things worse: Kioto Protocol, Star Wars, Colombia Plan, the exchange of rain forest for pieces of external debt, that abandonment of the position of third party in negotiations between IRA and England, and between Palestinians and Israel. All those mistakes in US external politics made your country more hated than before, and, of course, more vulnerable.

 

Listen, I'm NOT justifying the terrorist actions that took place in your country; but it seems to me that, if your leaders had come along another path of thoughts and actions, you wouldn't be suffering what you are now.

 

Best regards, and the hope that everything is resolved for the best of all of us.

 

Márcio A. V. Carvalho

 

State University of Campinas - Brazil