Its a mistake to call Krishna Chaitanya

[melvin]

Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu was born in

Mayapur in the town of Vijayanagara

(Nadia), India, on February 18, 1486,

Anno Domini. During an eclipse, the

Lord was christened by his mother, Sa-

ci devi, as Nimai because he was born

under the Nimba tree. And Pandita, Ni-

mai`s last name since it`s the name of

his grandfather, Pandita Nilambara

Cakravarti, an astrologer who predic-

ted his birth to be auspicious. Gau-

ra-hari, the damsels of Vijayanagara

call this whimsical and foolish boy,

because the Lord sported a golden skin

complexion.

Visvambhara is also Nimai`s other name

and later in his life as Chaitanya

since anyone who went to the Bhara-

tic School were recognized as such.

Lord Chaitanya`s guru was Keshava Bha-

rati, a follower of the Sankaracarya

sect. Thus, it`s correct to call the

Lord Chaitanya Keshava.

It was Keshava Bharata who allowed the

Lord to continue chanting the Hare

Krishna Maha-Mantra because Nimai was

foolish and sentimental about it, even

if he was Vedanta scholar during his

time, and the Lord was criticized and

by his peers and enemies alike since he

did not join in their group study.

In other words, Nimai Pandit never

really liked being called as Krishna

by his followers and devotees, even if

he actually was the Supreme Lord. This

precedent should be given cognizance

by Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu`s follo-

wers if they all wish to follow in his

footsteps.

It`s the surest way to please the Lord

of the Hare Krishna Movement. Or else,

His Divine Grace won`t dwell and live

with us who desire to be always in his

association.

 

[This message has been edited by melvin (edited 09-28-2001).]

[paul108]

This topic is wonderful, and I would love if it could be elaborated. The idea that Krishna would regard His devotees' position as superior to His own is very intriguing, but as of yet incomprehensible to me.

 

My introduction to Krishna consciousness came abruptly by way of Bhagavad-gita As It Is together with a painting of Krsna (or was it that I was the painting and He was looking at me?) and a lot of causeless mercy, very soon after I had purchased these spiritual gems. It dovetailed my "God" idea with Him, and introduced to me the concept "Supreme Personality of Godhead." (All glories to Srila Prabhupada!) However my exposure to Lord Caitanya is happening much more gradually, only so much as I hear of Him from His devotees. (Also from a few sneak-peaks in Sri Caitanya Caritamrita; I've only read up to the 4th Canto in Srimad Bhagavatam.) Because Srila Prabhupada introduced me to Sri Krishna, I accepted his declaration of Lord Caitanya's Divine and supremely merciful nature, but I still fail to comprehend Him at all. If anyone has any understanding about Lord Gauranga, please be merciful to me.

 

 

[Tarun]

Good point Melvin. For example your name, Melvin.

Is that your real name?

Are you familiar with your namesakes?

I/we've been conditioned to think of a particular Melvin...

So as soon as we hear that name we might wonder...

How would a kIrtan led by Melvin sound?

How 'bout a GItA lecture given by Melvin?

Melvin's Vedik Tape Ministry?

Yes, I've heard that Our MahAprabhu would cover his ears & pray to ViSNu whenever someone would address Him as God.

 

[melvin]

Namaste dear reactors, Tarun and Paul.

 

Our source for this discussion is the

book: Teachings of Lord Chaitanya,1987

Phil. Edition, which was handed over

to me from my childhood friend, Gaura-

sundara das(George Martinez)who left

for the USA as an immigrant in the ear-

ly `90s. I have read it, authored by

His Divine Grace, from cover to cover,

that I could not track anymore how many

times I`ve gone over it. And everytime

I open Lord Chaitanya`s book, in what-

ever page it`s convenient for me in my

search for the Absolute Truth, there`s

always, I feel, a fresh message which

comes to mind after having read a por-

tion of this wonderful book`s contents.

 

How I was able to assimilate Lord Chai-

tanya`s teachings, with no one to act

as my interpreter and guide in unders-

tanding its sublime message is a myste-

ry, considering that I had no idea what

Hindu religion is all about.

 

All I know is that I was born on Nov. 3,

1957 in the city of Cebu, Philippines.

My parents christened me the name of

Melvin Garces Mabalay. There even this

incident that the Catholic priest hesi-

tated to baptize me if I won`t carry the

a Christian name. Thus, I earned the

name of Melvin Vicente and Garces since

the latter is my mother`s(Juliana)maiden

name. I have asked my father-physician,

Mario Cochiengco Mabalay, Sr., why gave

me the name Melvin. His reason is that

it carried the letter M and that our el-

dest sibling, Mae, and my elder brother,

Mario Jr., all carried the letter M;that

according to my father, He chose Melvin

because he was very fond of reading nov-

els and he got my name from a certain

character portrayed in those books.

 

I have been practicing catholicism all

my life. I studied in a catholic school,

Colegio del Sto. Nino, run by priests

of the Augustinian Order, until they

kicked me out for bad conduct in my 2nd

year high-school. As a Catholic, I wor-

ship the Sr. Sto. Nino of Cebu and I

feel that, as the Patron Saint of Cebu,

the Holy Child of Jesus is Lord Govinda

Himself. If the truth is in the pudding

instead of the icing, then try to visit

His shrine,the Basilica del Sto. Nino,

located on the island of Cebu, Philip-

pines when we celebrate His birthday in

January, followed later by a mardi-gras

called The Sinulog.

 

It was here that led me to search for

Krishna, the Sr. Sto. Nino`s own Image.

That`s why I got interested in reading

the books authored by His Divine Grace,

in order to know more about this wonder-

ful and amazing GodChild. As I embarked

on the journey, of going home, back to

Godhead, it was this episode in time,

year 1987, that I started to read,write,

and produced articles about Krishna for

publication in The Freeman, a local dai-

ly newspaper in Cebu City since 1919,

that I used Naradadeva Bhagavan as my

pen name after the editor, Mr. Juanito V.

Jabat, gave me a space to write my views

entitled, " A Grain of Devotion," I had

no motive to become a servant or guru or

something when I started the column be-

cause all I wanted was for my fellow Ca-

tholic Cebuanos to be aware of the tran-

scendental messages of the Krishna Cons-

ciousness Movement that was taking place

in our midst. That I wanted the Filipino

to know a little of the Hindu religion

and the eternal philosophical truths it

carries because it seemed the Catholic

organization, for 480 years, have wanted

us to accept Christianity as if she was

the only religion that could make a fol-

lower, like me, go to heaven. Otherwise,

I would go to hell, including my family,

if I insist in believing in Karma and

the philosophy of Reincarnation, and

most of all, in the Krishna Sankirtana

Yazna initiated by Lord Chaitanya Maha-

prabhu, and later sustained by those

great men who believed in his Mission:

TO INUNDATE THE WHOLE WORLD WITH GOD

CONSCIOUSNESS, HIS LITERATURES, MUSIC,

DANCE, MOVES, BOOKS, PRASADAM, ETC.

 

Is that therefore a BAD thing if I go on

chanting and glorifying God`s holy names:

Hare Krishna Hare Krishna, even when I

still attend the Sunday mass with my fa-

mily inside the Church performed by the

Parish priest, while at the same praising

and calling God`s name, Lord Jesus Christ?

 

You be the judge...

 

 

 

[This message has been edited by melvin (edited 09-29-2001).]

[Yashoda dd]

Sad-Anga Saranagati

"Sri-Krsna-Caitanya Prabhu Jive Doya Kori"

 

by Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura:

 

sri krsna caitanya prabhu jive doya kori'

sva-parsada sviya dhama saha avatari'

 

(Sri Krishna Caitanya Prabhu, bringing mercy for all the living beings, descended with His own divine abode and personal associates."

 

*********

 

It is true Lord Caitanya never liked to be called "Lord Krishna". He would put his palms on his ears.

 

It does not mean we should forget who He really is: Sri Krishna and Srimati Radharani in one body.

[dasanudas]

Dear Melvin, rather than be the judge I'll just commend you in propagating the Holy Name of Sri Krsna Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, this can bring nothing but good to the world if done sincerely, without speculation. And with the same motive as all our predesessor acharyas ie. To spread love and understanding of God unto others, to give relief to those struggling in a world of confusion. If you can shed a little light in anyones' consciousness, and help to break down sectarian or religious barriers founded on the bodily platform, you are doing a service to God and humanity, and it is to your credit that Gauranga utilize you as His vehicle, to bridge the difference in faith by focusing on the common threads of all, not emphasizing the differences that divide one against the other.

I'm curious to know what sort of response you draw to your writing contributions?

Personally I feel more of such dispensation should be practiced by Mahaprabhus devotional community to spread his message of mercy to every heart, for in Him lies the key to Absolute harmony. Rather than conflicting amongst ourselves if we could galvenize the glorious gift He has bestowed upon us to spread the waves of Krsna Consciousness far and wide, there would be far less misery and suffering all round. There are so many out there in need of relief and each small drop of His divine glories can bring infinite nourishment to the whole environment. Devotional disspensation is it's own sweet reward.

Srila Sridhara Maharaj would simply say,

'Give and get." For the more we try to give what we have in our hand the more Krsna will increase our capacity.

You give all your brightness away and it only makes you brighter.

[stonehearted]

Melvin, I want to join dasanudas in congratulating and thanking you for being so inspired by Lord Chaitanya's teachings that you have been trying to share the message of the sankirtan movement with your neighbors. By sincerely following Lord Chaitanya Mahaprabhu's request, you have given them the greatest gift, and you will be rewarded accordingly. I'm confident that your efforts have been noted by Sriman Mahaprabhuand Nityananda Prabhu, as well as Bhaktivinoda Thakur, Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakur, Srila Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, and Srila B. R. Shridaradeva Goswami.

 

We should all be grateful enough for the example you have set to follow suit.

 

Babhru das

[Tarun]

Babhru: r u the same Babhru who spoke to Bhadri-Narayan in Hawaii?

Mel: YazodA dd mentioned MahAprabhu's palms covering His ears.

For this same reason Miami/Hialeah named their Highway Palm-etto.

Palmetto Expressway is named after MahAprabhu's Palms.

When traffic gets heavy, all the noise & music blasting...

It's only right that we should cover our ears. Thus Palm-etto.

But almost no one knows this, because He's the Hidden AvatAr.

 

[melvin]

Indeed I should perhaps let the Maha-

Prabhus do the evangelizing in bring-

ing back the people home, back to God.

I`m so glad you have come to offer to

get the job done in my behalf, for I

feel it`s my time to move to another

chapter in this book of life where I

could focus more in what I`ve been

destined by God to do in my present

life: Improve my skill in practicing

the art of medicine. That way, I`d

be able to heal as many as possible

those who are considered to be very

ill. Hence, if I could only find a

cure for cancer, HIV/Aids, or poverty

that leads to hunger and malnutrition,

then maybe, just maybe I could say to

myself that I`ve finally conquered

the very stumbling block I have crea-

ted for myself to succeed in life:

PRIDE.

I do hope the Lord in His divine mercy,

will forgive this egotistic-I and me. I

am therefore very sorry if I`ve caused

everybody who came to discuss with me

about anything under Krishna some em-

barrassment regarding what I may have

previously written.

 

[This message has been edited by melvin (edited 10-01-2001).]

[Tarun]

Actually yo should switch your thread title around to read:

It's a Mistake to Call Caitanya "KRSNa"

Otherwize His RAdhAdasyam mood will be disturbed.

Medicine nowadays means expertise in Homeopathy, Acupuncture, Ayurveda, Chiropracter, Kinesiology, Siddha.

People are so sick they'll generally come to you with many problems all at once.

Will you be able to stomach it/them? (no pun intended)

[melvin]

The branches of medicine,if it was a

banyan tree, is entertwined and rela-

ted, that one who studies it doesn`t

know just where each have taken root,

whether upwards or downwards, side-

wards and backwards, or whatever that

makes a medical student dreamed of

being able to perch on one of its

branches after having succeeded in

climbing the trunk of the banyan tree

(medical board exams) itself.

There are so many branches of medicine

that I can`t seem to make a choice of

what particular branch I should build

my future nest on. All I know is that

I`m a certified family physician, ha-

ving earned it in 1995 after attending

so many lectures and symposiums where

topics, from skin diseases to erectile

dysfunction, were discussed.

To heal therefore a person with cancer

is also part and parcel of Krishna

consciousness, similar to saktyavesa-

avatar, Jesus Christ, who healed a man

with Hansen`s disease, a malady known

to everyone as leprosy. In other words,

we all need a doctor, whom we could

trust to heal our aching muscles and

ligaments; do caesarean sections to de-

liver a baby which can`t be delivered

vaginally; manage a severely dehydrated

patient sick with dysentery by giving

intravenous fluids so he won`t die of

electrolyte imbalance; prescribing and

giving intramuscular antibiotics to a

patient suspected to have a sexually

transmitted disease, like syphillis or

gonorrhea; and providing alternative

forms of treatment like YOGA to heal a

disturbed mind addicted to alcohol, co-

caine, diazepams, and amphetamines.

If anybody thinks the job of a family

physician is easy, then I would suggest

to everyone to study medicine and try

to pass four years of a pre-med course,

another four years of proper-med, one

year post-graduate, six months of rural

work, and another six months preparing

for the board exams. If any teacher of

God can do that and still retain his

sanity in this chaotic, racist world,

then you`ve got it made.

 

Hey, anyone out there who is Guru wants

to become a physician? Then follow Jesus`

way because the Lord has seen the truth

(Krishna) who can give us eternal life.

 

[valaya]

Dear Dr. Melvin, Thank you for speaking so honestly from the heart about your personal life and thoughts. The root of all dis-ease in this world is our separation from God. For a devotee of Krsna, this means disconnection from Srimati Radharani who is the personification of devotional service.

 

It is obvious that you have been blessed by His Divine Grace and you should therefore know that you'll carry that blessing wherever you go to whoever you're with, always. Not everyone associated with Lord Caitanya's sankirtan movement is destined to become a preacher in their present lifetime. That does not mean they won't have a positive transcendental influence on others.

 

All that is asked from us is to take the Holy Names as our life and soul. That means to accept them as non-different from our Eternal Beloved and learn to take full shelter emotionally through constant chanting.

 

This need not be done only on japa mala beads or even out loud. One can repeat certain names to oneself, attentively or not, quite easily. In fact, this can become quite addictive. Leaning on the Holy Names will cause false pride and so many other negative things in our hearts to simply evaporate in a very short time.

 

The names I suggest are: Nitai (Prabhu Nityananda), Nimai (Lord Caitanya), Radha and Krsna. You can also chant Jesus, if you feel so inclined. I've found it best though to concentrate on only one of the above two-syllable names at a time, repeating it over and over again, trying (if possible) to feel oneself meek and humble by admitting complete helplessness, here in this world all alone.

 

There seems to be a natural `two-syllable` rhythm to our activities, such as walking left foot then right foot or breathing in and out, which this chanting can easily be synchronized with. After awhile you will probably find yourself attached to one name/personality in particular and repetition will become spontaneous.

 

At first concentration will most likely come and go as you attend to your daily work routine, but soon you'll see how focusing on the Names can help accomplish whatever the task at hand is. Rather than attempting to drift off into some `spiritual` dreamland, this is an active meditation which brings Krsna and all His potencies to bear right here and now. My own experience has taught me that I simply am unable to function properly without Him/Her in the form of their Holy Names. Now the process is automatic for me, at least to some extent.

 

I guess what I'm saying, prabhu, is that there's no need to believe you must choose to neglect medicine for devotion, indeed the two can be extremely complimentary. Rest assured that the power of Divine Love is with you always and will in time be fully revealed in the most personal way. Meanwhile, I would advise you to follow your heart in deciding what to do, including what books to read.

 

Don't be rushed into accepting any particular guru or feel guilty because you're not all that you might think you should be as a devotee, doctor, husband, father, etc. Just keep on keeping on, somehow or other... Trust in God and believe in yourself as the servant of all and everything will ultimately come together. Maya-devi and your own mind will become your friends! I am very grateful for your association and contributions here.

 

valaya RR

[stonehearted]

 

Originally posted by Tarun:

Babhru: r u the same Babhru who spoke to Bhadri-Narayan in Hawaii?

 

Well, I've spoken to Badrinarayan many times, but not in Hawaii that I can remember. I lived in San Diego for several years and just moved back to Hawaii in August. Badri and I have been friendly for a long time (our daughters were friends). When was I supposed to have spoken with him in Hawaii? And what did I say?

 

And as far as I know, I'm the only Babhru, although I've heard that Harikesh had a disciple named Babhru in Moscow

 

[Tarun]

Jan1999, on Watseka Bhadri approached me & said,

"You know Babhru? He mentioned how he recalls you from..."

I remember your name; can't recall your visage.

[stonehearted]

Originally posted by Tarun:

Jan1999, on Watseka Bhadri approached me & said,

"You know Babhru? He mentioned how he recalls you from..."

I remember your name; can't recall your visage.

Hmmm. . . now I'm really puzzled. Is Tarun your real name? I know two Taruns: Tarun Kanti, an old friend from my brahmacari days (and later, householder days, too--he and his wife are old friends, and their kids are both 3 weeks older than our kids) and Tarun Krishna, whom I met in Mexico City in 1973. So are you Tarun Krishna? If so, I can't imagine what I might have said to Badri, except that I had met you a long time ago and admired your preaching in Mexico.

 

Babhru

[stonehearted]

Tarun, if you like, write me privately at williamr@hawaii.edu