The Jiva Did Not fall From Goloka?

[Guruvani]

 

Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Madhya 20.268

 

sei puruṣa virajāte karena śayana

'kāraṇābdhiśāyī' nāma jagat-kāraṇa

 

SYNONYMS

sei puruṣa — the Supreme Personality of Godhead; virajāte — on the border known as Virajā; karena śayana — lies down; kāraṇa-abdhi-śāyī — Kāraṇābdhiśāyī; nāma — named; jagat-kāraṇa — is the original cause of material creation.

 

 

TRANSLATION

"That original Personality of Godhead, named Sańkarṣaṇa, first lies down in the river Virajā, which serves as a border between the material and the spiritual world. As Kāraṇābdhiśāyī Viṣṇu, He is the original cause of the material creation.

 

 

This is where is all began.

Lord Sankarsana lies down in the Viraja.

The Viraja is the border between the material world and the spiritual world.

The Viraja is as close to Goloka as we have ever been.

The Viraja is far, far away from Goloka on the very outer limits of Vaikuntha.

 

The jivas of the material world are the marginal potency of Lord Sankarsana in as much as the Viraja is the marginal region of existence.

[Guruvani]

 

Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Madhya 20.269

 

kāraṇābdhi-pāre māyāra nitya avasthiti

virajāra pāre paravyome nāhi gati

 

SYNONYMS

kāraṇa-abdhi-pāre — on one bank of the Causal Ocean; māyāra — of the material energy; nitya — eternal; avasthiti — position; virajāra pāre — on the other bank of the Virajā, or the Causal Ocean; para-vyome — in the spiritual world or sky; nāhi — there is not; gati — admission.

 

 

TRANSLATION

"The Virajā, or Causal Ocean, is the border between the spiritual and the material world. The material energy is situated on one shore of that ocean, and it cannot enter onto the other shore, which is the spiritual sky.

 

This Viraja is the marginal plane of existence.

It is the divine spiritual ocean from which one drop has created the divine Ganga river.

It is nothing to sneeze at.

It is spiritually powerfull as the sacred Ganges river flows from there.

 

Lord Sankarsana manifests his potency in this Viraja river and the jivas of this realm are known as marginal potency.

[Guruvani]

Let me assure the good members of this forum that there is no such thing as marginal jivas or marginal potency in Goloka or even Vaikuntha.

 

we have heard from shastra that the jivas in question of the fallen variety are coming out of the marginal potency of the Lord.

 

I have some good shastric material to present concerning these issues, but I think I will start another thread without all the speculation and concoction of "Vigraha" who goes by several other names.

 

I want to start another topic and present some good shastric material that will absolutely and totally defeat the "fall from Goloka" theory without question.

 

I already have some goodies saved up that are the product of hundreds of hours of study in the last few weeks.

 

I don't want to co-mingle the rest of my material with this toxic thread.

 

So, when I get a some fresh energy and some time I will work on presenting some good shastra that will put the "fall from Goloka" theory to rest once and for all.

 

Apart from the pablum preaching of Srila Prabhupada's letters, he gives a good course of higher siddhanta in his books.

I can prove it and I will.

[Guruvani]

It is the second expansion of Lord Sankarsana who is the origin of the marginal jivas.

 

Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Ādi 5.41, purport

 

 

Sańkarṣaṇa, the second expansion, is Vāsudeva's personal expansion for pastimes, and since He is the reservoir of all living entities, He is sometimes called jīva. The beauty of Sańkarṣaṇa is greater than that of innumerable full moons radiating light beams. He is worshipable as the principle of ego. He has invested Anantadeva with all the potencies of sustenance. For the dissolution of the creation, He also exhibits Himself as the Supersoul in Rudra, in Adharma (the personality of irreligion), in sarpa (snakes), in Antaka (Yamarāja, the lord of death) and in the demons.

Lord Balaram is the original Sankarsana.

[Guruvani]

Maha-Sankarsana is the ultimate shelter for all jivas.

 

 

Śrī Caitanya Caritāmṛta Ādi 5.45

 

'jīva'-nāma taṭasthākhya eka śakti haya

mahā-sańkarṣaṇa — saba jīvera āśraya

 

SYNONYMS

jīva — the living entity; nāma — named; taṭa-sthā-ākhya — known as the marginal potency; eka — one; śakti — energy; haya — is; mahā-sańkarṣaṇa — Mahā-sańkarṣaṇa; saba — all; jīvera — of living entities; āśraya — the shelter.

 

 

TRANSLATION

There is one marginal potency, known as the jīva. Mahā-sańkarṣaṇa is the shelter of all jīvas.

 

[Svarupa]

 

 

In a Srimad-Bhagavatam lecture given in London, on July 30, 1971, Srila Prabhupada makes the same point he made in the above-quoted Tokyo lecture. "No one really falls from Vaikuntha. We are always in the spiritual world. We just think we are somewhere else".

 

 

I notice you can't get your head around a lot of what Srila Prabhupada says. Everything I have posted is clearly backed up by what Srila Prabhupada has told us but only our degree of service to Srila Prabhupada will reveal that to us.

 

Srila Prabhupada - “Your next question, "Is a pure devotee eternally liberated and if so is he at any time a conditioned soul? We are eternally conditioned, but as soon as we surrender to Krishna do we then become eternally liberated? You are not eternally conditioned. You are eternally liberated but since we have become conditioned on account of our desire to enjoy materialistic way of life, from time immemorial, therefore it appears that we are eternally conditioned. Because we cannot trace out the history or the date when we became conditioned, therefore it is technically called eternally conditioned. Otherwise the living entity is not actually conditioned. A living entity is always pure. But he is prone to be attracted by material enjoyment and as soon as he agrees to place himself in material enjoyment, he becomes conditioned, but that is not permanent. Therefore a living entity is called on the marginal state, sometimes this side, sometimes that side. These are very intelligent questions. And I am very glad that you are putting such intelligent questions and trying to understand it. It is very good”. Letter to Aniruddha dasa, Los Angeles 14 November 1968

Srila Prabhupada: You are liberated. You are liberated. Simply just a cloud has covered you. Drive away the cloud. There is no question that you were ever. You are ever-liberated. That, the sky is always spiritual, but it is sometimes overcrowded with cloud, this maya. This is called maya. Actually, you are not conditioned. You are thinking. Just like in the dream you are thinking that tiger is eating you. You were never eaten by tiger. There is no tiger. So we have to get out of this dream. (Lecture on Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Adi-lila 7.108--San Francisco, February 18, 1967)

Srila Prabhupada says that as living souls we are all originally Krishna conscious. But what does that mean? Were we all originally with Krishna in the spiritual world? And if so, how could we ever have fallen? In Bhagavad-gita Lord Krishna says, “Once you attain to that spiritual world, you never fall.” So how then could we have fallen from there to begin with?

Some have tried to work around this problem by suggesting a different idea: We fell not from Krishna’s personal abode but from the brahmajyoti, the effulgent light that surrounds it. As stated in Srimad-Bhagavatam, yogis who seek the impersonal aspect of the Supreme may merge into that effulgent light—only to fall back later to the material world. Perhaps, then, we originally fell from the brahmajyoti.

Srila Prabhupada rejected this idea. Those in the brahmajyoti, he wrote, are not Krishna conscious, so they too are fallen. “So there is no question of falling down from a fallen condition. When fall takes place, it means falling down from the non-fallen condition.”

Well, then, since we’re called “eternally conditioned,” eternally illusioned, perhaps we’ve never really fallen at all—we’ve just always been down. That idea, too, Srila Prabhupada rejected.

“Eternally conditioned,” he explained, simply means that we’ve been down so long that when we fell is no longer possible to know.

Srila Prabhupada – “If one understands Krsna, then all the departments of knowledge are part and parcel of that understanding. Krsna is transcendental, for He is always situated in His eternal internal potency. The living entities are manifested and are divided into two classes, eternally conditioned and eternally liberated. Such living entities are innumerable, and they are considered fundamental parts of Krsna. Material energy is manifested into twenty-four divisions. The creation is effected by eternal time, and it is created and dissolved by external energy. This manifestation of the cosmic world repeatedly becomes visible and invisible”. Bhagavad gita as it is Chapter 18. Conclusion--The Perfection of Renunciation

"Forgetting Krsna, the living entity has turned his face away from the Lord from time immemorial". - Caitanya-caritamrita, Madhya lila, 20.108.

Constitutionally every living entity, even if he is in the Vaikuntha Loka, has chance of falling down. Therefore the living entity is called marginal energy. But when the falldown has taken place for the conditioned soul is very difficult to ascertain. Therefore two classes are designated: eternally liberated and eternally conditioned but factually every marginal living entity has these two fold characteristics. But for arguments sake, a living entity being marginal energy, he can't be eternally conditioned. The time is so unlimited that the conditioned souls appear to be eternally so, but from the philosophical view he cannot be eternally conditioned. Since we cannot trace out when we have become conditioned, there is no use of arguing on this point. Better to take care first how we can get rid of this conditional existence; as much as a patient should take care for treating his disease more, and less waste his time in finding out the cause of his disease.

Regarding your questions concerning the spirit souls falling into Maya's influence, it is not that those who have developed a passive relationship with Krsna are more likely to fall into nescient activities. Usually anyone who has developed his relationship with Krsna does not fall down in any circumstance, but because the independence is always there, the soul may fall down from any position or any relationship by misusing his independence. But his relationship with Krsna is never lost, simply it is forgotten by the influence of Maya, so it may be regained or revived by the process of hearing the Holy Name of Krsna and then the devotee engages himself in the service of the Lord which is his original or constitutional position. The relationship of the living entity with Krsna is eternal as both Krsna and the living entity are eternal; the process is one of revival only, nothing new.Letter to: Jagadisa : 70-02-27 Los Angeles

"This external energy of the Lord covers up the pure knowledge of the living entity's eternally existing with Him, but the covering is so constant that it appears that the conditioned soul is eternally ignorant". - Srimad Bhagavatam, 2.5.19, purport.

Srila Prabhupada - "This is maha-bhagavata nitya-siddha. And sadhana-siddha means those who are put into this material world, by the association of maha-bhagavata, if he tries, follows, then he can also become maha-bhagavata or nitya-siddha, because originally everyone is nitya-siddha. nitya-siddha krsna-bhakti ’sadhya’ kabhu naya sravanadi-suddha-citte karaye udaya Every living entity originally nitya-siddha, but somehow or other, just like Jaya-Vijaya, fell down in this material world, and he was delivered also, both of them were delivered". Srimad-Bhagavatam 7.9.4– Mayapur, February 18, 1977

 

In a Srimad-Bhagavatam lecture given in London, on July 30, 1971, Srila Prabhupada makes the same point he made in the above-quoted Tokyo lecture. "No one really falls from Vaikuntha. We are always in the spiritual world. We just think we are somewhere else".

 

In this lecture Srila Prabhupada is very clear. Originally we have a direct personal relationship with Krsna in the spiritual world. But when we want to take Krsna’s position, Krsna puts us into a dreaming state. In this dreaming state we forget our actual position and are thus free to act out our desire to become the supreme enjoyer. This state of forgetfulness and dreaming is sometimes characterized as being “fallen” from our position in the spiritual world. But Srila Prabhupada explains that in reality we are not fallen.

 

We are simply in a dreaming state. Srila Prabhupada says that this is a very important point and asks the devotees to carefully consider it. This concept that we are not really fallen offers an explanation for the statements that “no one falls from Vaikuntha.” We do not fall. We simply forget our original relationship of service to Krsna. Some might argue that we have eternally forgotten Krsna. But that is not supported by Srila Prabhupada’s purport to the text under consideration. Therein he says: “Therefore the first sinful will of the living entity is to become the Lord, and the consequent will of the Lord is that the living entity forgets his actual life and thus dreams of the land of utopia where he may become one like the Lord.” It is clear that the living entity is first situated in “his actual life.” In that life he is properly using his free will. Then comes “the first sinful will of the living entity.” This is to “become the Lord.” At that point the Lord arranges things so that “the living entity forgets his actual life.” There is no support here for the idea that our original position is as eternally fallen beings in the brahmajyoti, the Viraja River, or the material world. Neither is there any hint that our original position in the spiritual world is any different from our position after going back to Godhead. We were originally with Krsna, but we have forgotten that.

 

In that state of forgetfulness we think we have fallen, but actually we are not fallen. We simply have to wake up, and we will be in our original position

[Svarupa]

Devotee: Well, I believe you once said that once a conditioned soul becomes perfected and gets out of the material world and he goes to Krishnaloka, there’s no possibility of falling back.

<?xml:namespace prefix = u1 /><u1:p>Prabhupada: No! There is possibility. . . However generally once one has experienced the misery of the material world, he keeps perfect intelligence to not misuse his free will again. It is these experienced souls who will never return or fall from Vaikuntha. Lecture on Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Adi-lila 7.108 San Francisco, February 18, 1967</u1:p>

<u1:p>Acyutananda: .....But in the Gita, it says, "Once coming there, he never returns."</u1:p>

<u1:p>Prabhupada: But if he likes, he can return.</u1:p>

<u1:p>Acyutananda: He can return.</u1:p>

<u1:p>Prabhupada: That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that. Krsna-bahirmukha hana bhoga vancha kare. That misuse is the cause of our falldown. Morning Walk--February 19, 1976, Mayapura</u1:p>

<u1:p></u1:p>

<u1:p>Srila Prabhupada then cites the verse from Prema-Vivarta explaining the cause of the living beings original sub-conscious fall to the material world:</u1:p>

<u1:p></u1:p>

<u1:p>Acyutananda: What is the first birth? What is the cause of the first birth?</u1:p>

<u1:p>Prabhupada: Yes. That is stated in the Prema-Vivarta:</u1:p>

 

<u1:p>\</u1:p>

<u1:p>krsna-bahirmukha hana bhoga vancha kare</u1:p>

<u1:p>nikata-stha maya tare japatiya dhare</u1:p>

 

<u1:p>

“As soon as... We are eternal servant of Krishna. As soon as we want to become master, that is the beginning of our first birth in the material world. We have got independence. Because, Krishna says, mamaivamso jiva bhutah—we are part and parcel of Krishna—so Krishna has got full independence, but we are minute. Therefore, we have got minute independence. Our business is to serve Krishna, but as soon as we give up this idea, we want to become master. That is the beginning of our material birth. Lecture on Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.5.2 Hyderabad, April 11, </u1:p>

[Svarupa]

Srila Prabhupada explains on the cover of the 1966 Hare Krishna record album-

 

"This transcendental vibration--by chanting of Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare/ Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare--is the sublime method for reviving our Krsna consciousness. As living spiritual souls we are all originally Krsna conscious entities, but due to our asociation with matter since time immemorial, our consciousness is now poluted by material atmosphere. In this polluted concept of life, we are all trying to exploit the resources of material nature, but actually we are becoming more and more entangled in our complexities. This illusion is called maya, or hard struggle for existence over the stringent laws of material nature. This illusory struggle against the material nature can at once be stopped by revival of our Krsna consciousness.

 

Krsna consciousness is not an artificial imposition on the mind. This consciousness is the original energy of the living entity. When we hear the transcendental vibration, this consciousness is revived. And the process is recommended by authorities for this age. By practical experience also, we can perceive that by chanting this maha-mantra, or the Great Chanting for Deliverance, one can at once feel transcendental ecstasy from the spiritual stratum. When one is factually on the plane of spiritual understanding, surpassing the stages of sense, mind and intelligence, one is situated on the transcendental plane. This chanting of Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare/ Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare is directly enacted from the spiritual platform, surpassing all lower states of consciousness--namely sensual, mental and intellectual. There is no need of understanding the language of the mantra, nor is there any need of mental speculation nor any intellectual adjustment for chanting this maha-mantra. It springs automatically from the spiritual platform, and as such, anyone can take part in this transcendental sound vibration, without any previous qualification, and dance in ecstasy.

 

We have seen it practically. Even a child can take part in the chanting, or even a dog can take part in it. The chanting should be hears, however, from the lips of a pure devotee of the Lord, so that immediate effect can be achieved. As far as possible, chanting from the lips of a nondevotee should be avoided, as much as milk touched by the lips of a serpent causes poisonous effect.

 

The word Hara is a form of addressing the energy of the Lord. Both Krsna and Rama are forms of addressing directly the Lord, and they mena " the highest pleasure, eternal." Hara is the supreme pleasure potency of the Lord. This potency, when addressed are Hare, helps us in reaching the Supreme Lord.

 

The material energy, called as maya, is also one of the multipotencies of the Lord, as much as we are also marginal potency of the Lord. The living entities are described as superior energy than matter. When the superior energy is in contact with inferior energy, it becomes an incompatible situation. But when the supreme marginal potency is in contact with the spiritual potency, Hara,it becomes the happy, normal condition of the living entity.

The three words, namely Hara, Krsna and Rama, are transcendental seeds of the maha-mantra, and the chanting is a spiritual call for the Lord and His internal energy, Hara, for giving protection to the conditioned soul. The chanting is exactly like a genuine cry by the chold for the mother. Mother Hara helps in achieving the grace of the supreme father, Hari, or Krsna, and the Lord reveals Himself to such a sincere devotee.

No other means, therefore, of spiritual realization is as effective in this age, as chanting the maha-mantra, Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna, Krsna Krsna, Hare Hare/ Hare Rama, Hare Rama, Rama Rama, Hare Hare".

His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

[Svarupa]

 

 

The marginal living entity can be both nitya-siddha and nitya-baddha however originally every marginal living entity is nitya-siddha

 

 

Srila Prabhupada - “Your next question, "Is a pure devotee eternally liberated and if so is he at any time a conditioned soul? We are eternally conditioned, but as soon as we surrender to Krishna do we then become eternally liberated? You are not eternally conditioned. You are eternally liberated but since we have become conditioned on account of our desire to enjoy materialistic way of life, from time immemorial, therefore it appears that we are eternally conditioned. Because we cannot trace out the history or the date when we became conditioned, therefore it is technically called eternally conditioned. Otherwise the living entity is not actually conditioned. A living entity is always pure. But he is prone to be attracted by material enjoyment and as soon as he agrees to place himself in material enjoyment, he becomes conditioned, but that is not permanent. Therefore a living entity is called on the marginal state, sometimes this side, sometimes that side. These are very intelligent questions. And I am very glad that you are putting such intelligent questions and trying to understand it. It is very good”. Letter to Aniruddha dasa, Los Angeles 14 November 1968

 

Srila Prabhupada: You are liberated. You are liberated. Simply just a cloud has covered you. Drive away the cloud. There is no question that you were ever. You are ever-liberated. That, the sky is always spiritual, but it is sometimes overcrowded with cloud, this maya. This is called maya. Actually, you are not conditioned. You are thinking. Just like in the dream you are thinking that tiger is eating you. You were never eaten by tiger. There is no tiger. So we have to get out of this dream. (Lecture on Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Adi-lila 7.108--San Francisco, February 18, 1967)

Srila Prabhupada says that as living souls we are all originally Krishna conscious. But what does that mean? Were we all originally with Krishna in the spiritual world? And if so, how could we ever have fallen? In Bhagavad-gita Lord Krishna says, “Once you attain to that spiritual world, you never fall.” So how then could we have fallen from there to begin with?

 

Some have tried to work around this problem by suggesting a different idea: We fell not from Krishna’s personal abode but from the brahmajyoti, the effulgent light that surrounds it. As stated in Srimad-Bhagavatam, yogis who seek the impersonal aspect of the Supreme may merge into that effulgent light—only to fall back later to the material world. Perhaps, then, we originally fell from the brahmajyoti.

Srila Prabhupada rejected this idea. Those in the brahmajyoti, he wrote, are not Krishna conscious, so they too are fallen. “So there is no question of falling down from a fallen condition. When fall takes place, it means falling down from the non-fallen condition.”

 

Well, then, since we’re called “eternally conditioned,” eternally illusioned, perhaps we’ve never really fallen at all—we’ve just always been down. That idea, too, Srila Prabhupada rejected.

 

“Eternally conditioned,” he explained, simply means that we’ve been down so long that when we fell is no longer possible to know.

 

Srila Prabhupada – “If one understands Krsna, then all the departments of knowledge are part and parcel of that understanding. Krsna is transcendental, for He is always situated in His eternal internal potency. The living entities are manifested and are divided into two classes, eternally conditioned and eternally liberated. Such living entities are innumerable, and they are considered fundamental parts of Krsna. Material energy is manifested into twenty-four divisions. The creation is effected by eternal time, and it is created and dissolved by external energy. This manifestation of the cosmic world repeatedly becomes visible and invisible”. Bhagavad gita as it is Chapter 18. Conclusion--The Perfection of Renunciation

 

"Forgetting Krsna, the living entity has turned his face away from the Lord from time immemorial". - Caitanya-caritamrita, Madhya lila, 20.108.

Constitutionally every living entity, even if he is in the Vaikuntha Loka, has chance of falling down. Therefore the living entity is called marginal energy. But when the falldown has taken place for the conditioned soul is very difficult to ascertain. Therefore two classes are designated: eternally liberated and eternally conditioned but factually every marginal living entity has these two fold characteristics. But for arguments sake, a living entity being marginal energy, he can't be eternally conditioned. The time is so unlimited that the conditioned souls appear to be eternally so, but from the philosophical view he cannot be eternally conditioned. Since we cannot trace out when we have become conditioned, there is no use of arguing on this point. Better to take care first how we can get rid of this conditional existence; as much as a patient should take care for treating his disease more, and less waste his time in finding out the cause of his disease.

Regarding your questions concerning the spirit souls falling into Maya's influence, it is not that those who have developed a passive relationship with Krsna are more likely to fall into nescient activities. Usually anyone who has developed his relationship with Krsna does not fall down in any circumstance, but because the independence is always there, the soul may fall down from any position or any relationship by misusing his independence. But his relationship with Krsna is never lost, simply it is forgotten by the influence of Maya, so it may be regained or revived by the process of hearing the Holy Name of Krsna and then the devotee engages himself in the service of the Lord which is his original or constitutional position. The relationship of the living entity with Krsna is eternal as both Krsna and the living entity are eternal; the process is one of revival only, nothing new.Letter to: Jagadisa : 70-02-27 Los Angeles

 

"This external energy of the Lord covers up the pure knowledge of the living entity's eternally existing with Him, but the covering is so constant that it appears that the conditioned soul is eternally ignorant". - Srimad Bhagavatam, 2.5.19, purport.

 

Srila Prabhupada - "This is maha-bhagavata nitya-siddha. And sadhana-siddha means those who are put into this material world, by the association of maha-bhagavata, if he tries, follows, then he can also become maha-bhagavata or nitya-siddha, because originally everyone is nitya-siddha. nitya-siddha krsna-bhakti ’sadhya’ kabhu naya sravanadi-suddha-citte karaye udaya Every living entity originally nitya-siddha, but somehow or other, just like Jaya-Vijaya, fell down in this material world, and he was delivered also, both of them were delivered". Srimad-Bhagavatam 7.9.4– Mayapur, February 18, 1977

[Svarupa]

 

 

The Impersonal Idea of the Origin of the Soul

(Taken from Sridhar Maharaja's book, Search for Krishna)

 

"There are two classes of souls, jivas, who come into this world. One class comes from the spiritual Vaikuntha planets for the necessity of nitya-lila, the eternal pastimes of Krsna. Another comes by constitutional necessity.

"The Brahmajyoti, the non-differentiated marginal plane, is the source of infinite jiva souls, atomic spiritual particles of non-differentiated character. The rays of the Lord's transcendental body are known as the brahmajyoti, and a pencil of a ray of the brahmajyoti is the jiva. The jiva soul is an atom in that effulgence, and the brahmajyoti is a product of an infinite number of jiva atoms.

 

"Generally, souls emanate from the brahmajyoti which is living and growing. Within the brahmajyoti, their equilibrium is somehow disturbed and movement begins. From non-differentiation, differentiation begins. From a plain sheet of uniform consciousness, individual conscious units grow. And because the jiva is conscious it is endowed with free will. So, from the marginal position they choose either the side of exploitation or the side of dedication... The fallen souls come from the marginal position within the brahmajyoti, and not from Vaikuntha.

 

"In the brahmajyoti, we are equipoised in the marginal potency as an infinite number of pinpoints of spiritual rays, electrons of consciousness. Consciousness means endowed with free will, for without free will, no consciousness can be conceived. An atomic pinpoint of consciousness has very meager free will, and by misuse of their free will, some jivas have taken their chance in the material world.

 

They refused to submit to the supreme authority. They wanted to dominate. So with this germinal idea of domination, the jiva enters into the world of exploitation... Upon retiring from the world of exploitation, the soul may return to his former position in the brahmajyoti as spirit. But, if the soul has gathered the tendency of dedication through his previous devotional activities, he does not stop there; he pierces through the brahmajyoti and goes towards Vaikuntha...

 

"The responsibility is with the soul, otherwise, the Lord would be responsible for his distressed condition. But Krsna says that the soul's innate free will is responsible for his entanglement in the material world. The soul is conscious, and is atomic, his free will is imperfect and vulnerable. The result of that free choice is that some are coming into the material world, and some are going to the spiritual world."

 

But Srila Prabhupada says originally we were all with Krishna in Goloka and rejects the idea the living entity originated from tatastha or the Impersonal Brahmajyoti:

 

"As living spiritual souls we are all originally Krsna conscious entities, but due to our association with matter from time immemorial, our consciousness has now become polluted by the material atmosphere." (Original Hare Krsna album)

 

“It is the jivas who are the attendants in His Sports. They become attached to matter, having deviated from their own essential nature as the result of their desire for enjoyment. But when again the soul . . . gains true wisdom of the transcendental region of God . . . he begins to get back his pure essential nature . . .” Sri Caitanya's Teachings, page 323.

 

“Because he falls down from Brahma-sayujya (tatastha-s’akti, Impersonal Brahmajyoti or Brahman consciousness condition of the life force), he thinks that may be his origin, but he does not remember that long, long, long, long ago before that even, he was with Krishna”.

 

“Originally we have a direct personal relationship with Krishna in the spiritual world. But when we want to take Krishna’s position, we therefore put ourselves into a dreaming state due to our non-Krishna conscious choices. In this dreaming state, we enter the mahat-tattva dream of Maha-Vishnu that is a real but a perishable reality that exists in a temporary state in one corner of the Spiritual Sky, Brahmajyoti or creation”.

 

"As soon as we try to become Lord, immediately we are covered by Maya. Formerly, we were with Krsna in His lila or sport. But this covering of Maya may be of very, very, very, very long duration-therefore, many creations are coming and going. Due to this long period of time, it is sometimes said that we are ever-conditioned. But this long duration of time becomes very insignificant when one actually comes to Krsna consciousness.

 

This Brahma-sayujya mukti is non-permanent. Every living entity wants pleasure, but brahma-sayujya is minus pleasure. There is eternal existence only. So when they do not find transcendental bliss they fall down to make a compromise with material bliss. Unless one develops full devotional service to Krsna, he goes up only to brahma-sayujya but falls down. But after millions and millions of years of keeping oneself away from the lila of the Lord, when one comes to Krsna consciousness, this period becomes insignificant, just like dreaming. Because he falls down from brahma sayujya, he thinks that may be his origin, but he does not remember that before that even, he was with Krsna." (Lecture in Australia)

 

"The conditioned living being has forgotten his eternal relationship with God and he has mistakenly accepted the temporary place of birth as all-in-all... The living entities are not without spiritual senses; every living being in his original, spiritual form has all the senses, which are now material, being covered by the body and mind. Activities of the material senses are perverted reflections of spiritual pastimes." (Sri Isopanisad 11)

 

"Real sense enjoyment is possible only when the disease of materialism is removed. In our real, spiritual form, free from all material contamination, pure enjoyment of the senses is possible." (Sri Isopanisad, 11)

 

"This attachment of the devotee to a particular form of the Lord is due to natural inclination. Each and every living entity is originally attached to a particular type of transcendental service because he is eternally the servitor of the Lord.

 

"Lord Caitanya says that the living entity is eternally the servitor of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Sri Krsna, therefore, every living entity has a particular type of service relationship with the Lord, eternally." (SB3.9.11)

 

In an attempt to minimize or nullify all of the above truths, our impersonalistic adversaries are fond of quoting part of one purport from Srila Prabhupada's commentary on Sri Isopanisad. It reads as follows:

 

"The all-pervading feature of the Lord-which exists in all circumstances of waking and sleeping as well as in potential states and from which the jiva-shakti (living force) is generated as both conditioned and liberated souls-is known as the Brahman. (Sri Isopanisad 16)

 

“However, because of contact with matter, the imprisoned soul loses the memory of his original spiritual form in Vaikuntha. . . material rasas are perverted reflections of the soul's original spiritual rasas.” - Srila Bhaktivinoda Takura, Prema-pradipa, p. 83