Vedanta and Charity

[Guest guest]

Charity is an important part of one's life. It is very good that Bhaktivedanta Ashram is doing an excellent work in actually feeding the poor in India. I have seen practically in another case where sincere acts of charity goes a long way in helping the recipient spiritually also. I have stood humbled in front of slum boys and girls in Chennai who wear a nice tilak and recite Srimad Bhagavatham better than most pawn chewing brahmanas. They had actually started learning SB because some one gave them food and education. But now they dont need inspiration.

 

The main problem with doing charity is our own secondary needs supersede the primary needs of other people. Secondly, some people believe that Vedanta treats charity as secondary and unimportant.

[theist]

Acts of sacrifice, charity and penance are not to be given up; they must be performed.Indeed, sacrifice, charity and penance purify even the great souls.Bg 18.5

 

This is perfected in Krishna consciousness.

[Guest guest]

Originally posted by theist:

Acts of sacrifice, charity and penance are not to be given up; they must be performed.Indeed, sacrifice, charity and penance purify even the great souls.Bg 18.5

 

This is perfected in Krishna consciousness.

Apart from purifying oneself, it also purifies the recipient and the observer. One who sees devotees doing acts of charity in the name of the Lord appreciates the movement, glorifies the devotees and the Lord. This is purifying.

 

[Gauracandra]

Unfortunately I think many people who believe in Karma do see charity as unimportant. People will just chalk up one person's misfortune to bad karma and thus say they deserved it. This then clears us of any responsibility.

 

Ram is correct that devotees acting in charity is not only beneficial to the people engaged in or recipients of the charity, but also to those who admire the Vaisnavas performing the work. Not to get negative, but I was amazed a while back when some devotees were criticizing Caru Prabhu (the Utah temple President) for collecting some funds to donate to the firefighters of New York. I think he collected several thousand dollars by charging a small entrance fee to one of the Utah festivals. I think the figure was under $10,000. Some devotees were criticizing giving this money. But this is just foolishness I think. The money goes to a good cause. The money did not come out of congregation members pockets (but from mostly Mormon visitors to the festival). And for the price of say $10,000 he was able to generate literally hundreds of thousands of dollars of positive publicity for the devotees of Utah (and by extension devotees worldwide). You will see that Iskcon Utah probably gets the most consistently positive coverage in the press. This is because they work to be part of the community. So many people will then see the devotees in Utah and see that they are part of the community. When tragedy strikes they help out even to a small extent. I think Caru Prabhu is doing a great job. I've thought for some time that we should create a group of mayb 5-10 of the best devotee managers in the world, to just travel around to various temples and teach them "how to do it". Caru Prabhu would definitely get my vote to be on such a task force.

[Guest guest]

I think we should understand others'suffering by the dint of our own sufferings. Even though we may not experience all the sufferings that life can hold forth, we can definitely understand others suffering by reflecting on it. While charity has no hope of removing all the sufferings of the world, it definitely helps in reducing it. Especially charity done in the name of the Lord. Charity is also an instantly popular act. Even people who dont believe in God but would like to do some good are interested in doing charity. Why not use this in the service of the Lord ? Those devotees who cannot live the austere life of a temple become misfits in the temple and cannot work like a karmi. But if they run charitable organization, they will bring a lot of fame to the movement.

[theist]

When altruistic activities are executed in the spirit of Sri Isopaniñad, they become a form of karma-yoga. Such activities are recommended in the Bhagavad-gitä (18.5–9), for they guarantee their executor protection from the danger of sliding down into the evolutionary process of birth and death. Even though such God-centered activities may be half-finished, they are still good for the executor because they will guarantee him a human form in his next birth. In this way one can have another chance to improve his position on the path of liberation.Iso 2 purport

 

What kind of charities would be appropriate?

[bhaktajoy]

Yes all are one.God help those who help others

[Guest guest]

Originally posted by theist:

What kind of charities would be appropriate?

Isn't that a long list but to start with :

1. Anna Dhan

2. Vidya Dhan

3. Arokya Dhan (Medical)

4. ??? Dhan (Marriage)

5. ??? Dhan (Protection of brahmanas)

6. ??? Dhan (Protection of cows)

[theist]

Originally posted by ram:

Isn't that a long list but to start with :

1. Anna Dhan

2. Vidya Dhan

3. Arokya Dhan (Medical)

4. ??? Dhan (Marriage)

5. ??? Dhan (Protection of brahmanas)

6. ??? Dhan (Protection of cows)

Ram,

 

I think anna means foodstuff.What does dhan mean exactly.

 

Anyway how about prasadam distrbution to the elderly and those that are shutins?Wheelchair bound etc.This would take some mature steady folks who could just stick to the program without heavy attempts to convert.Mostly non-indian receipes,vegetarian but in a form that would be familar.Someone may be doing this already.

 

Vidya dhan we should all be trying to directly or indirectly supporting the distribution of transcendental knowledge.The internet is a great tool for this.I appreciated your telling of the children you met in Chennai.

 

Medical.Alot can be done with clinics.Support for hospice programs.Special training and being sensitive to others beliefs would be needed.To help someone die is alot of what this philosophy is geared to.

 

Protection of brahmanas.If we find one we should definetly protect him or her.

 

Protecting cows by advancing the war against the slaughter industry.See my post on the Meet Your Meat CD thread for instance.

 

Marriage?Oppose homosex unions. Half joking here I'm not sure what you mean.

 

 

 

[This message has been edited by theist (edited 05-07-2002).]

[karthik_v]

I think that charity is a nice thing. But I am a little skeptical about earning goodwill and publicity through such charities. Does it not reduce the religious movement to a commercial venture? When we talk of training people to manage aren't we heading this way? I can tell you what will happen next. Those who are good managers, fund-raisers etc., will receieve special treatment, as can be seen in ISKCON. Spiritualism takes back seat and it is only a matter of time before ISKCON becomes another Vatican.

[JRdd]

You can't go wrong if you donate to a devotee charity like the Food Relief program, which goes deeper than just feeding people's bodies. I like jndas' program because I trust it and because they emphasize the loving care with which the food is cooked and offered. Otherwise, it would be no more than watering the leaves of the tree instead of the roots. But I appreciate the quotes above pertaining to charity in general as being a viable way of making progress. I mean, I need all the help I can get to make progress, to the point where any small act of kindness from me could do me no harm.

 

A couple of days ago my visiting friend made loads of prasadam yummies (of particular mention is her berry and fresh apple pie) then went around the neighborhood selling them door to door, and passing out peace formulas. (Due to ongoing car problems, she needs the money for gas for her car to drive back home, in.) Anyway, she gave this one young man a cupcake as he had no money with him, as his mom was out. The next morning, we needed to get to town by a back road, to get to the DMV (dept. of motor vehicles) without getting caught first, and we met this woman who turned her car around and took us literally miles out of her way to show us where to get the scenic non-town non-highway route into town. As we were about to part ways, my friend handed her a peace formula and the woman's face lit up. She knew about it already, from her son who was the one my friend had given the cupcake to. It was a happy "coincidence", how things come around, and it made me think about ajnata-sukriti and how one's spiritual life may begin with one small act of service, like eating a cupcake, or reading a peace formula, or helping two renegrade devotees get into town without being caught. And a devotee doesn't have to be great in order for the giver to benefit, because any connection with the pure devotee, even if only through those attempting to follow him, is the most wonderful gift anyone could have, spiritually--that's how potently magnanimous is the biggest charity giver of us all.

 

All glories to Srila Prabhupada and all the Vaisnava devotees,

JR

 

[Guest guest]

Originally posted by karthik_v:

I think that charity is a nice thing. But I am a little skeptical about earning goodwill and publicity through such charities. Does it not reduce the religious movement to a commercial venture? When we talk of training people to manage aren't we heading this way? I can tell you what will happen next. Those who are good managers, fund-raisers etc., will receieve special treatment, as can be seen in ISKCON. Spiritualism takes back seat and it is only a matter of time before ISKCON becomes another Vatican.

This is all gapsa. The problems in the world are real to those who suffer it. One thing is to tell them to become self-realized - never mind you are not yourself. Another is to mobilize community support so that we can help them. I am definitely not for Teresa like cheating charity. But real stuff like the school in chennai i talked about. That devotee is talking about making 100 IAS officers who will be well read vaishnavas. This may not be pure spiritual and he may have personal motivation. You have to see those kids, their faith in Krishna, hope in a bright future and I am sure that is the kind of socially successful devotees one needs. The few who will renounce every thing will any way do it. They dont need guidance. I think BV ashram's program is damn good because it immediately connects people. I have done something similar once and you should see how wonderful it is. Their gratitude, love and the softening of your heart are real. Just look at the photographs of the kids on this site and look at their eyes.

 

As for the organization being spiritual - ha ha ha. You can never create an organization that is spiritual - it will always have problems. Our attempts should be create a good society that is God centered - daiva varnashrama. As for as becoming spiritual is concerned, it is ultimately personal.

 

[This message has been edited by ram (edited 05-07-2002).]

[Gauracandra]

Just a quick note, my idea behind creating a group of traveling consultants is for creating the best temples possible. We are going to have temple presidents, and interactions with the media, the community etc... We can either do it in a professional manner, or by the seat of our pants. Some people naturally have the talent, others need to be developed. The best temples I have entered have always had one thing in common – it looked like someone thought everything through. There was a guiding philosophy behind the layout and presentation. They might have a guest book, pamphlets and brochures, areas for consultation/information etc… The look of the temple itself was setup in such a manner as to be inviting to guests. While all of this might be external, it certainly helps in presenting the philosophy in a positive manner. Every little bit helps, and if we can learn better ways to interact with the community, present the philosophy, etc… I think we should utilize those resources.

[theist]

Exactly true.Its not external if it helps others become attracted to Krsna.

 

We need to put ourselves into the position of someone coming to the Temple for the first time.

 

Remember the ackward feelings,not knowing any one there,not knowing the customs or where to go.That is what any new person will feel.

 

I believe that if we can keep in mind that the Supersoul has just brought them there, as well as having accompanied them, we will act appropriately.

 

Hare Krishna

[Guest guest]

Agree. When a person comes to the temple, if a devotee treats him welcome, he will get more involved. This may give a chance for getting attracted. A vaishnava is a friend of all. But most often, we dont receive others so nicely because of reserved nature and preoccupation with ourselves. I remember how well I was received when I got associated with devotees. We need to receive even the poor people well. When the security guard or beggars outside are treated without love, the care we show to the life members and donors seems plastic.

 

I am sure acts of charity will help people come together in good association in the long term.

 

[This message has been edited by ram (edited 05-21-2002).]