BVI Posted June 2, 2002 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2002 Originally posted by Rati: Looks like they have you over a barrel on the Brajbasi side of the equation, BVI. I am sure you are correct about the majority of the residents born in the dhAma (or at least a third of them - don't really know), but what about those that make dacoit their occupation? We are supposed to respect the monkeys too, but they have been known to attack sAdhus sitting peacefully and taking kRSNa prasAda and biting them in the jugular vein (an obvious attempt to kill the humans for food). Good question. The answer is given by Srila Prabhupada "Don't make friends and don't make enemies." Remain a distance and just appreciate. Don't get too close. A little bit of information on septic tanks, for the plumbing impaired. When properly designed, they hold waste in a tank and have a septic field overhead. In the USA they are by law to be installed a safe distance from any wells. The tanks are maintained by a service that empties them periodically. Seems like quite an improvement over stool fields where the waste is lying out in the open and liable to be spread around with each heavy rain, spreading cholera and other nastiness. Obviously the type of sewers with pipes (actually used in anient Egypt) are superior, but far more costly to build and maintain. Your vision of plumbing free outhouses or open latrines (whatever your technologically impaired mind has concocted) is a throwback to horrible times and a prescription for hell on earth, BVI. I suppose you keep a small herd of those scrawny Vrindavan hogs to follow you around and tidy up whenever you feel a call to nature. Hah! B] You are full of pride, misconceptions, speculations and lack knowledge of the science of waste management. The Vedic system is superior. You fire an arrow from a long bow and the distance is travels is the minimum safe distance for passing stool. I don't know the range of a long bow, but let's say 200 meters. That means the Gosvamis went 10 times further than that to show special respect to Radharani's favorite place. To respect a normal place 200 meters, to respect the higher place 2000. It is a question of respecting the place. An open field where people go to pass stool is not necessarily a smelly place. It diferentiates humans from animals. Animals have no shame, except cats who bury their stool. Hogs will roam there in the field and clean it up along with the purifying rays of the sun. It is a wonderful system as long as you don't use water. When you start introducing water is when you have all the problems. That is one reason why people don't travel during the rainy seasons because it is a time of removal and purification of the fields and rivers carry it all away. People generally remain indoors. Just as a woman is purified by her menses, the rains purify the earth. When a woman is in that condition, like the earth, she should not be touched. This is called getting in tune with Divine arrangement. If you want to propagate imperfect concocted Western culture, values and systems, then why have you joined the Sankirtana movement? If you are against passing stool in fields then you are an atheist, or pasandi for rejecting the Vedic version. I am fully aware of the Western septic and sewer systems (I have even seen the installation of a few systems) and they are responsible for poisoning the ground water and polluting the rivers and oceans. Urgra karma, which is always the demons preferred method of doing things. There is a Vedic art of living and that should be implemented whenever and wherever possible because it is the most favorable way of living for cultivating devotional service. This was one of the most important and major issues in planning the Mayapura project. Waste management. We need to show an example to the rest of the world what is the value of Vedic culture. That is a part of our mission, and it begins with cultivating a sense of humility and shame, at least enough to restrict you from passing stool in Radharani's lake. It should begin from there. Then we can talk about reforming the rest of the world. Are you so advanced that you can pass stool in Her lake like the turtles who live there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raga Posted June 2, 2002 Report Share Posted June 2, 2002 Read Manah Siksha verse one on how to get direct service, "Develop unprecendented love for the Brajabasis..." Where is that love if you are finding fault in them and keeping guns for shooting them? Where is the realization? Where is the direct service? Where is the raganuga with priti and purva-kama? Bhaktivinoda states in his commentary on this verse, "Only pure devotees who live in Vraja with the motive to serve Sri Yugala are vraja-vasis." What would you say to that? By the way, from where comes the definition "born in Vraja" as Vrajavasi? Vrajavasi means one who lives in Vraja, not one who was born in Vraja. Why not extend the status of being beyond critique to everyone who resides in Vraja (all Vrajavasis), including those who are engaged in vigorous sadhana bhajana there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BVI Posted June 2, 2002 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2002 Originally posted by raga: Hmm... let's count the scores, as this is what counts. Here's my estimated scores-sheet: "Here's my estimated pride sheet" more like it. Okay, but be proud about distributing Srila Prabhupada's books. (My Guru, by the way, which I have said several times). - - - - - - ISKCON - - - - - - Maha-big books: 500 Big books: 4000 Medium books: 150 Recordings: 10000 Small books, magazines: 200 Flyers, posters: 55000 IF you actually distributed Srila Prabhupada's books, then you have done something nice. I will retract my previous statement in that regard and I officially apologize for that. All glories to this service! Keep up the good work on this front. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Gaudiya Matha - - - - - - - - - Maha-big and big books: 200 Medium and small books: 4000 E-books (website): 7500 Individual visitors (three websites): 20000 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - No comment here. [here I am shifting from streets to cyber highway] - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Babaji Camp - - - - - - - - - - E-books (website): 3500 and counting Visitors: 15000 and counting [hard copies of books are yet to come] - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - No benefit, and even negative benefit for spreading deviation. Fortunately your ISKCON service is eternal and cannot be destroyed by any manner of offenses, but the benefits you are to receive from it can be checked by this deviant behavior. I am here to help you clear your path and get back on track. Go back to distributing Srila Prabhupada's books exclusively and you will be in a better position. I am praying to Radharani to give you the intelligence to see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raga Posted June 2, 2002 Report Share Posted June 2, 2002 This is called getting in tune with Divine arrangement. If you want to propagate imperfect concocted Western culture, values and systems, then why have you joined the Sankirtana movement? If you are against passing stool in fields then you are an atheist, or pasandi for rejecting the Vedic version. Let us start with your good self. Do you go pass stool on the backyard of your house also during winter time, or are you an atheist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BVI Posted June 2, 2002 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2002 Originally posted by raga: Bhaktivinoda states in his commentary on this verse, "Only pure devotees who live in Vraja with the motive to serve Sri Yugala are vraja-vasis." What would you say to that? By the way, from where comes the definition "born in Vraja" as Vrajavasi? Vrajavasi means one who lives in Vraja, not one who was born in Vraja. Why not extend the status of being beyond critique to everyone who resides in Vraja (all Vrajavasis), including those who are engaged in vigorous sadhana bhajana there? Now you are just indulging in hypocrisy. You condemned Brajabasis because they came to Vraja recently, showing that you consider any new immigrants as fakes, and then you come up with this. You want to create a definition that only favors your sectarian group of offenders, who will never get vrajabasi status as long as they continue to offend the residents of Vraja by keeping machine guns, passing stool in Radha Kunda, not paying their taxes, having sex in the dress of Rupa Gosvami, and criticizing real gurus and acaryas like Srila Bhaktisiddhanta and his representatives. If they clean up their act philosophcally, socially, economically and politically then I will accept them as Vrajabasis too. Until that time they are just obnoxious guests who have overstayed their welcome and need to be sent home. If they want to make it their home, then they have to join the family and that means to appreciate the Brajabasis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raga Posted June 2, 2002 Report Share Posted June 2, 2002 I just asked you a question, sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BVI Posted June 2, 2002 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2002 Originally posted by raga: Let us start with your good self. Do you go pass stool on the backyard of your house also during winter time, or are you an atheist? There is a difference between not following and not agreeing. If I fail to follow I am a violater. If I denounce the validity or authority of the sastra I am an atheist. I am a preacher and I pass stool according to time place and circumstance. I do not own a house. I am working to implement the Vedic way of doing things in my preaching efforts as far as I can influence others to change. I am not posing as a Rupa Gosvami imitator. If I lived at Radha Kunda and had nothing better to do to save the world other than my own spiritual progress, then I would walk a mile to pass stool to respect Radharani's lake. It would be the least I could do, but at this time in my life I don't live like that. My approach to Radha Kunda is that I fast before going to such holy places, as is customary, so that I won't have to waste time and leave my remnants in those areas. I sprinkle three drops of water after doing dandavat parikrama of Radha Kunda and don't take full bath touching my feet to Radharani. That is my vow. It is a special place for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahnava Nitai Das Posted June 2, 2002 Report Share Posted June 2, 2002 It's amazing how much discussion can occur from the time you sleep till you wake up in the morning! I will close this thread because it is certainly consisting primarily of insults, which whether valid or invalid just disturb the minds of common readers. BVI, if you want to continue this discussion, maybe you can try to focus on philosophical points, and avoid personal criticisms, simply because I want to keep personal criticisms away from these forums as much as possible. Sorry to all for stepping in so late. I'm in a different time zone then most of the posters, so I usually see the posts much after they are posted (i.e. most of the posts occur while I am sleeping). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts