Gauracandra Posted July 3, 2002 Report Share Posted July 3, 2002 A brief but interesting conversation I had with my orthodox Jewish friend at work. I was watching a Public Access program given by an Orthodox Rabbi (who happens to be this person's head Rabbi at his synagogue). The program was interesting in that the main theme was how culture and traditions are passed on. The Rabbi kept saying how we are greater than our forefathers because we stand upon their shoulders. He kept discussing the importance of tradition in the lives of people. When I was explaining this to my friend he made an interesting point. He said "Yes, only good accumulates." It seemed to me this is a particularly Jewish view of the world perhaps? But having considered it I saw some parallels to Vaisnavism. True we believe that the world slowly deteriorates towards immorality. But we do accept that whatever spiritual advancement we make we do not lose. We can die, and start in our next life with the accumulation of past devotional service. In one sense I think it is almost by definition true. Those things which are bad are bad because they are self-destructive. So they are unlikely to be able to regenerate themselves, generation after generation. They might have short term victories, but in the end good always wins. Because "only good accumulates" while evil destroys itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauracandra Posted July 4, 2002 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2002 I think this Jewish view is a very positive outlook on life. In contrast, I can't help but feel the Vaisnava view is quite negative in regards to human destiny. Basically we (and Christians I think as well) view the world on a path towards complete immorality. At that point Jesus or Kalki will come down and save what few pious people are left. Isn't that a bit depressing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theist Posted July 4, 2002 Report Share Posted July 4, 2002 Originally posted by Gauracandra: I think this Jewish view is a very positive outlook on life. In contrast, I can't help but feel the Vaisnava view is quite negative in regards to human destiny. Basically we (and Christians I think as well) view the world on a path towards complete immorality. At that point Jesus or Kalki will come down and save what few pious people are left. Isn't that a bit depressing? Kalki comes and wipes out the demons but then Satya yuga is said to blossom once again. I believe what I have read in "Indian" Vaisnava texts to be the most positive and optimistic lifeview around.The doctrine of transmigration has souls rising back up even from the lowest germ life to find their proper place in the spiritual sky. [This message has been edited by theist (edited 07-04-2002).] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauracandra Posted July 4, 2002 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2002 Yes, but why does Kalki come? Because all of humanity has degenerated into savages. That is the destiny of man. We won't go upwards as a civilization. We will become evil, and depraved, and the whole of the earth will be populated by evil savages. Then God will come down and destroy it all to clean up the mess of humanity. Same with the Christian worldview. Jews really don't have this complex I 'think'. I could be wrong on this. They do believe in the Messiah (in fact this one group talks about the messiah all the time, I think as a way of positioning against Christianity). But to them, the Messiah isn't coming because the whole world is evil. When the Messiah comes, he will come as the culmination of the upliftment of mankind. That is as man becomes better and better, then at the right time the messiah will come and put everything in harmony. Sort of like the capping stone. Everything has been built up, and then on the top it will be placed. This is my understanding atleast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauracandra Posted July 6, 2002 Author Report Share Posted July 6, 2002 I have always found discussions with my Jewish friend to be very interesting. I can't quite put my finger on it, but basically Jews seems to have a very solid notion of ethics. Solid is the only word I can think of, though its not the best. Listening to him discuss tradition, ethics, right and wrong, he always makes common sense. From this, I can see similarities with Christianity, in having a highly structured and coherent ethical system. This I believe is key to their long term survival. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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