Shaivite roots of Islam

[Guest guest]

Thank-you for your magnificent contribution. From the point of view of an amateur ethymologist (Roman languages) I find your study extremely interesting.

 

I am myself from a Jewish background, and I find that there are a lot of common points between Judaism and Indian philosophy. Many concepts and ideas found in the Kabbalah (Jewish mysticism) seem to derive from India.

 

For instance, the seven candles seem to derive from the seven "bodies" from top to botton. For us the seven candles must be aligned, none must be placed higher than the others.

 

Also the word Shalom does obviously derive from Salaam.

 

At Jewish weddings the bride must also perform the 7 circuambulations that you have mentioned.

 

There used to be also some kind of gymnastics in Judaism, which helped the mystics to meditate.

 

As you can see, these are all the examples I can provide, I am far less learned than yourself in history and religion.

However, I find your study extremely interesting. If you wrote a publication studying the relationship of Judaism to Indian philosophy and history, I bet a lot of Jewish people would be interested in learning more about some of the origins of our culture.

 

Would you be kind enough to inform me whether you have any publications in the subject.

[Guest guest]

In a peace, love ,and understanding based forum.All I read is ,"My Gods better than yours".All "religon", from the begging to the end comes from the same source.Its great to read about the differences,but lets try to find whats the same, the common thread.How we can touch the "source"of all religion.Chant Hare Krsna,pray to god thru the lord Jesus Christ or see duality in unity and unity in duality like the Shaivites

[Guest guest]

The lord would not wish ill upon anyone. So why does your lord talk about terrorising those who do not believe. shree Krishna state in the Geeta "all come to me". everyone worships him differently yet he treats them all the same. No matter what is class, cast, gender etc is. that does not matter to the lord. and why does allah talk about attaining heavens where there are women and wine? which is for gaining mere pleasure? that is so not god. why does allah stress that this earth is 'Napaak'? that it is impure and he does not enter it? then why has he made it and why does he keep his people there?

 

think about it. sanatan dharm is eternal truth.

god bless everyone. and hope he puts them on the right path.

[Guest guest]

hey ..i am a 3rd yr student studying in canada , i have read a lot on the forums n other websites on the issue of a shivling in mecca ..i have had a lot of friendly debates with my friend who is a muslim .. i just need to know that is there any evidence be it a picture or a report of an eyewitness of who has axtually been inside kaba n witnessed the shiv ling ...

i have read a lot bout it mostly online .. just need to know wether its just a belief ;the fact that it existed or it still exists ?

 

u can contact me on mi email

shouvik_@hotmail.com

 

Shouvik

[Guest guest]

Dear All

As we all r aware of Islam & Hindusium.But the thing is that where is the Truth of our real Religion.R we Hindu or Muslim First we have to understand who we R.Who r our forefathers.Whom they follow & Why.What r the resons to Follow them.

Once u find out this Question U will be able to reach the Q.Hindu & Muslim.

One thing is clear We all r from one place & settled in different in different places due to some reasons.

One of the latest Example of Hindu & Muslim "1947"Division fo India & Pakistan.Before division Pakistan was a Hindu Base country "Kush",RajaRanjit singh,GuruNanak Dev,Chanakaya,Vikramaditya & Buddhas were their.On behalf of their thought "Sarv Dharm SamveshaDharam Ki Jai Ho,Adharam Ka Naas Ho,Pranio Me Sad Bhav Ho,Vishav Ka Kalyan Ho".

Recently In Lanka NASA has found that bridge which was made by Shri.HanumanJi.

[Guest guest]

in his post it is said

-->When Quran was revealing this was the status of all other scriptures in this world.!!

let us see what was the status of koran.it is actually a storehouse of true knowledge.

 

 

Koran 4:82)

Do they not consider the Qur'an (with care)?

Had it been from other than Allah, they would

surely have found therein much discrepancy.

 

According to the Muslims the Koran contains the words of God. Koran is to be read as if God Himself had spoken these words stated in it. It is important to emphasize this point because if Koran is the word of God then it should not contain any errors and it should hold true for all times. However, such is not the case.

 

First, we will see how some of the verses in the Koran itself show clearly that these words were obviously spoken by Mohammed and Not God.

 

The Opening Sura Fatihah:

(Koran 1:1-7)

In the name of the Merciful and Compassionate God.

Praise belongs to God,

The Lord of the worlds, the merciful, the

compassionate, the ruler of the day of

the day of judgement! Thee we serve and Thee

we ask for aid. Guide us in the right path,

the path of those Thou art gracious to;

not to those Thou art wroth with, nor of

those who err.

 

Someone need not be a rocket-scientist to comprehend that these words are clearly addressed to God, in the form of a prayer. They are Mohammed's words of parise to God, asking for God's help and guidance. Some Muslim compilers conveniently add the imperative "say" in the English translation of the Koran at the beginning of the sura to remove this difficulty. This imperative form of the word "say" occurs at least 350 times in the Koran, and its obvious that this word has, in fact, been inserted by later compilers of the Koran to remove countless similarly embarassing difficulties. Thus, we have direct evidence that the Koran starts out with the words of Mohammed.

(Koran 113:1)

I take refuge with the Lord of the Dawn.

 

One can clearly see, its Mohammed and NOT GOD HIMSELF who is seeking refuge in God.

 

(Koran 6:104)

Now have come to you, from your Lord, proofs

(To open your eyes): If any will see, it will

be for (the good of) his own soul; If any will

be blind, it will be to his own (harm): I am not

(here) To watch over your doings.

 

In this verse the speaker of the line "I am not to watch over your doings"- is clearly Mohammed. In fact Dawood in his translation adds a footnote that the "I" refers to Mohammed here.

 

(Koran 27:91)

For me, I have been commanded to serve the

Lord of this city, Him Who has sanctified it

and to whom (Belong) all things; and I am

commanded to be of those who bow in Islam to

Allah's Will

 

Again, the speaker here is clearly Mohammed who is trying to justify killing of innocent Meccans who were not willing to follow Mohammed's version of God. Dawood and Pickthall both interpolate "say" at the beginning of the sentence which is lacking in the original Arabic version of the sura.

 

(Koran 81:15)

So veriy I call To witness the planets that recede...

 

Again, here it is Mohammed and NOT God who is swearing by the turning planets.

 

(Koran 84:16-19)

I swear by the afterglow of sunset, and by the night,

and by the moon when she is at the full.

 

Once again it is Mohammed and NOT God. He is unable to disguise his pagan heritage. He swears again in the name of the Sun and Moon, both of which were considered as holy deities by pre-Islamic Arabs.

 

(Koran 6:114)

Should I seek other judge than God, when

it is He who has sent down to you, the

distinguishing book (Koran)?

 

Any sane person can comprehend that those words are not spoken by God but Mohammed himself. Yusuf Ali in his translation adds at the beginning of the sentence "say", which is not there in the original Arabic and he does so without comment or footnote.

 

Having established that Koran actually contains the words of Mohammed I shall now show various other contradictions which are present in the Koran.

Numerical Contradictions:

 

There are many numerical contradictions in the Koran. God cannot make an error in doing simple calculations, however Mohammed, as you will see, being an illiterate was very capable of making such errors.

 

How Many Days Did It Take To Create Heavens And Earth?

(Koran 7:54)

Your guardian-Lord is Allah. Who created the heavens and the earth in SIX Days...

 

(Koran 10:3)

Verily your Lord is Allah, who created the heavens and the earth in SIX Days...

 

(Koran 11:7)

He it is Who created the heavens and the earth in SIX days...

 

(Koran 25:29)

He Who created the heavens And the earth and all that is between, in SIX days...

 

The above verses clearly state that God created the heaven and the earth in 6 days. But the verses stated below contradict the above verses and imply that it took God 8 days to create the heaven and the earth. Read carefully and add up the numbers.

 

(Koran 41:9)

Is it that ye Deny Him who created the earth in TWO days?...

 

(Koran 41:10)

He set on the (earth). Mountains standing firm,

high above it, and bestowed blessings on the

earth, and measured therein all things to

give them nourishment in due proportion, in FOUR days...

 

(Koran 41:12)

So He completed them as seven firmaments in TWO days and...

 

Do the math: 2(for earth) + 4(for nourishment) + 2(for heavens) = 8 NOT 6

 

This implies that Mohammed did not know how to add integers.

 

and after all the muslims are boasting that the quran only is perfect and they think it was directly faxed to the earth from the heaven!

[Guest guest]

you must be jokking. there are verses found in ur scriptures that are blatanly a show of ur hipocracy such as

"[indrani:] 'No woman has finer loins than I, or is better at making love. No woman thrusts against a man better than I, or raises and spreads her thighs more.' " -- Rig Veda 10:86:6.

 

LORD INDRA RAPES GAUTAMA'S WIFE (not funny)still no offence

 

".... Indra raped Ahalya and was cursed by her husband, the sage Gautama, to lose all his prosperity ...." -- Brahmavaivarta Purana 4:47:11-45.

 

and there is much more my friend but i am not here to offend. but to show ur hippocracy. and the verses u mention its funny to see how u try to decieve people and i ask people to get a quran and check it for them selves. and also the books i have refered to to see who is lying.

 

there is also someone else who asked is there any evidence for the prophet in islam. what he failed to realise is that we have volumes of traditions that was witnessed an recorded by people. we also have with us letters even from the the negus(leader) of absinia (who was christian) to the prophet along with many other letters (including the caeser) as well as al the treaties that was written down and if that s not enough we also have the hair and footprint of our prophet. now in retaliation i request any form of unbiased objective not subjective evidence that such people (that many beleive as gods respectivly) did exist. if god existed on the earth as man why only india 330 million times and no where else? are they racially orientated? and if they were existant why is there no foreign written record that god was on earth in honesty ...wont men know when god visits the earth especially so many times?

 

there are many verses that i cannot comply with also one such as that the Earth is supported by a serpent.

 

The earths are seven in number, like 7 covers one above the other, the upper one is divided into 7 regions [ al-B. i.228 ]. There exists a serpent, Seshakhya, under the 7th lowest Earth, it has 1000 heads, so it feels no pain and bears the earths one above the other [ al-B. i.237 ]. Other texts say that the Earth is supported on a giant tortoise. Still others hold that this tortoise is in turn on top of a giant snake [ Kovoor 158 ]. Some other texts claim the Earth is held by 4 pillars, held by an elephant seated on a big tortoise [ Panda 69 ]. According to Balabhadra, the earth is in the midst of water, the lower part is immersed in water and the part above the water is round like the back of a tortoise [ al-B i.273 ].

 

one brother posted an article at the top saying the word semetic is from a sanscit word, then he goes into detail like i read another brother(Aditi Chaturvedi author of the vedic arabia theory) do wih the word namaz these are not arbic words!!! if u lie then lie properly pleassse you could fools people who dont know islam like many hindus have been thats why these things circulate but it realy doesnt work. the word namaz is only used by asians the word the prophet used for prayer was actually salaat which comes from the root word slm meaning peace/submission. and the term semetic was coined up in 1871 i beleive(not too sure bout date but roughly ther)by a jew named lugwig who used this term only to group a people who were closly related through language and these people did not include india or hindustan. and the word was made recently whereas sanscit is thousands of years old and the guy that invented the term did not understand sancrit so where is the basis off the claim please tell me??

 

pllease i beg of you with no disrepect understand before you criticise i understand that many hindu brothers have never even seen the vedas which are smrtu (revealed) books let alone read them. the claims such as christianity islam and so on comes from indian roots is plain conjecture with no evidence i refer you to top KNOWN scholars in the field of ancient studies in arabia such as professor coon or an anti-islamic christian by the name of moorey non ever talk of vedic arabistan unlike the unqualified brother Aditi Chaturvedi. please dont swallow all that is given too you because it might be poison only you will know

 

Bhagavat Gita 7-23 : Men of small intelligence worship the demigods, and their fruits are limited and temporary. Those who worship the demigods go to the planets of the demigods, but My devotees ultimately reach My supreme planet.

Yajur Veda 3:32: "...Of that God you cannot make any images."

 

Yajur Veda 32:3: "God is formless and bodiless"

 

Yajur Veda 40:8: "All those who worship the uncreated things, they are in

darkness, and you'll enter more into darkness if you worship the created things."

 

 

[Guest guest]

amzad bhai,

 

Indra is just a demigod and because he has powers , he does wrong things.

 

We are not demigod worshippers anyway, so you can go see someone who is.

 

Even Krishna has chastised Indra over and over.

 

By the way have you read the gita ever ?

 

http://vedabase.net/bg/

 

Read it if you have not , and see what you are missing !!

[Guest guest]

---------------------------

 

Bhagavat Gita 7-23 : Men of small intelligence worship the demigods, and their fruits are limited and temporary. Those who worship the demigods go to the planets of the demigods, but My devotees ultimately reach My supreme planet.

---------------------------

 

Oh So very nice to know that you accept the Gita and also the vedas !!!

 

I am so sure that now you will also accept the conclusion then.

 

Here are the verses from the gita :-

 

Chapter 15. The Yoga of the Supreme Person

TEXT 15

 

sarvasya caham hrdi sannivisto

mattah smrtir jnanam apohanam ca

vedais ca sarvair aham eva vedyo

vedanta-krd veda-vid eva caham

 

SYNONYMS

 

sarvasya--of all living beings; ca--and; aham--I; hrdi--in the heart; sannivistah--being situated; mattah--from Me; smrtih--remembrance; jnanam--knowledge; apohanam ca--and forgetfulness; vedaih--by the Vedas; ca--also; sarvaih--all; aham--I am; eva--certainly; vedyah--knowable; vedanta-krt--the compiler of the Vedanta; veda-vit--the knower of the Vedas; eva--certainly; ca--and; aham--I.

TRANSLATION

 

I am seated in everyone's heart, and from Me come remembrance, knowledge and forgetfulness. By all the Vedas I am to be known; indeed I am the compiler of Vedanta, and I am the knower of the Vedas.

PURPORT

 

The Supreme Lord is situated as Paramatma in everyone's heart, and it is from Him that all activities are initiated. The living entity forgets everything of his past life, but he has to act according to the direction of the Supreme Lord, who is witness to all his work. Therefore he begins his work according to his past deeds. Required knowledge is supplied to him, and remembrance is given to him, and he forgets, also, about his past life. Thus, the Lord is not only all-pervading; He is also localized in every individual heart. He awards the different fruitive results. He is not only worshipable as the impersonal Brahman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and the localized Paramatma, but as the form of the incarnation of the Vedas as well. The Vedas give the right direction to the people so that they can properly mold their lives and come back to Godhead, back to home. The Vedas offer knowledge of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Krsna, and Krsna in His incarnation as Vyasadeva is the compiler of the Vedanta-sutra. The commentation on the Vedanta-sutra by Vyasadeva in the Srimad-Bhagavatam gives the real understanding of Vedanta-sutra. The Supreme Lord is so full that for the deliverance of the conditioned soul He is the supplier and digester of foodstuff, the witness of his activity, the giver of knowledge in the form of Vedas and as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Sri Krsna, the teacher of the Bhagavad-gita. He is worshipable by the conditioned soul. Thus God is all-good; God is all-merciful.

Antah-pravistah sasta jananam. The living entity forgets as soon as he quits his present body, but he begins his work again, initiated by the Supreme Lord. Although he forgets, the Lord gives him the intelligence to renew his work where he ended in his last life. So not only does a living entity enjoy or suffer in this world according to the dictation from the Supreme Lord situated locally in the heart, but he receives the opportunity to understand Vedas from Him. If one is serious to understand the Vedic knowledge, then Krsna gives the required intelligence. Why does He present the Vedic knowledge for understanding? Because a living entity individually needs to understand Krsna. Vedic literature confirms this: yo 'sau sarvair vedair giyate. In all Vedic literature, beginning from the four Vedas, Vedanta-sutra and the Upanisads and Puranas, the glories of the Supreme Lord are celebrated. By performing Vedic rituals, discussing the Vedic philosophy and worshiping the Lord in devotional service, He is attained. Therefore the purpose of the Vedas is to understand Krsna. The Vedas give us direction to understand Krsna and the process of understanding. The ultimate goal is the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Vedanta-sutra confirms this in the following words: tat tu samanvayat. One can attain perfection by understanding Vedic literature, and one can understand his relationship with the Supreme Personality of Godhead by performing the different processes. Thus one can approach Him and at the end attain the supreme goal, who is no other than the Supreme Personality of Godhead. In this verse, however, the purpose of the Vedas, the understanding of the Vedas and the goal of the Vedas are clearly defined.

 

 

 

 

Chapter 18. Conclusion--The Perfection of Renunciation

TEXT 65

 

man-mana bhava mad-bhakto

mad-yaji mam namaskuru

mam evaisyasi satyam te

pratijane priyo 'si me

 

SYNONYMS

 

mat-manah--thinking of Me; bhava--just become; mat-bhaktah--My devotee; mat-yaji--My worshiper; mam--unto Me; namaskuru--offer your obeisances; mam--unto Me; eva--certainly; esyasi--come; satyam--truly; te--to you; pratijane--I promise; priyah--dear; asi--you are; me--Mine.

TRANSLATION

 

Always think of Me and become My devotee. Worship Me and offer your homage unto Me. Thus you will come to Me without fail. I promise you this because you are My very dear friend.

PURPORT

 

The most confidential part of knowledge is that one should become a pure devotee of Krsna and always think of Him and act for Him. One should not become an official meditator. Life should be so molded that one will always have the chance to think of Krsna. One should always act in such a way that all his daily activities are in connection with Krsna. He should arrange his life in such a way that throughout the twenty-four hours he cannot but think of Krsna. And the Lord's promise is that anyone who is in such pure Krsna consciousness will certainly return to the abode of Krsna, where he will be engaged in the association of Krsna face to face. This most confidential part of knowledge is spoken to Arjuna because he is the dear friend of Krsna. Everyone who follows the path of Arjuna can become a dear friend to Krsna and obtain the same perfection as Arjuna.

These words stress that one should concentrate his mind upon Krsna--the very form with two hands carrying a flute, the bluish boy with a beautiful face and peacock feathers in His hair. There are descriptions of Krsna found in the Brahma-samhita and other literatures. One should fix his mind on this original form of Godhead, Krsna. He should not even divert his attention to other forms of the Lord. The Lord has multi-forms as Visnu, Narayana, Rama, Varaha, etc., but a devotee should concentrate his mind on the form that was present before Arjuna. Concentration of the mind on the form of Krsna constitutes the most confidential part of knowledge, and this is disclosed to Arjuna because Arjuna is the most dear friend of Krsna's.

 

 

 

 

Chapter 18. Conclusion--The Perfection of Renunciation

TEXT 66

 

sarva-dharman parityajya

mam ekam saranam vraja

aham tvam sarva-papebhyo

moksayisyami ma sucah

 

SYNONYMS

 

sarva-dharman--all varieties of religion; parityajya--abandoning; mam--unto Me; ekam--only; saranam--surrender; vraja--go; aham--I; tvam--you; sarva--all; papebhyah--from sinful reactions; moksayisyami--deliver; ma--not; sucah--worry.

TRANSLATION

 

Abandon all varieties of religion and just surrender unto Me. I shall deliver you from all sinful reaction. Do not fear.

PURPORT

 

The Lord has described various kinds of knowledge, processes of religion, knowledge of the Supreme Brahman, knowledge of the Supersoul, knowledge of the different types of orders and statuses of social life, knowledge of the renounced order of life, knowledge of nonattachment, sense and mind control, meditation, etc. He has described in so many ways different types of religion. Now, in summarizing Bhagavad-gita, the Lord says that Arjuna should give up all the processes that have been explained to him; he should simply surrender to Krsna. That surrender will save him from all kinds of sinful reactions, for the Lord personally promises to protect him.

In the Eighth Chapter it was said that only one who has become free from all sinful reactions can take to the worship of Lord Krsna. Thus one may think that unless he is free from all sinful reactions he cannot take to the surrendering process. To such doubts it is here said that even if one is not free from all sinful reactions, simply by the process of surrendering to Sri Krsna he is automatically freed. There is no need of strenuous effort to free oneself from sinful reactions. One should unhesitatingly accept Krsna as the supreme savior of all living entities. With faith and love, one should surrender unto Him.

According to the devotional process, one should simply accept such religious principles that will lead ultimately to the devotional service of the Lord. One may perform a particular occupational duty according to his position in the social order, but if by executing his duty one does not come to the point of Krsna consciousness, all his activities are in vain. Anything that does not lead to the perfectional stage of Krsna consciousness should be avoided. One should be confident that in all circumstances Krsna will protect him from all difficulties. There is no need of thinking how one should keep the body and soul together. Krsna will see to that. One should always think himself helpless and should consider Krsna the only basis for his progress in life. As soon as one seriously engages himself in devotional service to the Lord in full Krsna consciousness, at once he becomes freed from all contamination of material nature. There are different processes of religion and purificatory processes by cultivation of knowledge, meditation in the mystic yoga system, etc., but one who surrenders unto Krsna does not have to execute so many methods. That simple surrender unto Krsna will save him from unnecessarily wasting time. One can thus make all progress at once and be freed from all sinful reaction.

One should be attracted by the beautiful vision of Krsna. His name is Krsna because He is all-attractive. One who becomes attracted by the beautiful, all-powerful, omnipotent vision of Krsna is fortunate. There are different kinds of transcendentalists--some of them are attached to the impersonal Brahman vision, some of them are attracted by the Supersoul feature, etc., but one who is attracted to the personal feature of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and, above all, one who is attracted by the Supreme Personality of Godhead as Krsna Himself, is the most perfect transcendentalist. In other words, devotional service to Krsna, in full consciousness, is the most confidential part of knowledge, and this is the essence of the whole Bhagavad-gita. Karma-yogis, empiric philosophers, mystics, and devotees are all called transcendentalists, but one who is a pure devotee is the best of all. The particular words used here, ma sucah, "Don't fear, don't hesitate, don't worry," are very significant. One may be perplexed as to how one can give up all kinds of religious forms and simply surrender unto Krsna, but such worry is useless.

[Guest guest]

WOW....it was indeed very enlightening and yet confusing...

SDear Brothers and sisters,

this is the first time I'm here and I'm so very impressed with all the information on religion.

But there is only one thing that made so sad... ignorance...

All those arguments and evidence of spiritual and historic knowledge are put to waste by pure ignorance and used as weapons to chastize and blashemy of religions. What a Waste...

Dont you all realize, may it be hinduism, juddaism,christianity or islam, its all from the same source...why dispute about the origin and the prophets, why dispute about the errors of human factor in the process of religion....

THE SOURCE is ONE... Krsna, Shiva, Allah and whateverthe names people call him....THE GOD is only one....

 

IN A KINGDOM

THERE SHOULD BE ONLY ONE KING

IN A FAMILY

THERE SHOULD ONLY ONE FATHER

IN THIS UNIVERSE AND BEYOND

THERE SHOULD BE ONLY ONE GOD.

[Guest guest]

MAHFOOZ ji

 

I am a hindu and a hare krishna and i whole heartedly back what you say !

 

keep it UP !

 

 

[Guest guest]

This is absoltuly mind-boggling . of purported research which I have ever come across.

 

 

[krsna]

Aditi Chaturvedi

Vedic Past of Pre-Islamic Arabia - Part 8

 

There was a price one had to pay if one wanted to live in the Arabia of the Prophet of Islam . That price was the

surrender of one's ancestral heritage, and all the values that one held sacred, of forcible subjugation, of curtailment of the individual right to choose one's god and method of worship. To live in Muhammad's Arabia, one had to give up the most cherished possession of human existence; that of the individual right to freedom of religion.

 

Arabia's Vedic culture had been slashed and ravaged to a state of tatters. In place of the tradition of spiritual tolerance and growth that defined Sanatan Dharma, Arvasthan was now the political center of a fanatical creed that ruled by the sword and held dear the values of extortion, greed and murder.

 

 

 

Figure1.

The huge Kalash atop Ad-Deir,

an ancient Vedic shrine in Jordan

Source: The Art of Jordan

 

As we have seen, the Prophet was completely unsuccessful in his Siege of the city of Taif . He therefore ended the campaign with the bitterly vituperative act of arson. Muhammad gave vent to his rage by setting fire to every tree around Taif, knowing fully well that such an act was defined as mass murder in the dry desert environs of Arabia. The Prophet was determined not to allow the Tribe of Thaqeef to survive. In order to implement his murderous intentions, Muhammad exhorted the subjugated Tribe of Hawazin (refer to Battle of Hunayn, Vedic Past of Pre-Islamic Arabia Part VII) to mercilessly harass the fortified city. All of the Thaqeef's herds were stolen at their pastures and all links to the trade with Mecca were severed. Isolated, starved and surrounded by death on all sides, the brave Thaqeef held on to their beliefs and subsisted on dry dates and water for at least one year. The morale of the Tribe collapsed steadily as they watched their children die day by day succumbing to starvation and disease. Those who were of the weakest character, gave in and secretly set out to negotiate terms with Muhammad. Their deputation was led by Urwa Bint Masud Al Thaqafi . Urwa the traitor accepted Islam and emboldened by his new found lease on life, ventured back to Taif to "invite his people to the true faith". Upon his return, when Urwa "went up to the room to show his people the Way of Islam", he was bombarded with arrows and died a traitor's death. The ferocious Thaqeef fought like heroes to the last to preserve the sacred honor of their beloved Mother Goddess, Al-Lat.

 

In the end of course, even the mighty Thaqeef could not last, they were compelled to send a deputation of six chiefs to negotiate peace with Muhammad. The chiefs were clear in their demands to the Prophet . In exchange for peace, they demanded that their holy territory of Wajj remain untouched, they would not break the idols of their beloved goddess Allat, no more trees could be cut down and the Thaqeef would retain their vineyards. Muhammad in his greed for the prosperous prize of Taif agreed, he even signed the treaty as Muhammad Ibn Allah foregoing the usual status of "Messenger of God" Allah at the insistence of the Thaqeef . It is another story of course, that he had ulterior motives in mind.

 

The Thaqeef were satisfied with the terms of the treaty and prepared to return home. Muhammad insisted that one of the traitors of Taif ,Al-Mughira, Abu Sofyan the traitorous leader of Mecca and a sizeable, Muslim army be allowed to follow them. The Thaqeef although suspicious, agreed in good faith. Upon reaching Taif, the Muslims showed their true colors. Al Mughira and his army surrounded the Temple of Allat and started smashing the idols with axes. Abu Sofyan even in his traitorous element was moved to cry out "Alas O Goddess! Alas!" Hundreds were massacred in sight of their families. The women of Taif collected in the streets, dishevelled and bare-headed, beating their breasts and weeping at the loss of their protectress, and the the inadequacy of their men who failed to protect her. As the unprepared Thaqeef were slaughtered, the anguished women cried out:

 

Weep! Weep for our protector!

Poltroons would neglect her

Whose swords need a corrector.

 

Every scrap of gold, jewellery and gems was plundered. Women and children were enslaved, the only ones who survived were those who were weak enough to bend at the threat of the Muslim sword and convert to Islam.

 

 

 

Figure 2.

Al-lat (Durga) of Amman

Source: The Art of Jordan

 

There were many other Temples in the vicinity of Taif , all of which were plundered, then destroyed or converted into mosques. Most of the temple fragments were buried underfoot so that the Prophet could satisfy his constant burning need to vituperate and insult the religion of his own ancestors. Among the temples that fell prey, were most of the shrines of Ruda (Rudra or Lord Shiva), Allat and Al-Uzza (forms of Shakti).

 

The consistent appearance of Temples dedicated to the divine couple of Shiva-Shakti throws light on the essential spiritual principles that the Hindus of Pre- Islamic Arabia upheld. Numerous instances support the preeminence of Shiva-Shakti worship in Arabia. The most obvious example is that of the Kaaba in Mecca.

 

 

 

Figure 3.

Allat of Palmyra

Source: Palmyra & its Empire

 

The Kaaba was dedicated to Al-lat and Al-Uzza both of which are forms of the Mother Goddess Shakti. The structure of the temple attested to the fact that it was based on the Tantric iconography of Devi Durga . The verses as written in the Devi-Mahatmya texts of the Markandeya Purana describe the formation of her physical body and iconographical attributes:

 

Born out of the bodies of all the Gods, that unique efflugence, combined into a mass of light, took the form of a woman, pervading the triple worlds with its lustre. In that efflugence,

the light of Shiva formed the face. The Tresses were formed from the light of Yama and the arms from the light of Vishnu Bhagwan

 

The two breasts were formed from the moon's (Somanath's) light, the waist from the light of Indra, the legs and thighs from the light of Varun, and hips from the light of the Earth (Bhoodev)

 

The feet from the light of Brahma

and the toes from Surya's (sun) light,

the fingers of the hand from the light of the Vasus(the children of Ganga)

and the nose from the light of Kuber .

 

The teeth were formed from the light of Prajapati, the lord of beings; likewise the Triad of her eyes was born from the Light of Agni (fire). The eyebrows from the two Sandhyas (sunrise and sunset) ; the ears from the light of the wind(Vayu). From the lights of other gods as well, the auspicious goddess was born.

 

Projecting an overwhelming omnipotence the three eyed goddess adorned with the crescent moon with her eighteen arms each holding auspicious weapons, emblems, jewels and other gifts offered by individual gods, emerged. With her pulsating body of golden color shining with the splendour of a thousand suns, standing erect on her lion vehicle (vahana) and displaying her triumph over the dark forces (shown in the form of a demon under her feet), she stands as the most spectacular personification of cosmic energy.

 

Among the 360 idols which surrounded the main shrine of the destroyed Kaaba were 16 magnificient ones that bordered the sanctum sanctorium. We know the names of the gods that inhabited these 16 important shrines. Every single one of these deities matches the Devi-Mahatmya's textual description of Devi Durga:-

 

Suwa which apparently stood for Lord Shiva

 

Ayam which stood for Lord Yama

Bag which stood for Bhagwan Shri Vishnu

Manat which stood for Somnath (Moon)

 

Sakiah which stood for Sakra (another name for Indra)

 

Al-Debaran which stood for Dev-Varun

Obodes which stood for Bhoodev (Earth)

 

Awal (first) which stood for Brahma

 

Shems which stood for Surya (Sun)

 

Wajj (pronounced "Vazz") which stood for the Vasus who were the seven sons of Ganga (corrupted to Zamza in the form of the ZamZam spring in the Kaaba)

 

Kaber which stood for Kuber

 

Aja which stood for Prajapati

 

Makha which stood for Agni (fire) (in Sanskrit Makha means a fire-sacrifice (Yagna), the city of Mecca got its name because of the fact that it was the site of the fire sacrifice)

 

Sunrise and

 

Sunset, called the two Auses which stood for the two Sandhyas (probably taken from Ushas)

 

Ha'uw which stood for Vayu (the wind)

The architectural elements of the Kaaba Temple consisted of a square block of black stone, crested by a crescent and sphere, which is encircled by 360 shrines. This is an exact representation of the Tantric Cit-kunda Yantra. Each element of the Yantra was represented in the Kaaba complex. The circle or Bindu symbolizes Shakti , it is embraced by the crescent or Shishu which symbolizes Shiva. This divine marriage shows the pure pre-creative stage of evolution. The beginning of creation is an omnipotent all-pervading cosmic principle - Shiva embracing his potential power -Shakti . Thus the crescent and moon symbol is the sign of the Self, which is aware of its inherent dynamic power. The four points of the square stone represent the four aspects of one's psyche: the pure self (atman), the inner self (antaratman), the cognizant self (jananatman) and the supreme self (paramatman) . The circle around these symbols represents both the wheel of time (the Vedic year consisted of 360 days) as well as the astronomical map of the universe and its 360 major heavenly bodies. The Kaaba in its symbolism therefore represented all the cosmic principles of the universe. It is the height of absurdity to call proponents of a culture that was capable of producing monuments such as these, as "superstitous polytheists and uncivilized pagans". The fact is that the Prophet of Islam destroyed a culture that was vastly superior in all scientific, spiritual, humanistic and symbolic respects, to his brand of theocracy. Ironically the word "Pagan" which has come to mean animalistic, has its very roots in the malpronounciation of the word "Bhagwan" (Divine God).

 

 

 

Figure 4.

Cit-Kunda-Yantra the Tantric pattern

that the Kaaba is based upon.

 

There is even more evidence that clearly suggests the conclusion that the Arabs used to worship different forms of the Divine Couple, Shiva-Shakti in many forms. Archaeological remnants of the Nabataeans who inhabited Arabia in the Pre-Islamic era, demonstrate that the chief deities were Dhu-Shara and Al-Uzza. As we already know Uzza was none other than Oorja or Shakti and since Du-Shara was her husband, it is quite logical to conclude that Du-Shara is a corruption of "Deveshwar" which is a Sanskrit synonym for Lord Shiva . Herodotus in his Histories also says of the Arabs " They deem no other to be gods save Dionysus and Heavenly Aphrodite ... they call Dionysus Orotalt and Aphrodite Alilat" (Negev 101). Alilat was again the corrupted version of Allat who as we know represented Alla (Durga). Dionysus her husband has all the traits of Shiva as well. Lord Shiva was known to have intoxicated followers called "Ganas". He was also known as "Pashupati" (lord of the beasts). He is always depicted wearing a Tiger Skin. The greatest clue to the Shaivite origin of Dionysus lies in the undeniable title of "fertility god". Just as the Shivling represents the creative energy, so too were phallic symbols made to represent Dionysus, the fertility God. Another clue that supports this conclusion is the fact that Du-Shara is represented as being surrounded by dolphins, as is Dionysus. It is quite plausible to suggest that Du-Shara and Dionysus were names for Lord Shiva and that their spouses Al-Uzza and Al-lat respectively, were names for Shakti.

 

Astrological references in the Vishnu Puran describe the shape of space in the following way:

 

"The heavenly form of the mighty Lord is made of stars and shaped like a dolphin with Dhruva (the Pole Star) in its tail. This dolphin shaped constellation which is the pathway of the stars' fixed abodes has its hub in the heart of the Lord. The sun, moon, stars and nakshatras together with the planets are bound to Dhruva in the tail of the Dolphin by fetters made up of a series of winds".

 

It is quite obvious that the Dolphin shaped constellation which represents the Hindu concept of the cosmos is the basis for Nabatean representations of dolphins in their sacred temples. They represented Du-Shara wielding a trident along with his consort Al-Uzza seated on a lion, surrounded by dolphins. The entire divine scene thus symbolized Shiva-Shakti and the shape of the spatial universe as envisioned by Vedic culture..

 

 

 

Figure 5.

Du-Shara, the, Nabataean

version of Lord Shiva.

Source: Deities and Dolphins

 

Dhruva himself was venerated in many Arab temples. He was worshipped as Duar in the Kaaba complex, where many other astronomical deities were revered. The Navagrahas or nine planets of Hindu cosmology each had an individual shrine dedicated to them in the Kaaba. We know the Arabic names for at least five of them.

 

 

Sanskrit Arabic English

Budh Wad Mercury

Surya Shems Sun

Somanath Manat Moon

Shani Al-Dsaizan Saturn

Shukra Al-Sharak Venus

 

 

The parallels are far too numerous to overlook. The Vedic theme that underlies the Kaaba and many Arabic temples, is apparent, when we add up all these fragments of evidence and consider them as a whole.

 

The fact that Muslim scholars have over the centuries tried their best to erase all such pieces of evidence speaks volumes. These irrefutable testaments to the Vedic origins of Arabia, were erased off the face of the earth by the Prophet of Islam in his quest for supremacy. Although only a few traces could survive the destructive assault of Islam, the truth still echoes from the silent remains of Nabataea, Sabaea, Palmyra and Dura-Europos, which eloquently tell of Arabia's past.

 

The stories that these ruins whisper have been ignored for centuries, it is time that they too were heard and given their rightful place in the history of Vedic civilization and the world.

 

Note: The Works "The Life & times of Muhammad" by Sir John Glubb, "Mohammed" by Anne Carter, "Yantra, the Tantric symbol of Cosmic Unity" by Madhu Khanna, "Deities and Dolphins by Nelson Glueck, "Classical Hindu Mythology" by Dimmitt and Buitenen, and "Hindu Temples: What Happened to Them? - Volume 2" by Sita Ram Goel have been used to compose this article.

 

[Guest guest]

amjad bhai

 

we know u are a muslim & u have love for ur man made religion.

 

i want to tell u that i was seeing a recent documentary on BBC related to human genes where even they have agreed that all have come from a single source in the past .

 

now we hindus believe strongly in OMKAAR tatva [(which has come from Lord Shiva (the Great Mahakaal)], & whatever has come to earth will perish & death is inevitable to what comes to life. u would agree that u do no come directly as a muslim but u have to convert yourself to one to be represented as a GREAT MUSLIM. only hindus do not have any such tradition of conversion since all of us know that this is the base from where everything other religion has come from. People like muhhammed liked to satisfy their egos & created a seperate ISLAM for themselves to be worshipped.

so amjad bhai u are welcomed to pass any comments

also it is clearly stated in the shivpuran that kalyug will represent majority from evils & so hindus are facing it but we would be brave enough to fight all the evils with peace & our love towards the SUPREME OMKAAR / MAHAKAAL

 

rgd

hemant

[Guest guest]

Good one Mahfooz .............Yes the source is one but, the one has become the many ......and the many will become the one again and this cycle will continue ....until there cannot be any more many's

 

......................this is the whole idea wether you call it Nirvana, Samadhi , salvation , kingdom of god or one with god.

[Guest guest]

I have read all the posts and all could fathom was the fact that Religions are at loggerheads with each other. They each call each other blind or deaf or incomplete or not true.

 

This is how I see all.

 

Hindus are blind.

 

Jews are deaf.

 

Muslims will forever remain in denial that they are both blind and deaf.

 

Christians are blind in left eye and hear not from the right ear.

 

Budhists are blind in right eye and hear not from the left ear.

 

Jains technically have both ears and eyes but refuse to hear or see.

 

Sikhs hear as well as see but can not comprehend what they see or hear.

 

Followers of some other isms hear from one ear and let the words escape from the other.

 

Only faculty all have in common is their Loud Voice in which they call each other Deaf or Blind Heathens.

 

Blind amongst them want to, and if they could, turn Whole Word Blind. Deaf amongst them want to, and if they could, turn Whole World Deaf. Collectively they all want every one else to be as ignorant as they themselves are. Above all, despite having failed to discover the roots of MAN, each one claims to be the Chosen by GOD.

 

GOD, if you are!!, then it is time you brought down Towers of Babble created by you to befuddle children of Man. Stop being a sadist. And, GOD, if you are not, then I pray Man is Man enough to do the Job.

 

Will we ever rid Mankind of its God given or Man invented Religions?

 

My real conclusion is the fact that “Religions Lost their innocence a long time ago and I for one refuse to treat them as Vestal Virgins”.

 

[Guest guest]

in this article you mentioned quite a lot about the idols in arabia. let me let you know that idol worship is even forbidden in hindu scriptures. in the rig veda it says he is one brahma without a second.The Vedanta declares, "The Supreme Being is One, there is none other than Him.""The Supreme Being manifests the manifest. He fulfils the desires of the good-natured. He is the Lord. He is Omnipresent. He is Worthy of all praise. He is the Object of all respect. He is Rich. He is the Greatest. He is the Creator of everything and has the knowledge of everything." - Rigveda (2:1:3).

 

The following mantra says, "The Supreme Being is the Sustainer of the Heavens and the Earth. For the wind of prosperity, He is the Source of Power. He is the One who gives provisions. He goes everywhere riding a powerful wind. He is the Beneficent. He is the Cherisher. He protects His worshippers." - Rigveda (2:1:6).

 

"The Supreme Being bestows riches to those who sing His praise. He is the Lord of the precious Sun. He maintains human affairs. He is the Object of veneration. He is Bountiful. He looks after those who worship Him in their homes." - Rigveda (2:1:7).

 

"That God, is One, who enters the hearts of men and knows their secrets." - Atharvaveda (10:9:29).he Rigveda has upheld that 'Truth is One'. This has been paraphrased further in the Shetash-watar Upanishad (chapter 6, mantra 11) where it says, "The lord of the Universe is One; He is the Soul of every living being, He is immanent in every form of life; He directs all actions, He is above all; He is everyone's Refuge, He sees all, He knows all; no epithet is applicable to Him."

 

Some people believe in the existence of Brahma, some do not. "One who does not believe in Him is His enemy. He destroys the possessions of His enemies." - Rigveda (2:12:5).

 

"He who does not need an ear to hear, and yet is the Source of the power of hearing, know! that He is Brahma. The one whom you worship, is not Brahma! - Upanishad.

 

He is the Supreme Soul, rich in Abundance. He sends His Messengers with programs which bring welfare to the poor. Wealth is earned through His Grace, and lost through His Wrath.

 

He can quieten the moving and restless world. He has created Space. He is the One who holds aloft the Heavens and the Earth. - Rigveda (2:12:2).

 

 

1. The Qur'an says, "God! There is no god but He, the Living, the Self-subsisting, Eternal. No slumber can seize Him, nor sleep. His are all things in the heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede in His presence except as He permits? He knows what appears to His creatures as before or after or behind them. Nor shall they compass anything of His knowledge except as He wills. His throne does extend over the heavens and the earth, and He feels no fatigue in guarding and preserving them, for He is the Most High, the Supreme in glory." - Sura Baqara (The Cow, 2:255).

 

* It is declared in the Upanishads, "God is One, there is no one worthy of worship except Him. The world is nothing without Him, i.e. it exists as long as He preserves it. The world cannot exist for a moment by rejecting Him."

 

2. The Qur'an says, "No vision can grasp Him, but His grasp is over all vision." - Sura An'am (The Cattle, 6:103).

 

* It says in Kenupanishad (1:3), "One whom no eye can see, on the other hand He sees all eyes, know that He is Brahma."

 

3. It is said in the Qur'an in the form of a prayer, "Show us the straight way." - Sura Fateha (The Opening, 1:6).

 

* In many places of the scriptures, notably in the Rigveda (1:189:1), it is said, "O' Self-revealing Lord of the Universe, guide us to the path which is beautiful."

 

4. The Qur'an says, "Say : He is God, the One and Only; God, the Eternal, Absolute; He begets not, nor is He begotten; and there is none like unto Him." - Sura Ikhlas (Purity, 112:1-4).

 

* Shetash-watar Upanishad (chapter 6, mantra 11) says, "The lord of the Universe is One; He is the Soul of every living being, He is immanent in every form of life; He directs all actions, He is above all; He is everyone's Refuge, He sees all, He knows all; no epithet is applicable to Him."

 

5. In the language of the Qur'an, Allah is Haqq, The Truth (the Reality). - Sura Hajj (The Pilgrimage, 22:62).

 

* In the Vedanta it is expressed as Brahma is The Truth.

 

6. The Qur'an says, "Whithersoever you turn, there is the Face (Presence) of God." - Sura Baqara (The Cow, 2:115).

 

* In the Geeta and other places it is said that His Face is looking at every direction. See for example, Rigveda (10:90:1), Samveda (6:13) and Atharvaveda (19:6:1).

 

7. The Qur'an says, "Say (O' Muhammad), I am but a man like you; it is revealed to me by inspiration, that your God is One God; so stand true to Him, and ask for His forgiveness." - Sura Sajda (Prostration, 41:6).

 

* In the Vedas, the Geeta and the Sacred Traditions, there are instructions to be respectful to One God, and to seek His forgiveness from all sins.

 

8. In the Qur'an, one who rejects the commands of God and His Prophets, is called a Kafir.

 

* One who shows disrespect to the Vedas and rejects the instructions contained in them is called a Nastik - literally, one who rejects.

 

9. Muslim is one who believes in God, obeys His commands and believes in His Messengers. Such a person is called an Aastik in Sanskrit. Just as Nastik is the opposite of Aastik, so is Kafir the opposite of Muslim. Just as an Aastik does not like to talk to a Nastik, so does a Muslim dislike argument with a Kafir. Therefore, Nastik and Kafir are synonymous, just as Aastik and Muslim mean the same. The difference is only of language. swami dayanand the founder of arya samaj was against idol worship and other practices like caste system according to him it lacked vedic sanction.

[gHari]

 

Tell me the names of the idols and tribes that worshipped idols that are mentioned in the Qu'ran.

 

Tell me why Mohammad (PBUH) did not enter India.

 

Did Abraham and Jacob call their God 'Allah'?

 

[Guest guest]

here we go little buddy

 

http://www.lankalibrary.com/geo/ancient/nasa.htm

[Gsid]

 

Vedic Past Of Pre-Islamic Arabia

By a Vedic Researcher

Many centuries before prophet Muhammad and the advent of Islam, Arabia or Arabistan was an extremely rich and glorious center of Vedic civilization. In this article, I will prove to you point by point that pre-Islamic Arabia was in fact a flourishing civilization which revered Vedic culture. In fact the Black Stone at the Kaaba is the Lingam of Lord Shiva. Millions of Muslims kiss this sacred emblem of Lord Shiva every day.

In learning about this most ancient heritage, let's begin with the word Arabistan itself. Arabistan is derived from the original Sanskrit term Arvasthan which means The Land of Horses. Since time immemorial proponents of the Vedic culture used to breed exceptional horses in this region. Thus eventually the land itself began to be called Arva (Horses) -Sthan (place). The people who lived in this land were called Semitic.

Semitic comes from the Sanskrit word Smritic. Arabs followed the ancient Vedic Smritis such as Manu-Smriti as their revered religious guides and thus they were identified as Smritic which has been corrupted into Semitic.

At that time the Uttarapath (Northern Highway) was the international highway to the North of India. It was via Uttarapath that Arabia and other Middle Eastern countries drew their spiritual, educational and material sustenance from India. Besides, this Sea-links were formed with India at least 800 years before the advent of Islam. Basra was the ancient gateway to India because it was at this port that the Arab lands recieved Indian goods and visitors. At that time the spoken language was Sanskrit, which later dwindled into the local variation that we now call Arabic. The proof of this is that thousands of words that were derived from Sanskrit still survive in Arabic today.

Here is a sampling of some:

Sanskrit, Arabic, English: Sagwan, Saj, Teakwood/ Vish, Besh, Poison/Anusari, Ansari, Follower/ Shishya, Sheikh, Disciple/ Mrityu, Mout, Mortal/ Pra-Ga-ambar, Paigambar, One from heaven/ Maleen, Malaun, Dirty, soiled,MALevolent/ Aapati, Aafat, Unfortunate, Karpas, Kaifas, Cotton/ Karpur, Kafur, Camphor/ Pramukh, Barmak, Prominent Chief/Naranga, Aranja, Orange.

Even various kinds of swords were referred to as Handuwani, Hindi, Saif-Ul-Hind, Muhannid and Hinduani. The Sanskrit Astronomical treatise Brahma-Sphuta-Siddhanta in Arabic translation is known as Sind-Hind, while another treatise Khanda-Khadyaka was called Arkand. Mathematics itself was called Hindisa .

The Arabs derived technical guidance in every branch of study such as astronomy, mathematics and physics from India. A noted scholar of history, W.H. Siddiqui notes:

"The Arab civilization grew up intensively as well as extensively on the riches of Indian trade and commerce. Nomadic Arab tribes became partially settled communities and some of them lived within walled towns practised agriculture and commerce, wrote on wood and stone, feared the gods and honored the kings."

Some people wrongly believe that Arabs used the word Hindu as a term of contemptuous abuse. Nothing could be further from the truth. The people of pre-Islamic Arabia held Hinduism in great esteem as evidenced from the fact that they would endearingly call their most attractive and favourite daughters as Hinda and Saifi Hindi. The fact that Arabs regarded India as their spiritual and cultural motherland long before the damaging influence of Islam is corroborated by the following poem which mentions each one of the four Vedas by name: (Note The English translation)

"Aya muwarekal araj yushaiya noha minar HIND-e Wa aradakallaha manyonaifail jikaratunOh the divine land of HIND (India) (how) very blessed art thou! Because thou art the chosen of God blessed with knowledgeWahalatijali Yatun ainana sahabi akha-atun jikra Wahajayhi yonajjalur -rasu minal HINDATUN That celestial knowledge which like four lighthouses shone in such brilliance - through the (utterances of) Indian sages in fourfold abundance.Yakuloonallaha ya ahal araf alameen kullahum Fattabe-u jikaratul VEDA bukkun malam yonajjaylatunGod enjoins on all humans, follow with hands down The path the Vedas with his divine precept lay down."

"Wahowa alamus SAMA wal YAJUR minallahay Tanajeelan Fa-e-noma ya akhigo mutiabay-an Yobassheriyona jatunBursting with (Divine) knowledge are SAM & YAJUR bestowed on creation, Hence brothers respect and follow the Vedas, guides to salvationWa-isa nain huma RIG ATHAR nasayhin Ka-a-Khuwatun Wa asant Ala-udan wabowa masha -e-ratunTwo others, the Rig and Athar teach us fraternity, Sheltering under their lustre dispels darkness till eternity"

This poem was written by Labi-Bin-E- Akhtab-Bin-E-Turfa who lived in Arabia around 1850 B.C. That was 2300 years before Mohammed!!! This verse can be found in Sair- Ul-Okul which is an anthology of ancient Arabic poetry. It was compiled in 1742 AD under order of the Turkish Sultan Salim.

That the Vedas were the religious scriptures to which the Arabs owed allegiance as early as 1800 B.C. proves not only the antiquity of the Vedas but also the existence of Indian rule over the entire region from the Indus to the Mediterranean, because it is a fact of history that the religion of the ruler is practised by his subjects.

Vedic culture was very much alive just before the birth of Muhammad.

Again let's refer to the Sair-Ul-Okul. The following poem was written by Jirrham Bintoi who lived 165 years before the prophet Muhammed. It is in praise of India's great King Vikramaditya who had lived 500 years before Bintoi.

"Itrasshaphai Santul Bikramatul phehalameen Karimun Bihillahaya Samiminela Motakabbenaran Bihillaha Yubee qaid min howa Yaphakharu phajgal asari nahans Osirim Bayjayholeen Yaha sabdunya Kanateph natephi bijihalin Atadari Bilala masaurateen phakef Tasabahu. Kaunni eja majakaralhada walhada Achimiman, burukan, Kad, Toluho watastaru Bihillaha yakajibainana baleykulle amarena Phaheya jaunabil amaray Bikramatoon" - (Sair-ul-Okul, Page 315)

"Fortunate are those who were born during King Vikram's reign, he was a noble generous, dutiful ruler devoted to the welfare of his subjects. But at that time, We Arabs oblivious of divinity were lost in sensual pleasures. Plotting & torture were rampant. The darkness of ignorance had enveloped our country.

Like the lamb struggling for its life in the cruel jaws of a wolf, we Arabs were gripped by ignorance. The whole country was enveloped in a darkness as intense as on a New moon night. But the present dawn & pleasant sunshine of education is the result of the favor of that noble king Vikram whose benevolence did not lose sight of us foreigners as we were. He spread his sacred culture amongst us and sent scholars from his own land whose brilliance shone like that of the sun in our country. These scholars & preceptors through whose benevolence we were once again made aware of the presence of god, introduced to his secret knowledge & put on the road to truth, had come to our country to initiate us in that culture & impart education."

Thus we can see that Vedic religion and culture were present in Pre-Islamic Arabia as early as 1850 B.C., and definitely present at the time of Mohammed's birth.

In his book Origines, Volumes 3 & 4", Sir W. Drummond adds "Tsabaism was the universal language of mankind when Abraham received his call, their doctrines were probably extended all over the civilized nations of Earth."

Tsabaism is merely the corruption of the word Shaivism which is Vedic religion. On page 439 of this book, Sir Drummond mentions some of gods of pre-Islamic Arabs, all of which were included in the 360 idols that were consecrated in the Kaba shrine before it was raided and destroyed by Muhammad and his followers. Here are some of the Vedic deities and their original Sanskrit names:

Arabic SanskritEnglish Al-Dsaizan,Shani,Saturn/Al-Ozi or Ozza,Oorja,Divine energy/Al-Sharak,Shukra,Venus/Auds,Uddhav-Bag,Bhagwan,God/Bajar,Vajra,Indra's thunderbolt/Kabar,Kuber, God of wealth/Dar,Indra,King of gods/Dua Shara,Deveshwar, Lord of the gods,Habal,Bahubali,Lord of strength,Madan,Madan,God of love/Manaph, Manu,First Man/Manat, Somnath, Lord Shiv/Obodes,Bhoodev, Earth/Razeah,Rajesh,King of kings/Saad,Siddhi,God of Luck/Sair,Shree,Goddess of wealth/Sakiah,Shakrah,Indra/ Sawara,Shiva-Eshwar, God Shiva/Yauk, Yaksha, Divine being/Wad,Budh,Mercury/

The Kaba temple which was misappropriated and captured by Muslims was originally an International Vedic Shrine. The ancient Vedic scripture Harihareswar Mahatmya mentions that Lord Vishnu's footprints are consecrated in Mecca. An important clue to this fact is that Muslims call this holy precint Haram which is a deviation of the Sanskrit term Hariyam, i.e. the precint of Lord Hari alias Lord Vishnu. The relevant stanza reads:

"Ekam Padam Gayayantu MAKKAYAANTU Dwitiyakam Tritiyam Sthapitam Divyam Muktyai Shuklasya Sannidhau"

The allusion is to the Vamana incarnation of Lord Vishnu whose blessed feet were consecrated at three holy sites, namely Gaya, Mecca and Shukla Teertha. Worshipping such carved, holy foot impressions is a holy Vedic custom which convert Muslims are inadvertently perpetuating. But in doing this they delude themselves and mislead others that these foot-impressions which are on reverential display in several mosques and tombs around the world are in fact Muhammad's own. There are several snags in this argument. Firstly worshipping a foot -impression amounts to idolatry and should therefore be taboo for a true Muslim. Secondly Muhhamad disclaimed having performed any miracles. Therefore there can be no foot-impression of his on stone.

Thirdly foot-impressions must always be in pairs like shoes. Yet in most of these shrines, it is usually a single footprint which suggests that Muhammad walked on only one foot. Another question that crops up is whether the foot-impression is of the same size and foot in all the shrines. The fact appears to be that when the Vedic Kaba shrine in Mecca was invaded by Muhammad, the pairs of foot impressions of Vedic deities there were plundered and later traded to the gullible and devout as Muhammad's own footprints for some favour, reward or personal gain by unscrupulous clergy. That is why they are single and not in pairs.

The Black Stone which is the Shiv Emblem (also known as Sange Aswad which is a corrupted form of the Sanskrit word Sanghey Ashweta--meaning non-white stone) still survives in the Kaba as the central object of Islamic veneration.

The Shiv Ling at The Kaba. It was broken in seven places and now is held together by a silver band.

All other Vedic Idols could be found buried in the precincts or trampled underfoot in labyrinthine subterranean corridors if archaeological excavations are undertaken. The Black Stone has been badly mutilated, its carved base has disappeared and the stone itself is broken at seven places. It's parts are now held together by a silver band studded with silver nails. It lies half buried in the South Eastern portion of the Kaba Wall. The term Kaba itself is a corruption of the Sanskrit word Gabha (Garbha + Graha) which means Sanctum.

In addition, in the inscriptions from Hajja and its neighborhood was found a votive vessel dedicated by members of two tribes called Rama and Somia. Rama and Soma are Vedic deities, Rama is of the Solar dynasty and Soma is of the Lunar Dynasty. The moon god was called by various names in pre-Islamic times, one of them was Allah.

Allah had 3 children, Al-Lat, Al-Uzza and Manat. Al-Lat and Al-Uzza were both feminine deities. Alla is another name for the Hindu goddess Durga. It is obvious that the goddess Al-Lat was Alla (Durga) and Al-Uzza was Oorja (energy or life force also known as Shakti). Manat was none other than Somnath which is another name for Lord Shiva. One significant point to note that Soma in Sanskrit means Moon and Nath means Lord. Thus the Kaba itself was dedicated to the Moon God Somnath alias Shiv and the word Somnath was corrupted to Manat. The famous Black Stone is none other than the ShivLing of Makkeshwar alias Mecca. Lord Shiva is always shown with a crescent Moon on his head and every Shiva temple is supposed to have a sacred water spring representing the Ganges. The Crescent Moon pinnacle of the Kaba and the Zamzam spring (actually Zamza from Ganga) are irrefutable testaments to the Vedic origins of the Kaba.

Maqam-E-Ibrahim or more appropriately the pedestal of Brahma. Muslims from all over the world pay homage to this shrine. This shrine is actually the pedestal of Brahma. Notice that the word, Ibrahim is actually a corruption of the word, Brahma. The octogonal grill which is a Vedic design, protects the holy footprints which represent the start of the creation nearly 2000 million years ago.

Before it was captured by the Muslims it was an international shrine of the Vedic trinity.

In fact the names of the holiest of Muslim cities Mecca and Medina come from the Sanskrit words Makha-Medini which means the land of Fire-Worship. Even the most ancient names of these 2 cities were Mahcorava- which came from Mahadeva (Lord Shiva) and Yathrabn - which came from Yatra-Sthan (place of pilgrimage).

Islam came into being about 1372 years ago. It is well known that over 7500 years ago, at the time of the Mahabharat War, Kurus ruled the world. The scions of that family administered the different regions.

Prophet Muhammed himself and his family were adherents of Vedic culture.

The Encyclopedia Islamia admits as much when it says: "Muhammed's grandfather and uncles were hereditary priests of the Kaba temple which housed 360 idols!"

According to Arab traditions, Muhammad is a title. We do not know what name his parents had given him. We do however know that the central object of worship which survives at the Kaba today is a Shivling. That was allowed to remain there because that was the faceless family deity of Muhammad's family. One of the original names of Lord Shiv is Mahadev (The Great God) therefore it is entirely possible Muhammad came from Mahadev. This appears fairly certain because the Arabs still have a Mahadevi sect. Moreover the title Mehdi of a Muslim chief is also a malpronounciation of the term Mahadeva. According to Sanskrit etymology the term Muhammad implies 'a person of great inspiration' - 'Mahan Madah yasya assau Muhammadah' In a hostile sense it also implies 'a person of a proud and haughty temperament'.

The Qurayshi tribe into which Mohammed was born was particularly devoted to Allah and and the three children of the Moon God. Therefore when Muhammad decided to spread his own Divine religion, he took innumerable aspects of the daily Vedic culture that surrounded him and applied them to suit the temperment of his era.

[Mothman]

I wonder why everybody hankers after the supremacy of his own God. Though I strongly believe that India was the ancient land with rich spiritualism and knowledge, I don't think we can discount other religions. If one considers the richness of the divinity and the scriptures that have been there for eons..one would certainly come to the conclusion nothing can be more complete and beyond what this holy land has to offer. Vedic scriptures are so wonderfully crafted by God or some Supreme Intelligence that their knowledge offers so many solutions related to many fields - health, astronomy, sciences etc., which is obviously not there in any other religion. Even if there is somewhere nothing could be to the extent of the knowledge in vedic scriptures.

I have seen personally from my muslim and christian friends.. they are so insecure about their religion and always get defensive about them. The irony is both descend from same lineage of prophets (I'll stick to the story) and still they fight amongst themselves. They are both trying to convert rest of the world to their religions and I believe this is mainly due to the caveats mentioned in the bible and quran. Both undoubtely say that you have to believe in jesus or allah only then you will go to heaven. There are so many things in bible and quran which I'm not sure they themselves are proud of..since it was written by mere mortals it's inevitable that the knowledge is limited considering the limited faculties of our brain. I'm not saying vedic scriptures are all perfect and stainless.. but it's only in small amounts compared to the vastness of gruesome and inhuman acts in bible and some racist views in quran. The very comprehensive nature and the knowledge of Vedic scriptures show the greatness of these scriptures and the religion they gave birth to which undoubtedly surpass the cults which evolved into religion. On the other hand these vedic scriptures do not suggest to degrade other races anywhere and because of the tolerance of the this holy land most civilizations and religions have survived.

Hindus are the only people in the world who do not even try to convert other people to their hinduism, because we don't have to since nowhere it's mentioned in the vedic scriptures if you believe in only Lord Krsna or Rama or Lord Shiva only then you will be liberated. There are many ways to attain liberation which are clearly mentioned in the scriptures. Just because these supposedly cullts which evolved into religions spread like wildfire doesn't mean they are true and god given religions..just like a rumour spreads.

These discussions will never stop till the end of humanity. It's just to satisfy one's ego.

Everything evolved from only ONE Supreme Intelligence. It's the same intelligence that's playing with all of us.

[ferdi452000]

Before Mohamed ie 600 A.D, at the time of Jesus there existed only one group of people who are called Jews.There is lot of similiarities with Christian names and Islam Names.For Example Christians name is ABRAHAM, where as ISlam Name Ibrahim. Christian Name : DAVID- Islam Name is DAVOOD, SOLOMON-SALMAN, YOSHUVA-YOUSUF, MARY-MARIAM like this we can see lot of examples.In those days Abraham had two children one is Isac born through his wife SAARAAH, and Ismail born through his maid servant AAKAR.This two children were multiplied JEWS. This is is the history.

 

It is true that the stone in Mecca is the shivlinga. But you should understand that there is no any religion called as" HINDU" This may be surprising to you but it is True. The truth is that "HINDU"means the name of the people who lived in the banks of river "SINDHU".if you have any clarification please write me.

[Daily Bread]

Hariom. Where is the Sayar ul Okul ? Why its not in print edition. People talk about a library in Turkey that doesn't exist. Muslims always use this fact when arguing with Hindus and its true. PN Oak has received critism from theories with little proof to support his fact. If Indian empire existed beyond Afghanistan, its remains would certailnly be there just as the Mesopotamian and Zorastrian remains existed.