Artificial meat?

[Gauracandra]

Anyone have an opinion on this? Personally I've always found the idea of fake meat to be rather disgusting. True it is all fake, but still trying to get something to taste like meat seems (for vegetarians) to be a subtle attachment for meat consumption. Of course it is far better than eating meat, but still I don't like it conceptually.

[JRdd]

I know exactly what you mean GC but I have to admit I do make vegy burgers once in a while. It doesn't remind me of meat though, not at all, though I know it is intended as a meat substitute. Once I visited a devotee friend who had just moved outside the temple to go to college, and she had this stuff taht was so much like roast ****, in taste but also--worse--in texture, all rubbery and chewy, that I could not go near it. It was TOO much like the real thing.

 

I remember a devotee in England who was a very good cook sometimes made what was supposed to represent a BLT. It was eggplant slices pakora-ed with black cumin and black salt, two of these sandwiching homemade cream cheese with sesame seeds, and including tomato slices. Now that was incredible, it was prasadam, and it did not remind me of anything except itself. However, I can't remember meat much after more than thirty years of shunning it.

 

Jayaradhe

[bhaktajoy]

All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

Dear Prabhus,

Please accept my humble obeisances.

Suffering due to meat eating far outweighs the taste to the tongue.Temporary illusion,our temporary bodies are not meant to simply satisfy our senses.When we realize we are merely guest in this world then where is the trouble?We are child of the divinity,loss and gain cannot even touch our shadow!

 

I left meat eating few months ago(I am pretty new)and am all happy.

 

HARIBOL!

Always your servant,

Bhakta Joy

[Pratyatosa Dasa]

Originally posted by Gauracandra:

 

Anyone have an opinion on this? Personally I've always found the idea of fake meat to be rather disgusting

I have heard that Srila Prabhupada said that people who like the taste of meat will be completely satisfied by eating preparations containing curd deep fried in ghee.

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

I remember seeing occasionally on the news that some of the fake meat actually has meat products in it. Sound ridiculous, but true. They were basically some for of oversight. Like I remember one where a veggie weaner was vegetarian except for the thin covering around it which was animal product.

 

Personally I can't see how anyone would want to eat something resembling meat. I nearly throw up if I just smell someone cooking it while walking in the road.

 

And the fish market! That's a place I can't stand walking by. The smell is so bad I find it hard to believe people can actually think of eating it.

 

[Gauracandra]

To me vegie burgers aren't a problem, as I don't think most are trying to taste like meat. They are more just a filling than anything else. I remember several years back going to a Ratha Yatra, and seeing an Indian gentleman going up to purchase a pizza. He saw the fake peperoni, and got a bit disturbed asking "What is this?". I was standing in line, and explained it was fake, but that non-devotees would like it better.

 

As for curd fried in ghee - who wouldn't be satisfied with that

[JRdd]

I am shocked that a Rathayatra festival would have pizza with fake pepperoni on it. That is just shocking. Pepperoni is among the more disgusting meats anyway, made of all kinds of junky garbagy animal parts, spiced up to disguise the disgusting reality.

 

I have been diagnosed with serious protein deficiency, which was caused by illness but also created more complications and wound me up in emergency a couple of weeks ago. Now I am told to go on a high-quality protein diet (along with fresh greens etc, of course) and from their limited standpoint they suggested soy things (which I am not fond of and which, when nonorganic, are extremely iffy anyway, as soy has been one of the main foods to be grown with genetic engineering, and also there are serious questions being raised about its harmfulness), and they suggested cottage cheese and yogurt. I know about balancing protein and generally eating healthy, but I am a bit stumped regarding what high quality protein products I can be eating. Not just a bunch of protein, which is hard on my liver, but that the protein I do eat, in a small amount, should be strong, if you get my meaning. So does anyone have any suggestions. Even where I can research this?

Pratyatosa prabhu, I also heard, as a very young devotee (another Prabhupada said, okay) that ones gets the blood of the animal through ghee. Something like that. I'm sure someone here must have the exact quote. And that anyone could very easily and naturally become vegetarian if given food cooked in ghee.

ys, Jayaradhe

PS I have another question. I have heard that when you pay for food it loses its karma of the person who prepared it. Anyone hear this?

[Gauracandra]

Jaya Radhe,

 

Take care of yourself with your eating. I'm no expert but I did take a nutrition class in college many years ago. The main thing to understand is not so much which food has the most protein, but rather which foods have protein complements. Basically the body can only process proteins in certain proportions to one another. So if you eat a lot of the same kinds of proteins your body actually wastes most of it. First your body can only handle so much at a time (to convert to muscle etc...). Second, it needs the proteins to be in certain ratios to one another. So proper nutrition requires eating complementary proteins. The only one I remember specifically is corn and rice. Both separately have protein, but when eaten together they complement one another and the body does much better in protein consumption. So if you do any research I would focus on that area. Also, instead of 3 meals a day, try 5 smaller meals each day. The body will be able to process the protein better and waste less. Another little tidbit is that the yam is the most nutritious vegetable, and the eggplant the least nutritious.

[JRdd]

Thanks, Gauracandra prabhu! I think that is the kind of advice I was looking for. I too know someting about combining proteins so that their total becomes more than their parts (I forgot how to say that expression), but I forget some. My favorite of course is kitri. But I think right now I need super protein, of the kind often considered vegetarian meat, like certain legumes Prabhupada mentioned as being too high in protein. When we are unhealthy we have to sometimes do unusaul things to get back to health. Of course, Srila Prabhupada is so pure that when he was dangerously ill as a child, and they converted the whole kitchen and got new pots to make him the doc-prescribed chicken soup to save his life, when the bowl was raised to his lips he threw up--and got well! But I myself have resorted to garlic many a time do to an unnatural or unhealthy state of the body, and I recall that in Los Angeles once, when Dr Dernard or someone like that prescribed garlic in milk for a devotee, that Srila Prabhupada, who was there at the time (as was I) said this was okay. Hope that memory is correct.

Anyone I am getting a bit off the point here, of the protein issue. So I will start as you say, keywording complementary po\roteins, I guess, and if you get any more keyword suggestions please let me know. Happily I am at least eating again. Five meals? I am lucky to drudge up two small ones at this point. But I do prefer small eating several times, than large eating fewer times. Taxes the system.

I did not know that about eggplant. I think I go through phases of eating a lot of it because it falls into the bitter food category, which I only just found out last recently. My body sometimes craves it. Yams, I can dig it. They're great! Anymore ideas are most welcome, and thanks for the feedback.

ys, Jayaradhe

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

There is a verse either from Manu, Mahabharata or Chanakya (I just can't seem to recall the source, but its one of these three) that says of all food the best is meat (i.e. for creating fat), but better than meat is clarified butter (ghee). I was looking for the verse but couldn't find it.

 

But I did come across a nice verse that isn't related to this topic. I will post it now otherwise later when I try to look up this verse I will find the verse I was looking for above.

 

"Of curd when it is churned, that which is its subtle part rises upward and becomes

clarified butter. In this very way, of food when it is eaten, that which is the subtle part rises upward and becomes the mind" - Chandogya Upanishad, 6.6.1-2

 

[JRdd]

Jahnava Nitai prabhu, could you please elaborate on or explain this verse? It is very intriguing to me but I'm not quite grasping it.

Thanks in anticipation,

ys, Jayaradhe

[bhaktajoy]

"You are what you eat"

[JRdd]

Thanks Bhaktajoy. Well I did get that gist of it, but I think there are technical or practical details that I'm not quite grokking. Like what is the subtle part of particular foods. Does each individual food have its subtle and gross parts?

 

And what would this mean, for example, about the curd part, or the less subtle part? What does it become? A strong body?

 

Originally posted by jndas:

"Of curd when it is churned, that which is its subtle part rises upward and becomes

clarified butter. In this very way, of food when it is eaten, that which is the subtle part rises upward and becomes the mind" - Chandogya Upanishad, 6.6.1-2

 

[atma]

 

Fake meat made my life easier a few years ago when my little one was entering nursery school. By law the schools provide lunch to all the kids in nursery grade.They want to make sure that the kids have a meal before class. I told them that she was vegetarian and she could bring her own lunch. They agreed with the condition that her plate should look the same like the other kids. They gave me the menu one week in advance and every day she took her lunch and ate with the children. Veggie chicken, burgers, gelatine made with agar agar, saved me from removing her from school. All the "fake" products don't taste or smell like the originals at all and can be good fillings for a sandwich, at least the ones that I know.

When I have to go to work I have to pass for a fast food restaurant and the smell is revolting, so true, you feel like cutting the air with a knife, so saturated with grease and blood.

 

[JRdd]

Your face sure looks funny when you're mad, Atma. Yeah it sounds like you did the best practical thing you could at the time. Makes me mad too, that they would force you to do that, subjecting your daughter to the idea of meat and all. Especially when schools ban prayer, librarians are not allowed to wear crosses on their necklaces, and all in the name of not offending anybody! What about the religious or vegetarian people? Guess they don't count as being worthy of not offending?

ys, JR

[Pratyatosa Dasa]

Originally posted by Pratyatosa Dasa:

 

I have heard that Srila Prabhupada said that people who like the taste of meat will be completely satisfied by eating preparations containing curd deep fried in ghee.

I found the following in the Folio, which more or less confirms the above:

 

Conversation, Melbourne, 2 July, 1974

 

Madhudvisa: ...cooking cheese and

spicing it with asafoetida and ginger, meat taste can be simulated very, very nicely.

 

Prabhupada: This cheese as it is you take, it is as beneficial as meat.

 

Madhudvisa: Protein.

 

Guest (2): Yes, yes. Similar protein.

 

Prabhupada: So why the animal should be killed? Take milk.

 

[JRdd]

Hare Krsna!

(edited out because of a repeat)

 

[This message has been edited by JRdd (edited 02-15-2002).]

[bhaktajoy]

All glories to srila prabhupada!

Dear Jrdd prabhu,

The food we eat have many subtle qualities which can only be felt but cannot be seen.This verse is just an example...butter is also contained in the curd but remains subtle.When we see colorful fruits and veges we feel the beauty of nature and the happiness,but when we see meat full of blood and disgusting smell we don't like that.We are what our thoughts are and good thoughts come from well being.Eating meat also fill us with bad karma and we start to feel the depression,anger,etc.Modern scientists cannot explain this as they remain very much busy pondering over the external only.Truth is beautiful and it is Shiva(the demigod of destroyer)which destroys all our ignorance...

my 2 cents worth

Take care my friend...God bless ya

HARE KRISHNA!

 

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

The essential part of digested food is ‘rasa’ (called in English roughly as chyle).

 

This rasa is primarily infused into food by the moon. In the Gita Lord Krishna states this as follows:

 

pushnami caushadhih sarva

somo bhutva rasatmakah

 

"I become the moon and thereby supply the juice of life to all herbs."

 

This "rasa" originating from the moon is the subtle energy of the plant. The moon is the predominating deity of the mind, and thus through the "rasa", the moon directly influences the mind of everyone.

 

Another level of understanding is that the subtle form of food is refering to the congregate modes of nature involved.

 

The Upanishads state:

 

"From purity of food follows purity of mind."

- Chandogya Upanishad, 7.26.2

 

Thus making it clear that the food one eats influences one's consciousness according to the modes associated with each.

 

Another verse from Chandogya Upanishad states:

 

"Mind is surely made of food, vital force (prana) is made of water, and speech is made of fire." - Chandogya Upanishad 6.6.5

 

This refers to the elements which power and influence the respective fields of activity. Speech is created from the fire within the stomach (that may require further explanation), Prana is composed of water and air (on the physical level), and the state of mind is formed based on the combination of gunas and rasa (i.e. the influence and the ingredients).

 

[Pratyatosa Dasa]

Originally posted by Pratyatosa Dasa:

 

I have heard that Srila Prabhupada said that people who like the taste of meat will be completely satisfied by eating preparations containing curd deep fried in ghee.

Here's another quote which tends to support the above statement:

 

Srila Prabhupada, 12 July 1973, London, BG Lecture:

 

"...A small piece of meat they are eating, not very much. But for these small pieces, so many population, huge quantity of slaughterhouse is being maintained. They cannot give up that small piece of meat. What is the difficulty? They can make... The same thing can be made by milk, milk product, channa. What do you call curd? Cheese. You prepare cheese and fry it. You'll get the same taste. But let the animal live, take its milk, and prepare so many milk preparations. But these rascals will not do. You kill simply for this tongue. It is so strong, this tongue. They cannot give up this, I mean to say, formidable tongue. He is demanding, "You must give me meat." So they are obliged. And for this obligation, they are committing so much sinful activities..."

 

[Avinash]

Do you people eat ladies finger?