Vipramukhya Swami quits

[Guest guest]

THIS MESSAGE WAS POSTED ON COM TODAY -

 

Letter PAMHO:5977801 (140 lines) [W1]

Vipramukhya Swami

11-Sep-02 15:18 (10:18 -0500)

vipswami@

Bcc: Padyavali (dd) ACBSP (Vancouver - CAN) [3986]

Apologies and departure

---------------------------

September, 2003

 

My dear friends and disciples in ISKCON,

 

Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

 

I'm sure some of you who saw me this summer, might have wondered why I had grown my hair out a little bit. One person even asked me about it the other day in England and I told him it was because of observing "chaturmasya" - the four months of the rainy season in India when sannyasis in the renounced order of life typically perform austerity, which sometimes includes not shaving.

 

Unfortunately, it is not actually the case with me.

 

And so it is with a heavy heart that I write this letter that I never thought would be written. After giving so many years of my life to the Hare Krishna Movement (more than 29), twenty of which have been as a sannyasi, I have reached an emotional and spiritual crossroads. I have tried as sincerely as I could to give my mind, body and soul to the eternal service of my spiritual master, Srila Prabhupada, and also trying my best to help others in need. Yet, while working sincerely to help others, I regret that I neglected my own emotional and spiritual needs.

 

Although I never stopped chanting my rounds, over the last few years my rounds became sloppy," and although I worshipped Salagram and Govardhan Silas, gave many lectures, and traveled the globe, I could not shake the loneliness and emptiness of my silent world.

 

I felt unable to discuss my problems with anyone for fear of repercussions and the blight that someone in my position might encounter for having such problems. Regretfully, I also confess that seeking some kind of recourse and companionship, I was not always able to strictly follow the regulative principles, though I was not able to discuss this with anyone except one kind devotee who has been a true friend.

 

It might come as a surprise to some of you that someone like me, who was blessed to have so many truly good and descent friends in the Hare Krishna Movement, could feel so alone and isolated within himself, but that is exactly what I have felt over the years.

 

I joined ISKCON at the age of 20 after a brief and short failed marriage from the age of 18. Two years later, at the age of 22, I was put up for consideration to take sannyasa, which I eventually did accept at the age of 28. I was approved for accepting disciples at the age of 32 and accepted my first disciples at the age of 33.

 

Now, many years later, at the age of 49, I have reached a dead end in my ability to continue. There are truly good friends and disciples out there that have loved me and dedicated their lives to assisting ISKCON under my guidance, and for them I have no proper words to say. It is not that I want to neglect you or abandon you. It is only that I am simply unable to continue living the external show of being the advanced devotee that I am not. I don't think that would be beneficial either to you or to me.

 

There are advanced devotees in ISKCON, and it is my duty to request those who have accepted guidance and shelter under me to take shelter of other senior devotees within ISKCON, and if in doubt to consult your local GBC representative. I bear no ill toward the GBC or ISKCON, and have not ever knowingly preached in such a way that would be considered inappropriate for a representative of ISKCON.

 

As my behavior and activities are no longer appropriate for someone in the renounced order of life or spiritual leader, I will no longer be able to maintain those posts of honor.

 

As for me, I still believe in Srila Prabhupada and Krishna. I still believe in the GBC system that Srila Prabhupada set up for ISKCON. However, I will be living a life of seclusion from ISKCON now and will sort out my personal emotional and spiritual needs independently.

 

I sadly release my disciples and aspiring disciples. I hope that you do not curse me out of anger and despair. However, it would be cruel and unfair if I were to falsely mislead you into believing that I am in some way qualified or capable to act as your true spiritual master. I am not. The email addresses that most people know for reaching me will be discontinued shortly after sending this letter. I wish to be left alone for awhile.

 

One or two persons regularly send me donations. Vrindavan-lila and the Garrisons in New York regularly send me money. I am no longer qualified to receive these contributions.

 

In Vancouver, Canada, I have a lot of stuff in a corner room in which I lived for many years at the temple. These things include the bed, the dresser of drawers, the couch, the electric heater and the microwave oven. I give these to Madhumati devi dasi with the exception of the bed, which should remain as part of the room. In that room there are some white cabinets to the right as you enter the door from outside.

 

Jaya Govinda Prabhu has the key to those cabinets. I have already removed the valuables from those cabinets that I wish to keep and have taken them away. The rest may be discarded or kept by whoever desires them. The air conditioner belongs to Janardana dasa but I think he will not come and remove it from the room.

 

At Bhaktivedanta Manor in England I have some cabinets in the sannyasa guestroom in the brahmacari ashram. Likewise, I have already gone through these cabinets and removed what I wish to keep. However, in the right hand cupboard there is a chest of drawers (where the blue network wire emerges from). Next to that you will find two microphone stands. These belong to the theatre department. I am leaving them the pop-screens attached to those stands, although I have taken the studio microphones which I purchased with my mother's money.

 

Inside my small room between room 4 and 5 in the brahmacari ashram, I have also removed the things I wish to keep. I suggest the microwave oven remain as part of that small room. Of particular interest, however, is that I left a stereo CD player in that room. I wish that his CD player be given to Dvaraka Puri and the theatre department. The rest of the items in the room may be dispersed or discarded, as I have already removed whatever I wish to keep. ISKCON Long Island, in Freeport, NY, owes me $10,000 plus interest for a loan I gave them to help pay off the mortgage, as documented in the promissory note that we drew up at the time of the loan. Although I am no longer continuing with my roles in ISKCON, I would expect that this money be paid back as planned, as this was money I received from my mother.

 

I wish you all well, and I pray that although fallen, I may one day be forgiven for my offenses. Although I have about 40 initiated disciples, there are a few very close friends and disciples who I see or speak with regularly and who will always be close to my heart, and who may be affected even more than others. I wish to mention these people by name. Manik, Prema Lila, Madhumati, Bhakta Chris and Rasa Parayani, Vraja Vilasini, Citralekha and Mirabhai - will all be deeply affected by my departure. Others such as Panca Pandava, Ekacakranath, Amrta Keli, Devahotra, Taruna Krishna and his wife Gokula Taruni, Mayapur Lila, and Vrindavan Lila have all been close disciples in Canada, the USA, Australia and Great Britain. My apologies to all of you for my shortcomings.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

Vipramukhya dasa

 

[theist]

Growing pains?I think so.It's not easy to face up to our shortcomings, especially from such a public position.

 

Crisis for his ex-disciples.They will need alot of real support.

 

Vipramukya das also when he decides to resurface.

 

Perhaps we should put more focus on Caitya-guru?

[Tarun]

Our dear godbrother Vipramukhya Prabhu stayed & conversed with SrIla SrIdhardev Mhrj at SrI Chaitanya Saraswat Math in NavadvIp 1981-2.

That fact alone is sufficient to save anyone from Kaliyuga's greatest pitfalls.

We all travelled together by rented City Bus (automatic tranny) from 439 Henry St Brooklyn, NYC to be with SrIla PrabhupAd in Philadelphia for Ratha-yatra 1975.

[Tarun]

Greetings & respectful obeisances from Merumala dd, MAdhava & JagannAth.

We remember u fondly from our Berkeley days together 1986-88.

Let's keep in contact.

Whenever u pass through Tampa Bay Area, don't forget to call or email us.

We hope u can stop at our home, stay for some time, sharing prasAd + your realizations with us:

8621 Robilini Road

Port Richie, FL 34668

1-727-510-2536

trnkr@

ps - Somewhere it is written: "it is times like these which show us who our friends really are."

[gHari]

I really liked Vipramukhya Swami. He was always very encouraging to me over the internet. I think perhaps the association of fellow airline passengers could have contributed to his current dilemma.

 

I expect Krsna to remain his real love, and we will see him again soon with an even greater zeal to save the world from their desperate lives.

 

I think I can understand his feeling alone in such a position. Even rank and file devotees were under a lot of pressure to be always proper. Surrounded always by demons, I sometimes attempt to reveal my mind - each such disaster quietens the heart even more. But Krsna will listen, as the heart pours out the mahamantra.

 

Perhaps Arjuna has laid down his bow for a bit, but armed with yoga and detachment he will surely again enter the battle.

 

Vipramukhya Swami Ki Jai!

[theist]

SB 4.12.33

TRANSLATION

The great associates of Vaikunthaloka, Nanda and Sunanda, could understand the mind of Dhruva Mahäräja, and thus they showed him that his mother, Suniti, was going forward in another plane.

 

 

PURPORT

This incident proves that the siksä- or diksä-guru who has a disciple who strongly executes devotional service like Dhruva Mahäräja can be carried by the disciple even though the instructor is not as advanced. Although Suniti was an instructor to Dhruva Mahäräja, she could not go to the forest because she was a woman, nor could she execute austerities and penances as Dhruva Mahäräja did. Still, Dhruva Mahäräja was able to take his mother with him. Similarly, Prahläda Mahäräja also delivered his atheistic father, Hiranyakasipu. The conclusion is that a disciple or an offspring who is a very strong devotee can carry with him to Vaikunthaloka either his father, mother or siksä- or diksä-guru. Srila Bhaktisiddhänta Sarasvati Thäkura used to say, “If I could perfectly deliver even one soul back home, back to Godhead, I would think my mission—propagating Krsna consciousness—to be successful.” The Krsna consciousness movement is spreading now all over the world, and sometimes I think that even though I am crippled in many ways, if one of my disciples becomes as strong as Dhruva Mahäräja, then he will be able to carry me with him to Vaikunthaloka.

 

[Guest guest]

I just read Vikramukhya Maharaja's article "Apologies And Departure"

and it really striked me.

 

Again, one more Gaudiya Vaisnava decided to have a break. What would Srila

Prabhupada say? He would find a way to cut a bubble. A wonderful, magical

moment when your spiritual master looks deep in your eyes and says few words

from Vaikuntha.

 

Immidiately after reading it, I found this on web:

 

"A Time for Looking Ahead

Middle age brings a greater awareness of what is at the end of life. The

greatest danger in our middle age self-examination is disappointment. If

severe enough, this can lead to what is known as a "mid-life crisis." A

crisis at this time of life often stems from a feeling that time is running

out and that life has passed you by. How

each of us faces and deals with mid-life is a personal decision. It is the

time to recognize the splendor of maturity, of knowing who and what we are

and where we stand."

 

We are not our bodies, but we live in our bodies and our bodies have some

rules and regs which we have to understand.

 

It is a hard thing to train a sannyasi, this world needs sannyasis and

leaders very much.

 

I really, really hope Vikramukhya Maharaja will find a "magical" person to

look into his eyes and say those magic words to continue.

 

It is a test.

 

[Guest guest]

maybe,although sanyasa was originally brought into Krishna Bhakti by Mahaprabhu

as a means to gaining respect as a serious scholar of Vedanta.

Previously Bhaktas were slightly looked down upon by the Advaitans and the like as being

emotionally affected and not serious about jnana.

[Jagat]

<h2>Vipramukhya’s retirement</h2>

 

Jagadananda Das

 

Vipramukhya Prabhu writes that he still has faith in doctrines taught by Srila Prabhupada, yet because of feelings of loneliness and the desire to find companionship in members of the opposite sex is unable to continue in his functions as a sannyasi and guru. As a result, he feels obliged to leave Iskcon after thirty years of service in which, I assume, he has achieved immense expertise in inspiring devotees, knowledge of the scriptures, experience of Iskcon management, and even a certain amount of devotion. I would like to propose that this “falldown” is probably a step to increased wisdom and that Vipramukhya’s enhanced experience might make him even more qualified to lead and guide devotees, if only the institution itself would allow it.

 

Longtime devotees have by now become accustomed to the “retirement” of leading sannyasis like Vipramukhya Swami. Though few are shocked or surprised, those who knew him, those who were his disciples, those who depended on his experience and knowledge, have no doubt been greatly disturbed by his departure. Some will just feel sad and let down, others cheated and angry. The cynical devotee says “punar mushiko bhava” and “vantashi” or some other derogatory term, but the fact remains that a sannyasi’s falldown is a great loss to the movement, making waves not only of a practical nature, but touching the very basis of the movement itself—faith in the process of bhakti yoga.

 

I do not know Vipramukhya. He may be a dishonest man who has prepared his departure by embezzling money that is rightfully Iskcon’s. I hope this is not the case, but I will write this article as though it were not. Even so, the embezzlement of funds might be considered a rather natural consequence of being in his position. After sacrificing years of one's life, when one knows that has been living a lie and decides to leave, he realizes that once "on the outside" he will have to find a way of maintaining himself as a householder. Though some falling sannyasis may have a parachute of some kind, many gave up their material heritage and then spent years and years as preachers, accumulating little in the way of material wealth or qualifications that would make them able to live productive householder lives. This is no doubt a rather large impediment to many who would like to take the step of leaving, even though they may feel the burden of hypocrisy weighing heavily on their shoulders. Others who cannot tolerate that burden may well consider embezzling funds rather justifiable as a kind of retirement pension.

 

Be that as it may, I propose here that the monopoly granted by the movement to celibate monks to act as its unique spiritual leaders of the society is tremendously unproductive. I think it is time to radically rethink the sannyasa and householder institutions in Iskcon. The householder state is not in itself a disqualification to pure devotion, nor is celibacy a necessary precondition to pure devotion. The life and teachings of Bhaktivinoda Thakur should be sufficient evidence for this.

 

It is time to return to the pre-Gaudiya Math tradition of promoting householders as gurus. This is the essential step that to the cultivation of a congregational community or lay society, in other words, the creation of Varnashram culture.

The Varnashram system means, as Prabhupada taught, a Brahminical society. Iskcon’s failure has been to place the Brahminical functions, i.e., the work of guru (varnanam brahmano guruh), almost exclusively in sannyasis, to the detriment of the entire creation of Varnashram.

 

Further confusion has been caused by fuzzy thinking on the distinction between Brahmins and Vaishnavas. Let me develop that thought. The Varnashram idea is important, but if one confuses Vaishnavas with Brahmins by making all Vaishnavas Brahmins makes the concept totally meaningless. A person who has taken Vaishnava diksha may not have the guna or karma of a Brahmin. (A Brahmin who is not a Vaishnava is not a concern here.)

 

Sad-achara (i.e., the four regulative principles and other fundamental aspects of Brahminical behavior) is not the only criterion of a Brahmin. A Vaishnava society automatically serves the Brahminical ideal in terms of sad-achara, but Vaishnavas not working as preachers, priests or teachers, even though following Vaishnava sad-achara, should not automatically be given Brahminical status in Varnashram.

 

This distinction between ordinary Vaishnavas and Brahmin Vaishnavas could be institutionalized by a reform of the initiation process. Brahma Gayatri was traditionally not given to non-Brahmin disciples by most Gaudiya Vaishnavas. Upanayan and diksha should be recognized as two different things. Saraswati Thakur started giving Brahma Gayatri to his disciples as an element of the Daivi Varnashram Dharma. It was a statement appropriate to the time and place, but we must seriously examine the context of creating Varnashram institutions in the world outside of India, where it has to be created from scratch. The criticism of abuses in the Brahminical or Varnashram society are simply not relevant and we should make the necessary adjustments.

 

If Brahma Gayatri and the sacred thread are signs of a Brahmin, they should not be given as a part of Vaishnava initiation, but in a separate upanayan ceremony that consecrates an individual who shows special qualifications as a Brahmin. I know that this calls for hierarchisation in what is essentially an egalitarian movement, but we already have that, with sannyasis, etc. The very concept of Varnashram is hierarchical in nature. The test is whether the society’s Brahmins will be able to combine their leadership with respect for all other members of society, as enjoined in Gita 5.18 and elsewhere.

 

It would thus be in the interest of developing the concept of Daiva Varnashram if upanayana were given separately from Vaishnava diksha. Diksha would be given when one has reached the requisite level of sad-achar and commitment to Vaishnavism. Upanayana, however, would only be bestowed on people who had attained a certain level of learning and cultural competence, a Brahmin in the full sense of the term.

 

The deliberate consequence of this decision would would be the creation of a householder Brahmin class, which is currently missing from the Iskcon/Gaudiya Math social structure. In the Gaudiya Math and Iskcon, only sannyasis act as priests and preachers and receive maryada. Householders are thus for the most part automatically marginalized.

 

Siddhanta Saraswati’s strong criticism of householders making a living from devotional service is the crux of the matter. This criticism is not without basis and naturally a certain amount of checks and balances are needed, but such checks and balances should be in place to protect against all abuses by anyone—householder or sannyasi—who is dependent on the congregation for his livelihood. A householder priest could be the paid employee of the congregation, for example, and still act as personal guru to householders and trainer to new brahmachari and brahmacharini students.

 

Householders who are qualified Brahmins could be allowed to make disciples, receive gifts, charge money for services rendered, including Bhagavata path, etc., as long as these were reasonable. I don't see that the dangers inherent in receiving gifts, etc., are all that different in a preaching environment where renunciates are involved. The embezzlement problem discussed above is evidence of this. There are advantages and disadvantages both in householders and renunciates preaching. However, Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition gave initiating duties to householder Vaishnavas. There were good reasons for this: sannyasis were advised to keep away from materialistic people, women, making many disciples. The Bhagavata and the Goswamis had a radically ascetic version of sannyasa that has to some extent been compromised. A householder was not restricted in this way, therefore Nityananda Prabhu, Advaita Prabhu and Srinivasa Acharya all became householder gurus. Why not Vipramukhya?

 

Some time back, I wrote to some devotees in Iskcon suggesting that the society should create a number of sannyas ashrams or monasteries (distinct from regular temples) where sannyasis can go into a real monastic environment where there are no women. Similar ashrams for women should also be set up. Sannyasis who travel and preach should be required to spend a minimum period of time every year (chaturmasya, Karttika) in intense bhajan to keep their sadhana pure. These ashrams could also be curing places where devotees with difficulties could be sent for cure and reflection about vocation change, etc.

 

Perhaps certain devotees who have a taste for bhajan could stay there year round. Of course, these ashrams would be open for retreats throughout the year for all male devotees, and for classes and certain programs during the day.

 

Strict rules would hold that women would not be allowed to come even for cleaning or cooking duties, which is generally allowed in Gaudiya Maths because of manpower shortages. Sannyasis would continue living, visiting, doing so many things, in other, non-sannyas ashrams where women would be present. This is because Saraswati Thakur’s sannyasi was, like the Roman Catholic priest, “in the world,” and thus a certain amount of compromise with the standards of sannyas shown by Mahaprabhu was necessary. The creation of sannyas ashrams would give the sannyasis a chance to regenerate their spirit of renunciation without creating tension or negative vibes in temples, etc., where women of necessity play a vital role that should and must be encouraged if the movement is to flourish.

This kind of institution would enhance the prestige of the sannyas ashram in Iskcon and would also empower sannyasi preachers who tend to get overinvolved in management and other superficial activities. These ashrams could also function as Vaishnava universities for Brahmins.

 

In the meantime, householder-based preaching centers would be the principal method of expanding the movement. This would (1) enhance the position of women in the movement, (2) create a priestly class more sympathetic to the worldly concerns of the congregation, (3) free sannyasis to travel and preach, and (4) help prevent the urge for people looking for labh, puja and pratishtha to take sannyas as a way of attaining it.

Why can't Iskcon support householder gurus? Not only would the above benefits accrue, but solidly implanted householder Brahmin families would result in the privileged education of their children, giving them the kind of from-birth training that would result in the development of future leaders of the movement.

 

Householders with Brahmin qualifications who are obliged to make their living by other means are seriously handicapped in their culture of Krishna consciousness. They are being told, in effect, that you are not allowed to work according to your nature because you wish to live in the company of a woman. If Vipramukhya were allowed to continue in his functions, even after becoming a householder, would the movement not on the whole be benefitted? Too much emphasis has been placed on the spilling of semen and not enough on the individual qualifications of the spiritual teacher.

 

 

Jagadananda Das (Hiranyagarbha Das) was the first headmaster of the Varnashram College in New Vrindavan in 1974. He was also headmaster at Mayapura Gurukula from 1975-1979.

 

[theist]

Jagat:"...charge money for services rendered, including Bhagavata path, etc., as long as these were reasonable."

 

I am certainly not fit to critque your article.Seems to make a lot of sense.I do however question your statement quoted above.

 

If a brahmana charges fees for services, isn't that a clue to his not being a true brahmana?

[theist]

Hådayänanda: Prabhupäda, generally in colleges in the West, they charge some fee for going to the college. What is our position?

 

Prabhupäda: No, we don't charge any fee. There is no question of money. Because the brähmaëas, they'll teach free. They require money because they have to give fat salary to these rascals. But we haven't got to. And even we have to feed them, we produce our own grain. So where is the question of taking money? So therefore it is required, somebody must produce food. Then there is no necessity of money. Conversations March 14,1974 Vrndavana

[Gauracandra]

Theist,

 

Yes, this is my understanding. A brahmana does not charge. He teaches out of love for sharing knowledge. Then society out of appreciation takes care of the brahmana. Very few can manage this. I've known only one such brahmana who actually lives in this manner (not counting those with disciples that is).

[theist]

It certainly is a good formula for keeping the institution together.There is benefit in that.Pious life is fostered.The Catholic church has shown this.

 

But if one wants a deeper experience, then look to the outskirts.Go to the fields,just outside of town, and take siksa from a St. Francis.

 

 

[Jagat]

This is all very well and good, but how is someone supposed to live? How is a Brahmin supposed to maintain and support his family? How is he supposed to raise his children and give them an education? A Brahmin is not a sannyasi. Let's be realistic.

 

The student or yajamana is supposed to give dakshina generously. That is a payment by another name. Look at the accounts in the Puranas of cows and land given to Brahmins. The Brahmin needs to be free from the burden of seeking an alternative livelihood so that he can engage in the work of his caste.

 

A genuine Brahmin will not turn away the poor and needy, any more than a genuine doctor will turn a sick patient who is unable to pay, but this doesn't mean that we expect to not pay our doctors.

 

I gave the alternative possibility that the congregation could pay a salary to the minister-priest-guru, etc.

 

This idea of not paying has just had repercussions in the Montreal temple where the temple personnel has dropped to practically 0. A nice householder devotee with all the Brahmin qualities was doing the pujari work. He cannot maintain the service because he has to work to support his wife and two small children. He requested the temple authorities to pay him a salary, but they refused on principle. So they lost a very qualified and sincere pujari.

 

Was he less sincere because he asked for a salary? I am sure he was not asking for the kind of money a busboy or gas station attendant gets. So the temple will now depend on whatever six-month brahmachari is around to do the service. Is this rational?

[theist]

Of course the student has the duty to take care of the teacher.But when you formalize it with a fee for services arrangement it loses something.It becomes business.

 

The householder pujari that you mentioned should not have had to ask.The temple managers should be aware enough to understand these simple things.

 

What you propose concerning a salary structure will work in terms of keeping the institution in place.And that has value.People have a place to meet and perform religious rituals and gain merit thereby.Some will seek a deeper connection to Divinity.A business relationship will not satisfy.

 

And it will be a business.The "brahmana" will soon feel dependent on the congregation for his ordinary livelyhood.The congregation will come to view him as a hired man.A preacher must be free to criticize his students without the worry of losing his home and food.

 

To each his own.I would rather sit under a tree with a weatherworn St.Francis,and hear from him,then sit in the Vatican and worship the Pope as he sits surrounded by his salaried Bishops and Cardinals.

 

The maintainence of St. Francis would then become my concern in gratitude.

 

 

 

 

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

 

A preacher must be free to criticize his students without the worry of losing his home and food.

 

 

I think that is an important point. The brahmanas must be able to remain free thinkers, not under the influence of their student (or educational institution) simply because of salary.

 

In Kali yuga, where the goal of most people (even devotees) is to make money and live a comfortable life, the whole idea of labeling such people as brahmanas is the real flaw. It may be hard to live the ideal way, but thats because we aren't actually brahmanas and we do not have those divine qualities present within a brahmana.

 

The next step after hired priests is family gurus, where payment is the only criteria, not qualification or teachings.

[Jagat]

There is merit in this argument, but there are different parts of society. One who wishes to renounce should take a renunciate guru. And of course, there is no harm in getting the "real deal" from a St. Francis.

 

However, the large majority of people have many preoccupations, big and little. Facile answers like "Renounce everything and live under a tree" is what you would expect from a Gaur Kishor Das Babaji, but that is not the right answer to give to a king.

 

This was my point about sympathy for a lay congregation.

 

Householder or not, salaried or not, the guru who has integrity will win the respect of his congregation. The one who has been trained to serve and then serves honestly will merit his status. Why deny him the right to live decently?

 

Is a sannyasi who hopes for a million dollar donation to build his temple and math going to necessarily be honest with his client? Ever seen an Iskcon GBC suck up to a rich Indian industrialist? It's not pretty.

 

My point, which is a little radical for most people accustomed to heavy Gaudiya Math preaching about the absolute good-as-God guru, which has been so destructive to Iskcon, is that the guru can be a little more ordinary than Jesus, Francis or Prabhupada. The guru can and should be much closer to us than that.

 

 

 

 

[xxvvii]

Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Vipramukhya Swami.

 

"Vipramukhya Swami is a good guy, good guy, good guru, good guru." Don't post a batch of annoying trashes in the newsgroup again. To throw myself down to the lotus feet of Vipramukhya Swami, let your govern. make a most convenient trip for me.

[gHari]

For all who would think of swimming in that ocean: Siddhartha.zip

 

This small Zip file contains the Herman Hesse classic 'Siddhartha' in Word (.doc) and Text (.txt) formats, and in eBook (Palm Doc .pdb) format.

 

A short read, but it entertainingly and wisely tells the ins and outs of taking the plunge. I am rereading it after thirty years with renewed understanding. I am sure anyone here would derive benefit from a few hours of light contemplation. If you like this one, then Hesse's Nobel prize winning 'Magister Ludi: The Glass Bead Game' is a must indeed.

[stonehearted]

Hesse wouldn't have won the Nobel Prize just for Magister Ludi; the Prize for literature is awarded for the author's body of work. Nevertheless, I agree that both of these books give insight into our plight--Siddhartha explores the ups and downs of a seeker's life, and Magister shows how ultimately fruitless so-called spiritual endeavor can be. Great books!

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

OFFICIAL MESSAGE FROM THE GBC EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE

REGARDING VIPRAMUKHYA DASA

 

 

Dear devotees,

 

Please accept our humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.

 

It is with heavy hearts that we inform you of the departure of

Vipramukhya prabhu from his services as guru and sannyasa.

 

He has been a dedicated servant of Srila Prabhupada's movement over the

last 29 years: a kind and considerate person, an attractive preacher,

and always jovial and fun to be with.

 

In recent years he took on the great burden of being the temple

president of Bhaktivedanta Manor, one of Srila Prabhupada's flagship

temples.

 

Of course his departure from sannyasa also raises other questions

regarding how to better help maintain all our sannyasi's in their chosen

asrama. This indeed is a subject that will require more thoughtful

reflection and meditation and one that requires a very measured and

considered response.

 

In the meantime we wish Vipramukhya prabhu well during this difficult

time and are looking forward to and praying for his association again in

the not too distance future.

 

To all of Vipramukhya prabhu's disciples and followers we also offer our

heartfelt concerns and request them (as Vipramukhya prabhu has himself)

to take shelter in Srila Prabhupada and Srila Prabhupada's senior

disciples in ISKCON, who in turn will humbly try to serve and guide you

through this difficult moment in your spiritual lives.

 

Your servants,

 

Giridhari Swami,

Bhakti Caitanya Swami,

Gopal Krsna Goswami,

Bir Krishna das Goswami,

Praghosa dasa.

 

[theist]

Hope they get together on this one.

 

 

 

GBC:"Of course his departure from sannyasa also raises other questions

regarding how to better help maintain all our sannyasi's in their chosen

asrama. This indeed is a subject that will require more thoughtful

reflection and meditation and one that requires a very measured and

considered response."

 

Jagat:"Some time back, I wrote to some devotees in Iskcon suggesting that the society should create a number of sannyas ashrams or monasteries (distinct from regular temples) where sannyasis can go into a real monastic environment where there are no women. Similar ashrams for women should also be set up. Sannyasis who travel and preach should be required to spend a minimum period of time every year (chaturmasya, Karttika) in intense bhajan to keep their sadhana pure. These ashrams could also be curing places where devotees with difficulties could be sent for cure and reflection about vocation change, etc.

 

Perhaps certain devotees who have a taste for bhajan could stay there year round. Of course, these ashrams would be open for retreats throughout the year for all male devotees, and for classes and certain programs during the day.

 

Strict rules would hold that women would not be allowed to come even for cleaning or cooking duties, which is generally allowed in Gaudiya Maths because of manpower shortages. Sannyasis would continue living, visiting, doing so many things, in other, non-sannyas ashrams where women would be present. This is because Saraswati Thakur's sannyasi was, like the Roman Catholic priest,in the world, and thus a certain amount of compromise with the standards of sannyas shown by Mahaprabhu was necessary. The creation of sannyas ashrams would give the sannyasis a chance to regenerate their spirit of renunciation without creating tension or negative vibes in temples, etc., where women of necessity play a vital role that should and must be encouraged if the movement is to flourish.

 

This kind of institution would enhance the prestige of the sannyas ashram in Iskcon and would also empower sannyasi preachers who tend to get overinvolved in management and other superficial activities. These ashrams could also function as Vaishnava universities for Brahmins."

 

 

[atma]

What about gay sannyasis? Where do you keep them?

 

Just wondering......

 

 

[stonehearted]

There have been a couple of things on my mind regarding Vipramukhya's departure.

 

One is that ISKCON badly needs a system for training sannyasis. Maybe something like the ashrams discussed here would help. The problem with sannyasa in ISKCON is much like the problem their system for approving (or non-disapproving, or whatever the hell it is) their institution's gurus. They say something like, "Well, we've vetted this devotee to the extent we're able, and he may be okay for you to take initiation from. But if he turns out to be unqualified, that's your problem, not ours." Since the institution has taken responsibility for approving sannyasa inititiations, it must also take responsibility fro ensuring as nearly as possible that those it approves are actually sannyasis. This needs to address their loneliness and possessiveness, as well as other issues.

 

Vipramukhya complains that he felt lonely and so wasn't always able to honor his pledge to his spritiual master to follow the basic regulations of discipleship, much less sannyasa. Those who take sannyasa must have good, confidential association, close friends with whom they can trust their misgivings and difficulties, an who can be trusted to actually encourage them to stretch beyond their (self-)perceived limits. We need sadhu sanga, all of us. Those of us who feel we're so "advanced" inKrishna conscoiusness that we don't need the association of more advanced devotees (usually because of false ego and temporary designations) are deluded.

 

His letter also provided insights that he had long not been in the sannyasa frame of mind. He wrote of how he went to the rooms where he had stuff locked up and took what he wanted (in one place he refers to "valuables"). That's evidence that he felt these things were his "due," that he had earned them by dint of his service to the society. I don't mean to criticize him for feeling this way. I think it's quite natural, and I would expect any householder with a family to support to feel the same. However, I've seen a different example. In the early '80s, some of my Godbrothers were given an ultimatum to repudiate their association with Srila B. R. Sridhar Maharaj or leave ISKCON. One of those who could not see it in his heart to so offend Maharaj, who had given him so much, went to Sridhar Maharaj to disclose his decision to leave. Maharaja advised him that, if he felt it was necessary to do so, he must leave with nothing, not even his books. Otherwise, he could be accused absconding with assets derived from his connection with ISKCON. I saw a practical example of this some years earlier. In 1974, when my friend Sudama left his service as Honolulu temple president and the sannyasa ashram, he was harrased nearly to death by ISKCON leaders because he kept even a watch. At one point he asked, "What do you want me to do, walk out of here naked?" Their reponse: "That would be a good idea. You're a thief."

 

Another thing I've thought about is the destrucive power of vaishnava-aparadha. In his years as temple president in England and as a staff member of CHAKRA, apparently felt he had to participate in offensive behavior and speech against some who have given their lives to glorifying and spreading the chanting of the holy names. Among these is, perhaps most notably, B. V. Narayan Maharaja. For a long time it seemed as though CHAKRA would post any item, regardless of its faults, that criticized Narayan Maharaja and his followers. A few years ago, when Umapati Swami resigned as CHAKRA editor, Vipramukhya asked me to take that service. I declined, explaining that I felt CHAKRA's policy of broadcasting vaishnava aparadha was dangerous. Actually, he never even replied to acknowledge my letter, and when, over the next two or three years, I wrote him on other matters, he never responded. Now, we read about those who offend devotees being afflicted with leprosy or having their homes devastated, but the most dangerous consequense of vaishnava aparadha is that we lose our attraction to nama-seva, we lose our enthusiasm for devotional service and the sacrifices it may entail.

 

I hope Vipramukhya is able to find some association that encourages him to renew his enthusiasm for devotional service. I know devotees who have the highest regard for him and who must be quite confused and disheartened. But as Jagat has said, we can only achieve great things if we strive to exceed our apparent limits. My father also used to say, "If you don't do anything, you can't do anything wrong." Viprmukhya took a shot at a rhino and took something of a beating. With proper treatment (good association), he can be expected to recover in time.

 

I apologize to all for the length of this post and for any inadvertant offense.

[theist]

Salagrama-sila in his heart takes it deeper now.

 

I found this part of his letter especially disturbing.

 

 

 

V:"There are advanced devotees in ISKCON, and it is my duty to request those who have accepted guidance and shelter under me to take shelter of other senior devotees within ISKCON, and if in doubt to consult your local GBC representative. I bear no ill toward the GBC or ISKCON, and have not ever knowingly preached in such a way that would be considered inappropriate for a representative of ISKCON."

 

I hope this is not the only communication he has had with those that accepted him as their spiritual master.Just a letter directing them to see the GBC for further details speaks to a mentality that is at the root of the problem.It sounds like he thinks he has fulfilled his duty by writing that paragraph.

 

He owes these people at the minimum a one on one, face to face explaination.He needs to hear them express their feelings on the matter at length and until they fully understand what is happening.

 

This impersonal "go talk to the GBC about it" is a major part of the problem there as I see it.

 

Krsna consciousness as personalism means more than just being able to argue dvaita over advaita.

 

Hare Krsna