Richard Posted January 15, 2003 Report Share Posted January 15, 2003 This is my understanding of the caste system (on a very basic level). Your karma in past lives represents what species you manifest as. Human being top of the list. Castes are a seperate sub-division of the human species. And if you have the best Karma possible (bar enlightenment) you're born as a Brahmin and the worst Karma, an untouchable. However if even the larger Indian race is sub-divided by racial groupings surely seperate races must occupy different levels of hierarchy as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2003 Report Share Posted January 15, 2003 Sastrically, I believe other races are below caste Hindus (brahmins, ksatriyas, vaisyas, sudras) on a birth lvl. But I don't know if the other world races are below the Untouchables in India. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2003 Report Share Posted January 15, 2003 unlike the judeo christian religions, there is no great significance attached to a person's birth in the vedic society. in the judeo-christian religions there are sectarian considerations and even support for slavery. even modern science holds that genetics or in other words birth determines one's nature. but vedas have a broader view of the issue. according to lord krishna, a person's varna is determined by his/her qualities and activities - guna karma vibhagasah. there is no greater authority on vedas according to people who know the sastras. Lord Krishna or Vishnu is the Supreme Lord Narayana or Vasudeva Himself. Govinda is the purpose of the vedas. From this Madhava alone emanates the Vedas. The knowledge of the Vedas culminate in understanding Kesava. Given that one need not go to secondary sources including smrti sastras what to speak of the words of indologists in understanding the vedic concept of caste system. there is no denying the fact that our activities in previous lives result in our nature in this birth. similarly, the activities in this birth would result in our nature in the future births. but caste system is not a rigid one as made out by missionaries and indologists of no standing. it is unfortunate that there is not enough effort to fight this information war. as far as foreigners go, the vedic system is universal meaning it is present even in other planetary systems. there are traces of vedic civilization in every part of the world. there are well researched material on this topic despite lack of funding. so no one is excluded - incl. the so called non-believers in this family of vasudeva. in fact my favorite brahmins are the western ones iniated by srila prabhupada. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gauracandra Posted January 16, 2003 Report Share Posted January 16, 2003 This is a very interesting question, and I’ve wondered about it as well. From my discussions with Indian friends it appears there are even gradations within various castes. But quite frankly no one has ever explained how people know. The only way such a system can work is if everyone agrees to abide by the rules. But percent wise how much of the population of 1 Billion in India is Brahmin? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 16, 2003 Report Share Posted January 16, 2003 Most of the Brahmins are atheist today.New generation is very much disturbed. Joy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 16, 2003 Report Share Posted January 16, 2003 http://krishna.org/ctfote/varnash.html in complete detail. Joy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2003 Report Share Posted August 23, 2003 WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, I SUBMIT SOME CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM : If the younger generation is converting to atheism and they are not respecting the traditional rules anymore, and marrying whoever, they could commit irreparable mistakes for the future generation. However, they cannot be held fully responsible for their actions. They are probably abandoning their identity because: 1. They perceive Western customs and values as superior to theirs; history has showed that, when two cultures clash, the members of the "inferior" culture (from an overall point of view, namely spiritual AND material) will identify with the "superior" culture; i.e. most of the peoples conquered by the Romans, even though they resisted politically their conquest, did identify with the Romans and wanted to imitate them, in their way they dressed, in the way they constructed their huts. It was "cool" to be Roman. Only spiritually superior people were capable to resist and were capable to actually integrate the conquerors. 2. Their whole being (all their spiritual bodies) are not satisfied with the surrendering required by a purely spiritual religion (as opposed to Western ideologies which tend to satisfy both spiritual growth and material desires). 3. They may be tired with the internal fighting of different religious branches, who spend to much time fighting instead of displaying tolerance towards each other, sullying their role and their undertaking. 4. They may want to assert their freedom of thought, their freedom of expression and their freedom of religion, if they have been exposed to excessive abuse of power on behalf of their parents or figures of authority. They may react and display a rebellious and self-destructive behaviour. 5. They probably have not received appropriate instruction and have no understanding of the principle of separation. Rules have been imposed unto them, but not explained them to them. They could not internalize these rules. In other words, the educated and enlightened people of India should take all the necessary steps to provide a healthy social environment as well as appropriate and respectful education to the young. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 23, 2003 Report Share Posted August 23, 2003 there is no one untouchable by birth. even a brahmin is untouchable after he has passed stool, had sex & is yet to wash, a brahmin woman undergoing her menstrual cycle etc. for a sannyasi, he should not come in contact with anyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2003 Report Share Posted August 25, 2003 there is no need to concoct what a caste system. krishna clearly says what it is in gita. and he has never said that untouchability is a part of that caste system. untouchability was a malpractice of the system by the hindus. it is going away soon for good. jai sri krishna! -madhav Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moorthi Posted August 25, 2003 Report Share Posted August 25, 2003 Caste System has certainly outlived it's (historic) purpose. Any prosperous society would have to contend with it's own internal contradictions, which at times can become so huge that all it needs is a tiny spark from outside to blow it up. This was the case with all prosperous societies in the past - they all had to succumb to a handful(compared to their number) of barbarians coming from outside. Were it not for the caste system(with all it's other deficiencies, as can be explained even by a child), Hindu culture would have by now been fully eradicated by the systematic massacre,slavery,conversion,oppression and ruthless policies of the Muslim rulers for the last 1000 years. However India still remain predominanty Hindu due to two reasons: 1) The numberous saintly men like Chaitanya,Kabir,Ramanuja etc 2) The caste system, due to which whenever something bad is perpetrated upon members of a caste, the whole caste takes to arms to 'defend' it's pride. Oftentimes, either of the following would accrue 1) Where the Sultan's armies are more powerful, the whole caste could get obliterated, after dying down to the last man 2) On the other hand, the Sultan's armies are kept in check, and much weakened due to incessant attacks from people belonging to a particular caste. Such was the story of the struggles and counter-struggles in Indian history all through the millenia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 25, 2003 Report Share Posted August 25, 2003 I think vivekananda and his sterilized interpretation of all things hindu has outlived its usefulness. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingentity Posted August 25, 2003 Report Share Posted August 25, 2003 the Varnashrama society with the Caste system. Varnashrama which is what Lord Krsna speaks of in the Gita is a natural social system which takes into account the individuals unique nature emphazing quality and work. This is the quite different from the concocted caste system which is a division of society according to birth. This causes problems in that you can not determine that just because your father was a great scholar or artist that you will also have this ability. Just by being born within a certain family does not make you exactly like your parents or other ancestors. A so-called untouchable might be in fact a math genius whereas a so-called brahmin might be the village idiot. Again, I think of Prahlada Maharaj and His demon father Hiranakasipu. No two could be more different and yet they are born of the same family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 hi everyone i am in debate team and we are debating on is the caste system racicim what do you think i need lots of facts! thanx mandi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 28, 2004 Report Share Posted October 28, 2004 but your karma is determind by your darma which is how well you do your job in your class Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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