Guest guest Posted January 30, 2003 Report Share Posted January 30, 2003 The incident that we are going to recount took place in mid-sixties. It took place soon after Nehru's death when Prabhupada was still alive. I was then working in an office in downtown Broadway in New York City, not too far from Brooklyn. The Truth Detector (01-30-03) There at Brooklyn, in Henry Street, Prabhupada used to preach in a small house, which served, at the time, as some kind of a head-quarters of the Hare Krishna people. I used to go and attend their services, now and then, mostly after office and before returning to my apartment in Flushing, Queens. Prabhupada, whenever he visited New York at the time, put up there and his sermons were attended in the evenings by a big crowd. Not only were there the usual chantings and eventual prasadam but there was a serious question and answer period. And the subjects varied from Varnashram Dharma to Reincarnation and many other similar topics. They were naturally of great interest to the local boys and girls, men and women of America but for us Hindus of India too, the question & answer period was of extreme interest and enlightenment. Those who have had the good fortune of hearing, first hand, Prabhupada's sermons could easily imagine how charged the discussions were. Nehru had died only a few weeks ago in India. Ashes from his funeral pyre had been strewn from airplanes, all over India. Every-where in India, the dead man's eulogy was being sung and this was the man who was at the root of India's unpreparedness when China attacked, the Kashmir imbroglio, the minority (or Mohammedan) problems in India and so on. It was amazing that many of the American disciples of Prabhupada were better informed of problems in India, generated by Nehru and his incompetence. However, the man had died only recently and out of a sense of propriety, no one spoke ill of Nehru in that congregation at the time. Then a youngman asked Prabhupada a question on re-imcarnation. Was it true that most dead were reborn and passed through the cycle of life and death once again, except those few good men who attained nirvaana and were not born again but blended with Brahman or the Almighty? If so, could Prabhupada (who was considered to be a reincarnation of the sage Vyasa, the writer of the Mahabharatam) throw some light on the current status of Nehru. Did he obtain nirvaana or was he reborn; if so what kind of a body did he receive on his next birth? The question was a loaded one, I thought. In fact, I had the misgiving that Prabhupada might refuse to answer. But then, I was wrong. I had not yet known Prabhupada so well. He was undaunted by any question and his reply came forth instantly. Quite clearly Prabhupada knew Nehru like the palm of his hand; it was us who knew so little of the man, thanks to all the well executed suppression of details of Nehru's private and personal life by the GoI and the Indian media. For instance, even today, some half a century after Nehru and his family took over the reins of Indian government, we do not know who indeed was Indira's father-in-law! Prabhupada started his discourse. He said that Nehru was re-born almost immediately after his death, a thing that happens only to the most sinful people. He did not even have a short-lived taste of heaven before he was born again. What was worse, is that Nehru was born this time in the form of a dog. He was a dog in a small town of Sweden. His master had another dog before the dog-Nehru was acquired by him and so the dog-Nehru had to share the love of his master with another dog. Prabhupada explained that to be born as a dog, after having been born as a Kashmiri Brahmin in India, is a big fall. It indicated that Nehru had led a vile life, a very vile life, during his existence as a man in India. Also, Nehru's hatred for anything vaishnava did not make things any easier for him. That Nehru was a meat-eater, specially beef-eater, a regular wine-drinker, made things even worse for him. On top of that, Nehru was (a fact which we did not know then and learnt later, much later, only after having read M.O. Mathai's treatises on Nehru; Mathai should know for he was the Catholic private secretary for Nehru for a decade or so) a notorious womanizer. It was not only Mrs. Mountbatten that he slept with on a regular basis while our jawans were dying on battle fields in the north-east and in Kashmir; he used to sleep with each and every woman he could lay his hands on. Thus, he had left a chain of bastards one of whom had been delivered in a Catholic nunnery in Bangalore. In the mean time, his sidekick, one Krishna Menon, became the Minister of Defense. First thing he did was dismantle the Ichhapore Gun Factory and turned it into a coffee making machine factory. He was a communist and he loved the Chinese more than he loved Indians. Prabhupada was quite discreet; we know now, for he did not divulge to us at the time that Nehru finally died of syphilis (exactly like the communist leader Lenin of Russia) and not a bullet wound on the battle front. Prabhupada, however, told us in detail all the harms Nehru did to the Hindus of India, all the insults that he had heaped on them during his reign. Nehru used to brag of his non-Hindu upbringing. He used to say openly that he was brought up as a Mohammedan, educated as a westerner; it was only by accident that he was born a Hindu. It is now known that he was born in a house in the red-light district of Allahabad, where his father Motilal used to ply a brothel-keeper's trade. No one wants to talk of this dark side of Nehru's upbringing. On the other hand, it is said openly, wrongly of course, that he was born in the Anand Bhavan, which was not even owned by Moti Lal at the time Nehru was born. However, the few little details that we learnt from Prabhupada opened our eyes and I returned home very depressed. I was even more depressed to think that our people in India were singing all kinds of fulsome obituaries for this man who was worse than a traitor to the Hindus, the overwhelming majority of India. What was wrong? The next few years showed us all that was wrong! His daughter, in order to create differences between the Hindus and the Sikhs, the fighting arm of the Hindus since generations, attacked the sacred temple at Hari-Mandir Sahib in Amritsar. She had to pay for the crime with her life and event-ually, as we have all seen, our gods saw to it that the dynasty was totally destroyed for the sins of Nehru, now a dog in Sweden! - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 How did he know that Nehru was reincarnated as a dog. Did he just make that up? Also, I've never heard that Prabhupada was a reincarnation of Vyasa, Is this true? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 this article is from http://www.krishna.org our speculation is useless.Srila Prabhupada is jagad guru , a liberated soul who is very dear to God.he saw it with his divine vision.he spoke the obvious without any prejudice. i also never heard before he is vyasdeva but i knew he was on the level of vyas. joy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahnava Nitai Das Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 ...could Prabhupada (who was considered to be a reincarnation of the sage Vyasa, the writer of the Mahabharatam)... This isn't true, though as Joy said, the pure devotee is on the level of Vyasa. The appearance day of the spiritual master is known as Vyasa Puja, for the Guru represents Vyasa. Someone may have misunderstood this to mean Srila Prabhupada was an incarnation of Vyasa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 JNDas, I apologize for my inappropriate comment, you were right to delete it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 I was aghast to read all these details, as I knew as much as the tip of an iceberg! The real shock was, however, that, he was born as a dog in Sweden. What a terrible fall! With this one more doubt was also clarified that, the departed soul could reincarnate immediately and not one year later, after the first Shraddha as commonly believed by many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 No offense, but why do you blindly accept that he was reincarnated as a dog? Where did Srila Prabhupada get this information from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahnava Nitai Das Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 No offense, but why do you blindly accept that he was reincarnated as a dog? Where did Srila Prabhupada get this information from? Believe it or not, we actually aren't concerned with what happened to Nehru, but more with the teachings of Srila Prabhupada. Each person has developed their own level of faith in the teachings of Srila Prabhupada based on their direct experience with him and his teachings. He has already established his credibility with us through his selfless teachings on Krishna consciousness. The spiritual experiences devotees have had on the path of Krishna bhakti validates the statements of Srila Prabhupada to each of us. We require no external confirmation, as we each have some direct experience with his transcendental message and its transcendental effect on our consciousness. He has given us a glimpse of the spiritual world, and that is enough to remove the doubts of any man. Academic philosophers will maintain their doubts, as they are not granted the transcendental experiences that will make their faith strong. The Lord reciprocates with everyone according to their surrender on the path of Bhakti. As they surrender through devotion, He manifests to them directly in various ways: pratyakshavagamam dharmyam su-sukham kartum avyayam. Prati-aksha, with your eyes you will see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 Aren't there checks and balances that prevent a Guru from saying whatever he wants? This just leads to a charismatic leader manipulating his devotees and brainwashing them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahnava Nitai Das Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 Yes, the balance is experience of divinity - pratyaksha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 Srila Prabhupada answered what we was asked.It's that simple.The sages speak the truth without any blame or prejudce. Joy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 How do you know what he spoke was the truth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 If Srila Prabhupada knew of Nehru's incarnation, did he reveal any others? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2003 Report Share Posted January 31, 2003 This article was taken from Sword of Truth www.swordoftruth.com. http://www.swordoftruth.com/swordoftruth/archives/oldarchives/anec-5.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jahnava Nitai Das Posted February 1, 2003 Report Share Posted February 1, 2003 How do you know what he spoke was the truth? I think I already answered that. How do you know who your father is? We judge people's word's according to the authority we see in them based on our faith. That faith can be based on our material dealings with a person (such as with our mother) or the spiritual experiences we experience from someone (such as Srila Prabhupada). One who see's divine experience will cease to doubt the words of a saint. This is the pratyaksha spoken of by Lord Krishna in the Gita. If Srila Prabhupada knew of Nehru's incarnation, did he reveal any others? Very rarely, but on occassion. John Lennon is one case. Someone want to post it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anveshan Posted February 1, 2003 Report Share Posted February 1, 2003 Nehru is said to have done a lot of things, and so is Vajpayee and Gandhi. We are none to judge. If there is somebody above to judge, he will surely judge based on what is right and what is not. You may criticize Nehru, Gandhi and Vajpayee of their political philosophy, their failures as a statesmen or their misrule or failure to provide right leadesrship. We are all fallible human beings. =anveshanam= Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2003 Report Share Posted February 1, 2003 Yes Lord Jesus Christ did the same thing just to lead his children on the right path.God is very much aware of all the darkness in our soul so from time to time he himself descends or sends his representative to show the light.Those who do evil things to other will have to pay karmic debt and this is universal law which is our greatest teacher.Nehru may have indeed been born as a dog and Srila Prabhupada pointed out the downfall of soul who is running away from God.Being a dog or cat is not a bad thing...Srila Prabhupada never saw bodily differences.All are fragments of the supreme personality of Godhead. Joy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 Where is the necessity for a great spiritual leader to speak lies? The spirtual leaders get divine vision due to their constant devotional service to God. Anyway, he answered the question, only when he was asked one. A great political leader (?) does not necessarily make a great spiritually advanced person and the rebirth depends only on what Karma we do and not what position we hold on the earth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 What did Srila Prabhupada say about John Lennon? Does someone know? I think I already answered that. How do you know who your father is? We judge people's word's according to the authority we see in them based on our faith. That faith can be based on our material dealings with a person (such as with our mother) or the spiritual experiences we experience from someone (such as Srila Prabhupada). One who see's divine experience will cease to doubt the words of a saint. This is the pratyaksha spoken of by Lord Krishna in the Gita. Very rarely, but on occassion. John Lennon is one case. Someone want to post it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kulapavana Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 what is so bad about being born as a dog in Sweden? being born as a dog in Kambodia or Zimbabwe would have been a LOT worse... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 LOL! Does that mean Nehru actually performed some kind of a good deed to be born in Sweden (albeit in a dog body)?! what is so bad about being born as a dog in Sweden? being born as a dog in Kambodia or Zimbabwe would have been a LOT worse... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Hare Krishna! What did Srila Prabhupada say about John Lennon....JNDas...do you have the quote? Didnt Lennon die sometime in 1980...??? Haribol! anand Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I haven't read this whole thread, as it is an old topic that has been revived lately. But, I just wanted to say that if it has not been said before, that the incarnation of Nehru as a dog in Sweden was something that some astrologer in India read as the next birth of Nehru from his astrological signs at the time of his death. Srila Prabhupada was probably just telling this story as a tongue-in-cheek joke that was just some rumor going around the Vaishnava community after the death of Nehru. Srila Prabhupada did not have some mystic revelation about the next birth of Nehru. It was an inside joke that some Vaishnava astrologer started after the death of Nehru. That is the way I heard it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kulapavana Posted August 9, 2006 Report Share Posted August 9, 2006 LOL! Does that mean Nehru actually performed some kind of a good deed to be born in Sweden (albeit in a dog body)?! yes, that was his GOOD karma life. real punishment usually starts after you enjoy your good karma first. it hurts more that way well... actually it is more instructive when it happens that way, as you enter your new human life after experiencing some valuable lessons. but I tend to agree with the astrologer story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saidevo Posted August 9, 2006 Report Share Posted August 9, 2006 I have read that a human form is the ultimate for a soul and that a soul never descends into the lower forms after it gets a human form, however much its bad karma be. I have also read about a story of a rishi being born as a deer that he was very affectionate with. The dog form for Nehru might be because of his excessive sexual indulgence, a characteristic trait of dogs. But even then they do it only during mating seasons. Perhaps God was kind enough to give the great political leader a form that best suited his propensity. It is a shame that our great Bharat is still being ruled by the dyansty of Nehru. This is the true karmic punishment for us Hindus for our neglect of our great religion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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