Power, Authority

[Guest guest]

Saddam (S) has (had) power and authority.

Bush (B) had power and authority.

 

S is a dictator, very ruthless and of criinal mind and karma. You cannot say this for B.

 

S has so much oil he can not use.

B has so much need for oil that he cannot live without a source of oil. US cannot survive without oil.

 

S follows islam that believes in killing or converting every kafir. B follows . that aims at converting all to xians, but now a days do not convert forcibly.

 

islam says the state must be run by koran and hadith.

B says he will not run gov. by the Bible, but by the US constitution.

 

S & B both have weapons of mass destruction.

 

so, whom would you support/trust?

B may not be perfect, but is close.

the world has more chance for peace with B.

 

when rama toppled ravana of lanka forcibly,

after that he gave the knigdom to vibhisnan

who loved rama.

 

when B will topple S,

he wants to give the kingdon to a friend of B (US),

not any outsider, but to a son of the soil ( not a .).

 

a kshatriya is one who fights to keep law and order and freedom of others. B does it, but also has interest in oil,

not to rob/loot oil, but to buy it at fair price.

 

So, whom god would love more, B or S?

 

i think S would go to hell.

B would not.

 

But, B, the superpower, also needs to be good friend of other democracies like india.

 

if B topples one dictator, then it does not make sense for B to become a friend of another dictator musharaf. B must stop arming or funding musharaf who causes problems in india and kashmir.

 

after iraq, pakistan must be next.

and pak dictator does have WMD.

bin laden prabably is in pakistan.

 

if B does not fix musharaff,

then india must fix musharaff just like B did to S.

no need to listen to UN which is just a dummy.

 

first thing india should do is to take back pakistan occupied kashmir.

 

one job HK's have is to make hindus understand gita well and make them practice it. the next and simultaneous job is to convert all muslims of india to KC. this peaceful conversion is non violent and is preferrable. else if the muslims keep making troubles to the hindus (HK's included), they may loose lives.

 

two opposing ideologies (sanatan dharma and islam) cannot live together and hope for peace. history shows that giving separate land to muslims does not cause peace but it gives a safe home to muslims to cause terrorism to neighbors and the world. now that india gave pakistan to muslims in 1947 they cannot go and check in pakistan what they are doing, what they are cooking to finish hindustan.

so dividing a nation is foolish.

 

jai sri prabhupada!

 

 

[Guest guest]

I respectfully disagree with you.

Only a virtuous man can proclaim war against another nation. I believe that Bush is not a virtuous man.

It is very clear that he is working for his own interests and for the interests of the elite upper class which he belongs to. How is that better than Saddam Hussein?

As well, what does Saddam Hussein represent? Why is Bush attacking Saddam? Certainly not because of a 'suspicion' that he 'may' have weapons of mass destruction. You don't sacrifice hundreds and thousands of lives for that.

As well, if Bush is fighting to bring democracy and human rights to Iraq, he could have started elsewhere-say in South Korea?

The axis of evil - Iran- Iraq- Syria are basically countries that have an independant stance. They are the countries that do not bow down to the will of the American government as do the governments of other Arab countries in the region.

The government of Saudia Arabia panders to the US government, which is why they are not being attacked, though one might argue that their history of human rights is pretty atrocious as well.

Before you proclaim Bush to be 'near perfect', I respectfully ask you to read more about Bush and his policies towards Israel, tax cuts for the rich, etc. Many of the devotees have posted some excellent web sites which explain in great detail and with much evidence the true motives behind Bush's actions.

As well, I think that God loves everyone.

[Guest guest]

Source: http://www.indianexpress.com/full_story.php?content_id=20588

 

After Iraq, it may be Pak

Ashutosh Misra

 

The second Gulf war could spell chaos in Pakistan. Musharraf himself has admitted that Pakistan may be the next target. Addressing a group of businessmen and industrialists in Lahore in January, Musharraf had said that “after the Iraq crisis, Pakistan would be the next target of the western forces”. Many western observers and diplomats believe that in the aftermath of this US attack on Iraq, radicalism and anti-US feelings in Pakistan will increase.

 

Qazi Hussain Ahmed, the parliamentary leader of the Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal (MMA), has also warned that Pakistan may be next. Before the invasion, he had said, “Despite a global opposition, the United States is fully ready to destroy Iraq. After Iraq, it has focused its eyes on Iran, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan.” Criticising Musharraf’s pro-US policy, he said, “FBI has been given a free hand to conduct raids on any house, mosque or madaris and round up respectable citizens while Pakistani courts are helpless in offering any relief.” Musharraf is not being able to convince the public nor the US. During his speech in Lahore, in January, he said “We can talk to the US, but how can we convince them on our points when the whole country echoes with the slogans of jihad (against the US).”

 

Anti-US feelings have intensified in Pakistan since mid-2002, when a madrassa was bombed in Angoor Adda, inside Pakistan by the US troops. Even before the war, a worldwide opinion poll conducted by the Pew Research Center revealed that 69 percent of Pakistanis hold an unfavourable view of the US and only 10 per cent a favourable one. Among the 44 surveyed countries, Pakistan and Egypt held the most negative perception of the US. There was a spurt in the hate-wave against the US after the US Immigration and Naturalisation Service (INS) arrested and deported over 1,200 Pakistani immigrants. According to the National Council of Pakistani Americans (NCPA), another 167 cases of deportation are pending in the US courts and as per the estimates up to two lakh Pakistanis are in the loop, which may result in the deportation of at least 50,000.

Radicalisation has increased since MMA secured 58 seats in the National Assembly and formed governments in NWFP and Balochistan. Musharraf is under attack from both religious and non-religious parties on his foreign policy. The secretary-general of Pakistan’s Peoples Party Parliamentarian (PPPP), Mian Raza Rabbani said that Pakistan foreign policy in the post September 11 era has drastically failed.

 

People have begun to question Musharraf as to why Pakistan has not been rewarded for its services to the US? Even Turkey managed a 5 billion dollar package to start with, in lieu of opening the Turkish front for US forces. The Jamiat Ulema-i-Pakistan (JUP) has vociferously questioned the US on its double standards on Iraq, North Korea and Israel. The party said “After Iraq it would not take long for the US to come up with some excuse for attacking Pakistan. They are now looking for an excuse to destroy the country’s nuclear capability.”

 

Musharraf seems to be preparing for serious domestic turmoil. This time he also has the agitated public to contend with. The notion of ‘Islam in danger’ has provided the super glue that the Islamists wanted. Musharraf knows that a crackdown on the agitating Islamists will not be easy this time, as it will create an uproar in the National Assembly and NWFP and Balochistan could become infernos. The resulting anarchy could paralyse the whole nation, which may eventually force the US to intervene. The possibility of nuclear weapons falling into wrong hands is what the US fears most. This scenario is more probable considering that a section in the military and ISI is hand in glove with the Islamists. Pakistan painted in jehadi shades, with discontent military groups and ISI support, could spell disaster for Musharraf. India should keep a constant vigil to guard against any adventurism that Musharraf may embark upon to divert domestic pressures.

 

(The writer is a research fellow, Institute for Defence Studies and Analyses)

 

---------

 

jai sri prabhupada!

 

[Guest guest]

"Only a virtuous man can proclaim war against another nation. I believe that Bush is not a virtuous man."

 

So, you ay bush and saddam are not virtuous.

you are.

 

when you will declare war on any of them?

 

if you dont, you are not virtuous either.

 

who is more virtuous; bush, saddam, or you?

 

 

[Guest guest]

Christian fanatics are the worst, even worse than the secular zionists. The xians have a philosophy of manifest destiny and are the same as brahma bandhu, the extreme burdens of society.

 

Bush is their spokesman as well as their thug, but he is the most ignoraNT, EVEN IN WAGING WAR. iN THE CITY, MILLIONS WILL DIE, JUST AS HITLER FOUND OUT. tHE . RIGHT WING WHACKOS still think that the americans defeated hitler, but it was hitlers ignorance of the art of war that did him in on the russian front, Millions died from each side at the russian front, and the 3rd reich never recovered.

 

100,000 walking youth going to bhagdad are having their escape shut off. When they are bottled in, if there are WMDs, they will be used then. If there are no WMDs, then bushwhacker will be recognized as a great war criminal.

 

There is no solution by waging kali yuga war. We chant the glories of the demon bush while he leads the whole world to doom. The turks will fry the kurds and we will abandon them as before. Like it or not, saddam was is and will be the only thing to balance the power. But we are not at war with him, because the kids and women are the ones dying, as basra is already without water, all the borders are filled with armies of syria, iran, turkey, jordan, aimed to kill not saddam or republican guards, but helpless refugees with nowhere to go.

 

This whole mess is demoniac, and those who are picking sides are fools and are just as foolish as all the other kali yuga fools who cannot see that the cabal is forcing their desire of population culling off on everyone.

 

Watch out amerikkka, you are on the list. That constitution which may have been inspired is all but destroyed by the patriot act and other . devices to force us all to be "with them or against them", but the devotees are not with or against anyone of this ilk. Murder, this is all you see, and the color of the bodies is of no consequence, all victims.

 

Haribol,mahak

[Guest guest]

"This whole mess is demoniac, and those who are picking sides are fools and are just as foolish as all the other kali yuga fools who cannot see that the cabal is forcing their desire of population culling off on everyone."

 

 

[Guest guest]

time will tell.

let us wait and see.

 

jai sri prabhupada!

 

 

[Guest guest]

 

 

 

I am all for Bush. Those radical religous terrorists are getting what they deserve. I am not saying America doesn't have its share of its own hypocricy but I am glad to see these terrorists come to justice. Once this is all cleaned up I think we are on the verge of entering a golden age.

 

 

Hare Krishna

[anveshan]

The Americans came down like wolves on the fold

Their prakshepastras gleaming in purple and gold

The land across the mighty Tigris trembled

For, they had the taste of these beasts in the days bygone.

 

The Anglo-Saxon Brahmino-Khatries of the day

With a mighty backing from the vysyas new

From the powerful land of the rising sun

Led by the allies whom they breed and bleed

 

With an insatiable greed for power and might

An eagles eye for oil wells deep and wide

And an unquenchable thirst for wealth of nations great

The Americans came down like bloodthirsty hounds.

 

On a Saddam they made and unmade with incessant effort

For a decade plus, they starved a nation great

And upon the skeletons and rotten flesh

They sprang up like eagles wild!

 

Germans against Germans, Vietnamese against Vietnamese

And Koreans against Koreans, have been their rule

A Russia great they made beggars without begging bowls

Strange are thy leelas, O, America great.

 

Like the great Macedonian, they have already made –up the routs

The entire Arabian peninsula is their stooges and lackeys now

From Kuwait to Mesopotamia and from there to the land of Xerxes

With Indus firmly under their foot, look forward to the Gangetic plains.

 

Hah!, the Union of Nations has met the fate of the earlier League

Let us welcome with folded hands

And prostrate before their lotus feet

For, alas! We have alternative none.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Haribol, maybe you think I am taking sides against the bush man, but I am not. Just like daddy, when he went against noriega, this was a drug deal gone bad, and they were always on the same side.

 

And saddam an young bush are also on the same side. Saddam wants to cull his population, and bush uses the troops to help him.

 

Maybe you think I cry for the stalinist saddam, but I dont. I cry to support our troops by withdrawing all support from the fanatic bush, who does not support our troops.

 

If those who think supporting our troops necessitates support of the cabal figurehead bush, this is way far from reality. His admin has before the congress right now, and he is sincerely stumping and arm-twisting for passage, $7,000,000,000 is funds cut off from Veterans Administration, and some VA hospitals will close. In this cut, he is proposing to cut off surviving families of those he caused to be gassed in the desert. Hes cutting off disability benefits incurred in active service. But this treacherous non-support of troops does not stop there.

 

He has sent them into harms way without protection, 75% of all respiratory gear is faulty, the chem suits have pinholes in them, and the timing sucks as well. Waging war in Iraq in the spring and summer is also suicide, and this is confirmed by many great military minds. The criteria for entering war is "clear and present danger", yet the Iraqi people do not present such a thing. There is no clear connection between those who are dying now and those who blasted WTC on 9-11, in fact they are enemies. Some will say that Iraq supplies the terrorists, which may well be true, but so does France, Germany, Saudi, Japan, Britain, and the United States as well.

 

And the idea that we must wage war because the UN rules have been broken, the war itself is breaking resolution. Israel is not held to any similar standard for all the so called resolutions that have been broken.

 

Yeah, it may seem I take sides here, but I comment only on the ridiculous nature of kali yuga warfare. There is no side worth pledging allegiance to, all sides only bring demise and pain and misery to the world. I cannot comment on saddam because I am not victimized by his treachery, but this does not mean that I forgive his treachery and that I hope he comes out on top. I do live under the treachery of the cabal that has taken over the U.S.A. The Patriot Act was enacted only one month after 9-11, meaning that such an act was being worked on well before the surprisae of that morning. No trial, no lawyer, no probable cause, just rounding up those deemed to be enemies of the state.

 

And the terrorism of fear on American citizens is unfathomable. Such terrorism is by the cabal, not Iraq, not even al qaida, neither of whom were responsible for the anthrax used for establishment of fear among our own people.

 

Manifest destiny, this is the operation. Idiots who think they are better that anyone else by dint of birth, zionism, so many names, but basically this is referred to in the vedic terms as brahma Bandhu, superiority complex, and is the greatest burden on our society, and is the standard of Kali Yuga.

 

So saddam, who has recieved all his weapons of mass destruction from Ronald reagan and both bushes because he is their greatest ally and protector against the shiite hoards, is now the enemy. Friends, now enemies, and enemies, now friends, sounds too Orwellian to me to lend the whole mess any credibility whatsoever.

 

And all we cheer is death, and those who do not have superiority master race idealogies, we all cry for all the innocents who die at the hands of the demoniac leaders of the world, who are puppets in the hands of the real enemy,. who was named specifically in Eisenhower's farewell address in 1960, the unelected and unknown military industrial complex, the machine that grinds up and spits out the innocent.

 

haribol, ys, mahaksadasa

[Guest guest]

 

I am all for Bush. Those radical religous terrorists are getting what they deserve. I am not saying America doesn't have its share of its own hypocricy but I am glad to see these terrorists come to justice. Once this is all cleaned up I think we are on the verge of entering a golden age.

 

 

So you don't mind if your child, or grandchild, is walking down the street 5 or 10 years from now and they open their new toy and a bomb blows up in their face? Just asking, cuz we have to remember, winning a war does not always mean we win and these people hold grudges! If they can hold one for 2,000 years, certainly 5 or 10 is nothing!

[Guest guest]

Golden age? After this, Bush is going to go after other countries. He wants to fight with Korea, Iran for starters. But not for enders. Nothing is getting 'cleaned up' now. The opposite is happening: creation of a huge mess. Let's be realistic.

[Guest guest]

Don't worry about grudges. These Islamists already hate us and have declared full out war. Remember 9/11? They won't stop until they are stopped with force. Just a fact as I see it.

 

other guest,

 

Now what does North Korea have that America wants? Unless you are refering to wanting to stop their proliferation of nuclear weapon technolgy around the world. They have nothing else. Same with Iran, at least the present radical Islamic leaders and their support for terrorism. I think you will see a different tact taken there however. We may be able to link up with the young Iranians who seem intelligent and rational.

 

It's all a bad dream but nontheless real and needs to be dealt with.

 

 

[Guest guest]

 

Don't worry about grudges. These Islamists already hate us and have declared full out war. Remember 9/11? They won't stop until they are stopped with force. Just a fact as I see it.[quot]

 

Gee, I wonder why. (Not that we are so innocnet in all of this. Nor has this war been 'proven' to have a connection to 911.)

 

Grudges can be halted if only big powerful america stops misusing its power and arrogance. Thats how I see it. Not that Sadam should not be stopped, and killed. He should, but this way is not going to work.

[theist]

 

Grudges can be halted if only big powerful america stops misusing its power and arrogance. Thats how I see it. Not that Sadam should not be stopped, and killed. He should, but this way is not going to work.

 

 

 

So let's hear your plan. What will work. Sending in Kofi-cup-n-hand and Hans Blinks from the UN? Yeah, that will scare him.

[Guest guest]

 

Now what does North Korea have that America wants? Unless you are refering to wanting to stop their proliferation of nuclear weapon technolgy around the world. They have nothing else. Same with Iran, at least the present radical Islamic leaders and their support for terrorism. I think you will see a different tact taken there however. We may be able to link up with the young Iranians who seem intelligent and rational.

 

 

Of course what I was referring to was that Korea has nuclear weapons, not that american 'wants' anything from Korea. These things must be dealt with before everyone gets so mad at each other they resort to war instead of talk.

[Guest guest]

 

So let's hear your plan. What will work. Sending in Kofi-cup-n-hand and Hans Blinks from the UN? Yeah, that will scare him.

 

 

I think maybe you are misunderstanding what I am saying. My point is that we rushed into this war, we ignored what the UN and other countries had to say and did whatever we wanted against good council of those who are maybe less biased or at least can see a different perspective. Even in the Vedas, the king always listens to his advisors. Not that they are so qualified in this age or that he should always do what they say, but in this case we did rush that war because we had the power to do so. If we had not, if Sadam's country was a different one with great power, we would not have gone to war and would have worked much harder to find an alternative solution. Again, not that this will always work, but when rushing into something that results in loss of life, there is a tendency to always wonder if it could have been achieved in a more peaceful way. So this is what I mean by saying america used its power and arrogance, not that its always that way, but because we did have the power we choose to kill instead of talk long enough to give that a decent shot.

[theist]

What rush? This whole situation is just a continuation from the last gulf war. 12 years have past.17 past UN resolutions. The French vowing to veto any further resolutions that mentioned war as a consequence.

 

Your plan seems to be let's just wait and see and hope for the best. That is no plan at all, sorry. I know you are a soft hearted devotee who is adverse to violence and I respect that good quality in you. Sincerely I do. But sometimes world leaders have to do the drastic.

 

Did you know that the head of Saddams nuclear weapons program defected after the Gulf War. He has been interviewed on TV many times. He reports that before Saddam invaded Kuwait they were only months away from having nuclear weaponry. But Saddam couldn't wait, figuring that the world would just acquiese. Just think if he had acquired a nuke. I have mentioned before that the French built him a weapons grade nuclear reactor that the Israeli's took out in 1981. The idea of giving Saddam more time makes no sense. More time to do what?

[Guest guest]

My plan is not a passive lets just wait and see. And while this war may be a continuation of the Gulf War, there is more going on than that. We ignored the problem for years, so we are not innocent bystanders in this game. We can't ignore something and then say it was going on for 12 years.

 

And I am saying do "something," just not this. Sadam is a demon, no doubt, and must be stopped. Yes, I am aware of the things you said, but we could have done things to stop that too without costing 20 Brittish and American troups their lives recently.

 

I had no problem with USA continuing inspections, it was too soon to say it did not work. Tho to which I know you will disagree somehow. Thats ok and your right. I am just pointing out that maybe it didn't work cuz of a preconceived time line Bush held. America may claim inspections take too long or were trippy due to Sadam's trickery, but this is their job. They get paid big bucks to do annoying political things. You can bet your bottom dollar they will find more patience with countries of power. :-)

 

But don't misunderstand. Inspection is not the only solution. Just one. Remember, Bush wanted to kill Sadam cuz Sadam threatened his daddy 20 years ago. Its a personal vendeta too.

 

We listen too much to whats on tv and dont think our govt isn't feeding us what they want us to hear just as their govt is feeding them what they want them to hear. I suspect there were quite a few alternatives that could have been done which we have been kept in the dark over. (You might feel different if it was your son over there.) Try going over to http://www.rense.com and take a read.

[theist]

I checked out the site and must be honest and say that is not what I would consider anything close to being objective.

 

Guest you mentioned that I might feel different if I had a son over there. I have no children but I am sure if I did my feelings would be colored in some measure by that. That wouldn't make them correct but I understand your point.

 

Do you have a son there?

[Guest guest]

So, we need a better idea. I have a son in the gulf so I have right to bitch.

 

Srila Prabhupada (who's he?) stated that war is a natural reaction to dishonesty. The Earth planet BHUMI, can tolerate anything but lies, so we must decide to get rid of all those who lie for a living. Bush is a genetic liar, he has lied about supporting the troops, because even the most leftist protester would not take away from the benefits for our troops, yet bush is trying to deprive dependents, VA, etc. I support my son by asking that GW Bush be arrested for high treason.

 

All you who listen to too much rush linbaugh to the point of surrendering all your intelligence to the . fanaticism that has destroyed our constitution, you must know the long term motives. The horrible way the last president was treated. Yes, He lied, but the motive was to protect his wife from embarassment and hurt feelings due to a marriage of yuppies on the rocks. Bush lies, but his motive is to murder millions and impose his perverted idea of amerikka on a world who now does not want to go there.

 

Daddy bush lied to the kurds, said that they would be protected, then we turned our backs while saddam mowed them down. Junior has done the same, the kurds are food for turks.

 

Refugees from saddam in jordan want to be in the war, too, but not on our side, they want to fight us, because we are liars, cheats, and treacherous demons who care nothing about anyone outside our brotherhoos of thieves.

 

So, get ready, all you war supporters do not want to hear my prediction, but when my son is not able to get out, trapped, then youll know. Pro war after 20,000 U.S. children are dead?

 

Pro war means celebration of political failure. You geeks who like to think of holy wars, think that Iraq is some sort of kuruksetra, you are beyond any kind of sensible debate on the issue. This is the scene of the cabal who run this country that have declared war on all of us. They want to serve jesus antichrist and bring on armageddon, and clearly say this in the open. Just like reagans secretary of interior WATT who used to wish for all out nuke war with USSR.

 

Next, be ready for a new wave of attacks on our turf, because, as stated in 1995 by your wonderful bushboys, terrorism is needed to get the will of US citizens on board. So the patriot act will be more powerful if more stuff is released here.

 

The anthrax was domestic, all the pilots who flew the planes into wtc were trained in US. All the binladens were protected by the State Department the week following 9-11.

 

I cannot be antiwar, because I am pragmatic, and I see the will of Bhumi. She cannot tolerate lies, so she purges herself.

 

Cheer on, idiots.

 

YS Mahaksadasa

[Guest guest]

 

I checked out the site and must be honest and say that is not what I would consider anything close to being objective.

 

Guest you mentioned that I might feel different if I had a son over there. I have no children but I am sure if I did my feelings would be colored in some measure by that. That wouldn't make them correct but I understand your point.

 

 

But the government controlled televised news is objective? I don't think so. One of our biggest illusions in this country is that our govt doesn't control our media the way communistic and other countries to. It may not be as severe, but it still goes on and not small time.

 

No, I don't have a son there. Being a parent, I dobt that means I am unable to view it from that perspective. If anything, I would probably be more upset about this war.

 

There are so many secrets being kept from us. I can't help but agree with Mahaksa. Much of what has been passed off as terrorism is coming from our own gov't to try to get the people on their side so they CAN start a war. They want to avoid another Viet Nam. They are getting protesters, but not as many, so its working.

[theist]

everyone will believe what they like. I am out of this 'conversation'.

 

Hare Krsna,

idiot #1

 

[Guest guest]

I agree no one should call anyone an idiot. I did not, but please accept my apologies.

[theist]

to apologize guest. The emotional acid was thrown in by someone else.

 

 

I respect that you have taken the time and effort to voice your point of view. We won't change each others viewpoint most likely, and even if we did where would we be?

 

This temporary world is designed to keep us from remembering Krsna. Sometimes by excessive pleasure and sometimes by the horrors of such wars. We can make it work for our advantage if we see it for what it is beyond the political machinations and pray and chant with more earnest.

 

Krsna's lotus feet remain the only safe shelter. I am sure we will agree on that.

 

Hare Krsna