Mr Microsoft Bill Gates in ISKCON

[Guest guest]

Just imagine if somebody sent Billy a copy of the Bhagavad Gita As It Is by Srila Prabhupada and he became a Hare Krishna!

 

Ps Anyone know he's address

[Guest guest]

what if some highly advanced devotee(s)/swami(s)

personallay meet him and makes him interested in krishna?

 

what would make him interested in krishna?

who can make him interested in krishna?

 

if he gets a gita copyin mail,

most likely he will not even open the book.

 

he is more interest in lakshmi, than narayan.

iskcon has interest in lakshmi too.

 

jai sri prabhupada!

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

only if Krishna wants...

 

Joy

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

 

he is more interest in lakshmi, than narayan.

 

 

Mrigari the hunter was only interested in half-killing animals for fun. But by the mercy of the Lord's devotees he was transformed into Valmiki Rishi.

 

There is hope for everyone.

[Avinash]

Did the hunter become Valmiki in the same birth or another birth?

[Guest guest]

1835 73rd Ave NE, Medina, WA 98039

[gHari]

Bhagavatam:<blockquote><center>vAlmIkiz ca mahA-yogI

valmIkAd abhavat kila

agastyaz ca vasiSThaz ca

mitrA-varuNayor RSI

</center>

vAlmIkiH--VAlmIki; ca--and; mahA-yogI--the great mystic; valmIkAt--from an anthill; abhavat--took birth; kila--indeed; agastyaH--Agastya; ca--and; vasiSThaH--VasiSTha; ca--also; mitrA-varuNayoH--of Mitra and VaruNa; RSI--the two sages.

 

By the semen of VaruNa, the great mystic VAlmIki took birth from an anthill. BhRgu and VAlmIki were specific sons of VaruNa, whereas Agastya and VasiSTha RSis were the common sons of VaruNa and Mitra, the tenth son of Aditi.

 

----

 

SB Purport: " [...] Similarly, we have information that VAlmIki Muni also practiced yoga meditation for sixty thousand years before attaining perfection. [...]"</blockquote>

[Guest guest]

Before we go into the story of the Ramayana, let us listen to the story of the sage Valmiki, who was the author. It is said that he was born of Brahmin parents, who abandoned him in the forest, at birth. He was found and brought up by a hunter and thus became a hunter and a robber by profession. He was known as Ratnakar. He was a wild and savage man and knew nothing of culture or civilisation. All those who went into the forest, had to go in fear of their lives, for he was known to be ruthless. He lived with his wife and brood of children in the depths of the forest and had never gone near a town.

One day he saw a man approaching him. With the ferocity of a wild animal, he pounced on him with a view to kill and rob him of his money. He was surprised to find that the man did not show any signs of fear but stood absolutely still. He was quite intrigued by this strange behaviour. He had only seen two types of animals before, in his life - those who turned tail and ran away as soon as they saw him and those who bared their teeth and pounced on him. It was the first time that he saw a creature who looked at him fearlessly, with eyes filled with compassion. Love and compassion were emotions to which he was an utter stranger, and for a minute he faltered in his tracks, his upraised arm holding a brutal knife freezing in the air.

 

Slowly he brought the hand down and asked the man, "Who are you, who shows no signs of fear? Everyone I know runs away as soon as they see me and I catch them easily. Why don't you run"?

 

"I am Narada, the heavenly sage and I do not run because I am not afraid of you".

 

"Why aren't you afraid of me"? asked the hunter. "Don't you know that I can kill you"?

 

"Then, why didn't you kill me"? asked the sage curiously. "Because I saw something in your eyes which is bothering me". "What did you see"?

 

"I don't know. I've never seen it before in any other eyes but it's very pleasant".

 

"I'll tell you", said the sage. "What you saw was love and compassion".

 

"Why should you feel love for me"? asked the savage, surprised, for he had never seen that look before, not even in the eyes of his wife. "Because I love everybody and everything". "Why should you do that"? asked Ratnakar.

 

"Because everything and everyone is the form of that Supreme Being whom I worship. Now let me ask you, something", said the sage, "don't you know that by killing all these creatures and people, you are incurring great sin"?

 

"Yes, I suppose I know it", said the hunter doubtfully. "Then why do you do it"? asked the sage. "Because I have to support my family", said the hunter.

 

"Will they share at least part of the sin which will accrue to you by these acts"? questioned the sage. "I am sure they will", said the hunter.

 

"Why don't you go and ask them"? asked Narada, "and I'll wait for you till you come".

 

The hunter ran back and asked his wife and children if they would take their share of his sins as they were taking more than their fair share of ill-gotten goods. They were quite surprised at this question and asked him what he meant by this. He explained to them that since he was committing so many crimes for their sake, it was only fair that they should also share his sins. They were quite horrified by this request.

 

The woman said that it was the duty of a husband to look after his wife and the children said that it was the duty of a father to look after his progeny. As for his sins, naturally they were the outcome of his own acts and he would have to bear the consequences himself. The hunter did not wait to hear any more. He ran back to the sage who was quite sure of his return and was waiting with a smile on his lips. "Well, what did they say"? he asked. "Were they not eager to share your sins, as they were eager to share your spoils"?

 

Ratnakar hung his head and admitted that no one was willing to share his burdens. Then Narada gave him a discourse on the law of karma and told him that he alone would have to bear the consequences of his actions. To commit sinful acts for the sake of another was quite foolish.

 

The hunter looked lost and unhappy and asked the sage, "Now what should I do"?

 

"Meditate on the Supreme Being", he said, "only then will you be able to attain salvation. He alone is your relation. He alone your friend. I will give you a mantra by using which, you will be able to do tapas", "I am your servant, please guide me", said the hunter and knelt before the celestial sage.

 

Narada whispered the glorious mantra "Rama" into his right ear but the poor savage was so untutored that he was unable to repeat it. Then Narada asked, "Can you repeat the word, "mara” "Of course, I can", he said, since the word "mara" means "tree" and that was a thing he was always cutting down.

 

So Narada blessed him and told him how to sit in a meditation pose and to repeat the word constantly. The word “mara" when repeated fast becomes "Rama" and thus without knowing, the hunter started repeating the word "Rama" instead of "mara". Due to his past samskaras, he went into deep meditation for many years, till he was covered by a hillock of mud brought by ants.

 

Many years later, Narada returned and found the ant-hill in the exact place where he had left the hunter. He broke open the mud cage and woke up the person seated within.

 

"Arise 0 sage"! he said. "Do you remember who you are"? "Yes, Your Holiness", he answered, "I am the poor hunter, whom you took pity on and advised to repeat the glorious mantra, "Rama". "Now you are no longer a hunter but a sage and from now on you will be known as Valmiki since you have emerged from this ant-hill or "valmeekam'

 

[Guest guest]

Sri Vakrathunda mahaakaaya kotisuryasamaprabha

nirvighnam kurume deva subhakaryeshu sarvadaa

 

 

 

Please pardon my imprudence,

Valmiki rishi and Mrigari are they not two different persons?

 

Mercy.

How does one qualify for receiving mercy?

Is it randomly distributed? How is it reconciled with Karma?

 

Jai Sri Hari

 

 

 

 

Jai Shree Krishna

 

[gHari]

I've read that after mercy the recipient can either ride out his karma here until the end of this life or Krsna will just end it.

[Guest guest]

Sri Vakrathunda mahaakaaya kotisuryasamaprabha

nirvighnam kurume deva subhakaryeshu sarvadaa

 

 

Thank you

 

But the question was how and when does one receive mercy?

Is it a chance at random or it is one&#8217;s karma?

 

Jai Shree Krishna

 

[Guest guest]

Sri Vakrathunda mahaakaaya kotisuryasamaprabha

nirvighnam kurume deva subhakaryeshu sarvadaa

 

 

Thank you

 

But the question was how and when does one receive mercy?

Is it a chance at random or is it karma?

 

Jai Shree Krishna

 

[gHari]

Dear whoever you are,

 

Not karma.

 

Why does Krsna want to see you? I think it is a heart thing, but I don't recall having read that anywhere, so that may just be meaningless speculation.

 

But it is definitely not related to the clothes we wear, the haircut we have, our drumming, our cooking, our austerities, etc. It is called causeless, so no material cause-effect phenomenon will be the root of it. But it is definitely not karma; that much I can say for sure.

 

If you're really interested, I could possibly spend some of my time to search through the writings of Guru Prabhupada to find something a little more satisfying. I estimate an hour or two to get the real scoop. Is it really worth an hour of my time? Will you or anyone for that matter read the quotes? Just how deep is your interest in Krsna and His krpa?

 

gHari

[Guest guest]

Sri Vakrathunda mahaakaaya kotisuryasamaprabha

nirvighnam kurume deva subhakaryeshu sarvadaa

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

(Dear whoever you are,)

 

Does this matter?

 

 

(Not karma.)

 

So what is it? Someone just got lucky, is the sweet Lord partial to some and not the others?

 

(Why does Krsna want to see you? I think it is a heart thing,)

 

You tell me? We all in our heart seek the true love the true happiness.

 

(But it is definitely not related to the clothes we wear, the haircut we have, our drumming, our cooking, our austerities, etc.)

 

This much we may agree.

 

(It is called causeless, so no material cause-effect phenomenon will be the root of it. But it is definitely not karma; that much I can say for sure.)

 

That is why he is lord Hari

Are you saying we stop all our karma?

 

(If you're really interested, I could possibly spend some of my time to search through the writings of Guru Prabhupada to find something a little more satisfying. I estimate an hour or two to get the real scoop. )

 

God forbid I should take up your time.

 

(Is it really worth an hour of my time? Will you or anyone for that matter read the quotes? Just how deep is your interest in Krsna and His krpa?)

 

I did not realize you could be so arrogant

Just remember a tree gives its fruit and shelter, a cow gives milk in abundance Sadhu and saint gives their Krpa this is their causeless mercy what to speak off the supreme lord. Still a question remains in my mind.

Any way you need not answer this

Jai sri Krishna.

[gHari]

Thank you, Sir.

[gHari]

First quotes are from the Nectar of Devotion (Bhakti-Rasamrita-Sindhu) relating specifically to causeless mercy, while the latter two are from lectures:<blockquote>Sometimes, however, it is found that without undergoing any devotional process, one all of a sudden develops devotion for Lord KRSNa. This sudden development of the devotional attitude in a person must be understood as a special mercy of KRSNa or of His devotee. This apparently accidental development of ecstatic feelings through the causeless mercy of KRSNa can be divided into three groups: simply by speaking, simply by glancing and simply by good wishes.

 

If one can gradually advance his status in devotional service, this is understood to be due to the causeless mercy of KRSNa Himself. If a person is completely detached from material enjoyment and has developed pure ecstatic devotion, even if he is sometimes accidentally found not living up to the standard of devotional service, one should not be envious of him. It is confirmed also in Bhagavad-gItA that a devotee who has unflinching faith in and devotion to the Lord, even if sometimes found to be accidentally deviated from pure devotional characteristics, should still be counted among the pure. Unflinching faith in devotional service, in Lord KRSNa and in the spiritual master makes one highly elevated in the activities of devotional service.

 

Great authorities like BhISma have explained that love of Godhead means completely giving up all so-called love for any other person. According to BhISma, love means reposing one's affection completely upon one person, withdrawing all affinities for any other person. This pure love can be transferred to the Supreme Personality of Godhead under two conditions--out of ecstasy and out of the causeless mercy of the Supreme Personality of Godhead Himself.

 

When a devotee is found to be always associated with the Lord in ecstatic love, it is to be understood that such a position has been awarded by the Lord Himself out of His causeless extraordinary mercy. An example of such extraordinary mercy is given in the Eleventh Canto, Twelfth Chapter, verse 7, of SrImad-BhAgavatam, wherein Lord KRSNa tells Uddhava, "The gopIs in VRndAvana did not study the Vedas to achieve Me. Nor had they ever been in holy places of pilgrimage. Nor did they devoutly execute any regulative principle. Nor did they undergo any kind of austerity. It is simply by My association that they have attained the highest perfection of devotional service."

 

Generally, a devotee who has achieved the causeless mercy of the Lord on account of following the strict rules and regulations of devotional service becomes attracted by the supreme greatness of the Lord, by the transcendental beauty of the Lord and by the spontaneous execution of devotional service. To be more clear, by executing the regulative principles of devotional service one can fully appreciate the transcendental beauty of the Lord. In any case, such exalted positions are possible only by the extraordinary mercy of the Lord upon the devotee.

 

Any person who is reliable in all circumstances is called dependable. In this connection RUpa GosvAmI says that even the demons were relying upon the dependability of KRSNa, because they were confident that KRSNa would never attack them without due cause. Therefore, with faith and confidence, they used to live with their doors wide open. And the demigods, although afraid of the demons, were confident of the protection of KRSNa. Therefore, even in the midst of danger they were engaged in sportive activities. Persons who had never undergone the reformatory ritualistic ceremonies of the Vedas were confident that KRSNa would accept only faith and devotion, and so they were engaged in KRSNa consciousness and were freed from all anxieties. In other words, all kinds of men, from the demigods down to the uncultured, can rely on the causeless mercy of the Supreme Lord.

 

Persons who can give themselves to anyone are called magnanimous. No one could be more magnanimous than KRSNa, because He is always prepared to give Himself completely to His devotee. Even to one who is not a devotee, KRSNa in His form of Lord Caitanya is prepared to give Himself and to grant deliverance.

Although KRSNa is independent of everyone, out of His causeless mercy He is dependent upon Garga RSi for religious instruction; for learning the military art He is dependent upon SAtyaki; and for good counsel He is dependent upon His friend Uddhava.

 

When a devotee is never tired of executing devotional service and is always engaged in KRSNa conscious activities, constantly relishing the transcendental mellows in relationship with KRSNa, he is called perfect. This perfectional stage can be achieved in two ways: one may achieve this stage of perfection by gradual progress in devotional service, or one may become perfect by the causeless mercy of KRSNa, even though he has not executed all the details of devotional service.

 

A person's achieving perfection in devotional service simply by the causeless mercy of the Lord is explained in SrImad-BhAgavatam in connection with the brAhmaNas and their wives who were engaged in performing yajJa, or sacrifice. When the wives of the brAhmaNas were favored by Lord KRSNa and immediately attained the ecstasy of love of Godhead, their husbands said, "How wonderful it is that although these women have undertaken no reformatory performances such as accepting the sacred thread, have not resided in the monasteries of the spiritual master, have not observed the strict principles of celibacy, have not undergone any austerities and have not philosophized upon the observance of ritualistic ceremonies, they still have attained the favor of KRSNa, which is aspired after even by great mystics! How wonderful it is that these women have attained such perfection, while we, although brAhmaNas who have performed all the reformatory activities, cannot attain to this advanced stage!"

There is a similar statement by NArada, addressed to Sukadeva GosvAmI: "My dear Sukadeva GosvAmI, you never took the trouble to reside under the care of a spiritual master, and yet you have attained such a great status of transcendental knowledge. You never took the trouble to undergo severe austerities, and still, how wonderful it is that you have been situated in the most perfect stage of love of Godhead."

Sukadeva GosvAmI and the wives of the brAhmaNas performing yajJa are vivid examples of devotees who achieved the perfectional stage of devotional service by the grace of the Supreme Personality of Godhead.

 

In SrImad-BhAgavatam, Tenth Canto, Thirty-third Chapter, verse 20, it is said that after enjoying love affairs with KRSNa by dancing, embracing and kissing, the gopIs would sometimes become very tired, and KRSNa, out of His causeless mercy and compassion, would smear their faces with His lotus hands. This is an example of fatigue caused by laboring in the rAsa dance.

 

One weaver at MathurA addressed KRSNa in this way: "My dear King of VRndAvana, I have become so proud of Your causeless mercy upon me that I do not even count upon the mercy of the Lord of VaikuNTha, which is sought after by many great sages in deep meditation." In other words, although the yogIs and great sages sit in meditation upon Lord ViSNu, who is residing in VaikuNTha, a devotee of KRSNa is so proud that he does not consider such meditation to be very valuable. This feeling of pride is due to one's having achieved the highest goal of life--KRSNa.

 

The causeless mercy of KRSNa, the dust of His lotus feet, His prasAda and association with His devotees are some impetuses toward a devotee's engagement in transcendental loving service to the Lord.

KRSNa exhibited His causeless mercy when He was present at the departure of Grandfather BhISma. During the Battle of KurukSetra, BhISmadeva, the grandfather of Arjuna, was lying on a bed of arrows before departing from this mortal world. When Lord KRSNa, MahArAja YudhiSThira and the other PANDavas approached BhISmadeva, he was very grateful to Lord KRSNa, and he addressed the brAhmaNa military commander KRpAcArya thus: "My dear KRpAcArya, just see the wonderful causeless mercy of Lord KRSNa! I am most unfortunate. I have no qualification. I was opposing KRSNa's most intimate friend, Arjuna--I even tried to kill him! I have so many disqualifications, and yet the Lord is still so kind that He has come to see me at the last point of my life. He is worshipable by all great sages, but still He is so merciful that He has come to see an abominable person like me."

 

The symptom of ecstatic affection with reverence felt by Bali MahArAja was expressed as follows: "My dear Lord, You have simultaneously punished me and showed me Your causeless mercy. My conclusion is that when I have taken shelter of Your lotus feet I shall never be disturbed in any condition of life. Whether You give me the opportunity to enjoy all the yogic perfections or You put me into the most abominable condition of hellish life, I shall never be disturbed."

 

One devotee has confidently expressed this opinion: "If a drop of Lord KRSNa's mercy can be bestowed upon me, then I shall feel completely carefree, even in the midst of a fire or an ocean. But if I become bereft of His causeless mercy, then even if I became the King of DvArakA, I would be simply an object for pinpricks."

 

FROM LECTURES:

 

So if you want to approach the same level like PrahlAda MahArAja, we should not immediately imitate him. We must follow the sAdhana-bhakti, sAdhana-bhakti, for general, and kRpa-siddha, that is special. That is incalculable. If KRSNa wants, He can make immediately somebody very important. That is kRpa-siddha. So there are three classes of devotees: nitya-siddha and sAdhana-siddha and kRpa-siddha. PrahlAda MahArAja is nitya-siddha. He is not ordinary sAdhana-siddha or of course, ultimately there is no difference, either sAdhana-siddha or kRpa-siddha or nitya-siddha. But we should always remember that PrahlAda MahArAja is not ordinary devotee. He is nitya-siddha. Therefore immediately he developed the transcendental symptoms, aSTa-siddhi. ASTa-siddhi, you have read in The Nectar of Devotion. So the ecstasies EkAgra-manasA. EkAgra-manasA, "with full attention." For us to bring that full attention may take hundreds and thousands of years, full attention. But PrahlAda MahArAja, immediately. Immediately. Five-years-old boy. Because he is nitya-siddha. Always we should remember that we cannot imitate. "Now, PrahlAda MahArAja has immediately ekAgra-manasA, and I shall become also." No. That is not possible. May be possible, but that is not the way.

Just like in our country, perhaps you know, there was a poet, Rabindranath Tagore. He got many distinction from the Oxford University. He got... He never went to school but he got the title "doctor,Doctor Rabindranath Tagore." And if you think that "I shall also get doctorate without going to school," that is foolishness. That is special. Similarly, don't try to imitate. Follow the general course, sAdhana-siddhi. The regulative principles you must follow as instructed in the zAstra. Therefore there are so many zAstras. And guru is guide. We must always... Even if you are nitya-siddha or kRpa-siddha, you should not neglect the general regulative principle. That is very dangerous. Don't try to do that. We must follow. Nitya. Just like Caitanya MahAprabhu. Caitanya MahAprabhu is KRSNa Himself, God, but He is accepting guru. Who is His guru? He is guru of everyone, but He has also accepted Izvara PurI as His guru. KRSNa Himself, He accepted His guru, SAndIpani Muni, teaching us that without guru you cannot make any advance. Adau gurvAzrayam. The first business is to accept guru. Tad-vijJAnArthaM sa gurum evAbhigacchet [MU 1.2.12]. Don't think that "I am so advanced. I may not require any guru. I can do without guru." That is nonsense. That, not possible. "Must." Tad vijJAnArtham. Tad-vijJAnArtham is spiritual science. "Must approach." Gurum evAbhigacchet samit-paniH zrotriyaM brahma-niSTham. TasmAd-guruM prapadyeta jijJAsuH zreya uttamam [sB 11.3.21]. If you are actually serious to understand the transcendental science, spiritual knowledge, oh, you must have guru. TasmAd guruM prapadyeta jijJAsuH zreya uttamam. And... Just like Caitanya MahAprabhu says, AmAra AjJAya guru haJA tAra' ei deza [Cc. Madhya 7.128]. Guru cannot be self-made. No. There is no such single instance throughout the whole Vedic literature. And nowadays, so many rascals, they are becoming guru without any authority. That is not guru. You must be authorized. EvaM paramparA-prAptam imaM rA... As soon as the paramparA is lost, sa kAlena yoga naSTo parantapa, immediately finished. The spiritual potency finished. You can dress like a guru, you can talk big, big words, but it will never be effective.

 

So this is the process. This process you cannot expect immediately, but if you practice general process, very easily done, as it is recommended in the Bhagavad-gItA, man-manA bhava mad-bhakto mad-yAjI mAM namaskuru... [bg. 18.65]. You cannot get the position of PrahlAda MahArAja immediately. That is not possible. The process is, first of all, sAdhana-bhakti. This PrahlAda MahArAja's position is different. He is mahA-bhAgavata. In many places we have seen already. He is nitya-siddha. There are two kinds of devotees, three: nitya-siddha, sAdhana-siddha, kRpa-siddha. These things are described in The Nectar of Devotion. Nitya-siddha means they are eternally associate of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. They are called nitya-siddha. And sAdhana-siddha means one is fallen in this material world, but by practice of devotional service according to the rules and regulation, injunction of the zAstra, direction of guru, in this way, one can reach also the same position as the nitya-siddha. This is sAdhana-siddha. And there is another. That is kra-siddha. KRpa-siddha means... Just like NityAnanda Prabhu. He wanted that these JagAi-MAdhAi must be delivered. There was no sAdhana. They never followed any rules and regulation. They were thieves and rogues, very fallen condition. But NityAnanda Prabhu wanted to show an example that "I shall deliver these two brothers. Never mind they are so fallen." That is called kRpa-siddha. So we should always remember there are three categories: nitya-siddha, sAdhana-siddha and kRpa-siddha. But when they become siddha, perfect, by any process, they are on the same level. There is no distinction.

So PrahlAda MahArAja's position is nitya-siddha. GaurAGgera saGgi gane nitya-siddha boli mAne. Caitanya MahAprabhu, when He came... Not only He, but others also. Just like with KRSNa so many devotees, they descended. Just like Arjuna. Arjuna is nitya-siddha, nitya-siddha friend. When KRSNa said that "I spoke this philosophy of Bhagavad-gItA to the sun-god...," imaM vivasvate yogaM proktavAn aham avyayam... [bg. 4.1]. That is so many millions of years ago. To clear the matter, Arjuna inquired that "KRSNa, You are of my age. How I can believe that You spoke this philosophy so many millions of years ago?" So what KRSNa replied, you know, that "My dear Arjuna, both you and Me, we appeared many, many times. The difference is that you have forgotten. That means you were also present at that time because you are My nitya-siddha friend. Whenever I appear, you also appear. But you have forgotten; I have not forgotten." That is the difference between jIva and ziva, or Lord, that we are minute part and particle of the Supreme; therefore we may forget. But KRSNa does not forget. That is the difference. So nitya-siddha. PrahlAda MahArAja is to be understood as nitya, mahA-bhAgavata, nitya-siddha. They appear to complete the lIlA of KRSNa.</blockquote>

[gHari]

From the Bhagavatam:<blockquote>The devotee prays: "As Your devotee is completely free from all desires, Your Lordship is also completely free from desires. You are fully independent. Although all living entities engage in Your service, You do not depend on the service of anyone. Although this material world is created complete by You, everything depends on Your sanction. As stated in Bhagavad-gItA, mattaH smRtir jJAnam apohanaM ca: [bg. 15.15] remembrance, knowledge and forgetfulness come from You. Nothing can be done independently, yet You act independently of the service rendered by Your servants. The living entities depend on Your mercy for liberation, but when You want to give them liberation, You do not depend on anyone else. Indeed, by Your causeless mercy, You can give liberation to anyone. Those who receive Your mercy are called kRpA-siddha. To reach the platform of perfection takes many, many lives (bahUnAM janmanAm ante jJAnavAn mAM prapadyate [bg. 7.19]). Nonetheless, even without undergoing severe austerities, one can attain perfection by Your mercy. Devotional service should be unmotivated and free from impediments (ahaituky apratihatA yayAtmA suprasIdati). This is the position of nirAziSaH, or freedom from expectations for results. A pure devotee continuously offers transcendental loving service to You, but You may nonetheless offer mercy to anyone, without depending on his service."

 

Bali MahArAja had already been blessed by his grandfather PrahlAda MahArAja. Therefore, he was a pure devotee, although born in a family of demons. There are two kinds of highly elevated devotees, called sAdhana-siddha and kRpA-siddha. SAdhana-siddha refers to one who has become a devotee by regular execution of the regulative principles mentioned in the zAstras, as ordered and directed by the spiritual master. If one regularly executes such devotional service, he will certainly attain perfection in due course of time. But there are other devotees, who may not have undergone all the required details of devotional service but who, by the special mercy of guru and KRSNa--the spiritual master and the Supreme Personality of Godhead--have immediately attained the perfection of pure devotional service. Examples of such devotees are the yajJa-patnIs, MahArAja Bali and Sukadeva GosvAmI. The yajJa-patnIs were the wives of ordinary brAhmaNas engaged in fruitive activities. Although the brAhmaNas were very learned and advanced in Vedic knowledge, they could not achieve the mercy of KRSNa-BalarAma, whereas their wives achieved complete perfection in devotional service, despite their being women. Similarly, Vairocani, Bali MahArAja, received the mercy of PrahlAda MahArAja, and by PrahlAda MahArAja's mercy he also received the mercy of Lord ViSNu, who appeared before him as a brahmacArI beggar. Thus Bali MahArAja became a kRpA-siddha because of the special mercy of both guru and KRSNa. Caitanya MahAprabhu confirms this favor: guru-kRSNa-prasAde pAya bhakti-latA-bIja (Cc. Madhya 19.151). Bali MahArAja, by the grace of PrahlAda MahArAja, got the seed of devotional service, and when that seed developed, he achieved the ultimate fruit of that service, namely love of Godhead (premA pum-artho mahAn), immediately upon the appearance of Lord VAmanadeva. Bali MahArAja regularly maintained devotion for the Lord, and because he was purified, the Lord appeared before him. Because of unalloyed love for the Lord, he then immediately decided, "I shall give this little dwarf brAhmaNa whatever He asks from me." This is a sign of love. Thus Bali MahArAja is understood to be one who received the highest perfection of devotional service by special mercy.</blockquote>

 

Adi-lila 8.5:<blockquote>

By remembering the lotus feet of the PaJca-tattva, a dumb man can become a poet, a lame man can cross mountains, and a blind man can see the stars in the sky.

 

PURPORT

In VaiSNava philosophy there are three ways for perfection--namely sAdhana-siddha, perfection attained by executing devotional service according to the rules and regulations, nitya-siddha, eternal perfection attained by never forgetting KRSNa at any time, and kRpA-siddha, perfection attained by the mercy of the spiritual master or another VaiSNava. KavirAja GosvAmI here stresses kRpA-siddha, perfection by the mercy of superior authorities. This mercy does not depend on the qualifications of a devotee. By such mercy, even if a devotee is dumb he can speak or write to glorify the Lord splendidly, even if lame he can cross mountains, and even if blind he can see the stars in the sky.

 

</blockquote>

[gHari]

various lectures:<blockquote>So KRSNa, when instructs from within the heart, He is called caitya-guru. And that caitya-guru is expanded by the process, personal presentation of spiritual master. So both ways He is helping us. KRSNa is so kind. Guru-kRSNa-kRpA. KRSNa is helping from within, but sometimes we are so dull, naturally, that we cannot understand. Therefore He sends His representative to instruct externally. So He is helping internally and externally. There is no difference between the internal and external instructor. We should take advantage of this instruction. That is called vyavasAyAtmikA buddhiH, fixed-up resolution. Fixed-up resolution. If we become fixed up in this resolution, that "Whatever we have heard from my guru, the representative of KRSNa, I must execute. I do not care for my personal convenience or inconvenience. This is my life and soul," then your life is perfect. Then your life is... If I make some amendment, addition, alteration, in the name of KRSNa, guru, then it is spoiled. No. We should receive the instruction as it is, especially...

 

To understand Vedic literature means one must have firm faith in KRSNa and firm faith in guru, not that "My guru is not so learned, so let me capture KRSNa directly." That is useless. That is useless. Caitanya MahAprabhu says, guru-kRSNa-kRpAya pAya bhakti-latA-bIja [Cc. Madhya 19.151]. One can get the seed of the plant or creeper of bhakti, how? Guru-kRSNa-kRpA. By the mercy of guru and by the mercy of KRSNa, not that kRSNa-kRpA. First guru-kRpA, then kRSNa-kRpA. So this brAhmaNa attracted the attention of Caitanya MahAprabhu. He was illiterate, and he could not read even one word. What is the truth in it? The same thing. Guru-mukha-padma-vAkya, cittete koriyA aikya **. He took guru's order very seriously, that "My Guru MahArAja has ordered me, and I must carry out. Never mind I cannot read. Let me open the pages and see. That's all." So he was doing that. So others criticized him that "This man is illiterate. What he is reading?" But Caitanya MahAprabhu did not criticize. Caitanya MahAprabhu inquired, "Oh, what you are reading, My dear brAhmaNa?" So he explained, that "This gentleman has not come to criticize me." So Caitanya MahAprabhu knew that "He is a perfect knower of Bhagavad-gItA." Still, He inquired, "Well, if you are not reading, then how you are crying? I see there are tears in your eyes. What is the meaning?" Then he admitted, "Yes, sir. Yes. That is.Why you are crying?No, as soon as I take this Bhagavad-gItA in my hand a picture comes before me that Arjuna is sitting on the chariot ordering KRSNa, and KRSNa, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is carrying out his order and driving the chariot. So that makes me amazed. Therefore I am crying, that ‘How KRSNa is merciful, that He accepted a menial service for His devotee. He is so kind.' " Caitanya MahAprabhu immediately embraced him: "Yes, brAhmaNa, your reading of Bhagavad-gItA is perfect." So it doesn't matter whether one is illiterate or literate. Everyone has got these ears. So we should hear from the realized person, guru VaiSNava, not professional, no. That will not help us.

 

Not only KRSNa's mercy, but guru's mercy, both mercy required. Guru-kRSNa kRpAya pAya bhakti-latA-bIja.

So by if you are sincere, actually, if we actually want KRSNa, KRSNa is within your heart, IzvaraH sarva-bhUtAnAM hRd-deze 'rjuna [bg. 18.61]. When KRSNa sees that "Here is a sincere soul, he wants Me," teSAM satata-yuktAnAM bhajatAM prIti-pUrvakaM, buddhi-yogaM dadAmi tam [bg. 10.10]. As soon as sees, KRSNa, that "Here is a sincere person who wants Me," He'll give you nice guru. Guru-kRSNa kRpa. Yasya prasAdAd bhagavat-prasAdat. And if you have really a bona fide guru, then by pleasing him you will get the favor of KRSNa. Yasya prasAdAd bhagavat-prasAdo yasyAprasAdAn na gatiH kuto 'pi **. If you have become more than your guru, then "Overcoming guru, I shall get KRSNa's prasAda, KRSNa's favor, I have learnt more, guru mara vidyA," that is also not good. Yasya prasAdAd bhagavat-prasAdo yasya **. This is the injunction of the AcArya, VizvanAtha CakravartI ThAkura. He has described very nicely vyavasAyAtmikA buddhir ekeha kuru nandana. The order of guru should be the life and soul of the disciple, without caring for his personal salvation. This is the qualification of ziSya. SiSyas te 'ham zAdhi mAM prapannam, fully surrendered. And guru's duty is to guide them, guide him how to overcome this cycle of birth of death.

 

By the mercy of the spiritual master, AcArya, we immediately get the blessings of Lord. Immediately. Yasya prasAdAt. Yasya means "whose"; prasAdAt, "benediction." By the benediction of the spiritual master. Yasya prasAdAd bhagavat-prasAdaH **. If spiritual master, AcArya, is pleased, then you should know that KRSNa is also pleased. You should know through. This is not very difficult. Just like you are working in office. If your immediate officer, boss, is pleased, that means the proprietor of the firm, he's also pleased. Although you do not see him. This is fact. Your immediate boss, if he's pleased. So similarly, we, our business, this spiritual line, is guru-kRSNa- kRpA. We have to first receive the merciful benediction from the AcArya, and then KRSNa will be pleased and He'll also give His blessings. Mad-bhakta. There is a version in the SrImad- BhAgavatam, mad-bhakta pUjyAbhyadhikA. He says, KRSNa says, that "If anyone worships Me directly and if anyone worships Me through the AcArya, he's better devotee who is coming to Me through AcArya." Mad-bhakta pUjyAbhyadhikA.

So our, this VaiSNava philosophy, process, is to go through the AcArya. Servant of the servant of the servant. We should try to become servant of the servant. GopI-bhartuH .-kamalayor dAsa-dAsAnudAsaH. DAsa-dAsAnudAsaH. We should not approach the Supreme Personality of Godhead directly. That is not good. That will not be... In the Vedic injunction also it is said, yasya deve parA bhaktir yathA deve tathA gurau [sU 6.23]. If one has got unflinching faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, yathA deve, and similar faith in guru... Of course, we must make guru bona fide. Then it is disciplic succession. And that is also not very difficult to select, who is bona fide guru. Bona fide guru means he presents himself as servant of God. He does not pose himself falsely that "I am God." This is bona fide. It is not difficult to find out bona fide. But this is the test. If anyone says that "I am guru," er, "I am God," then he cannot be guru. Because he has no knowledge. How he is God? But he can cheat some people. That is different thing. You can cheat all people for some time and some people for all time, but not all people for all time. That is not possible. So these kinds of guru, who poses themself that "I am God," he's a false guru. The bona fide guru will say that "I am servant of the servant of the servant of KRSNa," or God. Servant of. That is the business of guru. He serves KRSNa as KRSNa desires; that is his business. That is also not very difficult. KRSNa says, KRSNa desires, sarva-dharmAn parityajya mAm ekaM zaraNaM vraja [bg. 18.66], that "You give up all other engagement; just surrender unto Me, and I'll give you protection." KRSNa says. So guru's business is that "You simply surrender to KRSNa." What is the difficulty? Simply repeat the same thing. Not for himself, but for KRSNa. He's bona fide guru.</blockquote>

[Guest guest]

i find difficluty in relating the last few posts in this thread to bill gate.

 

jai sri prabhupada!

 

 

[gHari]

It's all part of the scheme to make Mr. Gates (try to remember the spelling) a Krsna bhakta. Here we analyze the nature of the mercy of Guru and Krsna, hoping to somehow extend mercy to Bill, so he can advance like the vicious hunter Mrgari.

[Guest guest]

 

 

 

You guys should get Tiger Woods to chant Hare Krishna. If he did it everyone would start doing it. They could even have commercials of Tiger Woods chanting Hare Krishna.

[Guest guest]

I heard Bill Gates visited the Seatle temple.

 

(I hope this is ok to say.)

[Guest guest]

I hadn't heard about that. I had heard that his partner from the early Microsoft days, Steve Jobs, former owner of Apple Computers, used to visit the Seattle Temple during a 6 month period in the '70's. But who knows, perhaps Gates went along with him once or twice.

 

gHari, you titled one of your posts "Guest Moderator." What is the meaning behind this. I'm not sure I understand. Does this mean you are a moderator here, specifically in charge of the Guests?

[stonehearted]

Guest: You guys should get Tiger Woods to chant Hare Krishna. If he did it everyone would start doing it. They could even have commercials of Tiger Woods chanting Hare Krishna.

 

Bill Gates, Tiger Woods, Bob Dylan, Cat Stevens, George Harrison, blah, blah, blah.

 

This is all pie in the sky. "If only we could get X to take up Krishna consciousness, everyone would do it." We thought that about the Beatles. Didn't happen. Yeah, George helped make Krishna a houshold word, but not many of my old friends took up Krishna consciousness because of him. We brought Cat Stevens to the Honolulu temple in 1974. He was very friendly, very favorable. Then he found Islam. My friend Prahladahlada sold a Krishna book to Carlos Santana; I sold one to Bobbie Gentry. Still, most people have never even heard of Krishna consciousness. And you think that if you can turn Bill Gates, we can move the world. ("Just think of what I could do 'for Krishna' with all that money!") Here's what'll work: work on those you know--give them what you understand about Krishna by simply sharing what they're ready to take and, more important, by being a good example. That will change people's hearts and gradually increase their faith in Krishna consciousness. Why bother? Because each of them, rich or poor, Ph.D. or fast-food worker, is eternally Krishna's servant, and remembering that will bring an end to their unspeakable suffering. Not so you get any points with anyone (although Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and Nityananda Prabhu will definitely notice). Treat each person you meet as your brother or sister who you're so happy to see again, give them what you have, introduce them to Krishna, and leave the results to Him. Dreaming of how much better it would be if we "scored" someone who's rich, powerful, or influential will not getus far.

 

Besides, if ISKCON "got" Gates, his money would disappear down a drain. That's after Windle Turley gets really, really rich.

[livingentity]

devotees that came from very wealthy influencial families. Hint: vroom vroom - for one.

 

Stonehearted is right - stop dreaming and start promoting.