Christ in Vedas

[theist]

Krsna is the wolf? Is that what you are saying?

 

Then I say unto you get behind me Satan... in the name of Jesus Christ and by the power of his holy spirit I cast thee away.

[Guest guest]

Thanks for your blessings (I don't think i can expect more than this from a person like you). The prophets you are refering are humans NOT god. Jesus talking about humans who are clamiong themselfs as God like Krishna , Rama even Sai Baba..Do you worship Idols?

[gHari]

Is the truth. Your activities here are not sponsored by the Holy Spirit. They come from your mind and your need to build your ego using religion. You think you have some understanding of Krsna, but you are totally ignorant.

 

You should practice your religion; not just use it to beat others. Seek the Kingdom; get beyond the words. Then you will not be so offensive toward God.

 

May Jesus have mercy on you for your offenses here.

[Priitaa]

 

YES Everything is OK by Geeta..Even krishna is known for lying and cheating others when he was in Gokulam. Would you describe above action is a act of God or Demon?

 

 

If your desire is to have a sane 'discussion,' and come to some conclusion, than I humbly ask you to control yourself and refrain from any name calling, especially about Krishna. After all, you dont hear me name calling Jesus! So there should be mutual respect and only from that point can any agreement, even if small, be achieved. If however this is a way your get your anger out, then it really has little to do with religion. So let us hope instead that it is just overzealousness regarding your religion.

 

With that said, I dont know whose version of Gita you are reading, and I have pointed out, untless one reads the translations of a pure deovtee, than they will not be given the right words or meaning of Krishna.

 

Be it the God of the Gita or the God of the Bible, we see similar sorts of things going on, such as challenging a father to prove his faith in God by killing his child. At last minute he did not let him do so, but the Biblical story of this challenge by God is there. One could also say this is demon, but I do not. Simply the exact same types of behavior of God being crticized, exist in the Bible. Actually, this is worse than lying or cheating! Yet I am not criticizing and hope this is mutual by now. The point is, God can do anything He wants to do, and no one should think they can sit in judgment of God's actions. It should be recognized that God would only do what is best for us, even if, with our pea brains, it does not make sense to us.

 

(To everyone: It would be nice if all these brave and right preachers signed their names to their posts.)

[AncientMariner]

 

 

 

This whole Bible versus Gita debate and whether Christ is the only way to God is going to be going on for a long time.... ad infinitum

 

In the name of the father the son and the holy ghost lets just all work together to bring about a revolution in the impious lives of humanity. After all we don't want to end up in an unmanifested state until the next Kali-yuga.

[Priitaa]

Ancient,

 

While I agree with you 'if' it becomes nasty, but if it does not, dialogue is important. So what if it goes on until infinity? Prabhupada had us going out onto the streets and preaching to all sorts of folks, giving them a book, and some even threw those books in the trash. If during that time into infinity, we can even come a bit closer together on this, which can only happen if talked about with kindness and respect, then I find no prolblem with that. On the other hand if name calling, or even subtle name calling, creeps back in, than of course it has to stop. And it is just proof that person never really wanted to talk in the first place. They only needed an outlet for their anger.

[Priitaa]

 

I don't understand the basic thing, As you know the demi/semi gods in Hinduesm has no power to lead sinners into SALVATION, Tell me how the SALVATION will work in Hinduesm, I don't think sinners can enter into Paramatma directly..

 

 

With all due respect, I am not sure what your questoin is here. I thought we were in agreement. So maybe I need to explain more.

 

I am not saying worship of demigods brings salvation. I am saying only by worship of the Supreme One God, can there be salvation.

 

If that does not clear it up, please let me know.

[gHari]

Have we forgotten that there are but three options in the face of blasphemy?

 

[Guest guest]

You meant to say worshipping krishna?, How about a white lie (a lie that doesn't harm anybody) will it be consider as sin?, How would you make sure your sins were forgiven?

[Guest guest]

Why do you want to call "Jesus" because you have accepted him as god (I am really glad about that),but that doesn't mean that i accepted krishna as god (?). Why are you so sure that all the versus in bible which are refering "Jesus" as a only gos is wrong. I am amazed about the credibility of the bible which even says about you guys

 

Matthew 7:15-20 "Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves

[Priitaa]

"You meant to say worshipping krishna?,"

 

Krishna is the One God, so if you are asking who I accept as God, it is Krishna.

 

" How about a white lie (a lie that doesn't harm anybody) will it be consider as sin?,"

 

Why is anyone dedicated to a spiritual path tellng white lies? The idea is to give up all sinful activities.

 

" How would you make sure your sins were forgiven? "

 

Just as you read your scripture and believe your sins are forgiven due to this or that promise, so do we. And in your own Bible, in Romans, you will see that it is by the chanting/singing of Gods names that will wash away all sins. Merely 'believing' will not free anyone from sinful reaction. It is by chanting the glories of God, and of course living a pure life, serving the Lord, these things are what's freeing. Hope this answered your question.

[Guest guest]

I am not calling Krishna as wolf but the bible does.

[Guest guest]

As you are worshipping Krishna I am expecting the answeres from Geeta not bible (Because bible was inspired by Jesus Christ & The Holy Sprit not Krishna) , Bible is clear

 

1 John1:7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin

 

That said there is no other way other than Jesus Christ..

 

1. Does Geeta says anything clear about the creation of the world?

2. Do we have any info about the the holy man became a sinner?

3. Do we have any explanation why do we have 330 Miliians of Gods?

4. How and idol can represent the glory and the power of God?

5. Does it says anything about the end of the world?

6. Does it has any prophecys and fullfilment of the same?

7. What will happen after you die?

8. How would you explain Jesus by Geeta?

[Guest guest]

To be honest I am asking this questions because i don't know..

 

 

How would you convince me that the worship of the animals such as cow ('Co Mada'), Dog 'Bhairava'), Snake ('Nagaraja')?

 

Who created the world whether Brahma or Big Bang?

 

According to the Hinduism there are four classifications in the humans called “Sutra”,"Vishnava","Shattriya" and "Brahmna". The brahmins are the only one who entitled to touch the idols and do pooja. What kind of science is this?

 

"As for as christianity is concern all humans are child of god there is no classification by birth"

 

 

If you are a brahmin would you accept the 'prasad' from a sutra?

 

why they are doing dump things such as walking on the fire , piercing a big Trishul on there mouth , Lifting some heavy stufff and take a long walk to one of the temple. What kind of mercy & kind god will encourage these actions?

[AncientMariner]

 

 

 

 

Regarding books being thrown in the trash that brings back memories when I met some devotees in the Seattle airport. I was picking up my brother and this really nice devotee came up to me and offered these books so I gave him 20 dollars for The Quest for Enlightenment, The Journey of Self-Discovery and Bhagavad Gita. I was with my dad and He looked at me like I was crazy for giving money to a Hare Krishna. Anyway my brothers flight was late so I had to go back to my car and I took the books with me. Later on I went back through the airport and saw that devotee again. I am sure he noticed I didn't have the books with me and I have always wondered if he thought I threw them away or something.

[gHari]

A couple of years back I was at a skateboarding Warped Tour concert and met a devotee. Later I saw some ripped Sri Isopanisads on the ground. It broke my heart. For an hour I picked up the various pieces and ended up with two and a half books. I guess I was showing the bystanders just how valuable these books really were.

 

It's like this silly arrogant character who'd rather speculate and offend rather than follow Jesus. He will call "Lord, Lord", but Jesus will say "I knew you not." Does he really think we are cheaters too who depend only on the words of the scriptures? How shallow.

[Priitaa]

Let me see if I can answer your questions, and by the way my answers do not come from Hinduism but from Krishna consciousness.

 

"To be honest I am asking this questions because i don't know.."

 

I appreciate your humility. And your honesty.

 

"How would you convince me that the worship of the animals such as cow ('Co Mada'), Dog 'Bhairava'), Snake ('Nagaraja')?"

 

We do not worship dog or snake in Krshna Consciousness. The closest we come is to worship of cow, but even that, it is not exactly worship, but respect. We protect and care for the cow because as mother she gives us milk, which we need for life, and gives our children milk too. Because she may not be so bright we do not slit her throat, just as we would not a mentally challenged child, but instead we protect. Since we also understand all life comes from life and therefore all have a soul, so too we don't kill her.

 

"Who created the world whether Brahma or Big Bang?"

 

Neither. Krishna. hehe

 

To get into technicalities, Brhama can be looked upon as a worker or servant. For example, say in this world a man owns a factory. He makes toys. So he employs many people to make the toys. Now he knows how to make them, but after all, he is the owner. So he hires someone else to do the job. Similarly Brahma, being given all the raw materials by Krishna, can put togther fleshy bodies or earthy substances, but he can not create the soul. So Krishna creates life, the soul.

 

"According to the Hinduism there are four classifications in the humans called “Sutra”,"Vishnava","Shattriya" and "Brahmna". The brahmins are the only one who entitled to touch the idols and do pooja. What kind of science is this?"

 

Thank goodness I don't practice Hinduism! /images/graemlins/smile.gif Now in Krishna consciousness we practice transcendental lifestyle. I have many quotes but they are tucked away. If you want I will get later (ask tho). But Prabhupada has said repeatedly we do NOT follow the caste system, that anyone is allowed to be elevated to the position of a priest or brahmana, equal opportunity and education for all. BUT even that is not where we stop, as he has pointed out a Vaisnava is transcendental to all of these.

 

"As for as christianity is concern all humans are child of god there is no classification by birth"

 

 

We are in agreement here.

 

"If you are a brahmin would you accept the 'prasad' from a sutra? "

 

Yes, if he offered it to Krishna. (I dont eat demi-god prasad, but I dont care who offers the food.)

 

"why they are doing dump things such as walking on the fire ,"

 

Thats mystic yoga, not Krishna consciousness.

 

" piercing a big Trishul on there mouth , "

 

Whats a Trishul?

 

"Lifting some heavy stufff and take a long walk to one of the temple. "

 

I dont know what you mean by lifting heavy stuff, but it is common to walk from temple to temple, even in Christs day. Pilgrimage is a common religious practice in all faiths, as are taking on austerities which are for the purpose to help us get off the bodily concept. So maybe the other things above that I dont recognize, maybe they fit in this category.

 

"What kind of mercy & kind god will encourage these actions? "

 

You know, before I joined the Hare Krishna movement, I was a Methodist. I still believe in Jesus as do most Hare Krishna devotees of Prabhupada's movement. Matter of fact, we have been one of the few to be able to convince those of Jewish decent or belief, to accept Jesus. So I dont think we are without bona fide teachings just on those merits alone. :-) Where I am going with this is, I have a hard time in regards to the suffering Christ "had" to endure on the cross, and that this is a main part of Christianity. Not to misunderstand, I believe and even know for a fact he was crucified. But that a major aspect of Christianity is focused on his suffering rather than all the good he brought, all the light, the love and the clearer understanding of God (at that time there were great amounts of demi god worship, even trees!). So this is a horrible thing to focus on. I guess I would have to go the extra mile and say that one could also ask what kind of merciful God would encourage this to have happened, tho personally I do not think that way. Only that this point is to be found in every religion and we must realize, again, that with our pea brain, we have a hard time understanding God.

 

I dont know if I answered all your questions, and also I have not meant to offend you if I did so by accident. Just ask me more, and I will clear up anything I have said.

[Priitaa]

Yes, it is disturbing to read of books thrown on the ground, torn, trashed, etc. I also get upset to see such a thing. I do remember tho, when devotees said we must make everyone pay money cuz they will otheriwse throw them in the trash, Prabhupada replied with a .... so what, they throw their babies in the trash.

 

Sad but true. But I did like his answer in the sense that books should not become a materialistic business. In kali yuga we have to distrubute books to everybody, no matter what (with intelligence of course). Desperate measures for desperate times.

[Priitaa]

 

As you are worshipping Krishna I am expecting the answeres from Geeta not bible (Because bible was inspired by Jesus Christ & The Holy Sprit not Krishna) , Bible is clear

 

1 John1:7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin

 

That said there is no other way other than Jesus Christ..

 

1. Does Geeta says anything clear about the creation of the world?

2. Do we have any info about the the holy man became a sinner?

3. Do we have any explanation why do we have 330 Miliians of Gods?

4. How and idol can represent the glory and the power of God?

5. Does it says anything about the end of the world?

6. Does it has any prophecys and fullfilment of the same?

7. What will happen after you die?

 

 

 

I will answer all these quesitons, but am a bit tired now. ha

 

Any other Hare Krishna (Prabhupada lineage) devotees out there, feel free to share your knowledge too.

[gHari]

That's my Prabhupada! What a perfect response.

[gHari]

These aren't questions. These are accusations; the dangerous result of a little book knowledge in the hands of the arrogant. They should not be answered, just as one should not place a jewel on the head of a cobra.

 

Anyone in a position to affect Christian thought would not be so ill-informed or abusive. Nothing will come of this.

 

The only way this fellow will change his mind is if he begins to actually follow Jesus, and receives the mercy of the Holy Ghost. Only then can he understand his scripture and be blessed to resolve the apparent differences between the two great religious heritages.

[Priitaa]

Gh,

 

I am not sure. I don't know who he is and I have recnetly noticed a bunch of Muslim/Hindu/Christians posts that are obviously fights. So maybe he is sensitive about how things are explained to him due to these, and as a result, defensive. I agree tho, that there is no problem from me encouraging him to follow Jesus.

 

Anyway, thats ok, I will come back later and answer his questions.

[Priitaa]

I am back, tho being tired, my answers may be incomplete for now.

 

"As you are worshipping Krishna I am expecting the answeres from Geeta not bible (Because bible was inspired by Jesus Christ & The Holy Sprit not Krishna) , Bible is clear "

 

"1 John1:7 but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin"

 

I have no problem with this. But there is more. Such as:

 

John 21:25 “And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written."

 

Here it is shown that not all of Jesus’ activities are known. In fact, it is intimated that only a small fraction of them are known.

 

"That said there is no other way other than Jesus Christ."

 

If that were true, it would indicate that he left all the Buddhists and every other religion to be cast aside into what Christians believe as the etenral hell fire. No, Christ was more compassionate than that.

 

I Timothy 3:16-17 “All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.”

 

This explains that bona fide scripture should be accepted, at least on the basis of instruction, even if it does not describe Jesus.

 

John 16:12 “I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.”

 

This states that there is more knowledge to be had, but the disciples were not purified enough to receive it or understand it.

 

Often we are told that Jesus instructs you can only reach God through him, and in no other way. The verse used for this is John 16:23 "Truly, truly, I say to you, whatever you ask my Father in my name, He will give it to you."

 

Now, the original Aramic word used here, Christ's mother-tongue, is BESHEMI. The Church has mistranslated this as "In my name." However, it actually means "according to my technique, or my system of dong things." Jesus encouraged his disciples in the manner in which he taught them. So according to the original Aramic which Jesus actually spoke, this verse should more properly read, "Truly, truly, I say to you, whatever you ask my Father in the same manner in which I ask Him, He will give it to you." Certainly Christ would accept praying in Krishna's name, as our technique has so much in common.

 

"And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." Acts 2:21

 

"Simply by chanting one holy name of Hari, a sinful man can counteract the reactions to more sins than he is able to commit. (Brhad-visnu Purana)" -- S.B. 6.2.7 (purport)

 

1. Does Geeta says anything clear about the creation of the world?

 

Vedic literaute gives much more detail about creation than the Bible.

 

2. Do we have any info about the the holy man became a sinner?

 

Sorry, I do not understand this question. What holy man are you referring to?

 

3. Do we have any explanation why do we have 330 Miliians of Gods?

 

As in the above explanation of Lord Brhama having the job of making bodies, etc., so the demi-gods, like in an administrative business for example, they all have their individual jobs as well. They are deputied to be in charge of material nature. I dont know why you have such interest of demi-gods, but really, they are not so important.

 

4. How and idol can represent the glory and the power of God?

 

I think I touched on this in an above post, not sure, but if you are going to ask the same questions from a different angle, it makes gH right. You dont want to do that now do ya? /images/graemlins/smile.gif /images/graemlins/smile.gif Anyway, the short answer is that God is unlimited and can turn even stone into life should He want to. A Deity of Krishna/God is not stone and if one thinks of Him that way, they have material vision. But it may need to be clarified that no one can just 'make up' or concoct a Deity, but instead must go in accordance to Gods word about how to do this, how He will agree to 'enter' into the Deity form. If the Deity is not made in accorance to His Divine instructions, that is when it becomes idol worship. (Yes, now I do remember talking about idol worship in a previous post.)

 

5. Does it says anything about the end of the world?

 

Yes it does.

 

6. Does it has any prophecys and fullfilment of the same?

 

Yup.

 

7. What will happen after you die?

 

Depends on what you do now.

 

8. How would you explain Jesus by Geeta?

 

I all ready explained in previous posts that we accept Jesus as an avatara or incarnation known as shaktyavesha avatara.

 

I dont mind answering any sincere questions that aren't for the purpose of tripping me up. I also am not trying to convert you, only to relieve any animosity so there can be peace on earth. Or at least on these message boards. :-) If we can come to that point, and be honest in our dealings, this would be a good thing.

[Guest guest]

Please explain me the following ridiculous claims from bibe.

 

1. Adam and eve ate some apple and then the whole world was punished for it. Original sin or original ..

 

2. What kind of demonic religion will believe in something like a human sacrifice or god's son's sacrifice. How can any god punish an innocent human being for a murderer's sin or likewise.

 

3. In old testament your god asks to sacrifice all the first borns, asks joshua and his followers to kill every living thing in the land of philistines. How can any god do such demonic things.

[Guest guest]

How can all loving god send you to hell for not praying to him inspite of a person doing consciously more good than evil.

 

Even a human father will not do such a thing to his son. What needs to be said of true GOD.

 

Face it, majority of bible is a bunch of baloney and mumbo jumbo.