Just find a nice homosexual boy - stay with him

[Guruvani]

In a recent sangha article Tripurari Maharaja has proposed that Srila Prabhupada was instructing his homosexual disciples to "find a nice boy" (for homosexual behaviour) and "stay with him" and practice Krishna consciousness.

 

The exact quote is:

Although my Guru Maharaja frowned on homosexuality in general, he was also very practical, flexible, and compassionate. One of his earliest disciples was a gay man who once related how he had ultimately discussed his sexual orientation with Srila Prabhupada. He said that at that point Srila Prabhupada said "Then just find a nice boy, stay with him and practice Krsna consciousness."

 

 

I personally find this a little disconcerting to hear that Tripurari Maharaja would try to impune Prabhupada's character in this way by making him culpable for the perverted activities of homosexual devotees. The use of the word "boy" carries an almost pedophilia inference.

 

His source of information for this statement of Srila Prabhupada was a homosexual disciple of Srila Prabhupada - hardly a reliable source for such a controversial and damning statement.

 

Can you believe this kind of propaganda is being passed off as "sangha"?

Dusanga Spamkirtan...............

[atma]

Especially knowing that most of the gay disciples got married, Hayagriva, Bhavananda, Upendra to name a few.

[livingentity]

Yes, and if I remember correctly - didn't Srila Prabhupada pick out their wives for them?

 

I searched through my folio disk and nowhere do I see any quote like this one that has been attributed to Prabhupada. And nowhere do I see Prabhupada condoning this behavior.

[atma]

Sudama....

[theist]

And the person he supposedly said this to has passed on. Can't be verified in anyway. people can say Prabhupada said so many things but without proof I just ignore it.

 

We do know he wrote that homosexual activity is demonic.

 

See the article on cakra on homosex marriages by ananda das?

 

Every hear the warning about wolves dressed as sheep?

 

Creepy stuff.

[Guest guest]

it sounds exactly like the post samadhi initiation theory:

 

in all the life and preaching srila prabhupada speaks for the living guru, giving siksa and diksa, then, as someone believes, suddenly, he changes everything on this most important matter

 

the same with homosexuality, srila prabhupada speaks clearly several times , now someone finds a controversial sentence that changes everything

[I_love_krishna_]

I am sorry to say, that the confusion here arises due to our misguided senses. I do not dare say that you have misguided senses prabhus/Matas, it could be my misguided senses....

 

 

Didn't krishna say that a wise man would control his senses due to the detachment to this world.

 

Who ever Tripurari Maharaj is, He is detached from this world, that is what we can clearly see by the statements made by him.

 

I do not see the point of this discussion, that is, I do not see the point of why you keep on posting on and on about these Gurus and Homosexuality...

 

Please don't think that I am not respectful prabhuji, which I am respectful to all devotees who are elder than me, but I do not see what you wish to gain about krishna through talking about homosexuality.

 

Homosexuality is nothing but maya, just as we cannot control our feelings sometimes, the homosexual people have a different sort of sexual orientation that they cannot control.

 

It is easier to gain control again by taking it out of one's character slowly than to subjugate it right away. This is what Tripurari Maharaja is trying to say.

 

This is what prabhupada may have said too.

 

Thank you.

[Guest guest]

[message deleted - Please refrain from making personal attacks against individuals, including the spiritual masters of disciples, and keep all discussions on the philosophy. - admin5]

[livingentity]

You have told us yourself that you have not read Prabhupada's books and yet you try to say what Prabhupada really meant or did not mean.

 

You say in this post that you do not know who Tripurari Maharaja is but from reading one paragraph or statement of his that you know

 

He is detached from this world

 

 

and what his philosophy is.

 

This is all speculation on your part.

[Guest guest]

India's Slow Descent Into Homophobia

 

BY AMARA DASA

 

Jul 12 — Ancient India's acceptance and accommodation of many forms of eroticism within its culture, including homoeroticism, has been well documented in early Sanskrit writings, art and architecture. This makes modern day India's sexual puritanism and homophobia, which reached its zenith in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries, all the more astounding. In today's world, India has been relegated to the level of the most backward countries in the sphere of personal liberties, and one might wonder how such a drastic change could ever have come about. Through careful examination, India's long and troubled past reveals a gradual descent into puritanism and homophobia due to caste consciousness and foreign religious influence. Timeline

 

Vedic India

 

Generally assumed to have ended with the dawn of the Kali-yuga age or just over five thousand years ago. At this time, many forms of sexuality are accommodated within India's native culture such as polygamy, prostitution, sexually explicit art, courtesans, etc. Homosexuality is recognized as a separate and third nature (tritiya-prakriti). Third-gender citizens are fully incorporated into society, most notably within the artisan and monastic communities.

 

Post-Vedic India

 

Vedic culture slowly declines over several thousands of years. A strict caste system develops based on birth and body type, causing the social structure to become very rigid. Priests are more ritualistic and less humanistic. They are known as smarta-brahmanas and become extremely arrogant and abusive of the lower classes, declaring them untouchable. Scriptures such as the Manu-smriti and other ritualistic texts are corrupted during this time. The ancient Vedic rites are misused, and sacrifices are employed as an excuse for rampant animal slaughter.

 

Buddhist Period

 

Beginning approximately 500 B.C., Buddhism gradually spreads throughout India. Vedic culture has degraded to such an extent that the population of India eagerly embraces Lord Buddha's teachings of non-violence and human equality. Buddhist teachings reject the Vedas, and Buddhism itself reaches a peak in India around the time of Christ.

 

Gupta Period

 

This period begins about 300 A.D. The influence of Buddhism over India gradually wanes and is eventually driven out by Sankaracarya, who reinstates the authority of the Vedas. That authority is later reinforced by other great acaryas such as Ramanuja and Madhva. During this period, a renaissance of India's Vedic philosophy and culture blossoms. Resurgence in the construction of Hindu temples begins around the sixth century, where one invariably finds a multitude of openly erotic images, including many depicting homosexuality. The temples of Khajuraho and Chapri serve as striking examples. The sage Vatsyayana also recompiles the Kama Shastra during this time.

 

Islamic Invasions begin

 

In the closing years of the tenth century, armed Islamic migrants begin to move into northern India from regions west of the Hindukush Mountains such as Afghanistan and Persia. This starts an invasion that culminates in the establishment of kingdoms in North India ruled by Muslim overlords. The meeting of Islamic and Hindu cultures is gradual and each ethnic group flourishes. The construction of Hindu temples climaxes between the twelfth and fourteenth centuries, particularly in southern India where Islamic influence remains virtually non-existent.

 

Hindu-Muslim co-existence

 

Originally confined to military centers, Muslim migrants carrying Perso-Turko-Arabic traditions quickly disseminate into large urbanized areas within northern India. This is further accelerated by a mass migration of scholars, poets and elite administrators from other Islamic kingdoms to the west. These migrants are seeking refuge from the depredations of the Mongols who are ravishing most of Asia during this time. Hindus and Muslims co-exist peacefully during this period, and there is a great cultural exchange between the two ethnic groups that lasts for centuries. Muslim clerics are free to interpret religious doctrine according to their own discretion and rarely punish homosexuality. On the contrary, it flourishes and is well documented within popular poetry from that time. Muslim migrants also introduce the Middle Eastern practice of castration among homosexual slaves and servants. Domestic slavery existed to a small extent in pre-Islamic India but now becomes an enormously profitable enterprise. Early sultans are heavily dependent on slaves as both soldiers and laborers. Alauddin Khalji (1296-1316) of the Sultanate of Delhi, for instance, is recorded as owning 50,000 slaves, and Firuz Shah Tughlaq (1357-1388) owned 180,000. Of these, a good number are castrated eunuchs who command a high price. They are considered to be the most reliable and trustworthy of servants since they did not marry to raise families of their own. By the late1400's, India is world-renowned for its exotic treasures and wealth, and European kingdoms clamor for a way to reach her lands. During the time of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, the Spanish entrepreneur Columbus accidentally discovers the Americas while searching for a new shipping route to India.

 

The Mughal Empire

 

The Islamic Mughal Empire, established in northern India in 1526, ends much of the peaceful co-existence between Hindus and Muslims with its new brand of Islamic extremism. Enforcing strict religious codes that have already suffocated much of the Middle East and Western Asia, these invaders forcibly convert or kill Hindus, plunder their wealth, and destroy villages, temples and religious deities. Not surprisingly, they also begin to mistreat women and criminalize homosexuality during this period. Homosexuals are punished under extreme Islamic law by flagellation or death, and this is accomplished by burning the victims alive, stoning them, collapsing walls upon them, or impaling their rectums with hot iron rods. Fortunately the Mughal Empire, along with the rest of the Islamic world, soon declines in the 1600's when new advances in world trade through ocean shipping rob them of their formerly prosperous monopoly on India's trade.

 

The Trading Companies

 

Bypassing Muslim traders, European shipping posts along India's coastlines flourish and establish powerful trading companies and ports. In 1757, the British East India Company becomes the dominant European trading company in India, a reign that will last for an entire century. After losing America to the colonists, the British are free to focus all of their attention on India. At this time in Christian England and Europe, the criminalization of homosexuality has reached its peak and unnatural fornication is routinely punished by torture and the execution of both men and women. People accused of homosexual acts are often put in the pillory and pelted with garbage until half dead.

 

British Rule

 

In 1857, widespread rebellion breaks out in India against the British East India Trading Company. The rebellion is brutally crushed by the British Navy and in 1858 India is officially incorporated into the British Empire. Two years later, the antisodomy law of 1860 is enforced upon the entire empire that now includes India. The law, which remarkably is still in place in India today as Section 377 of the Indian Penal Code, reads: Whoever voluntarily has carnal intercourse against the order of nature with any man, woman or animal, shall be punished with imprisonment for life, or with imprisonment of either description for a term which may extend to ten years, and shall be liable to fine. This law was taken to be an improvement for Great Britain, which had previously punished homosexuality by execution and torture, but for India it was a great step backward since Hindu culture had never previously criminalized homosexuality. The British also enact legislation outlawing castration and cross-dressing in an attempt to eliminate the eunuch class that had thrived under Islamic rule. Despised by the British, eunuchs are forced into the darkest shadows of society where they must now live as outcastes. Also during this time, puritan scholars translate India's Sanskrit texts into English, but they omit or hide any reference to homosexuality because it is shocking to them. By British estimation, India was a backward country with a barbaric culture and primitive religion. The British Empire would impress upon the Hindus their Christian values and educate them in proper civilized behavior while simultaneously exploiting their country's resources for another full century.

 

Independence

 

In 1947, after considerable struggle through civil disobedience, India achieves political independence and the British Empire is dismantled. However, as a country, India is culturally scarred in many ways. Most Indians believe that their ancient Hindu culture is inferior to modern Western civilization. They take their heritage to be something shameful and worth abandoning. Mahatma Gandhi, educated in England, sends squads of his disciples to smash the erotic representations on the ancient temples of Khajuraho and Chapri. Only the poet Rabindranath Tagore manages to stop them. Pandit Nehru attempts to halt the publishing of photographs that depict sculptures showing homosexual relations, claiming that such vices are due to Western influence. In fact, it is his own perception of vice that has been influenced by the West.

 

On To The Future

 

In 1967, the United Kingdom repeals its outdated antisodomy laws, effectively decriminalizing homosexuality for all of its citizens. India, on the other hand, continues to cling to such laws without considering its own native culture or traditions. Imposed labels such as abnormal, unnatural, and unhealthy are of relatively very recent origin in India and not rooted in traditional Vedic or Hindu thought. Indeed, the very inventors of these labels, Euro-American psychologists, have already retracted them and come to the conclusion that homosexuality is natural, normal and healthy behavior for those born of that orientation. As Western culture and science gradually adopt a more open and realistic approach in dealing with its homosexual citizens, it is expected that India will eventually follow.

 

Nineteenth and Twentieth Century Views On Homosexuality in India

 

The influence that Victorian British scholars and educators had in creating the current homophobic environment of India cannot be underestimated. Many professional and religious authorities growing up in India during the nineteenth and twentieth centuries were heavily indoctrinated with homophobic stereotypes and views by Victorian educators, and these outdated ideas persist down to this very day. While most people will consider these views outrageous by today's standards, India continues to enforce laws based upon such fallacies. The result is that millions of gay and transgender Hindus are stigmatized as social deviants and forced to live their lives in self-hatred and shame.

 

The following excerpts have been taken from academically recognized books that were printed and read in India during the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries. Many of these books are still taken as authoritative references today.

 

Mothers and fathers in Western countries, who are lovers of knowledge, are so careful of their children that at night they even tie the child's hands to their sides, so that during the night, the child should not inadvertently touch its lower organs and spoil its health. When one's own hand can be harmful for oneself, what use can a legal enactment or imprisoning the body be? (Pandit Madhavacarya's Kamasutra, 31, published in 1911)

 

The Reason for the Present Disasters

 

The present government has laid down severe penalties for unnatural fornication and the subjects fear these penalties, but who then are the immoral ones who practice unnatural immorality? We are not told how to recognize them, but in the section on oral sex, the author of the Kamasutra has drawn a portrait of their activities and has also introduced us to their identity, saying, 'Usually, this act is performed by shandas' (a term used for people of the third sex).

 

These evil practices are spreading among young men today like an infectious disease. If these tendencies were removed from their hearts by good education, they could become healthy, disease-free, good-charactered heroes, who would adorn the country by their lives.

 

Such boys do not engage solely in oral activity, they also engage in another type of unnatural fornication. People involved in theatre commonly are puppets of that type of vice. They all pretend to be pure, though. On one occasion, a fight with daggers broke out between students of a college over such an affair. (Pandit Madhavacarya's commentaries on the ninth chapter of the Kamasutra)

 

Hermaphrodites

 

Therefore it is necessary to discuss those beings who are neither men nor women. Eunuchs exist not only in India and in the East but also in Europe and America. In India the eunuchs are formally organized. There is complete agreement and unity among them and they are constantly intent upon expanding their community. You can well ask what sort of wretched person would want to join the community of these hijras. You might not know but there are countless such men who are counted as men but whose emotions are exactly the same as those of women. In their hearts they wish that they were with an attractive man, one with large dark eyes, a rosy and glowing complexion, red lips and a beautiful moustache, one who would take them in his arms, hold them tight and make love to them. They are constantly in search of such a man. European doctors have mentioned such cases in their medical books. The moment they get the opportunity, men with such feelings join the community of hijras.

 

Since there are men who prefer to love men and who find satisfaction in it, there is no reason why there should not be women who dislike men and prefer other women. Therefore there are women who to all intents and purposes are free from the qualities of women and have manly qualities. Such women are well built and slightly fair with a muddy complexion. Desire and lust drips from their eyes. They laugh often and prefer masculine manners. They stride along with their heads held high and they try to make friends with beautiful women. Gradually they entrap them in their magic and get closer to them. Simple respectable women, trusting them as other women, accept their love and friendliness as affection. Slowly they start kissing and petting. Finally they seduce them towards illicit relations. If by chance or in the course of joking and playing, a woman falls into their hands, we should take this as the end of that poor creature. These illicit relations develop so fast that in a couple of months the poor woman starts looking as if she suffers from tuberculosis. The simple one turns into the unbought slave of the manly, shameless one. Eventually, the woman loses her health and finds a place in the grave. The shameless one then starts to entrap some other woman. I have treated one such woman. This woman admitted to her crimes in detail but I cannot describe them here because they are obscene. (Hakim Muhammad Yusuf Hasan's Do Shiza, a popular medical book on sexual science, originally published sometime around 1900 in Lahore, India)

 

The Existence of Eunuchs is Dangerous

 

Do not allow eunuchs or hijras to enter the house. If the existence of lewd women is a danger, so is the presence of eunuchs. Eunuchs may corrupt the thoughts of respectable women with their poisonous conversation. Therefore it is not wise to let them come into the house or to make them guard women. Instead, it is an invitation to the corruption of respectable women (Hakim Muhammad Yusuf Hasan's Do Shiza, 132-35, 3rd ed.1934)

 

(Much of the material for this article is from the book Same-Sex Love in India, by Ruth Vanita and Saleem Kidwai)

[Guruvani]

If you look at Tripurari Maharaja's words closely, you will see that he referred to the homosexual devotee as a "man" and then claims that Prabhupada told this "man" to find a "boy" for homosexual acts while cultivating Krishna consciousness.

I find this wording extremely disgusting and monsterously offensive to Srila Prabhupada.

 

Is this the kind of person that Tripurari Maharaja wants the world to see Srila Prabhupada as? An acharya who condoned homosexual "men' to have perverted relationships with homosexual "boys"?

 

This is sick in my view.

[theist]

I must speaking from the heart here. You disciples of Srila Prabhupada, who don't mind advertising who your guru is when it is socially advantagous, stand by and let his institution leaders rewrite his books, while others say more should be edited to take out the statements of woman hatred in his books, as if there are any, and now are allowing homosexual activists to pervert the institution without speaking up really turn my stomach. Sorry for being so blunt but there it is.

 

To those who this doesn't apply to please now this is not a blanket statement.

 

Who is this Amara das and why is this subject so important to him?

[Guruvani]

Tripurari Maharaja, in the same sanga article, again uses hearsay from a homosexual to make the claim:

 

I also had the experience of meeting a transexual who explained her sexual orientation and confusion to Srila Prabhupada before committing to an operation. She told me that Prabhupada told her. "Just pick one or the other [sex] and stick with it." Those who knew him well would have expected him to say something like this in both of these incidences. Again he was very flexible and compassionate.

 

 

It is really surprising to me that Tripurari Maharaja would use the hearsay from homosexual devotees as an authoritative reference to a "Prabhupada said" which cannot be verified and is not documented.

 

I thought he was above such demeaning and disgracing of Srila Prabhupada in the name of "Prabhupada said" (because some homosexual told me so).

[theist]

I know who that transsexual person is. This person was always changing his/her mind on which gender to be and writing Prabhupada about it. What was he supposed to say. He wasn't endorsing gender confusion or their lifestyle. What was he suppose to say? He wasn't going to choose for this confused person. At some point all you can say is just get on with your Krsna Consciousness.

 

Since Prabhupada went so far as to accept homosexuals as his personal servants one can ask what else do they want? The answer is they want their perverted lifestyles endorsed so they will fit in AS practicing homosexuals.

[Guruvani]

I also find it quite interesting that Tripurari Maharaja is interested in courting the homo/lesbian section of society (which is just a small percentage of American society)at the cost of alienating the vast majority of the Judeo-Christian segment of American society.

 

We know that the Christian community is a very pious and religous section of society and that they frown on homo/lesbian relationships.

 

At the cost of alienating the Christian majority in America and giving the impression that Krishna consciousness is a cult aimed at recruiting homos and lesbians over the religious elements, Tripurari Maharaja is making his propaganda.

 

I have some good friends who are deeply into the Christian faith and I love these people. They are good people and sincerely religious. We have very good relationships and I think I have been able to give them a good impression of having known a Hare Krishna devotee. I don't understand why Tripurari Maharaja is so focused on recruiting homos and lesbians and promoting sannyasa for women at the cost of giving the Christian majority the impression that Krishna consciousness is a cult geared for attracting perverts and freaks.

[Guruvani]

I guess homos and lesbians are easier targets for cult recruitment into illicit sects than are the religious people of the Christian faith.

 

Apart from the homosexual devotees that I have met, most all the homos I have met in ordinary society are very rude, arrogant and perverted. I can't see this push to try and recruit these kinds of people to Krishna consciousness when there are millions of pious Christians who are sincerly trying to understand God.

[stonehearted]

Ksamabuddi: If you look at Tripurari Maharaja's words closely, you will see that he referred to the homosexual devotee as a "man" and then claims that Prabhupada told this "man" to find a "boy" for homosexual acts while cultivating Krishna consciousness.

 

You keep hammering this point, as if repeatedly saying that Maharaja his saying Srila Prabhupada sanctioned pedophilia makes it so. But it ain't. In the article, Tripurari Maharaja refers to his interlocutor as a man, which is certainly appropriate, since he was no longer a kid. However, Srila Prabhupada uses the word "boy." That's what he called us consistently, as you well know. Even though most of us were in our twenties, and some in our thirties, Srila Prabhupada always called us "young boys and girls." We found this charning, and it was quite appropriate, since he was around the age of many of our grandparents. I find myself referring to some of my own students as boys and girls, since some are younger than my own children (who are 24 and 26).

 

You repeatedly accuse Tripurari Maharaja of trying to whip up controversy, again, as if saying it often enough would make it true. Your peristence in this makes some wonder who is trying to stir up conflict. And some may wonder whether all this talk of pedophilia says more about you than about Maharaja.

 

Remember the story of the two sadhus who, when they came to a stream found a woman distraught because she was unable to cross. One of the men carried her across on her back. As they continued their journey, the other sadhu continually harped about his friend allowing a woman to touch him. Finally the first sadhu said, "Look--I only carried he across that stream. You have been carrying her for miles and miles!"

 

Threre's also the story Srila Prabhupada told of the brahmin who lived next door to a prostitute. This brahmin was appalled by his neighbor's livelihood, and every time a man visited her, he would keep track by adding a stone to a pile in from of her house. After a while, all he could think about was the size of the pile and all the illicit activity it represented. In the meantime, the woman lamented her lot in life. She could find no other way to make a living, and she knew her life was sinful, so she always prayed to the Lord to deliver her from such a wretched life. When the brahmin died, he took a low birth in a prostitute's family, but the woman was promoted to Vaikuntha.

[livingentity]

Letter of 5/26/75

 

My Dear Lalitananda dasa,

Please accept my blessings. I am in due receipt of your letter dated May 13rd, 1975 and have noted the contents. I am very sorry that you have taken to homosex. It will not help you advance in your attempt for spiritual life. In fact, it will only hamper your advancement. I do not know why you have taken to such abominable activities. What can I say? Anyway, try to render whatever service you can to Krishna. Even though you are in a very degraded condition Krishna, being pleased with your service attitude, can pick you up from your fallen state. You should stop this homosex immediately. It is illicit sex, otherwise, your chances of advancing in spiritual life are nil. Show Krishna you are serious, if you are.

I hope this meets you in good health.

 

Your ever well-wisher,

A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami

 

[stonehearted]

Ksamabuddhi: Apart from the homosexual devotees that I have met, most all the homos I have met in ordinary society are very rude, arrogant and perverted.

 

This is a particularly stupid remark (is that direct enough for you?). In the first place, where do you think the gay devotees came from? Were they rude and arrogant when they came to the temple? Moreover, my experience is very different from what you claim. As a professor and writer, I have met many gay men and women who aren't devotees--perhaps many more than you. I can't think of one who was rude and arrogant. (I don't know about perverted, since I consider just about all of us perverted due to our being so awkwardly displaced.) I've met some who are rather militant in their activism for seeking decent treatment of gays, but none were rude and arrogant. And there were many who I didn't know were gay (men and women) until I had gotten to know them personally.

 

K: I can't see this push to try and recruit these kinds of people to Krishna consciousness when there are millions of pious Christians who are sincerly trying to understand God.

 

What recruitment? You're either misreading things or just making that up to stir up discontent. All these devotees are advocating is that we treat the gay men and women we encounter with the same courtesy and kindness we show everyone else. And how pious are those cow-killing Christians, really? Most seem to want to be able to get away with their sinful activities and live forever in Heaven. The really pious ones will find themselves attracted to Sanatan-dharma.

[I_love_krishna_]

To view this, we need a broad mind, not a narrow one.

 

But, I think my mind even though its quite narrow.. can see a similarity in these two situations and the responses of the society.

 

 

First situation: A man is obsessed with smoking and tries to give it up but he can't . So, he goes to his "Guru" and says "Help me" the guru then says ...

"Although my Guru Maharaja frowned on smoking in general, he was also very practical, flexible, and compassionate. One of his earliest disciples was a smoker who once related how he had ultimately discussed his smoking problem with ____GURU______. He said that at that point _____GURU______ said"Then just find some nicoderm or something that they use to quit smoking, stay with it (slowly giving it up) and practice Krsna consciousness."

 

The Guru is praised for giving such a good advice!!!!!!

 

 

Second situation : A man is a homosexual and a Guru is trying to tell him to give up homosexuality by slowly eradicating it from his life, so he says...

"Although my Guru Maharaja frowned on homosexuality in general, he was also very practical, flexible, and compassionate. One of his earliest disciples was a gay man who once related how he had ultimately discussed his sexual orientation with ____GURU____. He said that at that point ____GURU____ said "Then just find a nice boy (not have sex with him), stay with him (you will start to feel like his brother , not a lover) and practice Krsna consciousness."

 

The guru is then frowned upon

 

Smoking is as disgusting as homosexuality, they are both the subjects of Maya.

 

Case closed by my account and I would like to request Guruvani prabhuji to not post things on this issue, because it does not matter whether one is homosexual or not, what does matter though is if one is trying to go to krishna or not.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[livingentity]

attach Prabhupada's name to fake senarios and speculations. This is offensive and can also start untrue rumours of "Prabhupada said."

[I_love_krishna_]

I changed it. Sorry, if i offended any one here.

 

 

[theist]

"Then just find a nice boy (not have sex with him), stay with him (you will start to feel like his brother , not a lover) and practice Krsna consciousness."

 

Oh is that what Prabhupada was supposedly thinking? And just how would you know that?

 

Read the letter posted above by LE. Does he tell his disciple to go find a nice boy and get married? Or to move in with one and he will come to see him as a brother? Ridiculous speculations

 

>>Case closed by my account and I would like to request Guruvani prabhuji to not post things on this issue, because it does not matter whether one is homosexual or not, what does matter though is if one is trying to go to krishna or not. <<

 

Oh are they trying to go to Krsna? Or are they trying to impose something on Lord Caitanya's movement to serve their own perverted ideas? Gay marriages now is being pushed for. Read Chakra and the article they posted by Amara das.

 

Now I have to wonder if Amara das is one of Tripurari"s disciple's, like Rama Keseva das the gay activist who runs gal_a's web site in Europe.

 

Guruvani is not bringing the issue up, they are. He is just responding.

 

 

 

 

[I_love_krishna_]

I think thats what he said.

 

I read the post from Mata Living Entity, he said give up sex with in the same sex because it is illicit .

 

he did not say, "stop it right now you homo"...

 

He did say "Krishna will take you out of that fallen state" so he clearly recognizes that homosexual's tendencies are not in that being's control.

Just like the tendencies us "straights" have.

 

 

 

[livingentity]

over and over. You should go sit down and read Prabhupada's books - not the selective reading that you appear to have on these forums - but truly read His writings. Then perhaps you will be able to discuss what Prabhupada did or did not say with some intelligence.