Guest guest Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Srila Sridhara Maharaja: I heard from different people that Swami Maharaja has told his disciples that in Bengal most of the disciples of Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakur have deviated from his teachings. So, now you have to go and reinstate them there. Giving such inspiration, he sent them there. Now, if that is true, of course I myself have not heard it from him, I simply heard it from others, and in a way, I think, it is quite possible also, just to encourage them so they might have gone this far from that. They might think that "What our spiritual master, the great preaching work that he has done, what he received from the lotus feet of his spiritual master, that is novel and a wonderful substantial potency, and with that he has come here to recapture. And the ones, those who are in possession of that, they are almost dying. So, you all must go and give it there." Like when the brahmanas fell down in Bengal at one time, the Adisur brought the brahmanas from Kanoj and then he reestablished the varnasrama system here like that. He has also done something like that. I heard from Krsnadasa Babaji Maharaja that before leaving this planet, Swami Maharaja requested him to beg forgiveness on his behalf from his godbrothers--that, at times, he might have offended his godbrothers while preaching. This he said, I heard it from Krsnadasa Babaji Maharaja. He said that although he had due respects towards his godbrothers, but still while preaching he might have offended them a little bit. So, he should be forgiven. Like, I heard once Akincan Maharaja asked him, "What are your other godbrothers doing?" So he replied, "Well, they just eat and sleep and ring the bell." Hearing this they became very offended, and then they came to me. But my observation is neutral. So I said, The drum that he is playing, if he accepts you as a player of the bell in that band, then you should consider this to be a great honor. I told this. My view is different. I saw that he is playing a huge drum, a battle drum, so if you get a chance to play the kasi, or cymbals, along with that, that is a great honor to you. A more dignified position you get. This I am speaking from absolute consideration. [A few Gaudiya Math sannyasis had many hundreds of disciples, had opened many temples and were at that time preaching with vigor, so they were understandably irritated. For example, in a room conversation in Bhuvanesvar in 1977 Srila Prabhupada, hearing the report of his disciples that Madhava Maharaja had a whole village enthusiastically engaged in Krsna conscious activities, suggested that we should do likewise. (770121R2.BHU)] Y.S. Audarya-lila dasa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 When there is a conflict between opposing statements, they must be reconciled. Since we, the disciples, take the instructions of our Srila Prabhupada as nondifferent from sastra, we may resolve his apparently conflicting statements as Rupa Goswami did for sastra. virodho vakyayor yatra napramanyam tad isyate yathaviruddhata ca syat tatharthah kalpyate tayoh When two scriptural statements contradict each other, one is not taken as inauthentic. One should give the meaning in such a way that the contradiction is removed. (Laghu-bhag. 1.212) To harmonize this in an impartial way, we may consider that in the Rupanuga letter Srila Prabhupada was using the apparent activities of Srila Sridhara Maharaja to make a particular point to us, namely that "to elect an acarya" was not an authorized activity of the Governing Body of the Gaudiya Math and that it was contrary to Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura's expressed desire. In Srila Prabhupada's own words, "Therefore we may not commit the same mistake in our ISKCON camp." Srila Prabhupada was also warning us that at least four of his godbrothers had on occasion tried to pollute and steal his disciples, so we must be very careful about them. He made it easier for us by simply saying, "all godbrothers." Although Srila Prabhupada may have in his intense preaching campaign criticized some of his godbrothers, in light of proper sastric vaishnava etiquette, it is improper for his disciples to criticize them, what to speak of publishing criticisms, thereby creating opportunity for repeated vaisnava-aparadha--for which one will be held accountable. Srila Prabhupada also did say that, "the war is over now." Still we see that certain ISKCON devotees have the habit of openly and freely criticizing any and all of Srila Prabhupada's godbrothers as they like. We feel that this is very unhealthy spiritually for them. Y.S. Audarya-lila dasa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Govindaram Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Hare Krishna What more is there to say? That has always been my standpoint, SP is a pure devotee He can chastise because He is pure, we on the other hand have to right at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingentity Posted July 17, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Does time, place and circumstance apply to this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingentity Posted July 17, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Is this the book you are quoting from?... Our Affectionate Guardians The entire book is online! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Govindaram Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 Hare Krishna Audarya-lila dasa and All /images/graemlins/smile.gif You are so right in what you say that people are so quick to criticise vaisnavas, instead of looking at their own flaws! I wish hopefuly I and everyone else won't make the same mistake, why not praise somebody and leave them be, ofcourse if you are a PURE DEVOTEE then you have a right to criticise, otherwise don;t be so high and mighty..OK! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 It was so elegant the way he saw the bells. He needed no honour for himself, he is a vaisnava. He saw how Srila Prabhupada was encouraging the great preaching wave of his disciples by ridiculing the idea of sitting in the temple, talking to one another all day, eating big, and ringing bells. So those who were described as bell-ringers were actually serving Srila Prabhupada's great mrdanga mission by fictitiously ringing bells; they were now part of the great world-wide kirtana with their bells accompanying Srila Prabhupada's drums and dancing white elephants. Such a beautiful insight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Govindaram Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingentity Posted July 18, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhaktavasya Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 Such a wonderful Saving the Day thread. Prabhupad said in purport that there are 2 kinds of pure devotees. Those who have achieved the perfectional stage and those who have not yet reached it, but they are trying and (something about being guaranteed of success, eventually)so they are also considered pure devotees. So it interesting that Prabhupad said "so many things" that seemed bewildering later. If the disciple is to see everyone as a pure devotee ("in time, just hang in there and we'll all be in 'pure devotee land' someday, together") then it can and usually does present a potentially dangerous situation. Someone could say "I read that 'quote' from Prabhupad and took it as my spiritual life compass, and look what happened, to me, to my offspring, to 'our religion'! It's all been a SHAM!" Tieing this in the 'Prabhupad's Godbrothers' theme, to take one comment, (that would never have made it to print if Prabhupad had the time or help from his godbrothers with the editing)and promote it as 'church doctrine', elbowing out 'vancha kalpa tarubyas ca..' is an even more dangerous path for the soul. Meaning that, even if you 'believe' Krishna has cheated you, your guru has 'tricked' you're not sure about your faith, in time, if you can live long enough, you realize that you have everything. That Krishna never left your heart, that your guru 'ignited' him there in your soul, that you weren't so smart after all when you thought you were 'a sort of pure devotee', and that life isn't so bad after all. In the other case, 'using' Prabhupad's words to promote hatred, vilification and division is, as Sridhar Maharaja has said, "like spitting at the sun; it will come back and hit you in the face." Pray for Peace Obeisances to all the Vaisnava devotees of the Lord Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 Thank you, yes no more trash in the name of God or God's pure devotee Srila Prabhupada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krsnanatha Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 Please see the post "Many positive things also happened." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingentity Posted July 18, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 "I am very glad to know that Ananda prabhu is staying with you, please offer my dandavats. He is my old Godbrother, sincere Vaisnava. Please treat him like your father. Do remain in full co-operation." (S.P. letter 6/5/'73) "So if you are actually serious to take instructions from a siksa guru, I can refer you to one who is most highly competent of all my god-brothers. This is B.R. Sridhara Maharaja, whom I consider to be even my siksa guru, so what to speak of the benefit that you can have from his association...When I was in India, Acyutananda, Ramanuja, and myself, with others, lived with Sridhara Maharaja, so Acyutananda knows him very well. He spared a big house for us and if both of you go there now, it will bevery good for your spiritual benefit. Then I will feel that you are safe. Besides that, if you wish to live in India, you can make arrangements for this house so that other of your god-brothers may go there in the future." (Letter to Hrsikesa, 69-01-09) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 So we have to follow the acaryas. If we at all, if we are at all interested in spiritual science, then we must follow the Vedic instruction, tad-vijnanartham sa gurum evabhigacchet. We must approach. You cannot have spiritual knowledge simply by speculating. Impossible. Simply waste of time. Srama eva hi kevalam. In the Bhagavad-gita, therefore, it is recommended, acaryopasanam. Acarya-upasana. Not only worshiping the Lord, but also the acarya. Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, guru-krsna-krpaya paya bhakti-lata-bija. Guru, acarya, and Krsna. One should seek favor of both of them. Not that "I am now seeking favor of Krsna. What is the use of guru or acarya?" No. You cannot overlap acarya and go to Krsna. That is not possible. Krsna will not accept you. Just like if you want to see a big man you should go through his secretary, through his orderly, doorkeeper; similarly, our process is acaryopasanam, go through the acarya. That is the injunction of the Vedas. Tarko 'pratisthah. If you want to enter into the spiritual world, you cannot get through simply by arguments. Because there is no limit of argument. I place my argument in one way. Another man, who is better arguer, he places his argument in a different way. So if you simply go on arguing, it is not possible. Tarko 'pratisthah. It will never help you. Argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 This thread has been reopened and will remain on topic and in the spirit of the opening post. Due to the nature of these forums, removing one post may affect other branches. If your post was in keeping with the spirit of this topic and was removed, please repost it. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livingentity Posted July 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 Thank you so much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2004 Report Share Posted April 1, 2004 - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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