please help me ...

[Hippie]

hello everybody ..

 

i`ve heard a wonderful song some time ago, and its lyrics are also realy beautiful ...but i don`t know what it means ....at official site of the artist who brought those lyrics it says:

 

"hara hara maha deva shambhu, kashi vishnu nara gangay"

 

but i also found very similar lyrics and it says:

 

"hara hara mahadeva shambho, kashi vishwanatha gange"

 

please can somebody tell me which of these lyrics are correct and what it means?

 

you can hear part of that song at the main page of my website http://www.bohemianhippie.com

 

thanks in advance

 

~ 3õ ~

[Hippie]

thanks for nothing /images/graemlins/frown.gif

[theist]

hippie bro. I just don't know what it means.

[Guest guest]

<<"hara hara mahadeva shambho, kashi vishwanatha gange">>

 

this is probably corect words because shiva worshippers worship shiva not vishnu.

 

what it measn is this:

 

oh siva, shiva, shiva, shiva, ....

 

kashi vishwanath is another name of siva, gange or gangeya is anotehr name becauce ganga river is ties up by the hairs on Hid head on his head.

 

jai sri krishna!

 

 

[livingentity]

it is a bhajan glorifying Lord Siva who dwells in Kashi (?) near the Ganges.

 

My wild guess would be that the second one you posted is the correct one.

 

 

[livingentity]

I see I was not too far off. I looked up Kashi just now and found it is another name for Benares.

[Priitaa]

And Lord Shiva is the greatest Vaisnava or devotee of Lord Vishnu.

 

YS,

Prtha dd

[Guest guest]

Shiva is not devotee of Vishnu, He Himself is part of Vishnu. Hari Hara betham or discrimination is the biggest papa people of Kali yuga will inherit because of misunderstanding as per the words of Viswamithra and its happening already.

Jagadguru Sankaracharya inhis commentaries on Vishnu sahasranama describes the Supreme personality as Mahavishnu who is called by thousand different names of which Shiva is one. Both Shiva and Narayana are called as Maheswara. They are inseparable separated only by two different names. Originally as profounded by Sankaracharya who explained this as the formless worship of Shiva as Shiva linga where the base represents Brahma or the creating part of Maha Vishnu, the central 8 cornered portion representing 8 directions represents the protecting part of Mahavishnu and the upper part is the destructive part of Vishnu which is worshipped as SHiva. Unfortunately in course of time, I am sure duue to some less informed gurus in the past centuries, people misunderstood the concept of Shiva linga and started describing stupid stories that brahma,vishnu and shiva fought for supremacy and all nonsense..God is not some one to fighht like us and I dont know how this concept was getting carried away. Vaishnavites worship the formless God as Saligramam. Vaishnavism and Saivism are different in modes of worship originally and there is no difference in God Himself. But this is nnot understood by many Saivites and Vaishnavites and they fight among themselves stupidly even the well educated ones. There is only supreme according to Sankaracharya also who is Mahavishnu. He was praying to the Lord's potency as Shiva and Lalithambika but this is not understood bby the followers and now gone tothe level of ridiculing each others.

[Guest guest]

The creator is shiva, vishnu, brahma. He creates countless divinities such as shiva , vishnu, brahma, but takes no part in the creation himself.

 

For Him creation is like a play, you may worship shiva, vishnu, brahma, but He is truly the reason for our worship. It is because we are trying to see Him in them , that we try to worship them. He is truly all attractive, even if He is to be found in "limited" divinites like Shiva, Brahma and Vishnu.

 

[ShegavichaRana]

fantastic explanation about (no) difference in Vishnu and Shiva and the fights between poorly informed souls. I have witnessed these silly fights many times. They even critisize each other severely, do not visit each other, do not have marriages among each other (scenario is changing a little bit these days). How can Gods fight among themselves, as the God is One! But under the spell of Maya, all sorts of things are going on.

[Guest guest]

I am sure due to misinformation from one person these kind of nonsense stories about different Gods fighting among themselves would have spread in course of centuries. In fact there are many vaishnavites who still think Shiva as phallic worship and dont visit shiva temples and even if they visit they will pray only to Parvathi as she is sister of Narayana. Is it not foolish to see God like this as you mentioned. Although I am a vaishnavite, I go by Jagadguru sankaracharya who has clearly understood the concept explained in Vedas. Ahambrahmaasmi is also mentioned in vedas and also in Bagavatham and Jagadguru worshipped Narayana as Supreme power which He explains in Vishnu sahasranaama. Every Guru innitially starts with proper understandings but unfortunately, the disciples who may be even the immediate followers dont understand the Guru's principles which is because of less enlightment and less self thinking, out of which they spread what they have understood. The next successor will be further less understood and this chain reactions continues out of which confusion prevails constantly in society. This is the prime reason why there are scattered opinions about sanathana Dharma having different or many Gods, who is actually only one.

[Guest guest]

Dear Guest,

 

Have you read the Srimad Bhagavatam and Bhagavad-gita? From reading them, my understanding is that Krsna/Vishnu created demigods like Brahma, Shiva, etc.

[Guest guest]

Yes I have read Bagavat Gita and also Bagavatha Purana. Brahma and Shiva are not Demi Gods. They are actually forms of Mahavishnu to perform creation and destruction. The actual Demi Gods described in vedas are Indra, agni, vaayu, etc etc, not brahma, and shiva. Brahma originates from Vishnu and still He is not Demi God since he takes the role of creation and the female potency of BBrahma is worshipped as Vidhya lakshmi or Saraswathi who is not demi God. Shiva is actually form of Mahavishnu and He is not demigod as this Vishnu performs the destruction of evil and thats why DurgaMaatha or parvathi or Lalitha who is Mrs. SHiva is also associated with destruction of evil. It is actually the less informed Gurus of the past who misunderstood the concept and passed it on to generations out of which many people think that everybody other than Mahavishnu are Demigods including SHiva-Parvathi, Brahma-Saraswathi. The combination of the three powers constitute Mahaa Vishnu who is the only supreme God and his female counterpart is Mahaalakshmi. According to SHree Krishna Himself (Please read chapter 9, 10 and 11) human mind cannot perceive the formless nature of Supreme and thats the reason for us to have our mind focussed He descended down with all full potency as SHree Krishna in Human form who is the supersoul. Since the human mind does not have the capacity to perceive the structure of Supreme in His creatiion, maintenance and destruction, we started worshipping Him as Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva who are actually Mahaavishnu. It will be sort of confusing to understand, but this is the Ultimate concept. So when He himself is all the three, is there a possibility of fighting for supremacy. God's different forms never fight among themeselves like we stupid humans who cannot perceive His structure and form. Thats the reason we worship Him as formless stone either as Shiva kundalini or Saaligramam. The snake above the SHivalinga represents the kundalini force which needs to be controlled by the human mind to acheive spiritual maturity for the mind to understand God. Shiva became shiva-linga in course of time because people started thinking that it is phallic worship. The generative force or the semen needs to be controlled and this is what it represents by the snake hood. Snake or sarpha represents kundalini energy or otherwise also the energy of procreation. Because it is associated with procreative energy, people started calling it as linga while it actually represents the formless nature of Supreme who cannot be perceived by human's imagination.

 

[Subala]

thank you unregistered impersonal for this quote...

 

>>>>Shiva is not devotee of Vishnu, He Himself is part of Vishnu. Hari Hara betham or discrimination is the biggest papa people of Kali ...

Jagadguru Sankaracharya inhis commentaries .....

>>>>>

 

you are in a wrong forum dear mayavadi....

 

 

 

 

[Jahnava Nitai Das]

 

Yes I have read Bagavat Gita and also Bagavatha Purana. Brahma and Shiva are not Demi Gods. They are actually forms of Mahavishnu to perform creation and destruction.

 

 

In the Gita Lord Krishna states the following:

a-brahma-bhuvanal lokah

punar avartino ’rjuna

mam upetya tu kaunteya

punar janma na vidyate

 

"From the abode of Brahma downward, all places in the material world are places of misery wherein repeated birth and death take place. But one who attains to My abode, O son of Kunti, never takes birth again."

 

Even the Brahma-loka is a place of death, and this is confirmed by Brahma-ji in the Srimad Bhagavatam. Hiranyakashipu requested Brahma-ji for immortality, and Brahma replied that even he was not immortal, therefore how could he make Hiranyakashipu immortal. Elsewhere Narada addressed Brahma as the Supreme, to which Brahma replied he is not the supreme but that he himself is worshipping Lord Vishnu. Brahma's life comes to an end when the maha-pralaya destroys the universe. According to the traditional calculations, 50 years of Brahma's life have expired, and another 50 years of Brahma's life are left.

 

The Narayana Upanishad states:

 

narayanad brahma jayate

narayanad rudro jayate

narayanad indro jayate

narayanad prajapatih prajayante

narayanad dvadasaditya rudra vasavah sarvani chandagmsi

narayanad eva samutpadyante

narayanad pravartante

narayane praliyante

 

"From Narayana came Brahma, Rudra, Indra, Prajapati. From Narayana came the twelve Adityas, the twelve Rudras, the twelve Vasus, all the Vedic metres and all the devas. Everything came from Narayana in the beginning and everything enters into Narayana at the end."

 

eko vai narayana asin na brahma na isano napo nagni-samau neme dyav-aprithivi na nakshatrani na suryah

 

“In the beginning of the creation there was only the Supreme Personality Narayana. There was no Brahma, no Shiva, no water, no fire, no moon, no stars in the sky, no sun.”

In the Gita Lord Krishna states Himself to be the supreme source of everything:

 

aham sarvasya prabhavo

mattah sarvam pravartate

iti matva bhajante mam

budha bhava-samanvitah

 

"I am the source of all. Everything emanates from Me. The wise who perfectly know this engage in My devotional service and worship Me with all their hearts."

 

In commentary on this verse Srila Prabhupada has cited two verses from the smriti as follows:

 

prajapatim ca rudram capy

aham eva srijami vai

tau hi mam na vijanito

mama maya-vimohitau

 

"The patriarchs, Shiva and others are created by Me, though they do not know that they are created by Me because they are deluded by My illusory energy." - Moksha-dharma

 

narayanah paro devas

tasmaj jatas caturmukhah

tasmad rudro ’bhavad devah

sa ca sarva-jnatam gatah

 

"Narayana is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and from Him Brahma was born, from whom Shiva was born." - Varaha Purana

 

 

[Haridham]

Jndas that outta do it.

 

That was a very nice explanation along with sastric evidence.

 

You have cleared up my illusions thats for sure.

 

I wish you were around with other discussions that i was going through.

 

Hare Krsna.

[Haridham]

by the way, the singer to those songs is Krsna das.

 

 

He is an impersonalist and doesnt like the devotees much but krsna has given him good singing talents.

 

Shiva is lord Visnu's greatest devotee.

 

hare Krsna

[Guest guest]

These interpretations whatever you have provided are actually interpretations of Prabhupadaji. I am a vaishnavite bbut on certain aspect I still dont agree with him as he is not all in all. He has his own lineage of a particular mutt and he his interpreations follows his mutt priniciples only annd that does not mean that alone is right. Well. anyways Nobody denies Mahaavishnu is the prime creator of everything and I too have mentioned the same as quoted by Aacharya.

[Haridham]

we just go by what the vedas say.

 

Krsna says he is supreme

 

Hare Krsna

[anadi]

In Brihad Bhagavatamrita Part2 Bhajana Ch.3. 99-107,

 

Sri Gopa-kumara said: O brahmana, filled with a great yearning to attain that place, I danced on the waves of a shoreless ocean of anxiety.

Thinking I would not be able to go there, I cried and by the power of my grief, I fainted from moment to moment.

Then Lord Siva, who is very merciful and very dear to the Vaisnavas , and who cannot bear to see others suffer, picked me up, comforted me, and spoke to me.

Lord Siva said: O Vaisnava, Parvati and I yearn to stay always in Vaikunthaloka, just as you do.

That realm is very difficult to attain. The liberated souls pray for it. Lord Brahma, his sons, and I myself strive for it.

 

A person who has great faith in the pure and desireless performance of one's own varnasrama duties attains the mercy of Lord Hari. If that mercy is multiplied a hundred times, one attains the post of Brahma. If that mercy is again multiplied a hundred times, one attains my post. If the mercy I receive from the Lord is multiplied a hundred times, one attains Vaikuntha.

 

Srila Sanatana Gosvami explains that this is described in Srimad-Bhagavatam 4.24.29. It is also described in Itihasa-samuccaya in these words:

"Saintly persons free of false-ego, material possessiveness, and material duality, who devotedly engage in the yoga of meditation, and who know that the pure, eternal, splendid Supreme Brahma effulgence is beyond the realm of the demigod Brahma, go to that effulgence."

"They who worship Lord Hari, who is known as Visnu, Krsna, Jisnu, Sanatana, Narayana, Aja, Visvaksena, and Caturbhuja, and who meditate on Him, the transcendental divine Person, and who remember Him, the infallible Lord, attain His eternal abode. That is the conclusion of the eternal Sruti-sastra."

107. You are a Govardhana-gopa's son, a devotee of Lord Mathuresa, and a disciple of a brahmana attached to the Lord's service. You devotedly chant a mantra glorifying the Lord and You love the Lord. You should go to Vaikuntha.

 

 

Brahma and Siva are considered as demigods, because these positions in the governing of the universal material affairs can be occupied by jivas.

Still Siva is a form of Bhagavan which eternally exist in Shiva dhama of the spiritual world, whereas Brahma is not.

Very rarely during the manifestation of the material worlds, there is a jiva who can occupy the position of Siva, whereas rarely Sri Visnu takes the position of Brhama.