The tendency to talk about Lord Krsna's pastimes to those who are not qualified

[Guest guest]

In one famous morning walk Srila Prabhupada explains about the tendency to talk about Lord Krsna's pastimes to those who are not qualified. This philosophy expounded by a class of men known as the prakrta sahajiyas, many of which reside at Radha Kunda in Vrindavan in the dress of babajis. Such philosophies are unauthorized and simply created disturbance in the execution of devotional service of sincere devotees. Below are excerpts from a morning walk conversation with Srila Prabhupada on June 7, 1976 in Los Angeles.

 

Ramesvara: The dangerous thing is that they are using your book for authority.

 

Prabhupada: That's all right. Authority, where? What is that? That I've already explained. Why these rascals do not take the lessons of Caitanya Mahaprabhu that we are all rascals, fools? No. That they will not take. They'll take the Radharani's bhava. What Caitanya Mahaprabhu is teaching by His practical life, that we have to take.

 

Tamala Krsna: There's a statement somewhere in one of your books that when one attains the highest platform...

 

Prabhupada: Then where is that highest platform?

 

Tamala Krsna: Yes, there's no question of it.

 

Ramesvara: One must go through stages.

 

Prabhupada: Yes.

 

Ramesvara: You gave the example of trying to get an M.A. degree.

 

Prabhupada: Yes. One has to come to that highest stage. It is not forbidden. That may be ideal, but not for the neophytes. You must.... One who does not know ABCD, what he will know about M.A. degrees? That they do not know. They think that they have already passed M.A. degree. That is their fault.

 

Tamala Krsna: There's another statement, I saw them, where it says, it's a quote, that you can treat Krsna as your lover and Krsna will reciprocate.

 

Hari-sauri: And they underlined the two words "you can" treat Krsna as your lover. In this way they're taking your quotes out of context.

 

Ramesvara: This is one of their main, the main ideas in their philosophy is that the living entity can desire to have any relationship he wants with Krsna.

 

Prabhupada: That's all right, he can desire. I already explained: first deserve, then desire.

 

Tamala Krsna and Ramesvara: Deserve then desire, oh.

 

Prabhupada: You are rascal, how you can desire? You have no qualification, you desire to high court judge. What is this nonsense?

 

Ramesvara: But then they have an answer.

 

Prabhupada: What is that answer?

 

Ramesvara: That "Let me just try it anyway, to keep my mind thinking..."

 

Prabhupada: How you can try it? First of all, be qualified, a big lawyer. Then you become high court judge. Where is that qualification? You are after illicit sex and bidi and you want to be associated with the gopis.

 

Ramesvara: They say that "In ISKCON, we do not..."

 

Prabhupada: Let them say all nonsense. They are disqualified. Sahajiya babajis, that's all.

 

Prabhupada: And they'll do that. (japa) That sahajiya tendency is very easy to take up.

 

Prabhupada: Thinking of Radha-Krsna lila, that is in liberated stage, not in the conditioned stage.

 

Prabhupada: Yes, first of all be rich man, then do all things, how you shall kick your wife. This is going on. Caitanya Mahaprabhu said that "My Guru Maharaja found Me rascal number one; therefore he ordered, `You cannot study Vedanta. You chant Hare Krsna.' " They will not read this portion. That Caitanya Mahaprabhu, He posed Himself as a rascal.

 

Tamala Krsna: But they prefer to read about all the ecstatic symptoms on Caitanya Mahaprabhu's body

 

Prabhupada: That's all right. That.... Be, first of all bona fide. That is good ambition. But how this good ambition can fulfill when you are a potter, poor man? Actually be rich, and then kick your wife. And without being rich, if you think all this nonsense, you're spoiling time. (japa) Ramesvara: Srila Prabhupada, some devotees, sometimes they feel that in ISKCON we're talking so much about the business of how to spread Krsna consciousness, but we're not talking enough about Krsna's pastimes, krsna-katha, they say. So that's another reason why they want to read all these pastimes.

 

Prabhupada: Then let them read. What kind of krsna-katha? The krsna-katha test is as soon as he'll get the taste, he'll lose this taste. That is the.... What is this nonsense?

 

Ramesvara: Won't it purify them? That's what they say, "It will purify me."

 

Prabhupada: What you are purified? You have become a, what is called, putrefied, not purified.

 

Prabhupada: The books are there for reading. By reading, you become purified. (break) In 1935, our Guru Maharaja, Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, he went to Radha-kunda for karttika-vrata. So at that time he was reading Upanisads. So first of all, these babajis they were coming. Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati had come at Radha-kunda. He's giving some class. So they used to come. But as soon as they saw that he was reading Upanisads, they stopped coming. They saw: "They are jnanis, they are not bhaktas."

 

Tamala Krsna: What did they want to hear? Dasama-skandha?

 

Prabhupada: Like that. So Prabhupada condemned them that "They are not living in Radha-kunda. They're living in Naraka-kunda." I heard it, "They're living in Naraka-kunda." Prabhupada: Mostly. They have no knowledge. Material. Prakrta-sahajiya. Their real name is prakrta. Their thoughts are on this material platform. Just as they are preferring this conjugal love because here the sex is prominent. They are thinking that is the highest stage. What is the lowest stage here, they're taking that as the highest stage. In the.... Of course, in the spiritual world there is such thing, but as Krsna has many other lilas, why they are not attracted to other lilas?

 

Ramesvara: They don't want to be limited. They think that Krsna is the krsnas tu bhagavan svayam. So why...

 

Prabhupada: That is good. That is always true, but Krsna says, manusyanam sahasresu kascid yatati siddhaye yatatam api siddhanam kascin mam vetti tattvatah How you have understood Krsna? Krsna says, "Out of many millions of people, one becomes siddha, and out of many millions of siddhas, hardly one can understand Me." So how you have understood Krsna so easily, within two years? What you have understood Krsna, that is materially understood. You do not know what is Krsna. That is prakrta-sahajiya. "Oh, we have understood. Krsna was a playboy, dancing with His girls. Bas, we have understood. Now we shall..."

 

Ramesvara: "If I follow the regulative principles and go on hearing about rasa-lila, then I'll be purified."

 

Prabhupada: You say that. In the sastra does not say. Sastra says that after you have studied all the nine cantos of Bhagavatam, then enter into the tenth. Sahajiya means they take very easily. "I am.... Everything is all right. Now I am perfect." That is sahajiya. Krsna says, "To understand Me, it will take millions of years." And they understand Krsna immediately. That is their.... That is called prakrta-sahajiya. Ramesvara: Krsna's incarnation is to attract the living entities to Krsna. So let me read about rasa-lila, because I'm feeling some attraction.

 

Prabhupada: Then why not Kuruksetra-lila? What...? Kuruksetra-lila... Krsna's lila is the same, absolute. You are attracted to rasa-lila means you have got sex desire. That's all.

 

Ramesvara: I may still have sex desire, but this will purify me.

 

Prabhupada: No, no, no. This will purify. You are not purified.

 

Tamala Krsna: Putrefied.

 

Prabhupada: That is.... The, this rasa-lila is for the person who is completely purified. What...? When one is impure, he should not think of. That is stated in the Bhagavatam.