God created the universe ? OR Univerise created the god ?

[sid]

I don't belive in bilindly following thing. i alwayes belived there is a logical reson to everything. so there nust be a reson to god if exsisted, i am puzzelsed by many Q such as , who is the god? who created the universe ? ....

 

is't this universe is created in the big bang , where did god come into the screean.

 

[Avinash]

It is possible that Big bang caused the world as we see it now. But, I do not believe that Big bang was the ultimte beginning.

[I_love_krishna_]

Or you can call them "Multiverses"

 

The point is... even scientists today don't agree that Big bang has created this universe.

 

It is a theory ... a theory based on mental speculation. HOwever, it is possible that there were many big bangs... which created this universe..

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

U can never get to know God or feel his presence by logical reasoning, what you need to have ananya Bhakti to know God.

[gHari]

That anything exists is inconceivable.

 

Matter and space are pretty mundane. They are definitely not inconceivable.

 

But God is. He Just Is.

 

We see a reason for everything. Indeed, He is the reason that everything exists. Strung on His inconceivable existence, is everything and everyone that will ever be; all for His enjoyment.

 

He is the owner and enjoyer of everything, and everyone's best friend. Live your life in this knowledge and the inconceivable will become known. This is religion, the big picture. This is reality.

 

gHari

 

[Guest guest]

 

what is the primal cause of causes ?

 

the Brahma samhita says

 

'Isvara parama Krishna...

...sarva karana karanam.'

 

which translates as ,the ultimate controller of the

cosmos is Krishna, He is the Karana Karanam,the ultimate cause of all causes.

 

the material 3 dimensional world (the 4th dimension is sometimes regarded as time) according to quantum physics

is an illusion,at the basest level non mass wavelets of energy(quanta) are

somehow tranforming into mass, or solidity, and manifesting this 3 dimensional reality.

 

which is like a computer Virtual Reality , there the illusion of a real 3 dimensional world is created by

the manipulation of Data creating a Virtual world that

seems real(as the software gets better, the illusion

of a VR world gets more real).

 

the ultimate VR world is seen in the Star Trek T.V. show,

they have the Holodeck, they can enter into a virtual reality chamber and a whole 3 dimensional world is created

that is indistinguishable from the "real" world.

 

So that is our situation, this 3 dimensional reality is a creation from a subtler dimension, the 5th dimension,

that is the dimension of consciousness,in Fact WE exist in the 5th dimension, our ability to interact on the 3 dimensional reality is done through 3 dimensional bodies,

and 3 dimensional stuff, or matter.

 

just like if you want to enter a VR world, you need the proper equipment, then you log in and interact in that reality with an Avatar or virtual form.

 

so in order for us to interact in the 3 dimensional world,

our 5th dimensional BEING needs to take on an avatar(sanskrit for incarnation) or proper form .

 

so the entire material cosmos is really in fact a virtual reality, being maintaned and controlled from another dimension, Physicists like David Bohm call this dimension

the Sub quantum strata which is the Mainframe for our 3 dimensional reality, everything in this materal manifestation is a transformation of energy , this is accepted fact in the world of the quantum physicists,

what that sub quantum energy is , is a great mystery to them.

 

the Vedic literature calls that energy 'Brahman', it is infinite and has no beginning or end, ultimately philosophicaly speaking no other reality is possible.

 

infinity must exist, if anything exists.

 

in order for infinity to exist there must be something

to define it's existence, nothing cannot exist infinitly,

that is not possible, if anything exists then automatically the only absolute truth is that infinity must exist as well and something must be comprising the nature

of infinity.

 

That is the sub quantum strata or Brahman, an infinite

changeless energy field of inconceivable quality.

 

We are told that Brahman is the original substance,

it was not created by a previous thing, it is the primal substance, logically SOMETHING had to be existing before anything else, if anything exists.

 

so according to the Vedic literature Brahman is the origin,

existing as a force field of infinite energy, because

this energy has manifested order in the 3 dimensional

reality we live in, Brahman must have not only consciousness, but also be energetic(able to control it's energy) and have intellect.

 

so this is the Vedic concept, God exists as an infinite

field of conscious energy with the ability to think,

and control it's Self/energy.

 

We are told that everything that exists in this world

exists within the being of God,comprised of God's

Self, at the same time God has created this 3 dimensional world and exists simultaneously in a higher

dimension, as we do, the dimension of consciousness, the original dimension , the difference between god and ourselves is that we are tiny and partake of the nature

of the infinite, whereas the infinite itself has an infinite power and ability that we only manifest in a

infinitesimal way, the ability to think, create,manipulate,

etc.

 

We exist only in our bodies,god exists in infinity,

having no end, also god has the ability to be fully conscious at any point in the infinite substance, without

losing any fullness of consciousness and control any where

else , god has the ability to interact at the same time

in an infinite variety of ways anywhere and everywhere,

without losing any concentration or focus.

 

We can deduce this from looking at nature, the laws of nature are working perfectly, why should this be ?

 

why doesn'y everything collapse into chaos, the second law of thermodynamics insists that is should, but it doesn't,

nature is perfectly aligned and running smoothly, from

Galaxies, to stars, to planets,to eco systems, it's

all running perfectly, mathematically precise with

such symettry and precision that any deviation

in anything ,just a little, and things like the earth,

the sun and galaxies, life as we know it, and everything

else would not exist,could not exist.

 

that is our situation, logically god must exist,

be intelligent,and able to control the cosmos at the

quantum level to the cosmic , anything else and their would only be ...nothing.

[sid]

ok lets simplify a bit, all the world we r seeing is a VR like matrix or maya. also ur saying god as an infinite eneery from quntum to cosmic level. u also point out the dimentions in which we react or see that they exist.

 

my Q is this where do u got that infinite energy?

 

cosidering it was alwayes there so taking that basis as origin now why is it what we see the cosmos is like this not anything else. i guess it is because universe or any thing is governed by some set of laws or rules.

 

also, who has a start will alwayes end so it be with cosmos also.

 

[Guest guest]

Great Poetry

Love that style of expression,

So Krishna Kool.

 

I mean it puts Krishna

Right there where we need Him most

On the cutting edge

of so-called modernity.

 

I feel like getting a can of spray paint

and putting your words all over town

where all those cool kids can see them !

[Guest guest]

the asn to this is in another Q that is ............

 

Which came first The Chicken OR The Egg ?????

 

 

any guess for that ???

[Guest guest]

Chicken comes first, because egg comes from the chicken.

 

From the egg comes the chick not chicken. /images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Guest guest]

 

"Which came first The Chicken OR The Egg ?????"

 

What do you think if we will just ask the creator of the Chicken and the egg? ..hehehhehehe

 

Hey..here we go again guys...confused of the beginning..Who is first: the creation or the creator? And the Big Bang theory?

 

What do you think why it is still a Theory? Becasue it has not prove it's validity yet..and I believe it will remain a theory becasue even the scientist today believe that there is a Creator/Master/ Architec.

 

Where is your faith people?

 

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

 

Does Reg Vedas told you.... In the beginning heaven and earth created God. Vedas doesn't, right?

 

Hey Sid....if you are not convinced that God created the Universe...throw your clock.....becasue it doesn't tell the truth anyway..if you won't believe it was created by someone...and only by chance...

 

Or maybe wear a helmet everyday..every minute..who knows, there is another big bang and the earth will be out of it's orbit....if there is no One powerful guiding it anyway...

 

Hey Sid..don't get angry of me..I am just trying to make my point here...hehehhehehehe...be cool man....

 

God Loves you anyway....

[Guest guest]

I can get you references from the ancient Vedic scriptures which tell you how the universe is created.

 

Dear friend, if you want you can follow Genesis it is fine, but do not bash the authority of the vedas.

 

Vedas are the truth.

[Guest guest]

really the big bang was created by temperture that was really hot in space it blew up then cooled down and turned into helium and gases and because the explosion it caused the univerise to expand

[sid]

ok ... show me ....

vedas or any thing else u have ...

but i don't know how u will prove the creator locked in its own creation /images/graemlins/smile.gif. .........

 

 

[Guest guest]

"God created the universe ? OR Univerise created the god ? "

 

they're contemporary and eternal

 

[Guest guest]

The soul of God creates the big bang that is what is OM,God created the universe.

the greatest truth are simplest.

The man from south.

[Guest guest]

the origins of the big bang theory

 

 

 

 

Today it is almost unanimous among the orthodox astronomers and astrophysics that the world was created some 12 billions ago from a magnificent explosion of a primodial atom. In a few seconds, as the theory goes, all the universe was created from this primordial explosion. From the energy of this fantastic explosion all matter has been created, according to Einstein's theory that matter is energy and vice-versa. Even space and time have been created by this explosion.

 

There are some astronomers, as Fred Hoyle, Thomas Gold and Herman Bondi, that don't accept the Big Bang theory. They rather believe in a steady-state universe. Regretfully they are the losers in the academic establishment.

 

.

 

How did such strange idea infiltrate into science? Science began some centuries before Christ, in Classical Greece, when some brilliant minds began to analyse the world free from the shackles of religion. Pitagoras discovered that mathematics rule the world. Leucippus and Democritus figured out that all matter is made of atoms. Hippocrates and Galen robbed Medicine from the priests. Aristaco de Samos found out that the Earth revolves around the Sun and not otherwise. Another Greek scholar measured the distance from the Earth to the Moon and missed by only 200 kilometers. Socrates, Plato and Aristotle abandoned the fables of Greek Mythology in favor of secular Philosophy.

 

Unfortunately this wonderful beginning was checked by the wide acceptance of the Christian cosmology based in the Bible. Europe remained in the intellectual darkness of Christendom for more than a millennium. The world was only to be awakened by the study of the pagan Greek classics (Renaissance and Humanism).

 

During more than a millennium the Roman Church has been accustomed to being owner of the truth. The Bible and the pope were declared infallible and those who dared to disagree were considered heretics and condemned to terrible tortures before being sent to the stake. This happened, among thousands, to Giordano Bruno, in the year 1600.

 

The Church didn't like when, after the Renaissance and after the religious liberty provided by the Protestant revolution, science exploded, explaining all the phenomena of nature without the help of the Bible, not to say of a god. Much to the contrary! Among dozens of discoveries that defied the authority of the Bible, Copernicus and Galileo dethroned the Earth from the center of the universe and Darwin showed that there are not fixed species and that man, instead of being a replica of God, is just a sophisticated ape.

 

It has not been comfortable for the Catholic Church to lose her authority as a source of truth. The Church never accepted being relegated to a second position. The Roman Church, under the guidance of Pope Pius XI, decided that she could no longer remain away from the debate of the origin of the universe. After all, she had the age-old cosmology of the Genesis to defend.

 

In the 20's a conference on Cosmology was held in the Vatican, in the Pontificia Academia de Scienza di Roma. The intention was that the Vatican should have a word in the academic establishment on scientific matters. The pope Pius XI decided that the Church had also to make science within the Vatican. Georges Lemaître, a monk with a great knowledge on theology and mathematics, was designated to study Einstein's and other scientist's ideas, with the explicit intention of selling the Roman Church's cosmology.

 

In 1927 Lemaître, inspired by the Bible's cosmology, developed a theory that the universe began from an explosion of a "primordial atom" (whatever it is). George Gamow follow suit developing the idea that all the constituents of the universe have been created in the first few minutes after the big bang, and Alan Guth, from Cornell University, authored the inflation theory of the Universe, according to which "the entire universe is supposed to have grown from an almost infinitesimal bubble of space, only one trillionth the size of a proton" (apud Herbert Friedman, "The Astronomer's Universe", 1998). Certainly both scientists swallowed Lemaître's bait and gave scientific credibility to the Bible version by elaborating on the beginning of the universe through a primordial explosion.

 

Hawking also helped to advance the Bible's Cosmology with his "singularity" theory. In 1975 he was rewarded by the pope with a medal.

 

Another scientist that swallowed Lemaître's bait was Bernard Lovell who, innocently, concluded that the creation of matter, in the big bang, could only be effective by the power of an external factor, god himself! He failed to explain how god was created.

 

Einstein was decidedly against the idea of the Big Bang. His equations have concluded that the universe had to be either in expansion or in contraction, but he didn't believe his own equations, because he was a supporter of a stable vision of the cosmos. He created a "cosmological constant" (a counter-gravity force) not to abandon his equations. Later he abandoned this theory.

 

The impasse between the Big Bang and the steady-state theory was broken when Hubble found out that the universe is in expansion. Einstein was shocked by the expanding universe demonstrated by the findings of Edwin Hubble. Lemaître saw this as a great opportunity and rushed to California. In the early 1930s, as reported by Timothy Ferris (The Whole Shebang, 1997), in a lecture in the library of Mt. Wilson observatory offices, Lemaître declared solemnly to an audience which included Einstein: "In the beginning of everything we had fireworks of unimaginable beauty. Then there was the explosion followed by the filling of heavens with smoke. We come to late to do more than to visualize the splendor of creation's' birthday." Not even Moses would be so eloquent. Lemaître's oratory was so brilliant that even Einstein became convinced by this new version of the biblical cosmology.

 

Unbelievingly, after resisting for a long time, Einstein, and most of the scientific establishment, capitulated to the idea of the Big Bang by the influence of no less than a monk: George Lemaître.

 

 

Finally, a quotation from Joseph Silk (COSMIC ENIGMAS, 1994): "In many respects, the Big Bang is to modern cosmology what mythology was to the ancients. To believe that we understand the very early Universe, the first microseconds of cosmic time, requires immense faith in the physicist's search for the ultimate union of fundamental forces of nature, because direct evidence is completely lacking."

 

the big bang fall down go boom

<A HREF="http://www.newtonphysics.on.ca/BIGBANG/Bigbang.html">kaboom<A/>

 

<A HREF="http://www.humanist.org.nz/Docs/BigBang.html">fizzled out<A/>