What is the main purpose of this whole process of material cosmic creation ???

[Guest guest]

THE PURPOSE OF MATERIAL CREATION

 

by Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

 

sa va esa tada drasta

napasyad drsyam ekarat

mene 'santam ivatmanam

supta-saktir asupta-drk

 

The Lord, the undisputed proprietor of everything, was the only seer. The cosmic manifestation was not present at that time, and thus He felt imperfect without His plenary and separated parts and parcels. The material energy was dormant, whereas the internal potency was manifested.

 

(Srimad-Bhagavatam, Canto 3, Ch. 5, Text 24)

 

Purport

 

The Lord is the supreme seer because only by His glance did the material energy become active for cosmic manifestation. At that time the seer was there, but the external energy, over which the glance of the Lord is cast, was not present. He felt somewhat insufficient, like a husband feeling lonely in the absence of his wife. This is a poetic simile. The Lord wanted to create the cosmic manifestation to give another chance to the conditioned souls who were dormant in forgetfulness. The cosmic manifestation gives the conditioned souls a chance to go back home, back to Godhead, and that is its main purpose. The Lord is so kind that in the absence of such a manifestation He feels something wanting, and thus the creation takes place. Although the creation of the internal potency was manifested, the other potency appeared to be sleeping, and the Lord wanted to awaken her to activity, just as a husband wants to awaken his wife from the sleeping state for enjoyment. It is the compassion of the Lord for the sleeping energy that He wants to see her awaken for enjoyment like the other wives who are awake.

 

 

The whole process is to enliven the sleeping conditioned souls to the real life of spiritual consciousness so that they may thus become as perfect as the ever-liberated souls in the Vaikunthalokas. Since the Lord is sac-cid-ananda-vigraha, He likes every part and parcel of His different potencies to take part in the blissful rasa because participation with the Lord in His eternal rasa-lila is the highest living condition, perfect in spiritual bliss and eternal knowledge.

 

[Guest guest]

Q) What is the purpose of material cosmic creation?

 

A) First off, one shouldn't divide life as material or spiritual. All life is one movement. What you call matter (what you can see or touch or smell or feel or hear) is nothing but a gross manifestation of the One Spirit. What you call thought or idea (or anything at all you cannot see or touch or smell or feel or hear) is a subtle manifestation of the One Spirit. In short, life (which includes body, mind, world, nature) manifests itself in gross or subtle forms. Period. Conclusion: I am ALL. There is nothing apart from me. I am the universe and beyond.

 

To realize this is the purpose of creation.

[Guest guest]

If you are ALL like you say, why did I forget??

 

Ain't I supposed to be ALL therefore unforgetful??

 

I'm lost when someone tries to make me ALL.

[Guest guest]

of evolution. In the beginning, there was nothing but intelligence. But wherever there is intelligence, there has to be evolution. Hence, intelligence divided itself into higher and lower nature, just for the delight of evolution (called Ananda in Vedic literature). When intelligence functions at the lowest level, it is inconscient like in stones, it is instinctive at a still higher level in insects. In man, it reaches the cognitive state. This is the decisive phase of evolution. From here, man has to move to the final stage of evolution, called the superconscious state. Once that happens, you will "remember" that you have never been anything but "THAT", you were just temporarily playing the game of evolution, for the sheer joy of it. That's why the Upanishad always say, "That thou art!" There is no difference between a stone and a sage. Only thing, the stone is intelligence functioning at an inconscient level, whereas the sage is also the same intelligence working at the intuitive level. The diff. is one of degree of manifestation. Water is water, whether it is inside a jug, or in the ocean. Of course, in sheer quantity and quality, they are diff. But in essence, they are the same.

[theist]

 

This is the decisive phase of evolution. From here, man has to move to the final stage of evolution, called the superconscious state. Once that happens, you will "remember" that you have never been anything but "THAT", you were just temporarily playing the game of evolution, for the sheer joy of it.

 

 

Q.1)So if samsara is such "sheer joy" why should I endeavor to give it up and become liberated?

 

Q.2) Whose intelligence? Are you suggesting some impersonal self-manifested intelligence? If so, who is the self that decided to manifest?

 

Q.3)Once getting back to the superconscious state who is the "you" that remembers?

 

 

The idea that some all pervading intelligence decided one day to infinitely split itself up into many parts to undergo seemimgly endless births and deaths, being eaten alive in animal and insect form or smashed by trucks or have limbs torn off by bombs for the "sheer joy" of it and then when in human form develop the cogntive awareness to realize it has all been useless suffering instead of "sheer joy" and then have to develop a renounced attitude to all the "sheer joy" in order to get back to its original impersonal state, which it renounced in the first place, in order to experience the real "sheer joy" makes no sense at all.

[Guest guest]

1) You should never give up samsara. You have to live through it to become liberated. If you renounce, you are only escaping. And escape is silly because you are the universe, so you cannot escape from yourself.

 

2) Intelligence could be a tricky word, let's call it "THE SOURCE".

 

3) There is no "you". Once again, we are faced with the frailties of the English language. Shall we say, no one remembers, yet THERE IS A REMEMBRANCE?

 

"The idea that some all pervading intelligence DECIDED ONE DAY to infinitely split itself up into many parts"

 

One day? You are still thinking in terms of time! The infinite cannot be confined within time and space.

 

Decide? Who is gonna decide? The whole process starts naturally and inevitably. Evolution is not a choice or a decision, it has to happen where there is intelligence. Intelligence does not make a decision to evolve BUT it will. It happens, it has to happen.

 

"then have to develop a renounced attitude to all the "sheer joy" in order to get back to its original impersonal state, which it renounced in the first place, in order to experience the real "sheer joy" makes no sense at all. "

 

It doesn't make sense because you are still thinking in terms of decision and decision-maker. Evolution take place because it is unavoidable, but there is "sheer joy" in it nevertheless. The "sheer joy" is not in suffering itself, but in evolving from that state to a higher state. I never said there was delight in the state itself, but rather in the evolution from the state to a still higher state. So the "sheer joy" is in change, mutation, NOT in the state itself.

 

Enough for today....