Young - Old and Old - Young Marriages

[Guest guest]

 

What can you say about the union of a younger male/female to an older male/female and vice versa?

 

Is it Godly? Or is it of this world?

 

Angekela.

[Kulapavana]

the age difference does not determine worldliness or godliness of a marriage. in vedic marriage system men are usually somewhat older than women (has to do with several factors, emotional maturity included /images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

too much age difference can be a problem these days, as this usually reflects a significant difference in mentality between husband and wife.

[Guest guest]

My theory has always been: if you are old enough to have brought them into this world, you are too old to marry them. Either gender.

 

Now Vedically it was acceptable in the 'past' for older male to marry young female, but its the past for a reason. In this modern age of kali, when we see old man of fathers age desiring young girl, there is usually a very real mental problem going on, or at least mid-life crisis. Many related issues can be listed but I don't have the time.

 

Does this apply to women too? Yes, but there are few, if any, women devoees lusting after young boy.

 

Anyway, the bottom line is, old marrying the young more often has to do with lust, which is worldly, rather then transcendental Krishna consciousness or not worldly.

 

Besides, as we age we all should be giving up such things, renouncing at least to a degree.

 

YS,

Prtha dd

[Myra]

"the age difference does not determine worldliness or godliness of a marriage."

 

________

 

Yes that's right. I agree with you. One most important thing too is the consciousness of both parties. Regardless of age difference, they will always attain unity, spiritual growth and god conscious offsprings as long as they truly love each other and the center of their lives is Krishna. For the most important common denominator for every succesful marriage is the presence of God in their relationship. Couples must be God conscious in order to survive in this tricky worldly age.

 

But of course it will be ideal to marry a man or a woman of the same age. How could you stop the feelings and hoping when among these people around, but this old guy or this old lady is the one you knew would "complete" you? God may have chosen this person to extend and let you know His love for you. It's up to you to reciprocate that Love.

 

Personally, I believe that only FALSE WITNESSES will say that love fades as gray hair appears.

[Guest guest]

The most important love is love of God. All these other relationships will fade with time, or cruel death will take them away. And then the pain. But to love another human being teaches us that there is higher love, that of God/Krishna. As we make advancement with age, we are able to give up the desires of these lesser types of love and just go after God.

 

Myra, I do understand your point of young and old, that age should not matter. Tho it also appears idealistic. Hey, we all need a little idealism. No probleml there. Simply I have seen too many dirty old men (claiming to be very spiritual) lusting after many young girls they insist must be virgins too. So my personal opinion, I dont want to open the door to that and make it easy for them to preach "its vedic for us 50 year old men to marry and have sex with 12 or 14 year old girls."

 

There may be an exceptions for legal age girls, but generally an old man who desires a younger girl has nothing to do with godliness and has everything to do with the worldliness of lust, immaturity (therapists have explained they can't handle an adult relationship), and many other factors figure into the equasion. Also, women think different from men on this, and most everything.

 

I wonder if you are a parent. A daugher or two down the road, you may see another perspective. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

YS,

Prtha dd

[Myra]

Dear Prtha Devi Dasi,

 

Perfectly stated: The most important love is love of God. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

Moreover, I can fully understand the scenario you were talking about, the older male seeking for younger female. I'm living in a thirld world country and almost everyday, when I go to the church or office I've seen this reality. They are obviously very worldly couple. You can see it in their body (lots of tattoos), their PDA or public display of affection, and the way they dress. Mostly, women who get involved in this kind of situation are those very desperate and are willing to risk their future in expense of "False" security. They thought that these older men are good catch, and could help them in their future or augment their income; while, these older men wanted to be with these girls becasue they feel young and could boast their false ego. It's middle-age crisis.

 

Note however, that I am speaking to a union that is bounded with love, respect and commitment to grow in spirit for God with each other not because of worldly reasons. This may sound so idealistic (based on my own experience), and besides, God expects His devotees and followers to be idealistic and righteous for His sake, right? Sometimes, we can't really understand the connection between two people, they may look odd, but spiritually they are very matched.

 

As what I have posted in one of the threads here and I will quote it again. The union between man and woman is a portrayal of the divine romance between God and His devotees. The only reason man and woman are attracted to each other and desire to build a life together, is because this principal is true in a spiritual sense. The natural realm is an illustration of the spiritual realm, and all spiritual truths existed long before the natural ones were manifested. In the same that way men and women seek each other to become one, so our spirits are also seeking oneness with God----and He with us.

 

/images/graemlins/smile.gif I know you are very realized person and I understand what you mean. I am not trying to negate your statement, just we are speaking in a different shadow.

 

Hare Krishna!

 

Myra.

[Kulapavana]

These are good points Pritaa prabhu. It is nice to think in idealistic terms, but the reality around us is very different. However, one important point needs to be made: even in the spiritual world the living entity can have emotional relationship with persons other than Krishna, certainly your guru included. Various pure forms of love for other living entities do not diminish your ability to love Krishna. I would dare to say that perhaps the opposite is true: if you cant love your closest family, chances are you cant love Krishna either, as you are in love with yourself.

[Priitaa]

Haribol Myra,

 

Thank you for your nice reply. I was initially unsure about opening this thread, not because of who answered, as I didn't know, but from seeing the numbers, indicating replies in general. The reason? My previous experience on this topic, because I have been so outspoken against old men marrying young virgin girls, has not been well recieved by such men though I wish to clarify, not all men. Especially dad's of daughters understand my point, and share my concern. Most of them see how wrong this is. Anyway, I thank you for your kind post.

 

Now, I don't know how realized I am. ha I am just struggling like anyone else. Its Prabhupada's books that are my saving grace.

 

Yes, I do understand you are speaking of a union based in love and respect. That should be there. Unless verbalized, often, in this age of kali it more likely not to be. Unless empowered by words or preaching.

 

But I take it a step further. As we look at the Vedas what is considered first class is to never marry, to remain celibate, and to think of, fall in love with, and serve only God or Krishna.

 

I am also a realist. In this age, those who have been more successful in Krishna consciousness are those who marry and serve Krishna together. There is often a fine line between loving ones mate and loving God. That is for each individual to decide for themselves.

 

But ultimately cruel death separates us all. This is one reason why, if one is advanced enough not to marry but to dedicate their life only to love of God, that is the best as it is the least painful. (What to speak of the pain raising teenagers. ha) In most cases however, to be total monk/nun should not be attempted until the end of life. Thus, 4 ashrams.

 

From youth to about age 25, one is to be brahmacari or brahmacarini. Celibate too.

 

From about age 25 - 50 (for a man, starts a little younger for a woman) there is grhasta life or marriage. Also celibate except to bring Vaisnava's into the world.

 

From approximately age 50 one can take Varnaprastha, where they remain married but travel to Holy places on pilgriage. Sometimes with their spouse, sometimes without. It is the weaning process, getting ready for the next phase.

 

I really dont know exactly what age Vranaprastha starts and when Sanyasa starts, but shortly after Varnaprastha is the total renunciation of married life completely, called sanyas. For men they travel and carry a dunda or stick to indicate their ashrama and their asuterity. For women they put on white to signify their renunciation as a widow, in this case, by choice.

 

Now can we all do that? No. But to understand the highest knowledge we first need to understand how the Vedas have it set up. Then we can be honest wihtin regarding what we can handle. Most important is to do whatever we need to do that will facilitate chanting Hare Krishna at the time of death.

[Priitaa]

Haribol Kulapavana prabhu,

 

Thank you. Actually I wasn't arguing with anything you said. Maybe adding on, that's all.

 

"However, one important point needs to be made: even in the spiritual world the living entity can have emotional relationship with persons other than Krishna, certainly your guru included."

 

Hmmmm My guru included? Wondering what that means. Anyway........

 

We are not in the spiriutal world and are not on the same level as such souls. To have a relationship with those of the spiritual sky is to never be forgetting Krishna, because when one thinks of the pure devotee, such as these residents, you are automatically connected to Krishna. They are very different types of relationships up there.

 

"Various pure forms of love for other living entities do not diminish your ability to love Krishna."

 

I never said they do. I do say there is risk of entanglement and getting too attached to persons other than Krishna, therfore having to take birth again.

 

"I would dare to say that perhaps the opposite is true: if you cant love your closest family, chances are you cant love Krishna either, as you are in love with yourself. "

 

Yes, and I made this point also, that when we understand love for our marriage partner (since that was the topic) it helps us understand that love of God exists too. But this is beginning knowledge. As we advance, we all ready know that and just want to love Krishna cent per cent.

[Kulapavana]

"Hmmmm My guru included? Wondering what that means"

 

No great mystery implied. We serve Krishna under our guru's direction both here and on the "other side". Most true disciples have great sentiment and affection for their guru, and that relationship certainly continues.

 

When you read stories about Krishna in Vrindavan a window is opened to the spiritual sky. Krishna's associates have also relationships among themselves, centering on Krishna of course.

 

I would not worry too much about the "risk of entanglement and getting too attached to persons other than Krishna, therfore having to take birth again". Such risk certainly is there, but we have much bigger problem. Our greatest problem is attachment to ourselves. I see many outwardly "unattached" devotees who are so severely self absorbed their "attachment" to Krishna seems dubious to me.

But this is just my own observation and oppinion. That is also not arguing, just adding to your points /images/graemlins/smile.gif