Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 He would always yell at me "Repent Sinner! every day. I was like thanks for the encouragment thats why I am distributing these books. LOL Another good reply! Anyways, the last time I talked to this gentleman(I say the word loosely as he was nuts and he also had a beard and such like Jesus) he said to me "Repent Sinner! Yes, some of them are actually mentally ill, othres may have the lesser types of emotional illness like fanaticism, tho I know a few devotees who have that too. haha But at least we aren't casting anyone into an eternal hell fire. he said to me "Repent Sinner! I replied with "Repent Christian! There was a chuckle from the crowd LOL You must be a blast out on skp! ha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 From My Web Page: Isaiah 7:14-15 14 “Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign: Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel." 15 "Butter and honey shall he eat, that he may know to refuse the evil, and choose the good.” Fundamental Christians tend to quote the first verse as proof that Jesus is the savior, and that's fine, but they rarely quote the verse next one, which indicates he will be a vegetarian. Now, the question arises, what does the eating of butter and honey have to do with knowing how to choose between good and evil? It may surprise some to learn that throughout history there haVE been many Jews who followed vegetarianism. Their belief was that meat corrupted the soul of a persons. The Bible teaches that meat makes you "stumble," on a similar level to alcohol, thus corrupting the your heart. Thus, notice the use of the word “it” (my emphasis), is used as singular. Jesus was offered fish and honeycomb, but took only one. He would eat butter and honey, instead of meat, so that his heart would not be corrupted. Romans 14:21 "It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor anything whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or made weak." ANOTEHR, SIMILAR HONEY/FISH VERSE: Luke 24:41-43 “And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he (Jesus) said unto this (his disciples), ‘Have yet here any meat?’ And they gave him a piece of broiled fish, and of a honeycomb. And he took IT, and did eat before them." The word used here for meat is "brosimos," which more accurately translates as “eatable.” So they simply gave him something that was eatable. Notice also the use of the word “it” (my emphasis), which is used as singular. Jesus was offered fish and honeycomb, but took only one. OTHER VERSES ON GENERAL MEAT EATING: Mathew 3:4 “And the same John (the Baptist) had his raiment of camels hair, and a leathern girdle about his loins; and his meat was locusts and wild honey." The word used here for meat is ‘broma,’ which more accurately translates as 'food.' Also note that the word locusts refers to locust bean or carob, known as St Johns bread. Luke 8.55 “And her spirit came again (referring to a woman Jesus raised from the dead), and she arose straightaway: and he (Jesus) commanded to give her meat." The word that has been translated as meat is "phago" which really means “to eat.” Jesus gave her something to eat, that’s all. John 4:8 “For his disciples were gone away unto the city to buy meat." The word used here is "trophe," which actually means "nourishment." Acts 15:34 “And when he had brought them into his house, he set meat before them, and rejoiced, believing in God with all his house." The word used here is "trapeza" which translates as table. It says he set a table before them. Luke 11:37 “And as he (Jesus) spake, a certain Pharisee besought him to dine with him: and he went in, and sat down to meat.” The word used here is "anepesem" or "recline." It says he went in and sat down. Isaiah 66:3 “He that killeth an ox is as if he slew a man. Shows that cow killing is equated with murder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 Very funny are you who criticize the 6th commandment : Thou shall not kill where you tend to forget the rest of the commandments especially the 1st to the 5th! not sure if anyone of you could memorize that and understand what that means? 1. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Hindus already broke it by having 33 million gods! 2. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me. Many so-called Christians are no exception. What more of Hindus? Islam is safe though. 3. Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain; for the LORD will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain. 4. Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. 5. Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee. 6. Thou shalt not kill. 7. Thou shalt not commit adultery. Just couldn't figure out why there was such a high percentage of Hare Krishna devotees remarried at least twice to each others wives. 8. Thou shalt not steal. 9. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour. 10. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 Is that you think you know anything about Hinduism. What is sad is that you displayed your ignorance here. Do not be foolish in accepting from fools. All tales written or spoken by old wives are not necessarily true, especially those found in the propaganda of hate on the internet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 In context it would appear not to support the idea that meat makes one stumble necessarily:<blockquote>11 It is written: " 'As surely as I live,' says the Lord, 'every knee will bow before me; every tongue will confess to God.' " 12 So then, each of us will give an account of himself to God. 13 Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in your brother's way. 14 As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I am fully convinced that no food is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for him it is unclean. 15 If your brother is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love. Do not by your eating destroy your brother for whom Christ died. 16 Do not allow what you consider good to be spoken of as evil. 17 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit, 18 because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and approved by men. 19 Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification. 20 Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble. 21 It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or to do anything else that will cause your brother to fall. 22 So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God. Blessed is the man who does not condemn himself by what he approves. 23 But the man who has doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin. </blockquote> I seem to recall that in the beginning as mentioned in Genesis, man was to be vegetarian, but man was too weak and they became savages for the taste of blood. Then God destroyed practically everyone and everything in the flood; and conceded that they could now eat certain animals in a certain way. Peter had a vision about God sending down animals from the sky as food for him. He told God that they were forbidden, but God said "No it's cool. I made it clean". Where did Peter get the notion that meat-eating was uncool; from Jesus? Haridhama, you now have a Bible HERE to bookmark for later reference. Now you will know that it is a camel that cannot pass through the eye of the needle not an elephant. And yes, my very loose paraphrasing of the meat stories above are much worse than your little elephantine exaggeration. gHari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Govindaram Posted October 30, 2003 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 ppls on this forum are not saying christians that eat meat are bad, its the fact that they think ITS OK! which it is obviosuly not, many ppls eat meant and it is difficult to give-up, but if you don't realise it's bad, and don't make a little effort to give-up, why should God help you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 1. Thou shalt have no other gods before me. Hindus already broke it by having 33 million gods! Maybe you're worshipping 33 million gods, but we are only worshiping one, The Supreme One God. Hinduism is not the same as Krishna consciousness, though some Hindu's simultaneously practice Krishna consciousness, yet some do not. I suggest you study both before you think you are qualified to comment, as I have only pointed out one of the many points you are mistaken on. To take it further, that was not the intent of this thread or my post. We were just trying to locate the fish/honey quote in the Bible. Try to stick with the topic and not use it as an opportunity to come to our forums and put us down. We dont go to your forums and put you down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 gH, I did not mean to take anything out of context. I was just trying to show that even within Christianity, the 4 regulative principles exist. And I find the other verses to merely be pointing to compassion and understanding, which I am under the impression most devotees, well, most devotees here, have. Though I suppose I would have to mention that we do not have the original words Christ spoke, and with so much changed within the Bible, there are some quotes in there I find hard to accept coming from a Vaisnava like Jesus. I strognly supsect many verses have been changed by the Church itself. I tend to try to hunt down original words whenver I can, to get a real translation better than King James versions or similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 Acts 11 Peter Explains His Actions 1The apostles and the brothers throughout Judea heard that the Gentiles also had received the word of God. 2So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcised believers criticized him 3and said, "You went into the house of uncircumcised men and ate with them." 4Peter began and explained everything to them precisely as it had happened: 5"I was in the city of Joppa praying, and in a trance I saw a vision. I saw something like a large sheet being let down from heaven by its four corners, and it came down to where I was. 6I looked into it and saw four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, reptiles, and birds of the air. 7Then I heard a voice telling me, 'Get up, Peter. Kill and eat.' 8"I replied, 'Surely not, Lord! Nothing impure or unclean has ever entered my mouth.' 9"The voice spoke from heaven a second time, 'Do not call anything impure that God has made clean.' 10This happened three times, and then it was all pulled up to heaven again. 11"Right then three men who had been sent to me from Caesarea stopped at the house where I was staying. 12The Spirit told me to have no hesitation about going with them. These six brothers also went with me, and we entered the man's house. 13He told us how he had seen an angel appear in his house and say, 'Send to Joppa for Simon who is called Peter. 14He will bring you a message through which you and all your household will be saved.' 15"As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit came on them as he had come on us at the beginning. 16Then I remembered what the Lord had said: 'John baptized with[1] water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.' 17So if God gave them the same gift as he gave us, who believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I to think that I could oppose God?" 18When they heard this, they had no further objections and praised God, saying, "So then, God has granted even the Gentiles repentance unto life." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haridham Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 You have misunderstood vedic culture. Please do a little bit more research before you make any comments. I wasnt saying anything nor do i think anyone here was trying to critize Lord Jesus Christ and his teachings but rather the people who claim to be christians. The Word Christian means Christ-like. When you are yelling, screaming, telling people you are going to hell that is not Christ like. Neither is opening thousands of Slaughter houses.\ Jesus was humble, tolorant, compassionate and loving. I think the last great Christian was tortured and crucified on a cross. Hopefully we can understand and realise he died for our sins so we should stop sinning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 What is your point gH, to make it not so serious an offense (1 ten thousands the tip of each hair of each cow), or not so serious for those who are not Vaisnava's to eat meat? I don't understand why you are posting all these pro-meat Bible quotes, especially when we know the Bible has been tampered with to convert Emperor Constantine who was a big meat eater and would not give that up to convert. Therefore the Church itself made Biblical text changes to get him to join, which he did. I am sure I am just misunderstanding your purpose here, so please explain it to me. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haridham Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 I am confused as well, I mean there were replies of the bible supporting vegatarianism and now it suppots people eating meat. Is the bible full of contradictions or something else is happening I am just curious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haridham Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 I wanted to know something, before Ghari Prabhu posted the Pro meat part of the bible I was planning to print that part out and talk to some of the fanatical Christians about these quotes. Is this still a good idea, I mean not necceceraly to fanatical christians but other people who are christian and it just gives some evidence to what I say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 It actually suggests that Peter thought that meat was impure. Since if we follow the meat story from no meat in Genesis to some meat after the flood, we must wonder where Peter's idea originated. I think it came from Jesus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haridham Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 LOL You must be a blast out on skp! ha Yes Priita ji I do have a good time doing books. I have fun with people which attracts them, and some like the fact that young people are serious about something other then raves or partying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haridham Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 I cant seem to figure out how to reply properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 Is this still a good idea, I mean not necceceraly to fanatical christians but other people who are christian and it just gives some evidence to what I say. Its never a good idea to talk to fanatical Christians. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haridham Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 what about other people who say they are christians???? and its usually fanatical christians that are attracted to me. .....I cant blame them hahahahah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 It actually suggests that Peter thought that meat was impure. Since if we follow the meat story from no meat in Genesis to some meat after the flood, we must wonder where Peter's idea originated. I think it came from Jesus. Ok, yes. That part I get. But Peter is actually going against God; in that quote God is instructing him to eat meat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haridham Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 apparently father(god) and son(Jesus) dont see eye to eye. Can you say family feud!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 It seems that whoever tried to make meat-eating okay in the Gospel for whatever reason did a poor job since many references are still left to support vegetarianism. This is what Jesus taught about food, according to the current scripture:<blockquote>Matthew 6 25"Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? 26Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they? 27Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life[2] ? 28"And why do you worry about clothes? See how the lilies of the field grow. They do not labor or spin. 29Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. 30If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? 31So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' 32For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. 33But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. 34Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own. </blockquote> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 Is the bible full of contradictions or something else is happening Yes, the Bible is full of contraditions, but Jesus is not. The Bible has been tampered with, more than once, so it's hard to know what parts are bona fide and what parts are not. That's why I do try to find original words whenever I can (which aint easy! ha) of Christs words, or at least the Greek. They even messed with the Greek-to-English. What to speak of the Aramic (Christ's mother tongue). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priitaa Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 Since if we follow the meat story from no meat in Genesis to some meat after the flood, we must wonder where Peter's idea originated. I think it came from Jesus. This is a good point. Where did Peter get the idea from in the first place? Yes, of course, Gods original diet for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gHari Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 Peter is explaining how he came to be eating with impure folks. God may be letting Peter know that he can go and eat with the uncircumcized people since God has purified that meat. I'm not sure it means all meat was made clean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haridham Posted October 30, 2003 Report Share Posted October 30, 2003 ...the circumcised people thing. If the christians read that part they will now say you are going to hell because you are not christian and you are not christian because you are not circumcised or something sheesh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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