Unique Relationships in Mahabharat

[Kulapavana]

anyway, the story is fascinating and characters very sublime, all that in a very, very ancient script. How rich and developed is the Vedic culture! Compare that to Old Testament. Mahabharat wins hands down in every category!

[Guest guest]

"Compare that to Old Testament. Mahabharat wins hands down in every category!"

 

-useless

[Kulapavana]

we compare prices, shoes, cars, and yes, religions too. unless you compare, HOW CAN YOU MAKE A CHOICE?

[Guest guest]

Hi Kupapavana, I did not write the useless comment, but just for the sake of rhetoric I'll attempt to answer what guest may be thinking.

 

The initial comparison you suggest between the Bible and Mahabharata is useful as an initial comparison only. For many of us, we don't care to look back to the Bible for inspiration, nor would we recommend it to anyone as a serious religious study. Talk about filler! It's worse than the National Enquirer!

 

Hmmm, the Bible is known as a religious text. Is the Mahabharata known as a religious text or just mythology?

 

Most of us have moved way beyond the Bible. Many Christians are stuck back on signs from God and other evidence between spirit and matter.

 

What do the Christians get from their Bible? They're waiting on signs. We're engaged in our etyernal service. Hari Bol!

[Kulapavana]

many devotees (including some who come to this site) have sentiments towards Christianity, especially in their early days, and my comment on comparison was for them. Mahabharat is certainly a religious text to scholars, even if you remove Bhagavat Gita from consideration. Even my kids in US public schools studied Mahabharat as both literary and religious masterpiece of human culture.

[Guest guest]

So the love and alligiance Karna had for Duryodhana could be seen as mundane. But between the lines or under the surface, there is a very spiritual aspect to these emotional bonds. It is the essence of life. I think that's why Krsna cried at hearing Karna's decision to sacrifice his life for his friend and mentor.

 

He was just co-operating with fate that had chosen his destiny. I certainly think his sacrifice was the greatest. The greatest king… without a crown.

[Guest guest]

Dropudi and Dhistrudum have a very strong relationship. It a a strong bond they share. They both would do anything for the other.

 

In the war, when Dhistrudum killed Dronacharya, Arjun was furious. He was on the verge of killing him. when realizing what had happened, Dropudi reasoned with Arjun and calmed him down. She helped save her brother's life.

 

When the Pandavas and Dropudi were in exile, Dhistrudum went in the forest to bring Dropudi back. He did not like that she was going to spend all of that time in exile. He pleaded with her. But, still she remained with her husbands.

 

These are just a few examples of the strong bond that lies between brother and sister. i always hope that when i have kids i will have a boy and a girl so i could name them Dropudi and Dhistrudum.

[Guest guest]

Karna is great in his character of giving anything he had, bbut still he was selfish in following Duryodhana and hence followed the path of Adharma. So he is just mundane and thats why he was killed. But for his good nature of giving away anything he had, God gave him darshan. Moreover, he was one of the prime person who insulted Draupathi by asking her to sit on the lap of Duryodhana when they lost the game. I am sorry, I hate Karna for this nature of insulting another man's wife just to please his adharmic friend.

Shyam

[Guest guest]

that is why, after he finds out that the Pandavas are his real brothers, that is the reason he could not be true and take the side of dharma. He remembers that day too. I bet if anything, if he had a choice to take that day back, he would. If he was unbiased and told Duryodhana this is wrong. we should not gamble this way, maybe, Duryodhana would have listened. But because of that day, he shamed himself for the rest of his life. if he had not said those things, the he himself would be untouchable. He did everything in his dharma. Again, that day tainted him for the rest of his life

[ShegavichaRana]

Another interesting thing is about Karna's wife. A very famous book on Karna in Marathi ("Mritunjaya") says, his wife's name was Vrishali, who committed sati when he was killed in the war and Lord Krishna was the witness. But BR Chopra's "Mahabharata Katha" (which is about the events after the war) showed that, Karna's wife (Padmawati) was also a maid servant to another princess. Which is true? I do not think he had two wives. Does anyone know?

[Guest guest]

Are you watching mahabharat katha on sony tv in India cos I'm wondering whether they'll show it in the uk soon.

[Guest guest]

A person who follows Dharma should be good all the time. Karna irrespective of the fact whether Pandavas were his brothers or not, he should have stopped Duryodhana and Duchadhana when they tried insultiing another man's wife, not just because she was his brother's wife. How much ever he may be good in giving things, so what, he is not good human at that time when a woman was getting molested and he ignited fire for it. So he deserved getting killed. Lord is always the true and right Judge and He never spares anyone just for the sake of something good in them on one

[Kulapavana]

at the time of the attempted disrobing, Draupadi was already Duryodhan's property. that was the reason for other kshatriyas like Bishma and Karna to be neutral on this deplorable behaviour of Duryodhan. dharma can be very complex.

[Guest guest]

They should have known that the property that one posesses is all His(krishna's) property and stopped the exploitation of draupadi right there.

 

Secondly, I think the thoughts of having a human being as property just shows how demoniac duryodhan became due to his selfishness, ego and arrogance.

 

 

[Guest guest]

For one thing, it probably seemed to Karna initially, that Durtodhana's claims were valid. These Kurus were all the same family.

 

Point two, I remember that the Pandavas started the animosity with Radheya at the Tournament. Then Duryodhana does this great act by making Radheya king and Radheya is bound to reciprocate out of duty.

 

Draupadi and the game of dice: I think they went too far. But for enemies to slight one-another and even their families is nothing new.

 

Pandavas were threatening to kill all of Varata's relatives if Yudhisthira's blood touched the ground. I mean that seems a little harsh given the circumstances.

 

My point was that emotions, feelings and relationships are the essence of conscious life. Radheya's bond was to Duryodhana and he was true to that. It can't just pretend all that didn't happen and give Duryodhana up. This is just not an intelligent opinion.

[Guest guest]

there are many times when the Pandavas were not right. they made many wrong choices. For instance at the tournament, when we were first introduced to Karna, Arjun started a sour relationship with him first. And why was Arjun so mean? I think that Arjun felt threatened by Karna. Karna's archery talent was probably equal to that of Arjun. That probably scared him. i think that Yudistdir should have scolded him. The tournament is a place to display your talents not a place where linage is so important. Every single time Karna's name comes up, Arjun always insults him. that is wrong. so, the pandavas are not always right.

 

[ShegavichaRana]

Pandavas might have had small tiffs with Kauravas and Karna but that is much less important than the cruelties and injustice meated out to them by the latter at every stage. Karna lost his discrimination as soon as Duryodhana befriended him. Why could he not shake off this friendship, while taking some important decisions? and Varnashramadharma was far more powerful then, than it is now. Now people do not care if you belong to forward caste or backward caste. Karna lost all the sympathy when he participitated in killing Abhimanyu. Perhaps it can be said, that, he behaved much worse than a Sutaputra while doing so.

[Guest guest]

Yeah, undoubtedly, Duryodhana was a monster and he should've been checked.

 

Karna's attitudes and decisions had alot to do with his unfortunate past. Imagine being born of a God only to be disgraced as a lowly man. He had all this power and energy in his blood. He attained his dream by his own design (student of bhargava) and prowess.

 

Duryodhana gave Radheya his heart's desire in a very grand fashion. I don't see how he could throw all that away on betrayal. The fact that he didn't is a tribute to his greatness. We know what you would have done. (he he)

 

About killing Abhimanyu, I agree with you.

 

Well, it came down to this: it's him or us. War is a very bestial activity anyway. Lives are on the line. What is morality to you if you loose your life?

 

Arjuna is called Bhibhatsu because he never fights by unfair means. Mahabharata says he had red hair.

[Guest guest]

but, i feel someone has to take is side. he is the under-dog of Mahabharat. He was born under such a stressful situation for Kunti Mata and for her to give up her child, is only something a woman can understand. yes, karna, falls short on many accounts but still, a symapthy arises for him that i cannot explain. I know all of the terrible things he particpated in. Dropudi insulting, Abhimunyu's death.

 

Again, many brave men participated in the Chuchraview-Dronachaya, Kripachachaya...these men were the Head of the army and if they were uncomfortable with the actions that were being taken, they had a right to oppose them. when is comes to the death of abhimanyu, many names are to be added for that unjustice. After Bhisma peeta was wounded in the war, rule after rule was broken, fighting at night, only one on one fighting, not killing an unarmed warrior, killing a wounded warrior. the list goes on and both sides broke rules. thatis definately true. even Bhagavan took certain liberties-thatcertainly cannot be denied.

 

for what it is worth, i love the mahabharat. and my hero is bhisma peeta and i love him truely to death. All of the people in mahabharat are so special. what other honor can there be than to be in the company of people like Lord Krishna, Bhisma peeta, Vedvyas, Arjun, Yudistrdir, Bheema, Nucul, Sahadev, Kunti Mata, Dronachrya, Dropudi, Balarama, Vidur, Ganga Mata, Devki, Vasudev, there are sooo many there names cannot be put here on this message board. but they are all magnificent. (good and bad)---as disscussed ealier, even dhuroydun had his good points...

[Kulapavana]

Do not think you are smarter or more realized than Karna or other persons who were part of Lord Krishna's pastimes and did not act as "proper" as you think they should have. There are many reasons for the way they acted, some obvious, some very confidential. Try to remember that they were chosen by Krishna to be His associates and study their actions with open mind and great humility. Hare Krishna!

[Kulapavana]

the killing of Abhimanyu marked the end of the honorable fighting at Kurukshetra, and was one of the symptoms that the age of Kali has started. Abhimanyu was sent by Yudhisthir to brake enemy formation even as Yudhisthir knew Abhimanyu had no chance of getting out of it alive on his own. Sometimes the only choices you have are bad and worse.

[Guest guest]

Of course, Arjuna is everyone's hero.

 

I was just thinking how he could afford to always observe ettiqutte… because he was so powerful!

 

So Arjuna was a jiva soul. Right? What is actually meant by Nara-Narayana? There's a Nara-Narayana incarnation that deals with Markendeya Rsi in the twelth canto. They are both Godhead. If Arjuna is a jiva, what is meant by Nara-Narayana?

 

Also, Arjuna was rather ordinary later later on after the war. Right? I mean he couldn't protect Krsna's queens. So how did he live out his life? There was no one holding a grudge to challenge him? They were all dead?

 

There were alot of strange departures of Krsna's associates as His pastimes ended. They Kurus killed each other. But the queens were left to thieves and murderers? What's going on there? Did the queens just evaporate in the criminal hands?

 

Who is Ugrasena? Was he king of the Yadus? You hear of him at Devaki's marriage and then much later when he was given the Syamataka Jewel by Krsna.

[Guest guest]

I think it's funny how Yudhisthira told that lie about Awatthama being dead: After telling it, he whispers that it was the elephant.

 

It reminds me of how so many of us try to cheat fate.

 

Well, it didn't work for Yudhisthira (he fell to earth) and I doubt it works for anyone else.

[Guest guest]

Maybe that was Krsna's way of curbing pride in Yudhisthira.

 

Yudhisthira seemed to be always attentive to cultural ettiquette. And it is a form of sacrifice to do all those things well. (There's practically some little ritual for everything.) The sadhana builds up and makes you powerful. No?

 

Maybe if Yudhisthira lied and didn't fall to earth, he would be infected with thinking he could transgress ordinary codes or something.

[Kulapavana]

Most of Lord Krishna's Queens were captured by barbarians when Arjuna was unable to defend them after destruction of Dvaraka. Departure pastimes are always sad and deeply confidential. I do not try to understand them. They are meant to be taken by devotees mostly on emotional/spiritual level.