Question about vegetarian debate

[Guest guest]

Apparently there is some article going around that says when harvesting vegetables and grain, a lot of smaller animals get killed under the machinery. They're using this argument to claim all vegetarians are hypocrites. They claimed to have stumped PETA.

 

Their demeanor is so assinine. How to debate this?

[ancient_paztriot]

If people have no more intelligence to see beyond this, we are all doomed!

 

The killing is done by big farm interests who use machines to replace people. Therefore, the responsibility for killing belongs to those who decide to use the machines.

 

This is what demons do… blame others for their own faults.

 

Hridyananda says people have hamburger for brains… they've eaten so much hamburger and meat… you are what you eat.

[Priitaa]

Flesh eaters will find an excuse for everything. They dont really care, its merely justification for the attachment to eat meat. They have also said, for example, a plant has feelings, this has been proven (this far, they are right!), therefore we are committing violence by murdering a carrot. Well, lets compare. They would not walk into a pasture gorund and rip the leg off an animal because the pain level is much higher! So let them not say that since we cause eggplant, etc., some degree of pain, its all the same thing. Thats outrageous.

 

The fact is, one is never fully free of karmic reaction unless they learn to offer their food first to the Lord. Only then can one eat a karmaless diet. Tho the degree of karma is EXTREMELY higher when eating flesh foods then veggie foods.

[Kulapavana]

it takes far more grains to feed the animals meat-eaters demand than vegetarians consume, so vegetarianism is still less violent alternative.

 

ultimately it is about your consciousnes: if you desire to eat meat you are just like animals, and all your arguments are simply meant to justify your animalistic taste

[Gauracandra]

has a reaction. So yes some animals may die due to vegetable harvesting. We can't prevent every single action. Still it is a question of degree. Those who don't see this degree are fools. This whole mad cow scare was interesting. One news show said there is made in the U.S. 30 Billion pounds of meat per year. If we assume say 3000 pounds per cow, that is like 10 million cows slaughtered every single year. So while a few groundhogs may get killed when corn is harvested, there is a long way to go before you get up to 30 Billion pounds of gopher meat.

[lover_soul]

We are only mortals. How will you know if a guy killed a rat trying to eat some of the grain which he sells you? Its not possible, we are not almighty and if we were then we would be far from this mess anyway. Who cares who debates what? We are trying to give up unecessary killing, the result is in His hand. Many people don't even try. They just accept their demonic nature and some revert back to it even after they were given the privelege to a vegetarian life and good family values at their birth. Its sad, but true.

[Guest guest]

Thanks so much, prabhus. These are some very good, precise points!

[paul108]

I've heard this argument before. The person was saying that it doesn't matter that meat eating kills so many more animals because meat eaters don't care about killing animals. Since vegetarians supposedly care about animals, but they can't avoid killing them, then they are stupid.

 

 

It's the kind of argument that makes me just want to go berzerk.

 

 

Hare Krishna

Pandu das

[Guest guest]

Indeed prabhu, that's the argument. In these arguments, they will impose so many moral epithets on vegetarians, calling them hypocrites, and yet when you show them the hypocracy of their own logic, they find some way to ignore it or attempt to divert your attention. It's maddening to debate this with karmis, but I am so incredibly addicted to it :/

[theist]

I too deal with thiese types all the time. "Do you use such and such product which has some animal ingedient in it? Like computers or car tires.If so you are a self righteous hypocrite" etc.

 

I just admit they are right and that vegetarians and vegans should never become overly proud. Even a fruitarian steps on insects as he goes to the tree to harvest fruit. So we can only try to minimize the suffering. I believe this is true and it always takes the bitterness out of the debate.