Proprietorship turns sand into gold

[krsna]

For householders owning a house and land is dharma.

For a peaceful life ,cows and grains

and maybe a little ghee.

[Guest guest]

a macintosh laptop? refrigerator? tv? hi-fi? internet?

[Guest guest]

prabhuji,

 

wat about pc & internet ? thru internet only i collect many spiritual information.

 

- Gokul

 

/images/graemlins/smile.gif Jai Shri Krishna

[krsna]

Walk Around Farm

 

August 1, 1975, New Talavana

 

 

 

(kirtana in background)

 

Nityananda: Our sugarcane field is down there. [break]

 

Devotee (1): ...all right?

 

Harikesa: Yes.

 

PRABHUPADA: I have seen all that.

 

Devotee (1): This is kirtana. (a child? cow?)

 

PRABHUPADA: Kirtana? (laughter) That's all right. Have kirtana.

 

Nityananda: Yes.

 

PRABHUPADA: That is ours?

 

Nityananda: Yes.

 

Brahmananda: Where the trees are?

 

Nityananda: Way over the hill and back down there is all ours. In this field, we have the calves. And in this field, here we have the big cows.

 

PRABHUPADA: It is not now utilized?

 

Nityananda: Not... No. We are just growing hay. Grass for hay. We can sell the hay in the winter for a good price.

 

PRABHUPADA: It is not possible to walk. [break] ...it is born?

 

Nityananda: This one? Last week. His name is... Her name is Laksmi. There is more over here. [break] Bull calves. We are getting more bulls than females.

 

PRABHUPADA: Why?

 

Nityananda: I don't know.

 

PRABHUPADA: Then how utilize the bulls?

 

Nityananda: To plow?

 

PRABHUPADA: Plow, transport. You have to engage more men for plowing. Two bulls will be required for each plow.

 

Nityananda: We can go this way maybe? See the sugarcane?

 

PRABHUPADA: Yes.

 

Jagadisa: This is not taking this yet?

 

PRABHUPADA: No. Why?

 

Nityananda: We just cut it two days ago, and then it rained. We have to wait for it to dry before you can...

 

PRABHUPADA: They will not be spoiled.

 

Nityananda: Yes, if it stays here too long, it will spoil.

 

PRABHUPADA: And it rains.

 

Devotee (2): We will take it to the garden.

 

PRABHUPADA: Then it will be soil? It will be fertilizer soil? Or no. When it is decomposed? [break] Drinking water?

 

Nityananda: Milk.

 

PRABHUPADA: Milk. (laughter) That is meant for calves? Those milk?

 

Nityananda: Yes.

 

PRABHUPADA: What is this?

 

Nityananda: The barn.

 

PRABHUPADA: No, this part.

 

Nityananda: Oh, that's the door. It fell off. These are orange trees here.

 

PRABHUPADA: Oh. How long it will take to grow?

 

Nityananda: Well, some down here already have a few oranges, but it will take a few years before they give a lot. They are very sweet kind. [break]

 

PRABHUPADA: So small still. They are growing. [break]

 

Nityananda: ...sugarcane here. [break]

 

PRABHUPADA: ...grow very high. [break] ...trees?

 

Nityananda: Pine trees.

 

Brahmananda: You can use those for making the cabins, cottages?

 

Nityananda: Yes. [break]

 

PRABHUPADA: ...natural arrangement. Jungles-you cut the tree, make your home, and balance you make fuel. And the ground, plow and grow your food. That's all, natural.

 

Jagadisa: Everything.

 

PRABHUPADA: In India still, in the villages they do not know, other than this wood fuel, anything else. They are misusing these trees by cutting, manufacturing paper, heaps of paper, in each house throwing daily. They do not read, but they are supplied heaps of paper and cutting these trees. Simply waste. Now wood and paper shortage all over the world. It takes so much time to grow, and one day they cut hundreds of trees like this and put into the paper mill. And heaps of paper is given every house, and he throws away. Then you bring garbage tank. In this way, waste.

 

Nityananda: There are some beehives down here behind this building. I have twelve, and every year we can get hundreds of pounds of honey. Honey is very nice because it does not spoil, just like ghee. It can keep for many, many months, or a long time. We can go up here to see the cows if you like. Right now, they are milking them.

 

PRABHUPADA: So if we go, it will be disturbed?

 

Nityananda: Oh, no.

 

PRABHUPADA: This is one sugarcane each? No. Two, three?

 

Nityananda: Yes, at least three. People here in the country, they have lots of land, and they can grow the sugarcane very easily, but they will rather go to the store to buy the sugar.

 

PRABHUPADA: Because they want to live in the city. That is the... Here if they grow, then they will be engaged here. They cannot go to the city.

 

Brahmananda: They grow cash crops, make money, and then go spend it in the city.

 

Nityananda: The principal livelihood of our neighbors is to grow cows for slaughter.

 

PRABHUPADA: Yes. That is all over Western countries.

 

Nityananda: They don't have to work. They simply put some cows in their field, and when the price is high, they sell them. In this way they live.

 

Brahmananda: What is the attitude of the neighbors to us here? They like us?

 

Nityananda: Pretty friendly.

 

Brahmananda: There's a papaya.

 

PRABHUPADA: They grow nicely here?

 

Nityananda: Er, we're trying. I don't know yet.

 

Devotee (3): Would you like to be fanned, Srila Prabhupada?

 

Harikesa: Just keep the flies away.

 

PRABHUPADA: He is very friendly to the small calves, this child?

 

Nityananda: Yes. That's my boy.

 

PRABHUPADA: Oh.

 

Nityananda: His name is Vimala.

 

Jagadisa: He chases them all over.

 

PRABHUPADA: Just see. That is the difference between animal and man. A child can control so many calves. Krsna was doing that. One stick in the hand of a child can control fifty cows. The child is controller of many cows; a man is controller of many children. In this way, controller, controller, controller, over, over, over... When there is final controller that is Krsna. Isvarah paramah krsnah [bs. 5.1]. This is the definition of Krsna: "the final controller."

 

Nityananda: Here is the cows here. We can see them from here.

 

PRABHUPADA: Yes.

 

Nityananda: Inside the barn they are milking two at a time. And upstairs we keep all the hay.

 

Brahmananda: You keep figures on how much each milk per cow every day?

 

Nityananda: You hear it?

 

PRABHUPADA: Yes. Then how the milk will be utilized?

 

Nityananda: We make sweet rice and burfi, we take the cream to make butter and ghee, and all extra milk is made into curd. So it is all used. Thirty gallons a day.

 

PRABHUPADA: One gallon means 6 pounds?

 

Nityananda: Eight and a half.

 

PRABHUPADA: Eight and a half pounds. In Vrindaban, they get 1,000 pounds daily, New Vrindaban. What is that cottage?

 

Nityananda: That what?

 

Devotees: Cottage there.

 

Nityananda: That's a little house for the pump, water pump.

 

PRABHUPADA: This fencing was done before?

 

Nityananda: Before. This farm was once owned by a person who grew racehorses for racing and gambling.

 

PRABHUPADA: Racing is also gambling.

 

Brahmananda: How much did you pay for it?

 

Nityananda: The farm? 170,000. This field here is millet. It's a grass for the cows to eat. They give lots of milk because they eat this grass. Very nutritious.

 

PRABHUPADA: You are not producing for man?

 

Nityananda: Pardon?

 

PRABHUPADA: Any grains for man?

 

Nityananda: No, we're not growing any grains for man right now. We have fruit trees in the yard. Pears, peaches, plums, figs.

 

PRABHUPADA: Some growing?

 

Nityananda: Not very much. They are very young. We just planted them. In a few years, we will get lots of fruit.

 

PRABHUPADA: Here the land is mixed with some stones? No.

 

Nityananda: I think they put this here, this gravel.

 

PRABHUPADA: There is no mango tree here? No.

 

Nityananda: No what?

 

Brahmananda: Mango trees.

 

Nityananda: We have some growing at the house.

 

PRABHUPADA: Vegetables you are growing?

 

Nityananda: Yes. We have a garden across the street. All these big trees are pecan trees. We have twenty. All this land across the road here that is cleared is ours, all the way up to the trees.

 

PRABHUPADA: (reading sign?) "Cow protection and God consciousness. Visitors welcome." That's nice. So, which way we shall go now? Cow protection, they are surprised: "What is this nonsense, cow protection?" Huh? Do they say? "Cow is for eating, and you are protecting?" There are falls?(?)

 

Nityananda: Falls?(?) No. This is our small garden.

 

PRABHUPADA: Fruits and flowers. No, only fruits. What you are doing, flowers?

 

Nityananda: This is okra.

 

PRABHUPADA: Oh, okra.

 

Nityananda: And sweet potatoes. And we have eggplants, tomatoes, and peppers here.

 

PRABHUPADA: They give daily some fruits?

 

Nityananda: Yes. And then we grow potatoes too.

 

PRABHUPADA: Oh, where? Which side?

 

Nityananda: Well, the spring crop was already harvested. We have to plant the fall potatoes in a few weeks. We'll put them over there by the fence.

 

PRABHUPADA: So it is nice farm. This is squash?

 

Nityananda: That's a cantaloupe plant.

 

PRABHUPADA: Oh, cantaloupe. You can grow cantaloupe here?

 

Nityananda: Yes.

 

PRABHUPADA: And also watermelon?

 

Nityananda: Yes.

 

Jagadisa: There is one big watermelon on the vine up there. Perhaps it's ready to eat.

 

PRABHUPADA: We are getting similar land, 600 acres, in Hyderabad.

 

Nityananda: We can go this way, here. This is all our machinery here.

 

PRABHUPADA: Hm. So already some machine idle. You had to spend so much, but they are lying idle. That is not good. That is the defect of machine. If you cannot ply it, then it is dead loss.

 

Brahmananda: If you cannot what?

 

PRABHUPADA: It is dead loss if you cannot work with the machine.

 

Brahmananda: Yes, yes.

 

PRABHUPADA: But when you go to purchase, you have to pay lots of money. Now they will be rusty with water and gradually useless. How much money you have invested?

 

Nityananda: Thousands.

 

PRABHUPADA: Just see. This is the defect of machine. If you cannot utilize it, then it is dead loss.

 

Brahmananda: Where are the tractors kept?

 

Nityananda: One's at the house, and one's in the field.

 

PRABHUPADA: So they have to be utilized or rejected, these machines?

 

Nityananda: Yes, they all have a purpose. We use them from time to time.

 

PRABHUPADA: But now they are kept open and the...

 

Nityananda: Well, we are building a shed to keep them out of the rain.

 

PRABHUPADA: In the meantime it will be finished. By the time, you finish your shed, it is finished. Sastre sastre dal phariyaga.(?) "Some women were dressing to go to a fair, and when they were dressed, the fair was finished." (laughter) Utilize them. Otherwise, while they are in working order, sell them. Don't keep in that way, neglected way. Either utilize it or sell it at any cost. Otherwise, they are useless.

 

Devotee (4): Srila Prabhupada? A materialist or someone who wouldn't know, he may say that when the bull is not plowing, all he is doing is eating. You have to pay money to feed him grain or to grow grain to feed the bull.

 

PRABHUPADA: They will grow, and they will eat. Rather, they will help you for your eating. The father also eats, but he maintains the family. Therefore, the bull is considered as father and the cow as mother. Mother gives milk, and the bull grows food grains for man. Therefore, Caitanya Mahaprabhu first challenged that Kazi that "What is your religion, that you eat your father and mother?" Both the bulls and the cows are important because the bull will produce food grain and the cow will give supply milk. They should be utilized properly. That is human intelligence. This is filling up with paddy or...? No?

 

Nityananda: With food for the cows. This one has forage or fodder, and that one has grain.

 

PRABHUPADA: So everything is for the animals. Nothing for the man?

 

Nityananda: The cows give us milk.

 

PRABHUPADA: That's all? And you are not growing any food grains? Why?

 

Nityananda: Er... We've been trying to establish self-sufficient cow protection program first, to grow our own food for the cows.

 

Brahmananda: There is no land available for growing rice or wheat?

 

Nityananda: Yes, but the number of devotees we have to do it...

 

Brahmananda: But you have so many machines.

 

PRABHUPADA: All these machines require oiling and keeping nicely. Otherwise, it will spoil.

 

Devotees in distance: All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

 

PRABHUPADA: Jaya. Hare Krsna. They are starting?

 

Brahmananda: They are starting back.

 

Nityananda: Down the road we have fifteen acres of sorghum, grain for the cows.

 

PRABHUPADA: And everything for the cows, but what for the man? They will give everything for cows because they will eat cows, other farmers. But you utilize the animals for growing your food.

 

Brahmananda: The idea is we should maintain the animals, but then the animals should provide foodstuffs for the men.

 

PRABHUPADA: Yes.

 

Brahmananda: And that way there is cooperation.

 

PRABHUPADA: Yes. The animals, bulls, should have helped in spite of that... instead of that machine. Then it is properly utilized. And others, they cannot utilize these animals. Therefore, what they will do? Naturally, they will send to slaughterhouse. But we are not going to send to the slaughterhouse. Then what we will do? They must be utilized. Otherwise simply for growing food that the cows and bulls we engage ourself? You are already feeling burden because there are so many bull calves. You were asking me, "What we shall do with so many bulls?" Nityananda: Well, when they grow up we will train them as oxen.

 

PRABHUPADA: No, what the oxen will do?

 

Nityananda: Plow the fields.

 

PRABHUPADA: Yes. That is wanted. Transport, plowing fields. That is wanted. And unless our men are trained up, Krsna conscious, they will think, "What is the use of taking care of the plows (cows)? Better go to the city, earn money and eat them." Which one? Huh? That? We shall get on?

 

Brahmananda: Yes. (end)

 

[krsna]

"Soul's Constitutional Position"

66/03/28 New York, Bhagavad-gita 2.46-47

 

Perhaps you know. There is a proverb in English that "Proprietorship turns sand into gold." A person working on his own account, oh, he can turn sand into gold, but a person working for others' account, oh, that is not possible. He will be slow. He will be slow because the purpose is that "Why shall I work so hard? It will be enjoyed..." Just like our business friend was speaking to me that "Why shall we work so hard and make huge profit that...? The whole thing will be taken by the government."

[Kulapavana]

that is why ISKCON farms are such a failure... I have been around them for 25 years. such kibutz (or kolhoz for you east europeans) are not Vedic and contradict the natural varnashrama system. they might have been unavoidable during the initial stage of the movement, but now need to be transformed with mostly private ownership/life lease arrangement.