Swaminarayan was god supreme

[Guest guest]

Hahahaha. These people have no clue. I could make my own sastra and call it the gujukemchomajamacho and say a bunch of things but that doesnt make them legit. The bagavatam is the amala purana compiled by vyasa dev and swaminarayan or sai baba or any person that you think is god mentioned there.

 

 

There is nothing to laugh and there's no need to compare Lord SwamiNarayan to Sai Baba.He is the Avatari and the Creator of infinite Brahmands.Infinite Brahmas,Vishnus and Shivas stay with in his Commands,Thats why they are Worshipped.

 

[Guest guest]

Swaminarayan's philosophy:

 

He is Krshna and Krshna is Swaminarayan : same thing. No one is higher than the other because they are the same, one and onyl God.

 

Pramkuh Swami - just a regular saffron clothed sadhu. Not God. Not incarnation of God. Not Akshar neither incarnation of Brahm. The BAPS philosophy has adulterated Lord Swaminarayan's teachings and it is completely man-made to encourage human worship. Has nothing to do with Swaminararayan in reality.

[Guest guest]

shikshapatri verse 108, krishna is source of all incarnations.

 

[Nilkanth]

You are refered Sikshapatri slok 108 then go and read Slok 203 which states If you Want to know more about this Sampraday read their scriptures, which is manly Vachanamrut, Bhaktachintamani, satsangijivan, Harililamrut, Purushotam Prakash ect.

 

Now When i say know your Basis, meaning In Vachanamrut Shriji Maharaj Have asked questions, Answered Quetions, In This Scripture You will see its not only verses but its with day/time/place/how many people were there. In some Vachanamrut you will see some vedanti/purani/sashtri had asked questioned or shriji maharaj asked or answered question, but only with Pramanbhut Shashtra such as Gita,bhagvat, smruti,puran....any discusion made or answerd base on resources. The Most valuable resources alloewed were made by VedVyasji. Now You need to know In Bhagwan Swaminarayan's time who were followers. How did he became head of this Sampraday. Where this Sampraday's origin at? During Bhagwan Swaminarayan, there were more then 2 million followers, 500 paramhans along with around 2000 sadhus were followed him and accepted him as Supreme Lord. Now Question is why these many people were followed him in swaminaranay sampraday.

 

Shikhapatri is How to follow Niyam-Dharma(AcharSanhita) More details are in other scriptures listed above. If you wants to know reality then may have read atleast one of them.

 

[Nilkanth]

Reply to this:

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Pramkuh Swami - just a regular saffron clothed sadhu. Not God. Not incarnation of God. Not Akshar neither incarnation of Brahm. The BAPS philosophy has adulterated Lord Swaminarayan's teachings and it is completely man-made to encourage human worship. Has nothing to do with Swaminararayan in reality.

----------------------

Swaminarayan Philosophy tell me how its has adulterated

http://swaminarayan.org/philosophy/index.htm

http://swaminarayan.org/philosophy/precepts/index.htm

http://swaminarayan.org/philosophy/discipline/index.htm

 

Once one reporter asked P.P.Pramukh Swami that what are you? he replied i'm god's servent. Which is very true, he serves god 24/7, He is Guru for all BAPS follower...but not god.

Do You read vachnamrut the read verse Gadhada Section I 27, 37, 54, 68.

also read Vartal 4, 11, Kariyani 12

You will Get Your answer.

 

This Are Shiji Maharaj's Word

 

[harekrishnadas]

Hare Krishna !!!

 

Please pardon my ignorance about the Swami Narayan sampraday. I had one question - Do the Swami Narayan followers believe GOD has a form ? If Yes - What do they believe is GOD's original from ?

 

OR

 

Do they believe belive GOD is formless and takes on a form or avtaar like Shri Krishna ?

 

Hoping you understood my question - and please I don't mean any offence - pardon me if I have mistakenly committed any.

 

Thanks for your time.

 

Haribol !!

[Nilkanth]

Parabrahman or Purushottam is the highest reality, the supreme Godhead, one and unique. He is, at once, transcendent to everything and immanent in everything. He is the concrete reality with divine form and perfect personality who is the controller and supporter of everything. Jiva, Ishwar, Maya and Aksharbrahman constitute the body of Parabrahman who is their soul. And Lord Swaminarayan Himself is Parabrahman or Purushottam.

 

Jai Swaminarayan

[Nilkanth]

Is Atman the Ultimate Reality?

No. Beyond Atman is Paramatman.

Paramatman is the All-doer, One and

Unique. Is Paramatman with a form or

formless?

 

'God is Sakar, forever with a form.

God is full of Divinity, free from all Evil and

the reservoir of all Bliss.

He is extremely radiant, extremely

pleasant, extremely glorious and Divine....'

The Lord's Divine Abode - Akshardham is

Conscious and Divine Light. And the God

residing at the centre of the Light is Me.

I am Paramatman - The God Supreme

 

 

Revealing the purpose of God's incarnation

upon the earth, Lord Swaminarayan

explains: 'God incarnates Himself to fulfil

the loving desires of His beloved devotees.

And with it, He redeems countless souls

and establishes Dharma - Righteousness.'

 

http://www.swaminarayan.org/lordswaminarayan/biography/9.htm

[Pankaja_Dasa]

 

 

Swami--Guru

Narayana--God

 

That is why you chant Swami Narayana right?

 

So if I go to somebody called Govinda {a guru} and he says to me chant Swami Govinda Swami Govinda, then what will I do? I want to know where this Mantra is mentioned in Vedas or Upanishad/Purana etc etc. Is it not?

 

I know in London they have a very big temple of Radha-Krishna. So I don't see why you don't specifically chant Hare Krishna. Isn't it in Vaishnava Sampradaya they invoke both. In this age situation is so bad, I don't see how not calling upon Sri Radha you will get anywhere fast.

 

I heard once my own Auntie say Swami-Narayana is 1000 times better that Krishna. I wasn't really hearing what she was saying but I did laugh {natural reaction to hearing something funny}. I think maybe you have mixed up devotees with God worship devotees is 1000 times better than worship God, becuase that pleases God. I respect Pramukh Swami Maharaja also. You should follow what he says not make things up.

 

 

[Nilkanth]

You will Find More Details on this Link

 

http://www.swaminarayan.org/philosophy/precepts/index.htm

 

A few days after Ramanand Swami's departure, Sahajanand Swami introduced the 'Swaminarayan' mantra. When followers chanted it they experienced samadhi. samadhi resulted only after mastering Ashtang Yoga. Yet through His grace, people entered samadhi, in which they experienced divine bliss and the vision of the deity they worshipped. Henceforth He came to be known as "Swaminarayan".

 

The essence of His teachings emphasized worshipping the Lord Purushottam by transcending the three bodies (gross, subtle and causal) and identifying one's Atma with Brahman (Aksharbrahman) (Shikshapatri 116). This would lead to moksha - ultimate salvation. He further stipulated that the manifest form of Aksharbrahman, also known as the God-realised sadhu, was the gateway to moksha and God-realization (Gadhada I.54), echoing the injunction of the Shrimad Bhagvatam(3/29/20). For this the devotee needed to develop profound love for such a sadhu (Vadtal 11).

[Pankaja_Dasa]

 

 

Still doesn't explain why you say Swami Narayana is God. From the above it say Sahajanand Swami introduced the 'Swaminarayan' mantra.

[Nilkanth]

How Do U Believe Lord Krishna Is God.

Same Way We Believe Lord Swaminarayan is Supreme God.

 

Above this i answered Question About Swami-Narayan Meaning You asked Why we chant that and How Do We worship The Supreme God As a Swaminarayan Follower.

 

The greatness of Divine Incarnations,remains beyond the reach of the intellect.

Their words about themselves alone

reveal their Divinity.

Just as Lord Rama reveals Himself in the Ramayan and Lord Krishna in the Geeta, Lord Swaminarayan reveals His divine attributes in the Vachanamrit.

 

 

To understand the Divine Personality of Lord Swaminarayan, let us behold His Personality through His own words.

What was the state of His mind? His vision of Atman? His concept of Paramatman?

 

[Nilkanth]

Thereupon Shriji Mahãrãj said to the muni-mandal and the devotees, “Everyone please listen to what I have to say. One should first develop a firm conviction of the form of God. What is God like? Well, He, by His own wish, takes birth for the liberation of the jivas. Yet having taken birth, He is still beyond birth. Despite having to die, God is still beyond aging and death. He is also ‘niranjan’, that is to say, He has no blemish of mãyã. In addition, He possesses a definite form and is self-radiant; He is Parabrahma, antaryãmi, the supporter of countless millions of brahmãnds; and He also transcends Akshar. His assuming and discarding of a human body is merely an illusion – like the magic of a wizard. Furthermore, He is the controller of the countless muktas, including Akshar. He is also the lord of all. That Shri Purushottam Nãrãyan, after first taking birth from Dharmadev and Murti, performs austerities in Badrikãshram in the form of Narnãrãyan.

 

“That same Shri Narnãrãyan assumes the forms of Matsya, Kurma, Varãh, Vãman, Rãm, Krishna, etc., on earth for the fulfillment of particular tasks. There, using his own body, he helps other people eradicate their belief of being the body and accept the belief of being the form of Brahma. In this way, he makes his body and the bodies of other people appear to be the same…”

 

[Amdãvãd-4]

 

This Is Quatation From Vachanamrut

Vachanamritam

From 1819 to 1829, Bhagwan Swaminarayan's sermons to the Paramhansas and devotees were systematically recorded in prose form. The compilers comprised of four senior and learned Paramhansas: Gopalanand, Muktanand, Nityanand and Shukanand.

From a collection of over two thousand dialogues, they selected two hundred and sixty two and compiled these as the Vachanamritam - the nectar of His words. Each dialogue includes a reference to the place, date, time, a vivid description of Bhagwan Swaminarayan's attire and the names of the participants.

A scholar, P.B. Vidyarthi, has observed: 'In fact, it is reckoned as one of the most edifying sacred texts, every word of which is packed with profound wisdom enshrined in the traditional Indian literature, like the Upanishads, the Gita, the Mahabharat, the Ramayan and the Pancharatra.'2

The compiled text, read and approved by Bhagwan Swaminarayan, renders it a unique authenticity among Hinduism's many sacred texts.

 

[Pankaja_Dasa]

 

Before you said he gave mantra to everybody. Far as I know only Guru does this. So are you saying He is hidden Incarnation. Also sometimes God empowers living entities i.e Lord Buddha to preach. So I think maybe this could be the case. What do you say? Also you can't compare Lord Swaminarayana to Krishna. In the sense that Krishna is orginal personality of godhead. Lord Brahma whom you mentioned before I think says this. Also we can trace back our Sampradaya to Lord Krishna 5000 years ago. I would like to see same for you.

 

regards Pankaja

[harekrishnadas]

Hare Krishna !!!

 

Neelkanth Prabhu, Thank you for taking the time to answer my query.

 

Neelkanth Prabhu you wrote earlier : “Parabrahman or Purushottam is the highest reality, the supreme Godhead, one and unique. He is, at once, transcendent to everything and immanent in everything. He is the concrete reality with divine form and perfect personality who is the controller and supporter of everything. Jiva, Ishwar, Maya and Aksharbrahman constitute the body of Parabrahman who is their soul. And Lord Swaminarayan Himself is Parabrahman or Purushottam. “

 

Neelkanth Prabhu then you wrote : “That Shri Purushottam Nãrãyan, after first taking birth from Dharmadev and Murti, performs austerities in Badrikãshram in the form of Narnãrãyan.

“That same Shri Narnãrãyan assumes the forms of Matsya, Kurma, Varãh, Vãman, Rãm, Krishna, etc., on earth for the fulfillment of particular tasks.”

 

So if I put your above 2 statements together - You believe that Lord Swaminarayan Himself is Parabrahman or Purushottam. That Shri Purushottam Nãrãyan, after first taking birth from Dharmadev and Murti, performs austerities in Badrikãshram in the form of Narnãrãyan. That same Shri Narnãrãyan assumes the forms of Matsya, Kurma, Varãh, Vãman, Rãm, Krishna, etc., on earth for the fulfillment of particular tasks.”

 

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In short you as the followers of Swami Narayan sampraday believe Lord Swami Narayan is Purushottam Narayan and that HE takes the form of Matsya, Kurma, Varaha, Vaman, Ram, Krishna etc…

 

Did I understand you correctly ?

 

 

Let me ask you a few simple questions – and I would like to know the answers according to the Swami Narayan sampraday

 

1) Is Lord Krishna any special compared to others avataars ?

 

2) Do you understand the full meaning of this verse krsnas tu bhagavan svayam (Srimad Bhagavatam Canto 1 chapter 2 verse 28).

 

3) Why do you think in the Srimad Bhagavatam Srila Vyasadeva gave a very indepth coverage to the Lord Krishna's lilas compared to other avtaars ?

 

 

4) You wrote “….This would lead to moksha - ultimate salvation. “ What do Swami Narayan followers believe happens when one attains moksha ?

 

One other follower of the Swami Narayan Sampraday in a different posting said this : “God (Parbrahm) is both Nirgun and Sagun. He has a definite divine Sakaar form and resides within his abode along with the redeemed souls who are merged into the bliss of Brahm (Supreme light which may also be called Chidakash and is the body of God just like the souls are)!”

 

Just wanted to confirm that you too believe in moksha as merging into the Supreme…

 

I appreciate your time in letting me become more aware about the Swami Narayan sampraday..

 

Haribol !!!

 

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[Guest guest]

Hope this message isnt taken the wrong way, but would like to show the strangeness and risk of following someone as the highest(even higher than krishna and vishnu) without scriptual athority.

 

As we know our sences are imperfect as well as our intelligence. Therefore we take guidance of higher athority like the vedas and puranas as first and foremost as this has been revealed by god himself.

 

The scriptures are written for kaliyuga, they were divided for the population of kaliyuga.

 

The puranas state especially srimad bhagvatam that there will be many people who will claim to be gurus and gods. we should be wary.

 

It doesnt matter if they have 2million followers or 20million like sai baba has, his followers also talk about miracles he done and trances and meditation, im sure his cult will survive many years.

 

We therefore should look through the eyes of scripture and not our sentiment. Also do not look to scripture to back your own theories up but follow scripture as it states.

 

The bahgvata purana is mentioned as the cream of the vedas, it is also one of the 6 books swaminarayan in the shikshpatri said to read.

 

The bhagvatam states worship krishna (or any athorised form of vishnu)

The Gurada prurana clearly states that worship of krishna is the only way in kaliyuga. The matsya purana talks about the 6 satvic puranas the 6 tamasic and the 6 in the mode of passion, all the satvic puranas tell us to worship krishna.

 

The mahamantra is clearly mentioned in the purans and upanishads to be chanted. Mantras chanted that are not athorised in scripture are condemed.

 

All im saying is that we know the puranas and vedas are givin specifically for kaliyuga due to our small intelligence it has warned us to be careful of so-called incarnations and given us the athorised mantras.

 

Now why take the risk of spirtual suicide by worshipping someone who may not be god (as condemed by gita and bhagvatam). if he is not god you are taking a big risk by worshipping him and chanting his mantra as you cannot be sure. (Lack of scriptual evidence on the matter if any)

The scriptures are screaming to us to follow krishna or any of the incarnations of vishnu that are clearly mentioned. Y not do that? Its the safest way right? especially in this age of confusion?

Y not take scripture at face value instead of trying to find ways to justify our sentiment to someone/some process we believe in.

 

Anyway this probably will not have any effect but hopefully krishna will see the endeavour.

 

Please forgive any offences.

 

Vijay

 

[Guest guest]

Why dont you understand,

 

Sri Krishna is accpeted as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, by so many scriptures and so many Acaharya's of so many sampradayas who are of imppecable character.(Shankaracharya, Ramanujacharya, Vishnu swami, Nimbarkacahrya, Sri Krishna Chaitanya, Vallabhacarya, and others)

 

Moreover Shiva in padma purana(authentic vedic scripture accross board), also accepts the same.

 

Why do you not understand this simple fact?

 

After liberation a devotee of Krishna will enjoy so many rasa's with the lord's eternal pastimes some of which are described in the srimad bhagavatam.

 

Have you(swami narayans) even a unified concept of what is liberation and what happens to Jiva after that.

 

please worship Radha- Govinda , Seeta Rama, Laxmi narayan, Narashiga dev, but do not concont a mere human to be God, or you will be cheated of this precious life of max 60 - 70 years.

[Guest guest]

Just to reiterate:

 

Real and original Swaminarayan Sampradaya does NOT condone the worship of human beings such as Pramukh Swami...the quotes that BAPS followers give from Vachanamrut mention Sadhus in general and not Gunatitanand or any other Sadhu in particular...an extremely flawed notion propagated to break away from the real and original Swaminarayan sect as established by Swaminarayan HIMSELF..

 

There lie many insecurities in the way the Hare Krshna people here have repeatedly attacked, not just here, but on other forums AND at university talks AND in other forms of media the validity of the Swaminarayan sect.

When I talk of the Swaminarayan sect I EXCLUDE BAPS as that is something completely different...more a cult.

 

The amount of times I have received emails from Krshna devotees trying to make me see the light that I should be worshipping Krshna and not Swaminarayan.

Aside the Vedic evidence and proof, the internal satisfaction, experience of divine spiritual content from meditating on the form of Sahajanand Swami, Harikrshna Maharaj, Ghanshyam Maharaj etc in incomparable...first try defeat that effect.

 

All the discussions I have had with ISKCON people, they continuously fail to register the fact that Swaminarayan openly declared Himself 'Pratyakha Shree Krshna' or Krshna returned. Therefore, wherever Shree Krshna is mentioned, as for instance in the Shikshapatri, it is referring to Sahajand Swami Himself. Let's not forget, one of Swaminarayan's birth names was indeed 'Krshna'.

 

Bhagavatam mentions 'Krshnastu Bhagavana Svayam' yet lists Shree Vasudev Krshna as an avatara. No contradiction here though because the Source of all incarnations, call Him Narayan Or Purushottam is eternally known as Krshna aswell - long before Vasudev Krshna was on this planet.

 

However, it appears that there remains insecurity within the minds of many Hare Krshnas towards their own faith resulting in the constant, and I mean CONSTANT, challenging of the Swaminarayan faith. Maybe theres a bit of 'green' among them but grow up and learn to overcome this 'your God my God, your faith, my faith' business

 

[Pankaja_Dasa]

 

 

so chant hare krsna whats your problem eh?

[Guest guest]

No 'problem' but

Hare Krshna is a mantra propagated by Chaityanya

 

"Swaminarayan" is the mahamantra propagated by Lord Sahajanand Swami. In substitution of that there is the ashtakshara mantra

Krshna t**m gatira m***

in the Swaminarayan faith...but not hare krshna.

 

 

 

 

 

[vijay]

"There lie many insecurities in the way the Hare Krshna people here have repeatedly attacked, not just here, but on other forums AND at university talks AND in other forms of media the validity of the Swaminarayan sect.

When I talk of the Swaminarayan sect I EXCLUDE BAPS as that is something completely different...more a cult."

 

Its not an insecurity, when we give a talk it is based on scripture, in the bhagvat gita krishna says the less intelligent follow worship the demigods we repeat that. The vedas were written for kaliyuga souls we repeat that, in kaliyuga many so called 'gods' will appear, that are not authorised by scripture we repeat that. In kaliyuga the names and worship of krishna and his stated incarnations (krishna that appeared 5000 years ago) are the only way to attain krishna. If someone says some god appeared 200 years ago and they say he is "higher (avtari) than krishna then the burden is on them to give vedic evidence, all throughout the vedas the chanting of krishnas name is mentioned not this other mantra, so of course at our talks we will state that.

 

"Therefore, wherever Shree Krshna is mentioned, as for instance in the Shikshapatri, it is referring to Sahajand Swami Himself. Let's not forget, one of Swaminarayan's birth names was indeed 'Krshna'."

 

The first verse states that i worship radha and krishna who reside in glokaka vrindavan, that is refering to original krishna not himself swaminaryan resides in aksardham (not mentioned in scripture), i have no idea what methodology you use to come to a conclusion that the siksapatri is talking about swaminarayan sometime and sometimes krishna. He states in verse 108 that krishna is the source of all incarnations, what do you interpret this as?

 

"However, it appears that there remains insecurity within the minds of many Hare Krshnas towards their own faith resulting in the constant, and I mean CONSTANT, challenging of the Swaminarayan faith. Maybe theres a bit of 'green' among them but grow up and learn to overcome this 'your God my God, your faith, my faith' business"

 

We challenge anyone who claims that a man is higher than krishna without giving evidence for it, we challenge anyone who says that "actually the swaminarayan mantra is the highest even though it is not mentioned in scripture" The scriptures say the only way to become liberated in kaliyuga is chant the names of krishna, using the mantras mentioned in scripture. We have limitied sences and intelligence especially in kaliyuga, its easy to become cheated so let us follow simply whats in scripture, your risk, if you think what you have even though contridicting veda which is written for us is the truth.

 

"grow up and learn to overcome this 'your God my God, your faith, my faith' business"

 

Krishna in the gita didnt say any god or any faith and worship are equal, he said theres faith in mode of ignorance,passion and goodness. Worship a man you become a man, worship a ghost you go to a ghost, worship demigods you go to demigods, worship him you go to his abode where you never have to return. so he made distinctions between faiths and differing 'gods', whats your problem if we repeat the words of gita at our talks. In an age where people dismiss the scriptures ment for us where the people have limited intelligence it has to be drilled in. I dont care if you worship ram chant his matra, narayan, or any other bonifide incarnation, at least we are sure they are god, why take the risk worshipping anyone else when we know these to be god already.

 

 

 

 

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna

 

 

No 'problem' but

Hare Krshna is a mantra propagated by Chaityanya

 

"Swaminarayan" is the mahamantra propagated by Lord Sahajanand Swami. In substitution of that there is the ashtakshara mantra

Krshna t**m gatira m***

in the Swaminarayan faith...but not hare krshna.

 

 

 

Yes, the Hare Krishna mahamantra is propagated by Lord Chaitanya which is mentioned in the Vedic texts including Kali-Santarana Upanishad, Brahmanda Purana, Brahma Yamala, Ananta Samhita, Sanata Kumar Samhita etc. and also referred to in Padma Purana. It is coming from Lord Brahma (originally from Lord Narayana) in the Brahma-Madhva gaudiya sampradaya. In places this has been called the confidential mantra but Lord Chaitanya gave it to one and all and by His grace this has now been propagated far and wide. Because no one can create mantras, which can only come from the Supreme Lord, hence this objection. If you can provide a reference to this in any of the Vedic texts no one will have an objection.

The ashtakshara mantra of Sri Krishna is definitely accepted and no one would have an objection if the followers of SwamiNarayana would be following the Shikshapatri instead of giving convoluted arguments like:

-- the Krishna referred to in Shikshapatri is Swaminarayana (this is nonsense; in Bhagavad Gita the Lord always refers to Himself in First Person -- so the Lord refers to Himself in First Person and not in third Person open to all kinds of speculations; even if this be the case by a stretch of imagination better follow the instructions which by your belief are coming from the Supreme Lord and so are beyond errors, than create any number of interpretations)

-- Swaminarayana is the avataarii and all others are avataars (need unambiguous Vedic evidence for such a claim)

 

Please note that this is independent of whether or not Sahajananda Swami is an incarnation of Supreme Lord.

[DILL]

Jai Swminarayan, Jai Shree Krishna

Yes, I have taken this message in the wrong way, it is the only way it can be taken. You are using such harsh worlds such as spiritual sucide, indirectly to the Swaminarayan sampradhy. Whar right do you have (*Vijay) to express your opinion in such a such a nature.

You mayby a follower of Lord krishna, even i have SOME reverence for him but this does not mean the every Hindu IN THE WORLD HAS TO WORSHIP kRISHNA- what are you talking about.

And to your your indirect reference that Bhagvan Swminarayan having no spiritual authority- in the Bhagvat Gita, Lord Keishna states that he lives within Purna Purshottam- This is Lord Swaminarayan.

Faith in one paticular God i no beter than the other-Always remember this and frome now- never post such negative comments

[Pankaja_Dasa]

 

I find it odd, that they only quote from one scripture. Where as we have Gita/Bhagavatam. Where Krishna is mentioned on everypage. Even Chaitanya Caritamrta holds Krishna as Supreme. Anyway I liked your post above

[sumedh]

Hare Krishna and dandavats

 

Being a devotee of SwamiNarayana it may be sounding harsh to you, but please read carefully what vijay prabhuji posted. He said that there is a definite "risk" in worshipping SwamiNarayana (if say only the followers made him God) rather than that which is accepted by all acharyas. Nowadays, we are seeing this phenomenon of gods popping all over the place. The main objection is that the followers of SwamiNarayana are violating his own instructions in Shikshapatri which asks them to worship only Krishna; in addition apparently they are not considering the standard Vedic texts, instead only Vachanamruta etc. The philosophy cannot be changed at all from that of the standard Vedic one, and that is what the current followers of the sampradaya are doing -- please correct this if i am wrong.