everydays life in vaikntha, do they eat sleep etc?

[Guest guest]

then if that is so great experience maybe some higher jivas also want to experience it. I mean for example fishes, animals etc. Maybe fish also wants to be chewed by Sri Krishna?

 

But in material world these things are associated with killing and stopping of material existence. Like when you cook and eat a patato it will not grow anymore. The jiva inbodied in the patato body will have to be transported to another suitable body according to its karma. This is clear to me. What happens in such a circumstances in spritual world where the body and the soul are same thing and where is no karma nor body change?

[Kulapavana]

let me first say that I'm not at all qualified to explain the lilas Lord Krishna manifests for us conditioned souls.

 

and Krishna lilas are never material, but some take place in the dhama visible from our side, and yes, there are elements in them which occur only under these conditions. It is said that some eternally liberated souls take birth here on Earth just to be able to participate in these special events. you need to ask more advanced devotees for the reasons and explanations.

 

I do not try to understand the lilas - I merely wonder at their special nature and enjoy their sweetness.

[Guest guest]

duryodhana, shishupala, shakuni, all the asuras like bakasura, kaliya etc are they all pure devotees? How could they see Krishna?

..demons are generally devotees pleasing krsna with fighting

 

still I dont understand how Arjuna, Yasoda and other exalted devotees had left this world?

..they are eternally performing krsna pastimes... we do not see them because we are blinded by maya

[Guest guest]

Why then you tell that some of His lilas are only manifested in the material world?

 

---when there's krsna, there's no material world... when he walks in the earth every atom and cell under his feet come back to their constitutional positions as his parts and parcels inhabitants of vaikunta

[Guest guest]

what about kamsa? he has killed all other children of Vasudeva and Devaki, he made them so much troubles, he was about to kill Krishna, he just before his death was so much troubled by differnt signs, is he devotee too?

 

What about shishupala? he was slain by Sri Krishna and it was visible that the soul came out of the dead body and entered Sri Krishna's body, but devotees never have liberation like that so is shishupala devotee too?

[Guest guest]

So can Sri Krishna fight demons in original Goloka or He has to come down here, manifest spiritual world on Earth and only then He can show lilas with the demons. Doesnt sound logical to me..

[Guest guest]

Please tell me where can I find bona-fide vaishnavas qualified to explain me these thins?

[Kulapavana]

there are many qualified Vaishnavas that can explain these lilas to you - both in person, and from the pages of their books. Srila Prabhupada and Srila B.R. Sridhara Maharaja are my personal favourites for books or lectures. You can approach some of their senior disciples for in-person direct explanations and instructions. And there are many more others.

[Guest guest]

 

have read somewhere in the scriptures that Goloka is so opulent that there is no need in this material world at all. Sri Krishna can have everything in His world, He doesnt need maha maya for His lilas. Why then you tell that some of His lilas are only manifested in the material world?

 

 

 

If Krishna did not manifest His lilas in this material world, how will we come to know of Him? It is *only* because of His kindness to us fallen, that He manifests His lilas from one material universe to another. Otherwise, it stands to reason, why would God need the material world to satisfy Himself??!!! Infact, Krishna takes pleasure only in His spiritual potency; and maya, the material energy, cannot stand in front of Him. Thus to attract the material people to Him, He manifests His lilas in the material world.

[Guest guest]

 

then if that is so great experience maybe some higher jivas also want to experience it. I mean for example fishes, animals etc. Maybe fish also wants to be chewed by Sri Krishna?

 

 

 

I guess, we should respect Krishna's dietary preferences!!!

 

 

What happens in such a circumstances in spritual world where the body and the soul are same thing and where is no karma nor body change?

 

 

 

Maybe, when Krishna is sleeping, the potato will take a human form and come out of Krishna's body, massage Krishna's legs for a while and play with Him for the next few days and then again become a potato to get the pleasure of being eaten by Krishna.

[Kulapavana]

just read the lilas described in Srimad Bhagavatam and try to understand THAT first /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Guest guest]

I agree that all our previous acaryas are wonderfull. But these days I have a problem looking for bona fide Vaisnava. I suppose you have heard about ritviks, ISKCON/GBC, different gaudiya mathas, etc. There are some serious contradictions among them like "origin of the jiva" (fall/no fall from vaikuntha theory), ritviks deny that there is any guru after Srila Prabhupada, GBC is not very friendly to any other vaisnava organisation like mission of Narayana Maharaja, somewhere else I heard that Narayana Maharaja had a quarell with Srila Sridhara Maharaja etc etc

 

I just scare to surrender to not bonafide person. I am just seeking for the Truth.

 

I will be very gratefull if you can advise me where I can find bonafide Vaisna who will be willing to give me instructions via internet (I am from Ukraine, its difficult to get out from this country).

 

Anyway thank you /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Guest guest]

 

duryodhana, shishupala, shakuni, all the asuras like bakasura, kaliya etc are they all pure devotees? How could they see Krishna?

..demons are generally devotees pleasing krsna with fighting

 

 

 

Some of them like Shishupala and Dantavakra are pure devotees - Jaya and Vijaya who were cursed by the chatu-sanahs to go to the material world. Vishnu gave them a choice of 7 pious lives or 3 demon lives. Jaya and Vijaya chose 3 demon lives because they wanted to come back to Vishnu as quickly as possible.

 

Anyway, all other demons too were blessed that they were touched by Krishna. Baladeva Vidyabhushana writes in Govinda Bhashya that Kamsa in his end moment realized His spiritual form and went to the spiritual world.

 

Merely seeing Krishna in material world is not sufficient. Because that realization or sight of Krishna which awards liberation is hidden by yoga maya. nAham sarvasya prabhavo yoga mAyA samAvrtAH. One has to be awarded "spiritually potent" darshan and only this can break the knot tying us to the material world.

[vanamali]

It is a problem. I am very troubled by quarrels among people that are supposed to be a guiding force. Basically I only attend the Hindu temple because I don't find any arguing there. I also attend satsang only there. It seems like people have many different viewpoints, but it doesn't seem to bother them, and they don't fight amongst themselves. No one is interested in "changing other peoples minds" or "brining them to the truth." People just live their lives. I like to be left alone, frankly, and have some inner peace. I find it quite anti-conductive to bhakti to become involved or basically come in contact with people who fight over God or base their faith on raw intellectualism.

 

I'm not saying that you should do this, but that's what worked for me. Anyway, hope I didn't offend anyone.

 

My guru is also my husband. Be careful when choosing a guru, but I hope you find him soon!

 

Sorry for that /images/graemlins/smile.gif Good luck!

 

~vanamali

[Guest guest]

To read Srimad Bhagavatam I need a motivation, I need feeling that all this is real, I need to fill the gaps in my knowledge of the spiritual world first, because if I feel emptyness inside I cant proceed to read, follow the princyples, chnat japa etc. It just my personal way of being -- I need to know what I want to know then I can study all the rest. In this way I am developing my sraddha, faith.

[Guest guest]

You're lucky, you can go to hindu tamples, probably you live in India so you have all the chances to visit Vrindavana and other holly places.

 

Here I can only reach some spiritual guidance via internet.

 

 

[Kulapavana]

do not be confused by the bickering between different Vaishnava camps. you will find very sincere souls in all of them.

 

as to current Vaishnavas that can help you over the internet: I have a deep respect for Tripurari Maharaja and he also has a very good internet organization. Here are some links:

 

http://www.swami.org/sanga/

 

or email sangaeditor@swami.org

 

good luck to you prabhu! Hare Krishna!

 

[theist]

No one is suggesting that you don't ask questions. That in fact is a large part of the process. But try to refine your questions to those which are most pertinent.

 

Also when we say that some things are beyond our present ability to understand, that is for all of us and not just you. It's not that we know all the answers and consider you too inexperienced yet to learn.

 

We also have many unanswered questions. I can't tell you what life is like on other subtle material planets what to speak of the eternal spiritual ones.

 

I can understand you are looking for motivation and want to make sure of your next step. That is natural. Try this. Pray to the Lord in your heart to guide you too Him. You needn't be dismayed by all the various opinions professed by different vaisnava groups. You can surrender directly to the Lord in your own heart. He will guide you past all the static and reveal His voice and answer your questions.

 

For more motivation you might try easier to understand topics that may be more pressing.

 

Like the fact that you are being thrown from womb to tomb to another womb in a continous cycle of horrendous suffering. You don't want to experience old age and disease but they are being forced on you at every moment.

 

We don't even know who we are. That is the definition of one who is insane. We are all stuck in this embarassing condition.

 

Let us concentrate there first and these other interesting but not as pressing questions will be answered in time.

 

Before the child learns the higher principles of electrical energy he is first taught to keep his finger out of the socket.

 

This is all our positions presently.

 

 

[Kulapavana]

I understand your quest for knowledge as related to motivation to proceed further in this process of Krishna Consciousness. This takes time and patience as well as certain level of humility. And some subject matters are not even meant to be understood. Ultimately it is all based on your desires.

[ancient_paztriot]

How do you educate an insect about 'our' activities?

 

So we are all insects crawling on the Absolute. We speak much the same language.

 

A liberated spiritual master is what guest(s) need. But that's not likely to happen on this forum.

 

I think they should read Prabhupada's books and they'll know what we know. If they still don't have the devotion? Well, some things you just have to do for yourself.

 

Anyway, the volumes of literature they can read are considered unlimited. It's too much for us to understand in this lifetime.

 

AND compared to what else is available, it's full of rich detail. It's enough to carry you away.

[Guest guest]

I dont think that when you say something is beyond our understanding you mean only me /images/graemlins/smile.gif yes, certanly there are some things which in full cannot be understood by human material inteligence, but anyway there always is way how to present these matters in satisfying way.

 

I scare to pray to Sri Krishna in this way, I know He will take away all my material pleasures and that means I will suffer for a while. Yes maybe then some spiritual pleasures will come, but as far as I see it takes quite long time between day when you started to follow princyples/japa etc and the day when you feel pleasure in that.

 

>For more motivation you might try easier to understand topics that may be more pressing.

 

I cant answer why at the moment this is the most interesting topic to me. All the rest answers I know in satisfying for myself level. The topic about everydays life in Goloka/Vaikuntha I dont know at all, this is why I started to ask here.

 

>We don't even know who we are. That is the definition of one who is insane. We are all stuck in this embarassing condition.

 

I know who I am. I have learned it from Bhaktivinoda Thakura Maharaja -- "Jaiva Dharma" -- there are all the answers about who we are, how we came into this world and what to do to get out from here.

 

>Before the child learns the higher principles of electrical energy he is first taught to keep his finger out of the socket.

 

If the child is inteligent enough to ask what is electricity and why to keep fingers out of socket -- this child has already inteligence to hear appropriate answer.

I am this kind of child -- I need to know "why" and "what"

 

However I agree that lots of other children maybe not interested in this particular question at all, so this is all individual.

[Guest guest]

Thank you for advice, I will write an email to Maharaja.

[Guest guest]

If the insect has enough inteligence to ask me about my activities that means that he has capability to understand some sort of answer, maybe not in full but to the level which is satisfying for such an insect.

 

>A liberated spiritual master is what guest(s) need. But that's not likely to happen on this forum.

 

100% agree. Just the problem to recognize one in these days.. Yes I learn a lot from Srila Prabhupada and Bhaktivinoda Thankura Maharaja but I desperatedly need for present sandhu sanga. Here the problems come.. I cant understand why do they fight... I cant understand how it is possible that one of GBC(Jayadvaita swami) has changed books of Srila Prabhupada.. How is that possible?? Where to look for spiritual guidance in such a circumstances?

 

I will try to connect to Swami Tripurari as you've advised.

However after all I know about hidden ISKCON history about inner Gaudiya math quarrels I am pessimist in this.

 

I hope Sri Krishna loves me and will help me somehow.

[theist]

Hearing from Bhaktivinode that we are spiritsoul and accepting that mentally and realizing that you are spiritsoul may just be different things.

 

I am glad you raised Jaiva Dharma,which I haven't read in long time. In there somewhere the question is raised on the origin of the soul and the answer given was you will have to go there to understand.

 

This is similar.

[vanamali]

I don't live in India, and I've not yet visited Vrindavana. I live in the middle of "small town USA" in Kansas. /images/graemlins/smile.gif However the Hindu Temple in Kansas City is very nice.

 

/images/graemlins/smile.gif