Srila Prabhupada embodiment Lord Caitanya

[kailasa]

Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakur as partial embodiment Gadadhara Pandit operated in role Laksmi devi or Rukmini devi, blessing a material world. For devotees Krisna lila or for those who cultivates mood Krisna lila, Gadadhara Pandit it Radharani is direct, but real Srimati Radharani she is Lord Caitanya in Gaura lila.

 

Bhaktivinoda Thakur did not make comments on mood of separation, but only has referred on Svarupa Damodara in this connection, having told in Jaiva Dharma that this highest mood. The mood vipralambha as is present at Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakur, that as Srila Prabhupada much quotes, but as a whole, in doctrine Bhaktivinoda Thakur, it is not underlined, it is possible in connection with sermon Srila Bhaktivinoda babajis including. Bhaktivinoda Thakur as embodiment Laksmi devi, blesss all very generously.

 

Srila Bhaktisidhanta Sarasvati has presented an ideal of direct relations Krisna lila, including having specified on various sorts of deceivers and sahajiyas in the work " Prakrita rasa ". Srila Bhaktisidhanta Thakur left a body in mood vipralambha, that speaks about His spiritual priorities.

 

Srila Prabhupada, Bhaktivedanta Svami, has finished work of all sampradaya having given us sastra explaining and initiating us in this supreme mood Lord Caitanya. Actually since times Gosvamis and before Srila Prabhupada's arrival nobody preached this supreme mood Lord Caitanya so directly.

 

Madhavendra Puri the first who has shown this primary seed of pure fidelity was. Lord Caitanya "has developed" and has brought up a huge tree from small seed planted Srila Madhavendra Puri. This primary mood Madhavendra Puri also is essence of all Gaura lila.

 

Thus crowning a statement of a science of fidelity, Srila Prabhupada preaches this supreme mood Lord Caitanya - Gaura vani. Certainly, Srila Prabhupada operates as and in mood Lord Nityananda, but it is more external aspect or this mood which not so dominates. As Lord Nityananda, Lord Narayana, Srila Prabhupada will destroy all atheism together with impersonalism and sahajiism without problems, in this sense the spiritual master is assisted by everything, all spiritual world.

 

Srila Prabhupada training in the supreme mood Lord Caitanya, therefore did not welcome references to anothers acaryas sampradaya, in the certain context, for that what to learn the person to the highest understanding of a spiritual life. Precisely just as practice of direct relations Krisna lila He has named - " practice for neophytes ". In any case of what to understand or especially to practise direct relations, it is necessary to understand before it about what it is spoken in nine songs Srimad Bhagavatam. And how and proceeding from what motives has reached perfection Dhruva Maharaja, to understand what essence of pure fidelity Prahlada Maharaja ( Haridasa Thakura or in a similar example Jesus Christ ), to an embodiments of a nonviolence in a spiritual life and as to understand as servant Sri Hanuman serves the Lord perfect, to come nearer thus to world Dvaraka and Pandavas even more deeply to realize lectures Bhagavad Gita.

 

Mood Srila Madhavendra Puri - Lord Caitanya, is essence mahabhava - Srimati Radharani and Srila Prabhupada actually conducts the person on this level. Srila Prabhupada was in this mood mahabhava Lord Caitanya without doubts and as has shown attributes 21 hour ecstasies which showed Gosvamis Vrindavan.

 

This mood which is not known by anybody, except for three persons and is not present the fourth. The secret and essence Gaura lila as will be, that all approached devotee Lord Caitanya such as Srivasa Pandit, the head of all devotees Lord Caitanya, all of them, it is direct expansion Lord Caitanya. Therefore all of them, in a different degree it is possible, are in this mood. It perhaps the most maximum understanding of unity with God and most likely the highest degree of relations Lord - Gaura vani. The most secret. It is present in view of what Lord Caitanya has opened locks from all secrets and freely distributes most secrets things.

 

Srila Prabhupada has quite presented in the books all philosophy Gosvamis and as Bhaktivinoda Thakur and the spiritual master, the great acarya and the best well-wisher for all devotees Krisna lila - Srila Bhaktisidhanta Sarasvati Thakura!

 

This day has come - Srila Prabhupada, Bhaktivedanta Svami, Abhay Caran, thousand and thousand bows to Him has made all.

 

Besides that He has distributed this movement Lord Caitanya worldwide ( but meanwhile it only the beginning), He as initiated all in the most secret devoted service and the highest races of fidelity.

 

Srivasa Pandit one of those who least communicated with Lord Caitanya during this last period of a life Lord Caitanya - antya lila was. But He was one of those who understood Him most. Thus being in this mood Lord Caitanya in Kamarahatta, after "ending" of games Gaura lila, leaving this world, Srivasa Thakur has thrown last sight at a material world. And his this sight, this instant which has been stretched for 12 years of the sermon in the Western world, this experience and dialogue with Lord Caitanya also it is embodied in His books for us - books of His divine Grace Bhaktivedanta Svami Prabhupada.

 

For Srivasa Thakura Gaura lila here it is finished, but for us she only begins and in this sense, nevertheless, He always will be to be present here, with us.

 

Srila Prabhupada devotes us in various subtleties and essence of devoted service - bhakti and philosophies of fidelity - vedanta on what true, pure fidelity to the God is based.

 

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Vande'ham sri-guruh sri-yuta-pada-kamalam

[Guest guest]

the spiritual master is simply the shaktiavesha avatara, manifestation of the paramatma...

 

paramatma is krsna, krsna is radhe, krsna + radhe is chaitanya mahaprabhu, chaitanya is nityananda and pancha tattva and so on

 

a guru who is not like that, does not simply have to be called guru

 

so.. prabhupada is the only guru in the history.. or every pure guru is embodiment of lord chaitanya mahaprabhu

[kailasa]

Srila Prabhupada is avatara Lord Caitanya, ordinary guru not embodiment.

 

***paramatma is krsna, krsna is radhe, krsna + radhe is chaitanya mahaprabhu, chaitanya is nityananda and pancha tattva and so on

 

Needs stady sastra and lees see TV.

[Guest guest]

Needs stady sastra and lees see TV

 

if you say to me from wich shastra comes your treaty i will read it

 

(there's no ordinary guru.. guru is never ordinary)

[kailasa]

Atamatattva Prabhu has citation from Purana about Prabhupada, I am give citation from Biblie about Prabhupada.

 

needs read sastra for understanding - Bhagavad Gita as it is, Srimad Bhagavatam. First needs understand simple things, then go forever.

[Guest guest]

the problem is that you feel that in this way you are making a service to srila prabhupada.....

[kailasa]

Has three guru - kanistha, madhyama and uttama. Has kanistha-kanistha, kanistha-madhyama, madhyama-madhyama, madhyama-uttama. Madhyama-uttama it is VERY rare. If you guru kanistha-madhyama it is good.

 

Prabhupada is uttama-madhyama it is eternal liberated soul. Eternal preach in material world, He is embodiment Pancatattva. He is not ordinary guru and not ordinary acarya. He is maha acarya Lord Caitanya - general Lord Caitanya. Mood mahabhava with power Lord Nityanada.

 

It is begining this movement, after 2000 years world see Prabhupada in His full glory. /images/graemlins/smile.gif Lord Caitanya "come", He is not left this world, Gaura lila will be flow (?) in all world. Demigods come, it is golden age.

[kailasa]

***the problem is that you feel that in this way you are making a service to srila prabhupada.....

 

I am write truth any way. I am write arguments.

[Guest guest]

If you guru kanistha-madhyama it is good.

 

i think my guru is uttama, and the same i hope for yours.. otherwise why surrender to them?

 

prabhupada is not madyam/uttama... prabhupada is uttama adhikari ACTING (sometimes) as madyama adhikari with the purpose to teach

 

 

[kailasa]

***i think my guru is uttama,

 

It is dobtfull.

 

***and the same i hope for yours.. otherwise why surrender to them?

 

me guru live in Goloka. He is madhyama-madhyama, but follow true uttama acarya in this sense He is madhyama-uttama. I am know me spiritual nathure, but no stay perfect in spiritual life, then i am kanistha adhikari. You understand? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

***prabhupada is not madyam/uttama... prabhupada is uttama adhikari ACTING (sometimes) as madyama adhikari with the purpose to teach

 

Yes, no problem.

[Guest guest]

***i think my guru is uttama,

It is dobtfull.

...are you atheist? do you believe that krsna leaves this world without pure devotees?

 

me guru live in Goloka. He is madhyama-madhyama, but follow true uttama acarya in this sense He is madhyama-uttama

...this is very offensive.. if your guru is in goloka he's and was uttama adhikari. if he was not uttama he could not follow the uttama adhikari. And definitely, it is offensive to speculate on the ontological nature of the spiritual master

 

I am know me spiritual nathure, but no stay perfect in spiritual life, then i am kanistha adhikari.

..as a practitioneer you are very advanced.. but if you should know really your spiritual nature as eternal servant of krsna, you should be an uttama adhikari

 

theoric consciousness does not mean too much

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

***...are you atheist? do you believe that krsna leaves this world without pure devotees?

 

May be yours guru madhyama?

 

"sraddhavan" - kanistha adhikari pure devotee too. What means - "pure devotee", your guru -"vasudevam sarvam iti"?

 

***if your guru is in goloka he's and was uttama adhikari.

 

One point - yes, but in higher point - no. "kanistha adhikari" in THIS case - it is person who go in Goloka lila in some degree. It is grade ujjvala nilamani. Me guru is madhyama. Some problem?

 

***if he was not uttama he could not follow the uttama adhikari.

 

If some kanistha, he is may follow uttama, what problem? If you kanistha but you has rule uttama, you work like uttama - it is spiritual life.

 

***And definitely, it is offensive to speculate on the ontological nature of the spiritual master

 

Do not harry (?), do not worry. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

***..as a practitioneer you are very advanced.. but if you should know really your spiritual nature as eternal servant of krsna, you should be an uttama adhikari

 

No. it is work me guru, do not me personal. Of course i am personal work too. Yes, i am try, try, try, chant, read, preach, work, more reason...but all from spiritual master come. I am know it is truth, BUT I am not able stay in this level - kanistha - some time yes, some time no. It is big question. I am wrie this for all anothers - spiritual life real, in ISKCON spiritual life real. Other plase spiritual life? - may be, I am do not know now.

 

No one spiritual master, ewerybody spiritual masters help. ( in ISKCON in me case ).

 

***theoric consciousness does not mean too much

 

Yes.

[Guest guest]

With Madhumangala actually even Krishna all time consults. As in Krishna lila occurs all time twirled enough intrigue and the party - Srimati Radharani. She too the God, therefore is opposite to a situation such, that Krishna addresses for council to Madhumangala. Madhumangala plays a role false brahmana ( gulabjamuns - any blessings), but it is real He there is the real and very skilled brahmana. Actually Madhumangala the head of all brahmans and as all devotee Gaura lila.

 

There are close friends of Krishna such as Subala. Krishna discusses with Subala that does not discuss with many others - the feelings or the adventures. Subala in this sense empathizes them. But Madhumangala occupies a little bit other position, He operates more as brahman, more is not adhered, therefore more objectively and as the one who always in the greater degree understands a situation. Madhumangala certainly as in a know everything, as perfect brahman. Madhumangala operates in such a manner that lilas would be even more sated, moreover, as perfect brahman, He as is never adhered to consequences of events. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

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Philadelphia

14 July, 1975

75-07-14

 

"Yes, everybody says like that, that I am incarnation of Caitanya Mahaprabhu. "

 

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"Gadadhara Panditas pure ecstatic love for Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu was also very deep. It was like that of Rukminidevi, who was always especially submissive to Krsna."

 

"Lord Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu sometimes desired to see Gadadhara Panditas affectionate anger, but because of knowledge of the Lords opulences, his anger was never invoked.

 

"In the Gaura-ganoddesa-dipika, verses 147 through 153, it is stated: " The pleasure potency of Sri Krsna formerly known as Vrndavanisvare is now personified in the form of Sri Gadadhara Pandita in the pastimes of Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu. " Sri Svarupa Damodara Gosvame has pointed out that in the shape of Laksmi, the pleasure potency of Krsna, she was formerly very dear to the Lord as Syamasundara-vallabha. The same Syamasundara-vallabha is now present as Gadadhara Pandita. Formerly, as Lalita-sakhi, she was always devoted to Srimate Radharani. In the Twelfth Chapter of this part of the Caitanya-caritamata there is a description of the descendants or disciplic succession of Gadadhara Pandita."

 

That is Gadadhara it Lalita devi is real, which operates as Laksmi devi ( Rukminidevi ). As the God is absolute also Lord Caitanya "accepted" mood Radharani is in the primary form and is not present and there can not be "Radharani" outside Him.

 

Gaura - Gadadhara it Laksmi-Narayana. Gadadhara and Jagadananda Pandit Lord Caitanya as see Krishna and really it is two queens Vaikuntha - Rukminidevi and Satyabhama.

 

It is possible to see that Gaura - Gadadhara it Radha Krishna, but it is real Gadadhara does not operate as Radharani in relation to Lord Caitanya, sastra clearly writes - Rukminidevi. Sermon Bhaktivinoda Thakura in this mood that it is not difficult to see. Through mood Rukminidevi He conducts the person on a level of fidelity to Radha Krishna, but training in spontaneous fidelity is not present, therefore this worship Laksmi-Narayana or Krishna-Rukminidevi.

 

Gadadhara as an embodiment sakti it Radharani as position Lord Caitanya "is specific" and as a whole is latent. As really Radha-Krishna is Lord Caitanya directly, therefore Gadadhara really it is first expansion Radharani - Lalita devi - " The same Syamasundara-vallabha is now present as Gadadhara Pandita. Formerly, as Lalita-sakhe, she was always devoted to Srimate Radharaee. " Very clear text.

 

Therefore Gadadhara Pandit as it Laksmi devi about what speaks an embodiment of internal energy Svarupa Damodar or the one who in the best way understands position Gadadhara Pandita in Gaura lila. Itself Svarupa Damodara He operates as "Radharani" CONSTANTLY in Gaura lila therefore and does this note. Really Radha-Krishna is Lord Caitanya what doubts can be in it? The Lord is absolute - having accepted "mood", there is no such "mood" /images/graemlins/smile.gif, is not present separately the person, separately "mood", it is Radha-Krishna, directly, the primary person. Lord Caitanya the primary person, the most secret and high understanding of the Lord is those. As this supreme mood, therefore He does not consider insults. Therefore Panca tattva the mantra spiritually surpasses to Hare Krishna mantra.

 

"Svarupa Damodara has been identified as Lalita-devi, the second expansion of Radharani. However, the authoritative Gaura-ganoddesa-dipika of Kavi-karnapura describes Svarupa Damodara as the same Visakha-devi who serves the Lord in Goloka Vrndavana. Therefore it is to be understood that Sri Svarupa Damodara is a direct expansion of Radharani who helps the Lord experience the attitude of Radharani.

 

But here Svarupa Damodara it is specified as Lalita devi. Thus all of them the first expansion Radharani. As emotion Lord Caitanya is boundless, thus all approached satellites are in this role - in a role of the closest girlfriend. Really Svarupa Damodara it Visakha devi.

 

The Gaura-ganoddesa-dipika (120-24) states that Ramananda Raya was formerly Arjuna. He is also considered to have been an incarnation of the gopi Lalita, although in the opinion of others he was an incarnation of Visakhadevi.

 

Ramananda Ray as is described as Lalita, but is real He Arjuna. Thus by the example of two approached satellites - Svarupa Damodara and Ramananda Ray it is shown as well as sakhya and madhurya races are in a role of close girlfriends Lord Caitanya. Precisely just as Srila Prabhupada's deities - at the left sakhya - Krishna Balaram, on the right madhurya - Radha - Krishna. As it is combined? yes - combined. Therefore Srila Prabhupada also has told to not read others acaryas as it is impossible then to understand Lord Caitanya up to the end.

 

All who follow for Bhaktivinoda Thakura simply practise sambhoga Krishna lila. Bhaktivinoda Thakura simply popularized Gosvamis, that is quite obvious. And as has restored the doctrine about sambhoga Krishna lila as all have been already spoiled babaji. In conformity with Bhaktivinoda Thakura it is necessary to cultivate direct relations. But in conformity with Srila Prabhupada - it is not NECESSARY to cultivate them.

 

Simply the essence that all over again it is necessary to develop this or that belief including in sambhoga and later if who that will follow Srila Prabhupada and His representatives the mood of pure fidelity will start to dominate. Not clearly what for in general Lord Caitanya accepted this mood? And gopis that, gopis as far as are unreasonable, it was necessary to sit in carts and to go in Mathura with songs?

 

Bhaktivinoda Thakura all life was in vipralambha, but in the end under the plan of Krishna He "would reach" perfection in Krishna lila what to set an example and training to this subject. In conformity with Srila Prabhupada sambhoga for beginning,

 

" Not sambhoga. Vipralambha. Vipralambha-seva "

 

" Direct contact is not possible. Neither that is the way of worshiping by the method of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. That is sahajiya-vada. "

 

" That is Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu's teaching, separation, not direct contact. "

 

" Without seeing Govinda, the whole world is vacant. " This is love.

 

" Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu taught us this method of worship in separation, vipralambha-seva. Not that " Oh, I have seen yesterday. Last night, I have seen Krsna. "

 

Indeed Bhaktivinoda Thakura began training to a great transcendental science of devoted service, I think that nobody will argue with it or can argue.

 

Therefore Srila Prabhupada actually unique who directly learns this mood Lord Caitanya and a science Lord Caitanya it Gaura vani. Therefore Srila Prabhupada stops and unites thus all devotees sakhya (vatsalya) races and madhurya races as all these races if follow directly in the steps Lord Caitanya - Gaura vani are in one mood.

 

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"After this incident, the Lord remained in an ecstatic position for twenty-one hours, and all the devotees saw His specific pastimes.

 

"...Some devotees call this exhibition of ecstasy by the Lord sata-prahariya bhava, or "the ecstasy of twenty-one hours," and others call it mahabhava-prakasa or maha-prakasa.

 

"...There is a supreme symptom of ecstatic love which is called mahabhava. This mahabhava expression was possible only in Radharani, but later on when Sri Krsna Caitanya appeared to feel the mode of love of Radharani, He also expressed all of the symptoms of mahabhava. Sri Rupa Gosvami says in this connection that when the symptoms of ecstatic love become the most bright, that stage is accepted as mahabhava.

 

"That supreme ecstasy of Srimati Radharani is the essence of spiritual life. Her only business is to fulfill all the desires of KRSNA.

 

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Vande'ham sri-guruh sri-yuta-.-kamalam

[Guest guest]

Me guru is madhyama. Some problem?

 

not for me.. for you that are blaspheming your guru

 

If some kanistha, he is may follow uttama, what problem?

 

a kanista cannot follow uttama, he has material attachments, so if he follows he's not kanista

 

you work like uttama - it is spiritual life.

 

spiritual life is not external... if i wash a pot and an uttama adhikari washes a pot we are not doing the same service, he's doing it for krsna , i am doing it for gratification

 

kanistha - some time yes, some time no

 

some time kanista, some time something else is .. kanista

 

in ISKCON spiritual life real

 

if one's practices iskcon (=krsna consciousness)... of course

 

Other plase spiritual life? - may be, I am do not know now.

 

if you do not know it is ok if you make your sadhana and do not judge others

 

No one spiritual master, ewerybody spiritual masters

 

krsna consciousness is guru and sadhus.... so you need the one and the "everybody"

[Guest guest]

***not for me.. for you that are blaspheming your guru

 

Aaaa I am understand you guru is uttama - vasudevam sarvam.

 

***a kanista cannot follow uttama,

 

Kanistha needs follow uttama. If you guru uttama then you follow him?

 

***spiritual life is not external... if i wash a pot and an uttama adhikari washes a pot we are not doing the same service, he's doing it for krsna , i am doing it for gratification

 

/images/graemlins/smile.gif good.

 

***some time kanista, some time something else is .. kanista

 

Yes, me friend.

 

***if one's practices iskcon (=krsna consciousness)... of course

 

Yes. Intarnational society KC, never listen? /images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

***if you do not know it is ok if you make your sadhana and do not judge others

 

I am follow sadhana. Where I am judge others?

 

***krsna consciousness is guru and sadhus.... so you need the one and the "everybody"

 

If you gugu uttama, then everybody, if you guru kanistha then - "only me guru". If you follow "only me guru" then you guru kanistha, no madhyam.

[Guest guest]

***not for me.. for you that are blaspheming your guru

Aaaa I am understand you guru is uttama -

..i am trying to following prabhupada's instructions to follow uttama adhikaris

 

***a kanista cannot follow uttama,

Kanistha needs follow uttama. If you guru uttama then you follow him?

...being a kanista i am not really following, i am practicing to be a real follower if i get, by krsna's mercy, uttama realization. Kanista adhikari does not really follow, he's mixed, he wants some krsna and some gratification. This is not real following

 

***spiritual life is not external... if i wash a pot and an uttama adhikari washes a pot we are not doing the same service, he's doing it for krsna , i am doing it for gratification

good.

......so one is real service, one is a shadow of the service... if i follow the kanista i can only get the shadow, not the real thing

 

If you gugu uttama, then everybody, if you guru kanistha then - "only me guru". If you follow "only me guru" then you guru kanistha, no madhyam.

.....who follows an uttama adhikari guru is not forced to be sectarian.. who follows a kanista guru thinking that all gurus are kanista is an aparadhi

[kailasa]

***..i am trying to following prabhupada's instructions to follow uttama adhikaris

 

Yes. Then needs guru who follow Prabhupada.

 

***Kanista adhikari does not really follow, he's mixed, he wants some krsna and some gratification. This is not real following

 

You do not understand. Real uttama make you all kanistha adhikara as uttama. You understand? God all powerful. Yes we mixed, but in servise uttama make you perfect. You understand?

 

***if i follow the kanista i can only get the shadow, not the real thing

 

Kanistha is who stay in lila not perfect. We speak in this contecst.

 

***.....who follows an uttama adhikari guru is not forced to be sectarian..

 

yes, uttama try do all uttama. Kanistha try do "uttama" only himself.

 

***who follows a kanista guru thinking that all gurus are kanista is an aparadhi

 

Yes kanistha see all kanisthas, madhyam many levels, not only external behaviour. It is words sastra - "kanistha adhikari see devotion on external behaviour."

[Guest guest]

***..i am trying to following prabhupada's instructions to follow uttama adhikaris

Yes. Then needs guru who follow Prabhupada.

---no more need... krsna has already provided

 

You do not understand. Real uttama make you all kanistha adhikara as uttama.

---yes... but it is a gradual process. Until you are kanista you do not perform real service to the uttama adhikari then to krsna. If you perform real service you have to be classified as uttama adhikari. To be born as uttama or to be uttama for having followed sadhana makes no difference.

 

God all powerful. Yes we mixed, but in servise uttama make you perfect. You understand?

---gradually.... a mixed who serving gets perfection is no more mixed, he's pure. And from the point of view of the disciple he never was mixed

 

 

 

[kailasa]

---yes... but it is a gradual process.

 

Yes, i am speak in another contecst.

 

***Until you are kanista you do not perform real service to the uttama adhikari then to krsna.

 

Yes, but uttama has absolute position, YOU POSITION no has any value in this case. You understand?

 

***If you perform real service you have to be classified as uttama adhikari.

 

In some sence yes.

 

---gradually.... a mixed who serving gets perfection is no more mixed, he's pure. And from the point of view of the disciple he never was mixed

 

If you follow instruction uttama you work like uttama. Sadhana it is good, but not all instruction uttama.

[Guest guest]

***If you perform real service you have to be classified as uttama adhikari.

In some sence yes.

---that's the key... the quality of the service is in the heart, i can wash more pots than an uttama adhikari, but i wash for gratification he washes for krsna

 

---gradually.... a mixed who serving gets perfection is no more mixed, he's pure. And from the point of view of the disciple he never was mixed

If you follow instruction uttama you work like uttama.

---again... uttama, kanista or madyam is not in the activity itself, it is in the heart. If the uttama adhikari tells me: "wash the pots!" i can wash.. but it is not automatic that i do this service in a pure way only because this service was given to me by a pure devotee.

The purity is not in the execution of the order, the purity is in the heart who executes the order. The pure devotee says "chant hare krishna and be happy". Many follows but everyone at their level. Gradually they will surely get pure devotion and the order of the pure devotee will have made them pure.. but not now. Prabhupada says to you "chant hare krsna.." or "distribute books".. the order is pure, who gave the order is pure, but who is executing the order can be not pure. So this execution of the service can be simple sensorial gratification

 

so the real following of an uttama adhikari is done only by another uttama adhikari.. now

 

in perspective the materialists or mixed materialists who are"attempting to give service" to the pure devotee will gradually become pure servants... but not now

 

when they will be pure servants it will be an offence to think that once they were kanista or madyam

[Guest guest]

Yes, it is right. I am in another contecst some. If some follow uttama - all heart, all reason. All heart it is good, but needs all reason too. Srila Prabhupada write MANY INSTRUCTIONS. He is write many instructions for ALL PEOPLES, ALL LEVELS! Then if person follow he is go in uttama. Any disciple Prabhupada-uttama if he is follow all heart, all reason. Any way - Prabhupada and all His true followers uttama. Prabhupada transcendentl. Try understand -He is transcendentl - if you follow all heart, all reason you transcendentl. /images/graemlins/smile.gif If person work, work, read books and so on. Vipralambha - person stay in transcendentl level - all time. They do not understand, this preach sahajiya and materialists, them some fall, left. This is big question.

 

Srila Prabhupada acarya for kali yuga, then needs read His books in ISKCON, babaji, GM, it is uniti and way in transcendent position. Some guru ISCKON, babaji, GM it is kanistha adhikari and if they do not follow Prabhupada no needs listen they too many. Lord Caitanya do not take ofences, then this offenders SP, be progress slowly. /images/graemlins/smile.gif /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Guest guest]

Try understand -He is transcendentl - if you follow all heart, all reason you transcendentl.

 

being not transcendental i cannot follow with all heart or all reason. Trascendence is a gift of god and of the transcendental spiritual master.. external following means very little. We sadly know many people with external following, respecting rules, doing great activities but fallen at the top of their career because they were not complete followers inside their heart. if they were real transcendentalists the falling were not possible

 

If person work, work, read books and so on. Vipralambha - person stay in transcendentl level - all time.

 

real working and real reading is done only by transcendental people.. if i read krsna book and prabhupada reads krsna book, only apparently we are doing the same activity... i am gratificating, he's seeing krsna

 

They do not understand, this preach sahajiya and materialists, them some fall, left. This is big question.

 

there's no need to twist philosophy or to give all value only to external actions because someone (=sahajia) gives no value to them. Transcendence is an internal business and comes from krsna's mercy and not from our personal plans and activities. If someone plays with this concept and is oversentimental and shows despise for working and preaching it is not our fault... preach in the right way and do not worry of politics

 

Some guru ISCKON, babaji, GM it is kanistha adhikari

 

so they are not guru, being not transcendental they cannot teach transcendence.. prabhupada has given to us sri guruvastakam, the guru joins the gopis to help them to serve radha-krsna pastimes... this is guru

 

and if they do not follow Prabhupada no needs listen they too many

 

yes.. no need to listen them because they are usurpating the role of the guru that is not fit for them.. they cheat all the devotees and they are a great disturbance for society, the greatest disturbance.. "mitya acharya"

 

 

[Guest guest]

***being not transcendental i cannot follow with all heart or all reason.

 

You transcendental. If person sinsirety shi is - "from begining devotional servise liberated." BG commentary, Srila Prabhupada. You may follow all YOUR heart, all Your reason. May be am has small reason - 2%, but if am use ALL own reason - it is 100%. Some has reason - 5%, but if he use 2%, it is less 50%. It is understand?

 

***Trascendence is a gift of god and of the transcendental spiritual master..

 

Yes if person desire it. Then he is read, chant, go preach, take reason and so on. Guru, Krisna see ouer disires. Then if person decires - all come. It is not teoretikal, it is praktic.

 

***external following means very little.

 

Yes. Then external following needs follow in books Prabhupada. Then it is not be external. Prabhupada MANY write about all - principles, chanting, preach and so on. No needs stupidly "follow SP", it is not following. Following it is UNDERSTAND books SP. Only one things from books SP may liberation person. It big whole instruction for sadhana-spontaneus devotional servise. It is not theory, it is real practik.

 

***We sadly know many people with external following,

 

External following it si obstakle (?) - from Srila Rupa Gosvami.

 

***respecting rules, doing great activities but fallen at the top of their career because they were not complete followers inside their heart.

 

Needs self realized souls. Needs listen holy name. Holy name enter in heart, then be clearing, step by step.

 

***if they were real transcendentalists the falling were not possible

 

Soul never fall. /images/graemlins/smile.gif We needs madhyama, no needs false uttama.

 

***real working and real reading is done only by transcendental people..

 

All transcendentl. Needs do karma yoga, no needs - home, family, and so on. It is krazy - i am desire $, big home, family and so on. Then this people do not make progress.

 

No needs be sanyas for glory, it is too material. Sanyas it is book destribution, and go door to door.

 

***if i read krsna book and prabhupada reads krsna book, only apparently we are doing the same activity... i am gratificating, he's seeing krsna

 

If person read books SP, them he is develop vision uttama adhikari. It is no doubth. Needs read and following for SP. Whole life for preaching in many forms. Not nedds care about wife, home, $. Lord Iesus speak - " do not care about future. Future care himselfs." Needs has some for life and preach it is perfect formule.

 

God is allpoverful, if person work for Him, He is care about person. It is true. No needs do divorce, no needs all life work for big $. It is reason.

 

***there's no need to twist philosophy

 

Yes person may follow principles and be big guru or sanyas, but work for himself. It is material.

 

***Transcendence is an internal business and comes from krsna's mercy and not from our personal plans and activities.

 

Yes it is right. Follow plans Srila Prabhupada. It is good. Well. Glory. All glory! You be happy all life and take many many transcendentl experiens and end go in spiritual world. All another people it is crazy. It is waste time. It is usekess work for homself, for own plan. It is waste time.

 

If person wrok for Krisna Krisna come Himself. It is true. If you work in fabrik - preach. In fabrik, toun, willage, in street, internet, cafe - all preach. No worry. I am kick out from 2 job 18 years ago, /images/graemlins/smile.gif /images/graemlins/smile.gif do not worry, it is not has walue. In another job - preach. One place preach, another place preach - it is spiritual life. In India preach.

 

Not saty big devotee. We small devotte, then - no any problem. I am small devotee animal. Srila Prabhupada speak me - "go, praech". I am not has own plan, i am not ha s any reason, then I AM GO. !!! If person not has reason then she is do this. It is rigth?

 

***If someone plays with this concept and is oversentimental and shows despise for working and preaching it is not our fault... preach in the right way and do not worry of politics

 

Is all politiks kick out. /images/graemlins/smile.gif You kick out all politiks on street.

 

***so they are not guru, being not transcendental they cannot teach transcendence.. prabhupada has given to us sri guruvastakam, the guru joins the gopis to help them to serve radha-krsna pastimes... this is guru

 

All gopis preach. If person not preach it is not gopi.