"Women are better than men because they can accept any position."

krsna · May 28, 2004

* "Regarding your questions about the examination to be given, the girls will also be able to take these. In Krishna Consciousness there is no distinction between girls and boys. The girls also may become preachers if they are able." (letter to Himavati, 1969)

* When Srila Prabhupada was asked if Jyotirmayi should finish her studies in ethnology, (studies of religion and culture), in order to teach vaishnavism in the universities, He answered, "Yes, she is very intelligent girl, she can do it." (Yogesvara)

* It is not that women should only produce children, but they are meant for advancing in devotion." (letter to Jayatirtha, 1975)

* In the Bhagavad Gita we find that women are also equally competent "like the men" in the matter of Krishna Consciousness movement." (letter to Himavati, 1969)

*A devotee woman recalls that she was once in a Srila Prabhupada's room for a darshan. There were hundreds of devotees visiting from other temples. Before lecturing, he insisted that the women, (who were all at the back), come and sit up front on one side of the vyasana. At least five sannyasi's, and about twenty men had to move to make room for the women. Srila Prabhupada sat quietly for about five minutes while everyone was relocating themselves and getting situated.

* "Regarding your question, yes woman can certainly reach the perfectional stage of devotion to Krishna." (letter to Krishna Devi, 1969)

*While during darshan, Srila Prabhupada had a brahmacari distribute a little prasadam to everyone present. The boy gave prasadam to all the men and sat down. Srila Prabhupada noticed that he did not serve the only two girls present, and said, "Give them also prasad, why don't you serve them?"

* "Women are better than men because they can accept any position." (Bhavatarini)

* In France, when Prabhupada noticed that Jyotirmayi could pronounce the Sanskrit better than others, (she had been taught by Nitai, His personal Sanskrit secretary), Srila Prabhupada said that from now on, she should lead the recitation of the Sanskrit verses before class. (Jyotirmayi, 1972)

* When a male devotee refused to be instructed by Jadurani, the head of the art department, because of her being a woman, Prabhupada called him in and ordered him to accept her instructions.

* "I want to organize a women's kirtan party singing the Gita-gan. Can you help me?" (letter to Gargamuni Maharaja, 1974)

* A disciple of Swami Narayana said to Srila Prabhupada, "My spiritual master said to avoid all women and to never go where there are women." Srila Prabhupada laughed, and said, "That is impossible, there are women everywhere." Then, coming back to the temple and watching two women devotees bow down to Him, He said, "By associating with these women, you will be purified." (Madhavananda)

* An acarya who comes for the service of the Lord cannot be expected to conform to a stereotype, for he must find the ways and means by which Krishna Consciousness may be spread. Sometimes jealous persons criticize the Krishna Consciousness movement because it engages *equally* both boys and girls in distribution of love of Godhead. (Chaitanya-caritamrita A.L. ch.7 purport of verses 32 and 38)

* On various occasions, brahmacari's complained to Srila Prabhupada that they were agitated by the presence of women in the temple, and Srila Prabhupada replied that if they could not restrain their senses, they should go live alone in the forest.

* When women were made to stand behind the men in the back of the temple room instead of side by side as established by Srila Prabhupada, women went on different occasions to Prabhupada who simply answered, "Why, the men on one side, the women on one side."

* When the women were made to offer flowers after the men during guru-puja, instead of simultaneously, Srila Prabhupada, informed by Ekayani, gave the same answer: "Why, the men from one side, the women from one side." (Ekayani)

* Bhibavati asked Srila Prabhupada, "Should I live like in the Vedic times, and simply serve my husband and child?" Srila Prabhupada replied, "No, you have talent as a writer, you should write articles for newspapers and propagate Krishna Consciousness." (Bhibavati)

* Srila Prabhupada said to a lady disciple, "Well, if you think you are a woman that means you are less intelligent, because you are supposed to understand that you are a spirit soul and that your real identity is transcendental to these bodily designations." (Sadaputa)

krsna · May 28, 2004

"During a conversation with Srila Prabhupada, someone commented that my son was very intelligent. Prabhupada agreed, "He is very intelligent." Someone then suggested, "Just like his father." Prabhupada shook his head and smiled, "No, like his mother." (Pradyumna)

"The social institution known as varnasrama-dharma--the institution dividing society into four divisions of social life and four occupational divisions of caste--is not meant to divide human society according to birth. Such divisions are in terms of educational qualifications. " BG 16:1 - 3, Purport

"We are Vaishnava's. We are not concerned with male of female position in life. That is simply bodily concept of life. It is not spiritual. Whether one is male or female, it does not matter, simply chant Hare Krishna and follow the four regulative principles and your life will be perfect." (letter to Jennifer, 1975)

"The system of varnashrama-dharma is more or less based on moral principles. There is very little realization of the Transcendence as such, and Lord Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu rejected it as superficial and asked Ramananda Raya to go further into the matter." Srimad Bhagavatam, Introduction.

"A devotee woman recalls that she was once in Srila Prabhupada's room for a darshan. There were hundreds of visiting devotees from neighboring temples. Before lecturing he insisted that the women (who were all at the back) come and sit up front on one side of the vyasana. At least 5 sanyasis and about 20 men had to move to make room for the women. Srila Prabhupada sat quietly for about 5 minutes while everyone was relocating themselves and getting situated."

"Regarding your questions about the examination to be given, the girls will also be able to take these. In Krishna Consciousness there is no distinction between girls and boys. The girls also may become preachers if they are able." (letter to Himavati, 1969)

"Now I see that in our Society the girls are more intelligent than the boys." (Letter to Krishna Devi, 1970)

"This *modern* caste system is now condemned in India also, and it should be condemned for the classification of different types of men according to birth is not the Vedic or Divine caste system." SB 3: 6:13

"There are two kinds of sva-dharma, specific duties. As long as one is not liberated, one has to perform the duties of his particular body in accordance with religious principles in order to achieve liberation. When one is liberated, one's sva-dharma -- specific duty -- becomes spiritual and is not in the material bodily concept. In the bodily concept of life there are specific duties for the brahmanas and kstriyas respectively, and such duties are unavoidable. Sva-dharma is ordained by the Lord, and this will be clarified in the fourth chapter. One the bodily planet, sva-dharma is called Varnashrama-dharma, or mans *STEPPING STONE* for spirutal understanding." BG 2. 31

Bhibavati asked Srila Prabhupada: "Should I live like in the Vedic times, and simply serve my husband and child?" Srila Prabhupada replied: "No, you have a talent as a writer, you should write articles for newspapers and propagate Krishna Consciousness." (Bhibavati)

"When Srila Prabhupada was asked if Jyotirmayi should finish her studies in ethnology (study of religions and cultures) in order to teach vaishnavaism in the universities, he answered, "yes, she is very intelligent girl, she can do it." (Yogesvara)

Women, as well as men, accompanied Prabhupada when he was traveling and served him as secretaries, as did Arundhati, or served him personally as did Janaki.

When Srila Prabhupada was personally present, women as well as men could stand next to him.

Women wrote articles in magazines. Prabhupada personally asked Bibhavati who had been journalist previously, to do so.

As far as the service of temple president was concerned, Srila Prabhupada included husband and wife, he recommended them to be father and mother of the devotees they were in charge of.

In France, when Prabhupada noticed that Jyotirmayi could pronounce the Sanskrit better than others, (she had been taught by Nitai, His personal Sanskrit secretary), Srila Prabhupada said that from now on, she should lead the recitation of the Sanskrit verses before class. (Jyotirmayi, 1972)

Prabhupada: "Nowadays, ladies, they can understand." BG 4.10 Calcutta Sept 23, 74

Women were doing things that, later on, they were forbidden to do in front of Srila Prabhupada himself (and this forbidding came from the authorities, not from Prabhupada.) Jamuna was leading kirtans in front of him, Himavati gave public conferences, Jyotirmayi and Rukmini performed arati in front of him.

"This is a *new thing* in the history of the sankirtana movement. In India all the acaryas and their dependents later on only acted from the man's side. Their wives were at home because that was the system from *old times.* BUT in Bhagavad-gita we find that women are also *equally* competent like the men in the matter of Krishna Consciousness movement. Please therefore carry on these missionary activities, and prove it by practical example that there is no bar for anyone in the matter of preaching Krishna Consciousness." SPL to Himavati 69-12-20

Kulapavana · May 28, 2004

yes, now threads are more balanced /images/graemlins/wink.gif

protection of women by men includes protection from unbalanced quotes (what to speak of protection from male chauvinism - of which I'm not accusing anybody here)

vijay · May 28, 2004

Its nice to have these verses but devotees should be wary in what context they were spoken, many quotes like by prabhupada are cited out of context by both pro-traditionalists and feminist/liberal devotees.

Jay

Priitaa · June 2, 2004

Its nice to have these verses but devotees should be wary in what context they were spoken, many quotes like by prabhupada are cited out of context by both pro-traditionalists and feminist/liberal devotees.

While I agree many other types of verses are quoted out of context by the ......... they like to call themself traditionalists but they are not following Prabhuapda's tradition. Anyway, maybe you consider me a feminist, but I do not consider myself one. And most of those women quoted above, I know many -- they are not feminists.

For example, Bibhavati who Prabhupada told it was perfectly fine as a woman to work, is so subserviant to her husand many have wished for years she would speak back to him, but seldom does that happen. Yet by reading her quote, some might say, "Oh, she is a feminist." Not at all. To know a bit of the history of the women in our movement is important for understanding why women who are not feminists may make comments that appear to be.

A man can speculate but just ask some of the women, if they even have the self esteem left to speak up, what they have been put through. I would explain more but am rushed for time. Anyway, I think I made the point. We're not our bodies, we're spirit souls. /images/graemlins/smile.gif